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Why isn't there a player revolt?

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Lizardempire said:
If what you are saying is true and there is evidence that substantiates that assertion then of course they will be found guilty. It is a big if and currently your statement is an assertion and not fact.
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Not a big if by any imagination. And I would call it an accusation rather than an assertion.
 

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yaco55 said:
I am certain that Paul Gallen was NSW's best player award in the State of origin.
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Is that a significant thing? It's like being best on for one of our blockbuster afl games. Possibly beneath notice for anti doping agencies (it's no flag or Dalley M)
 
yaco55 said:
I am certain that Paul Gallen was NSW's best player award in the State of origin.
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He received a MOTM in game three, but where is this best player award from 2011? Its usually only awarded to the victorious state.
 
Valleyboy9 said:
Who cares you say...
Probably the players...
But you sit back and relax....
Keep feeding your delusional thoughts
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What, about the NAB cup being shit?
 
yaco55 said:
He brings up cases where athletes give up previous results, return prizemoney etc in a negotiated plea bargain
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Nothing to do with negotiated plea bargain. It's part of the rules, and part of the penalty.

Look at who won the Tour de France in 2010 and the Giro in 2011 - it wasn't the guy who was first across the line, and being stripped of the titles and the substantial amount of prize-money that went with them wasn't as a result of a plea bargain, it was a penalty. P E N A L T Y.

Applied retrospectively. You live in a parallel universe Yaco.
 
yaco55 said:
Every sport frames rules that pertain to the WADA code - I doubt that ASADA has the power or the authority to strip Watson of his Brownlow Medal. ASADA and USADA have different powers.
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Sigh ... it's like shooting fish in a barrel.

USADA don't have any more powers than ASADA. They didn't strip Armstrong of anything. They recommended (R E C O M M E N D E D) a penalty, which cycling's governing body (UCI) accepted and applied.
 
Crankyhawk said:
Is that a significant thing? It's like being best on for one of our blockbuster afl games. Possibly beneath notice for anti doping agencies (it's no flag or Dalley M)
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State of Origin is a big thing in the NRL.
 

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yaco55 said:
Best scenario is players are found not guilty - I wonder if players are found guilty if this will embolden ASADA to investigate other clubs?
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Entirely possible. Have said the same myself a bit on this board.

Chief will be happy - HTB a permanent fixture?


Another team....

You and Echols can be on the same side fighting Fabulous Phil who will no doubt defend anyone even if a needle is sticking out of player x's eyeball.
 
Dapperd0n said:
Who cares mate???????
The NAB cup will be shit either way. Calm your t***ies.
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Nooooo! NAB Cup is a place where Melboune could win something. Also, it is necessary game practice. I would be alarmed if Melbourne pulled most or all of their players - everyone else's season start would be significantly better prep for the H&A.

Not unrelated - I got drunk and did something stupid on Saturday. I came up with a 'definitive' ladder prediction, bet $500 bucks on it and it brings in Melbourne as finishing 11th on the ladder. And my email sent folder suggests I have sent it to 72 individuals, many of which I will encounter today. What am I going to do?
 
Proper Gander said:
Nooooo! NAB Cup is a place where Melboune could win something. Also, it is necessary game practice. I would be alarmed if Melbourne pulled most or all of their players - everyone else's season start would be significantly better prep for the H&A.

Not unrelated - I got drunk and did something stupid on Saturday. I came up with a 'definitive' ladder prediction, bet $500 bucks on it and it brings in Melbourne as finishing 11th on the ladder. And my email sent folder suggests I have sent it to 72 individuals, many of which I will encounter today. What am I going to do?
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Firstly, I apologise. And yeah I did the same thing with LinkedIn....
 
Proper Gander said:
Nooooo! NAB Cup is a place where Melboune could win something. Also, it is necessary game practice. I would be alarmed if Melbourne pulled most or all of their players - everyone else's season start would be significantly better prep for the H&A.

