The Senior Player Crisis

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Your experienced players are the ones who are supposed to lead the way. To stand up under pressure, to do the right thing at the right time, to be the example for young players to follow and to remain calm in the hurly burly of a contest.

They are the ones who drive the culture at the club.

What has happened?

Reilly - a spike in 2012 followed by a dire 2013. Panics under pressure. Is the opposite of an experienced player.

Thompson - AA last season, a terrible 2013. Rumours of injuries and of coaches being talked into letting him play on... wtf? Reeks either of complete selfishness on his part, lack of faith in the young players from the coaches or the tail wagging the dog.

van Berlo - struggling to exert an influence and jumping between roles

Mackay - an absolute shadow of the player we thought he'd be. Running out of roles.

Vince - better the last few weeks but a long way away from being a consistent, high output leader.

Porplyzia - awful season again and finally dropped

Jacobs - coming off a near-AA year and now timid, low on confidence and having zero impact

Johncock - unfit and never even got near it

Apologies to Rutten and Douglas who have been very good but that is only two out of ten senior players who would have a pass mark for this season. A few of these guys were promoted into leadership groups this year.

So what to do?

Do we hope that in 2014 these guys will suddenly turn things around and start showing the leadership and quality expected of senior players? Or do we need to make some hard calls and understand that if these guys were ever going to do anything positive, they would have done it by now?

Jacobs you'd obviously retain and Douglas and Rutten, Johncock gone, but the other six?

Do we need to hand the keys to the club over to the next generation and accept that these players we have invested years and years of time into just don't cut the mustard?

 

[ftmch]

Good thread Carl.

Bugger the injuries, the umpiring, the Tippett aftermath etc - the collective form of our Senior's is the single biggest contributing factor to our decline this year.

In some respects it speaks volumes of the young kids we've got coming through that we were still even a mathematical possibility to make the 8 up until about 4.30pm this afternoon.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

Of the other 6 I'd keep Vince and be happy to trade any of the rest.

 

[spexau]

Vince has been pretty consistent this year since his axing in the first Showdown. I agree on the rest which reflects our overall performance.

 

[fairfooty]

Agree Carl. Very fair objective assessment. Watching McKay from the northern stand today I was increasingly concerned that he'd been selected at all hundred games or no hundred games. Had absolutely zero impact, made a shocking mistake in Q1 resulting in a Port goal and it was all downhill from there. Van Berlo wasn't much better - remain concerned about his on field leadership. Thompson has been poor for weeks and can't take a trick with the umpires either. Sauce's turnover fumble in the last few minutes of Q4 probably cost us the game. But where to go for a ruckman? I just can't reconcile the Sauce from last year with the one in front of me today. And as much as I love Porps, I think we've seen the last of him. Despite being a vocal Vince critic I'm still inclined to keep him but ' on notice' - we need to keep some experience in this team. I said during the second quarter today we really needed Johncock - he excelled at Showdowns and it could have been his farewell game.

Your experienced players are the ones who are supposed to lead the way. To stand up under pressure, to do the right thing at the right time, to be the example for young players to follow and to remain calm in the hurly burly of a contest.

They are the ones who drive the culture at the club.

What has happened?

Reilly - a spike in 2012 followed by a dire 2013. Panics under pressure. Is the opposite of an experienced player.

Thompson - AA last season, a terrible 2013. Rumours of injuries and of coaches being talked into letting him play on... wtf? Reeks either of complete selfishness on his part, lack of faith in the young players from the coaches or the tail wagging the dog.

van Berlo - struggling to exert an influence and jumping between roles

Mackay - an absolute shadow of the player we thought he'd be. Running out of roles.

Vince - better the last few weeks but a long way away from being a consistent, high output leader.

Porplyzia - awful season again and finally dropped

Jacobs - coming off a near-AA year and now timid, low on confidence and having zero impact

Johncock - unfit and never even got near it

Apologies to Rutten and Douglas who have been very good but that is only two out of ten senior players who would have a pass mark for this season. A few of these guys were promoted into leadership groups this year.

So what to do?

Do we hope that in 2014 these guys will suddenly turn things around and start showing the leadership and quality expected of senior players? Or do we need to make some hard calls and understand that if these guys were ever going to do anything positive, they would have done it by now?

Jacobs you'd obviously retain and Douglas and Rutten, Johncock gone, but the other six?

Do we need to hand the keys to the club over to the next generation and accept that these players we have invested years and years of time into just don't cut the mustard?

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Apart from Johncock, the odds are strong that all and sundry will play round 1 next year.

Because that's how this club rolls.

 

[Elite Crow]

Very appropriate and timely thread. Sando said he doesnt know why we give up easy quick goals, it's simple. Turnovers. And the biggest culprits are our senior players. That's because we've allowed some average footballers to develop lovely careers with us. I'd chuck Otten into that lot even though he's not really senior.

Today DMack handballs to the opposition to start the rot.

I'm starting to worry about Lynch. For a good kick he's making some howler decisions. Today's handball to the oppositon was what the ****.

 

[King Elvis]

Do we need to hand the keys to the club over to the next generation and accept that these players we have invested years and years of time into just don't cut the mustard?

