What happening to our State 18s program?

[acuguy]

It has been quite a number of years since we have been a really competitive unit at the state un18 level. This must be a concern for the development of our footballers. I would have thought with the structure and pathways put in place over recent times that we would be experiencing more success.

Are there floors in our current development system?

Are we selecting footballers who we think are more likely to be drafted (athletic ability) instead of selecting the best players available?

My concern with qld footy has always been it is a small pond and often it is easy for people involved in qld footy to be just as concerned about getting a name for themselves as they are about developing footballers.

Has anyone else been shocked by our poor performances at un 18 level over the last 3 or so years.

 

[mongrel_punt]

It is certainly a worry.

Many of the boys competing in the U18's are on BIG money (from the GC17) and are older that the other players, yet we are still being beaten, and beaten badly.

Not sure what else can be done though to be honest...

 

[Brisvegas]

It has been suggested that starting at the U14 level in our development departments we should start looking at training full 40 man squads from Summer training right through the year. As it stands now most development squads start there summer training for a cash grab, then onto rep selection. They then select a small squad, train for about 8 weeks have a carnival then back to club footy until next summer training. With the U16s its the same unless you make state squad and get that extra training after the state carnival. Im hoping AFLQ look at a full year of 1 night a week or every 2nd week of training with the best kids available in your areas, with the best advise available and the best training set ups for fitness health etc. Clubs are great if you are in Div 1 and with good coaches..........but still they are just part time dads who think they know everything, and you have to be very lucky if you get one that does. There is a few around that are pretty good. Time will tell though if AFLQ wants to ever get as good as the Vics rep sides..............but it has to start younger than the U14s. Colleges in Qld need to get some serious pressure put on them by AFL heavy weights with some cash incentives to get the breading grounds flourishing with potentials. Honestly I beleive it starts at school level then club then rep. I do hope eventually that this happens but not sure how to make it happen except talk to the development people with ideas, and hope they have the pull to make it happen.

 

[Lifes a Beach]

You are spot on with this assessment, easier to take a short cut and put a rookie search player in at the expense of a footballer.Unfortunately reduces the teams likelihood of being competitve, shatters the boy who misses out, alienates the family of grassroots AFL players and removes an opportunity. The professionalism of this years coaching group removed those issues and they performed accordingly.

 

[Mello]

By the sounds of it we need a clear goal for our development squads. Do we want competitive teams for National Carnivals or do we want to develop future AFL players. With such a small pool of talent in Qld it is hard to do both.

Remember clubs want future AFL players too as they are great promotional tools as well as good money spinners as clubs get paid by the AFL when a player is drafted and after a certain number of games.

 

[acuguy]

By the sounds of it we need a clear goal for our development squads. Do we want competitive teams for National Carnivals or do we want to develop future AFL players. With such a small pool of talent in Qld it is hard to do both.

Remember clubs want future AFL players too as they are great promotional tools as well as good money spinners as clubs get paid by the AFL when a player is drafted and after a certain number of games.

We teach kids at junior level that if you want to make state teams then you should concentrate on succeeding with regional rep team. I am sure the same thing applies with the AFL. You pick the best kids in the state now you are more likely to win state games. The more state games you win the more draftees you get.

 

[Lifes a Beach]

By the sounds of it we need a clear goal for our development squads. Do we want competitive teams for National Carnivals or do we want to develop future AFL players. With such a small pool of talent in Qld it is hard to do both.

Remember clubs want future AFL players too as they are great promotional tools as well as good money spinners as clubs get paid by the AFL when a player is drafted and after a certain number of games.

I don't see why they are not one and the same, surely the best footballers are selected and developed to become AFL players.Qld has been sidetracked by the myth that anyone can play our game after 5 minutes tuition because they are good at another sport. Let them develop in state leagues not at National carnivals.

 

[Mello]

I agree that you would think that winning games at carnivals would ensure a higher number of draftees but many decisions on player recruitment has already been made by that time.

The real disappointment in recent years has been that programs such as Rookie Search have taken development opportunities away from players that are natural footballers and not natural athletes. This appears to be changing, the introduction of the kicking btest at draft camp shows that clubs are beginning to once again value players who don't burn the footy.

I also agree that Rookies Search players should develop in the local comp, it would be interesting to find out how many of these players stick with playing footy at a local level if they are unsuccessful in getting drafted. Are we wasting a lot of development money on what essentially becomes only a few footballers.