Not unrelated - I got drunk and did something stupid on Saturday. I came up with a 'definitive' ladder prediction, bet $500 bucks on it and it brings in Melbourne as finishing 11th on the ladder. And my email sent folder suggests I have sent it to 72 individuals, many of which I will encounter today. What am I going to do?
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Calm your t***ies as the boy said
 
yaco55 said:
State of Origin is a big thing in the NRL.
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Like has been explained to you already, Gallen is a NSW player, he was found guitly of taking drugs in 2011, QLD won the state of origin in 2006,2007,2008,2009,2010,2011,2012 and 2013.So what state of origin accolades should Gallen be stripped of from 2011? Remove a loss from his trophy cabinet?, His team Cronulla has yet to win any trophies so 2011 saw them win no awards either. You keep banging on about double punishment ets, it seems the NRL had no problem penalising the Melbourne Storm for salary cap cheating, they removed Grand finals from their record books and shock horror that was also retrospectively.
 
Proper Gander said:
Ah. Yeah, I probably just imagined the bit about them being allowed to play because it wasn't an afl match. I couldn't remember where I got the info, so it follows I probably dreamed it.
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There was definitely an article floating around pushing that angle. I skimmed it and can't remember too much what it was on about.
 

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Proper Gander said:
Does anyone actually know what exactly the wrong information given by ASADA actually was - I mean, what was actually said? And to whom?

If it was anything like the "interaction" between Dank and WADA - I would argue that Essendon are a lot less innocent victim like then their supporters sometimes make them out to be.

But what was said by ASADA? I don't think I have ever read what it was, just been spammed with dozens of ASADA gave poor players bad advice posts
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I haven't seen this advice either as it hasn't been released. It is the only hypothesis to my mind that fits with McDevitt's nobody could've known it was banned story, that's why I assumed it existed. I'm yet to hear a credible explanation of how ASADA can make that proclamation other than this.
 
bing181 said:
Perhaps - but ASADA aren't the governing body, in regards to drugs-in-sport, it's WADA. In any case, I don't believe any of the players contacted ASADA to check on the status of anything.

But I just don't get this line of reasoning at all. If you steal a Mars bar from a supermarket, whether you get caught or not, it's still stealing. It's the act itself that determines whether something is illegal, not a) what you believed or b) whether you were prosecuted or not. If you did it, you did it.
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I know ASADA aren't the governing body, just WADA's rep. I don't doubt that the players didn't contact ASADA either, we're in furious agreement there.

I don't agree with the analogy though. It's not a matter of not getting caught, we've had a player admit on national TV to it. We've had the national body say nobody could've known it was illegal at the time, that's not like doing something which you know is wrong and getting away with it.
 
Crankyhawk said:
Therefore as a result of the stuff up on the ACC report ASADA are no chance of prosecuting AOD unless there's a ruling that says if you take something prohibited you are suspended even if ASADA tell you it was ok to use. That said the tax code operates this way (if an ATO person gives you incorrect direction you still have to pay the balance of the back taxes)
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You mean like this rule:

From the AFL Anti-Doping Code:

20.2 In performing its functions under this Code or otherwise, ASADA is not and must not be deemed to be the agent of the AFL. For the avoidance of doubt, it is expressly stated that ASADA has no authority or capacity on behalf of the AFL to:
(a) authorise or approve the use of any substance or method prohibited under this code;

Or how about:

5.3 Persons to whom this Code applies are specifically cautioned:
(c) It is the obligation of each Person to whom this Code applies to inform himself of all substances and methods prohibited under this Code. It is not a defence to any claim that a Person has breached this Code for that Person to contend:
(ii) an honest and reasonable, but mistaken, belief that a substance or method is not prohibited under this Code.
 
ASADA hasn't publicly admitted the real reason why it didn't pursue AOD. McDevitt's radio interview just looks like an attempt to whitewash the issue.

Reading between the lines I think what happened is that ASADA itself was unaware of AOD's S0 status under the code at the start of the investigation. Their initial interviewers then gave assurances to the players not to worry about AOD in order to coerce co-operation, confusing their role between advisory/compliance and investigation, and once done it would have become impossible to prosecute without embarrassing arguments from the defence about improperly obtained evidence. The notion though that anyone connected with Essendon asked ASADA about AOD in 2012 and received incorrect advice prior to starting the program has no basis.

In other words, the players got off because of ASADA's incompetence in interpreting the code and then in its investigation of AOD use, not because of any real ambiguity about AOD's banned status.
 

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