That's exactly what we should do.

The young players are largely our best players - the future and the success of our Club will depend on them, so lets put our fortunes in their hands.

The other issue is the lack of transparency and honesty in our selections. If the senior players were judged on their merits, not their experience, then this issue would take care of itself.

The senior players whose forms warrants selection (ie, Rutten, Douglas, normally Thommo) should be selected - those whose form doesn't warrant it, shouldn't be selected.

Pretty simple.

 

[Cap]

I'll stick up a bit for Vince, when he needs to be somewhere that needs a level head he is there.

but just doesn't do enough. but in reality the rest of the list is spot on.

 

[fairfooty]

I'll stick up a bit for Vince, when he needs to be somewhere that needs a level head he is there.

but just doesn't do enough. but in reality the rest of the list is spot on.

Yep agreed. As I said before, I think he's 'on notice' but he did enough today (just) to maintain his spot - for the time being.

 

[Elite Crow]

How good was it to see a player with great disposal? Grigg embarrased senior players today.

 

[Cap]

How good was it to see a player with great disposal? Grigg embarrased senior players today.

What does Grigg, Laird, Crouch, Brown and LJ have in common? they all have better disposal than our senior players.

 

[Elite Crow]

What does Grigg, Laird, Crouch, Brown and LJ have in common? they all have better disposal than our senior players.

And Smith and Talia

 

[CrowAboutIt]

Not sure if this is the reason for Thommo's poor form but he is going through a messy divorce atm. You'd think it wouldn't effect him on the field but who knows. His ex is trying to take him for everything and the kids.

 

[TFloyd]

It is becoming increasingly concerning.
Given how young our list is, and without our senior players standing up to steady the ship, its no surprise how often we fade in and out of games.
Id say Rutten's consistency and experience has been a huge factor in the success of our young and inexperienced back 6 this year. They have been exceptional given how badly they have been exposed at times by our defensive pressure further up the ground.

 

[Cap]

you can see why they want to focus FA on some senior talent.

 

[mattymac]

Yeah Vince is a different kettle of fish, precise and solid under pressure, just sometimes a lazy moron.

The others are panick stricken fumbly turnover merchants. Axe the lot. And Otten. And Smack. Not an ounce of composure between them.

 

[King Elvis]

It is becoming increasingly concerning.
Given how young our list is, and without our senior players standing up to steady the ship, its no surprise how often we fade in and out of games.
Id say Rutten's consistency and experience has been a huge factor in the success of our young and inexperienced back 6 this year. They have been exceptional given how badly they have been exposed at times by our defensive pressure further up the ground.

You only have to listen to Talia talk about Rutten to see how true that is.

 

[CrowAboutIt]

Did danger play in the centre bounce in the last 5 mins?

 

[Tex200]

That's exactly what we should do.

The young players are largely our best players - the future and the success of our Club will depend on them, so lets put our fortunes in their hands.

The other issue is the lack of transparency and honesty in our selections. If the senior players were judged on their merits, not their experience, then this issue would take care of itself.

The senior players whose forms warrants selection (ie, Rutten, Douglas, normally Thommo) should be selected - those whose form doesn't warrant it, shouldn't be selected.

Pretty simple.

isn't it amazing... I was banging on about this weeks ago and was branded a lunatic

 

[rocket18]

Apart from Johncock, the odds are strong that all and sundry will play round 1 next year.

Because that's how this club rolls.

Unfortunately quoted for accuracy.

The senior players quoted are down on form this year but these are still the players that when even in good form have failed in the big games on a very regular basis for the last 5-6 years.

So disillusioned with the club at the moment. The handling of Trigg has put "me offside" and Sando's ridiculous selections have compounded it.

Next year can't come soon enough - I hope Sando looks back and realises what a poor year he has had.

 

[TFloyd]

We got a few decent pick ups pre rendell, especially in the rookie drafts. But some terrible drafting and list management decisions during those years is really hurting us now. Speaks volumes that post the years of Macca, goodwin, edwards, etc. its our youngest players standing up and putting many of our now senior players to shame.

 

[Vader]

Apart from Johncock, the odds are strong that all and sundry will play round 1 next year.

Because that's how this club rolls.

Fingers crossed they sort out the reason why so many of our senior players have gone backwards this year. Get that sorted and 2014 could be something pretty special, with the way the youngsters have performed this year.

 

[Glenno23]

The older players being shit may be a blessing in disguise

Get rid of them in 2 years (retire etc) and then we have the likes of:

Danger, Sloane, Tex, Talia, Dougie as senior players with 100-150 games into them

Brown, Laird, Grigg, Crouch, Smith, Lyons?, Kedge?, LJ? all with 50 odd games

Even with our lack of draft picks, there's some talent there. A few smart FA acquisitions and we may be ok

A time with no high draft picks would be a great time to have Rendell doing your recruiting......

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Fingers crossed they sort out the reason why so many of our senior players have gone backwards this year. Get that sorted and 2014 could be something pretty special, with the way the youngsters have performed this year.

But that's the thing, if we play our senior guys the younger players will be back to playing SANFL as we won't have a spot for them.