 

[LOOSEMAN]

I don't see why they are not one and the same, surely the best footballers are selected and developed to become AFL players.Qld has been sidetracked by the myth that anyone can play our game after 5 minutes tuition because they are good at another sport. Let them develop in state leagues not at National carnivals.

Mate its a shame that the talent in AFL is not being recognised The Sydney Market is worse with the current Scholarship program it is full of athletes, not even, (talls) they atuomatically get slotted into the rep and state teams and now the newly established TAC Cup team, when are the dills going realise that footballers win games. Rep programs should be for footballers that take pride to play for their state and not used as training or development program at the expense of committed players that deserve to be there.

 

[Lifes a Beach]

The Qld 18's squad is currently training, only six Gold Coast players out of 38 are they kidding? and the state under 18's carnival doesn't start until March! Surely you would wait and see how players were going first given growth spurts etc. In addition the players have been advised that there will be a larger percentage of bottom agers in this years side, so they aren't trying to win and if you need yo be 17+ to be drafted not looking to have that happen either. So what is the point of all this can anyone tell me.

 

[Brisvegas]

The Qld 18's squad is currently training, only six Gold Coast players out of 38 are they kidding? and the state under 18's carnival doesn't start until March! Surely you would wait and see how players were going first given growth spurts etc. In addition the players have been advised that there will be a larger percentage of bottom agers in this years side, so they aren't trying to win and if you need yo be 17+ to be drafted not looking to have that happen either. So what is the point of all this can anyone tell me.

Fast tracking many of the high potential 17 yr old kids to have an opportunity with the GWS id say...........

 

[Brisvegas]

I know of 3 kids with great potential that refused to do Summer training with there rep club............why because they had just finished a season of footy and were offered no rest...........as well the drills and training that they were supposed to get involved in was more a flogging to try and fast track them, than any real proper body and mind conditioning

 

[Lifes a Beach]

Wonder what would happen if the Sydney media got hold of these stories about the treatment of young AFL players, maybe it would create some integrity in the talent pathway process.

 

[Brisvegas]

Wonder what would happen if the Sydney media got hold of these stories about the treatment of young AFL players, maybe it would create some integrity in the talent pathway process.

The talent pathway is pretty well up in the air from the info available, and much guess work is required by players and parents to how an academy actually works. The recent minimal publisised new GC, Brisbane Lions, Sydney and GWS academies have not been explained well enough to the public for anyone to know if they can qualify...........and how they are being scouted, and get picked, and at what age is the final limit. They say from as young as 12 i think, but dont talk much about 16 17 or 18yr olds. So im not real sure about how there integrety looks until they give more for everyone to understand. As for Sydney media........dont think anyone would allow negative stuff against a very valuable future commodity

 

[oldschoolfooty]

The Queensland Development of football has done a complete cartwheel from where it was heading 10 years ago as it was having a bad impact on local club U18 Competition.

10 Years ago there was an under 18 competition which included the usual Rep side but they played the whole season of football. The teams were able to select the best players from 16's and up to play in the U18 competition. These teams then played all season and trained together and got proper development for their mind and body. there was nutrition and weights coaches available for each team and a panel of coaches. through this competition the U18 state team won the second division one year and came runner up another year. they also got 4 - 5 players drafted eg. mitch hahn, michael osborne, Robert Copeland.

However the local brisbane clubs kicked up such a stink that these teams were raping their club of talent and leaving a large whole in their own U18 sides. Thus the league succumbed to pressure of the clubs and turned the U18 state carnival into the Round robin joke that it is today. Players can not develop into AFL footballers with 3 months floggings that they get pre season with their respective Rep sides. I say bring back proper season long competitions and develop these lads into Mentally strong and physically strong footballers ready to cope with playing against the stronger states of football.

If you want to Develop athletes into footballers put them into a rep side and let them develop from there don't place them in a state side where they may not cope against a footballer who knows what he is doing. By doing that you are destroying two players confidence and chances..

 

[Lifes a Beach]

The Queensland Development of football has done a complete cartwheel from where it was heading 10 years ago as it was having a bad impact on local club U18 Competition.

10 Years ago there was an under 18 competition which included the usual Rep side but they played the whole season of football. The teams were able to select the best players from 16's and up to play in the U18 competition. These teams then played all season and trained together and got proper development for their mind and body. there was nutrition and weights coaches available for each team and a panel of coaches. through this competition the U18 state team won the second division one year and came runner up another year. they also got 4 - 5 players drafted eg. mitch hahn, michael osborne, Robert Copeland.

However the local brisbane clubs kicked up such a stink that these teams were raping their club of talent and leaving a large whole in their own U18 sides. Thus the league succumbed to pressure of the clubs and turned the U18 state carnival into the Round robin joke that it is today. Players can not develop into AFL footballers with 3 months floggings that they get pre season with their respective Rep sides. I say bring back proper season long competitions and develop these lads into Mentally strong and physically strong footballers ready to cope with playing against the stronger states of football.

If you want to Develop athletes into footballers put them into a rep side and let them develop from there don't place them in a state side where they may not cope against a footballer who knows what he is doing. By doing that you are destroying two players confidence and chances..

Current carnival was a great example of what you are talking about, a couple of games had less than a four day turnaround in sloppy conditions the players were very sore. Training was controlled by a format that all regions had to adhere to, they had a schedule to follow and a whistle would blow and players would stand around for 7 minutes so no region actually got better than any other. ( Communist footy).

When will an effort be made to lift the States overall levels of football not fill out people's resumes with achievements that don't count for anything.

Why would a PNG boy who was 20 and played under 18's Qld and GC last year (and on Mt Gravatt's List) be put into the Suncoast Power side, I would have thought he had his time. give a suncoast kid a go for gods sake. These idiots should wake up to themselves.

 

[Lifes a Beach]

For all those interested this is what the Qld Talent pathway program people don't understand:

"I think there's no doubt at the moment you need players who are football smart, it becomes a priority," Lloyd said.
"While that slipped down the pecking order in recent years it can be varied within different footy clubs.
"You've obviously got to have a number of attributes - elite running capacity, endurance, footy smarts and being able to use the ball in a constructive way. I think he's shown all of that to date.

Don't see, or can't see or won't see.

 

[Mighty Pirates]

I was lucky enough to be in the 10 years ago format and what an eye opener.... You had to rock up on time, in the right gear, got good advice from coach/ES not just one bloke, we got worked hard but out of it came a good state side and a few AFL players.... It seemed perfect preparation for moving forward even to State Leage clubs.... Speaking with a current Taipan and the 4 day carnival wrecked most kids and now it is back to club footy?? Interesting to see whether or not it is on the Agenda??

 

[Lifes a Beach]

It seems people involved in these pathway programs in other states notably Victoria have become aware of the vast shortcomings of the Qld pathway programme. In conversation it appears changes will happen over time driven by people with a love of the game, not a career protecting motivation.Unfortunately the current best players in the State not playing for Qld will not benefit in the short term.They will have to go interstate to prove themselves.

Nice to know the truth is surfacing in areas critical to make changes, not just being discussed at grass roots football by hundreds of people every week. The Karma Bus will be arriving for those who have conspired to hold Qld football back.

 

[oldschoolfooty]

It seems people involved in these pathway programs in other states notably Victoria have become aware of the vast shortcomings of the Qld pathway programme. In conversation it appears changes will happen over time driven by people with a love of the game, not a career protecting motivation.Unfortunately the current best players in the State not playing for Qld will not benefit in the short term.They will have to go interstate to prove themselves.

Nice to know the truth is surfacing in areas critical to make changes, not just being discussed at grass roots football by hundreds of people every week. The Karma Bus will be arriving for those who have conspired to hold Qld football back.

Well its about time the group of people that are supposedly "looking after" Queensland football got a bit of a shake up. There has been too much politics and personal development of the people in the admin rather than personal development of the players.

I certainly hope things do change and that it isn't just a lot of hot wind.

 

[Lifes a Beach]

Here it is everyone

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/93671/default.aspx

The footy dads are to blame because they teach their boys to play the game, shame on all of you.

 

[Lifes a Beach]

WA 21.25.151
QLD 4.6.30

For all who have contributed to this thread, the evidence is overwhelming.

 

[Snorkle]

WA 21.25.151
QLD 4.6.30

For all who have contributed to this thread, the evidence is overwhelming.

What more can the system do for these boys who are selected to represent Qld.
Firsty at 17 - 18 and now it seems for a chosen few 19 years of age boys, apart from the rookie search project players, their pathway as it has been said has been well and truly set in stone, with them and them alone as the master of their own destiny.
The selectors can only go on what they see at the QLD Championships and what they are told from the regional managers and coaches of each region etc.

All of the boys that are selected in each regional team that play in the Qld Championships are then given their opportunity to shine, if the written comments in this thread and blogs above are inferring that there are players playing in Qld that are up to representing QLD who are not selected, then I think this is a long way off the mark.

As fathers we all want what is best for our kids but sometimes we must look at reality and admit that we may be wrong at that time, as some players dont reach their full potenial until they have matured to their 20's, and some dont reach the potential that we wish for them at all.
If a player misses out at 18-19 to play for Qld then it is not the end, he will be noticed if he continues to play good footy and he will be offered to play at a Qld state league level and then if he keeps going OK beyond who knows where he could go (clubs and coaches are continualy looking at all levels of footy to strenghten their clubs playing stocks).In the AFL system it is a fair achevement to play for your state as an adult.

Yes we are getting beaten by the traditional AFL states and others at the moment, but in my opinon the standard of AFL Footy in Qld is getting closer and closer to those traditional states with every year, you dont have to win to be considered succsesful the more we compete and learn the better we will become and eventually we will be at a level to be respected.

We shouldnt bich about the best side not being selected for Qld we should be telling all of the kids comming through to take their opportunities they get (some may only get one) in both hand and dont assume you are the best player but be the best player every time you play and I am sure Qld AFL will be better for it.

 

[Western Taipan]

What more can the system do for these boys who are selected to represent Qld.
Firsty at 17 - 18 and now it seems for a chosen few 19 years of age boys, apart from the rookie search project players, their pathway as it has been said has been well and truly set in stone, with them and them alone as the master of their own destiny.
The selectors can only go on what they see at the QLD Championships and what they are told from the regional managers and coaches of each region etc.

All of the boys that are selected in each regional team that play in the Qld Championships are then given their opportunity to shine, if the written comments in this thread and blogs above are inferring that there are players playing in Qld that are up to representing QLD who are not selected, then I think this is a long way off the mark.

As fathers we all want what is best for our kids but sometimes we must look at reality and admit that we may be wrong at that time, as some players dont reach their full potenial until they have matured to their 20's, and some dont reach the potential that we wish for them at all.
If a player misses out at 18-19 to play for Qld then it is not the end, he will be noticed if he continues to play good footy and he will be offered to play at a Qld state league level and then if he keeps going OK beyond who knows where he could go (clubs and coaches are continualy looking at all levels of footy to strenghten their clubs playing stocks).In the AFL system it is a fair achevement to play for your state as an adult.

Yes we are getting beaten by the traditional AFL states and others at the moment, but in my opinon the standard of AFL Footy in Qld is getting closer and closer to those traditional states with every year, you dont have to win to be considered succsesful the more we compete and learn the better we will become and eventually we will be at a level to be respected.

We shouldnt bich about the best side not being selected for Qld we should be telling all of the kids comming through to take their opportunities they get (some may only get one) in both hand and dont assume you are the best player but be the best player every time you play and I am sure Qld AFL will be better for it.

Sornkle
I agree with you with my boys involment i find the programs as good as anything Victoria has to offer since recently moving here.
There seems to be an anti AFLQ feeling amonst the posters, but given the number of boys drafted form local footy compared to Rookie search kids all boys are given an equal opportunity to preform to be picked in a State team.
Who are the boys that have missed out?????????

 

[Snorkle]

Sornkle
I agree with you with my boys involment i find the programs as good as anything Victoria has to offer since recently moving here.
There seems to be an anti AFLQ feeling amonst the posters, but given the number of boys drafted form local footy compared to Rookie search kids all boys are given an equal opportunity to preform to be picked in a State team.
Who are the boys that have missed out?????????

Western Taipan, you sound like a dad who dosen't put pressure on your kids or don't blame the system and those who run it if things go against them.

In answer to your question: I dont know of to many boys that in the past that have been up to it or have show some special talent that havent been given a go, there are too many kids running around in the state league system at the moment that stand out without being given a go in the system, but not withstanding that if I am wrong, if they are there, they only have to play good footy to eventualy get there chance.
To be lucky enough too play at a state league and then be a long shot from that to go on to an AFL level - it all starts with ability first, then opportunity and in most cases it ends with peoples opinions usually the kids that listen, learn, keep under the radar and play well make it, the ones who dont make it usually find a level of involvement and thats where they stay. That is why this game is so great

You dont have to play at an AFL level to be a sucsess, just playing the game at any level is a great achivement as I have said once or twice before - sucsess is measured not by your B & F medals, or your premierships, or even by your riches - it is measured only by your peers, it's called respect.