Toast Why we didn't replace Fevola

[Guff]

Talia will never be a power forward.Move along nothing to see here people

 

[Sin City]

Talia will never be a power forward.Move along nothing to see here people

Agree 100%

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

Here is the Carlton explanation as to why we picked the best available midfielder in the draft, some of the bullshit coming out of some Carlton supporters mouths makes me sick. We will be ok we have quality talls, we have a new recruit in Waite, and from everything I have heard about our #12 he sounds like a genuine gun. I for one am going to support these kids and I have faith they will turn out to be stars. Here is the article http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/why-we-didnt-replace-fevola/story-e6frf9jf-1225805942217, we don't need to turn on each other, or our recruiting staff we will be A OK in 2010.

Aside from the name calling and post degeneration, there was nothing wrong with having the discussion on these boards (Talia vs Lucas). Carlton having a meeting and asking WHs about his selections to discuss it only validates that it worth a discussion on these boards.

Of course bigfooty discussions are permeated with half the people crying over spilt milk for not choosing a tall, who are equally offset by WHs personal secret service. This means any discussion hits the skids pretty quickly.

WH's stating Talia injury as a concern could be offset by the Judd/Selwood arguments and many more. He should just stick to best available without the injury stuff for mine.

Despite being an instigator of discussion on a tall, i was hardly crying in my milk, I just wanted Carlton to take Talia for structure. Lucas will def improve our midfield a lot and is a welcome addition to the Carlton ranks. I also think Lucas will tip Carlton's midfield into the best midfield brgiade in the leaguie over the next two years. I'm def excited by that!

 

[Sin City]

WH's stating Talia injury as a concern could be offset by the Judd/Selwood arguments and many more. He should just stick to best available without the injury stuff for mine.

Despite being an instigator of discussion on a tall, i was hardly crying in my milk, I just wanted Carlton to take Talia for structure. Lucas will def improve our midfield a lot and is a welcome addition to the Carlton ranks. I also think Lucas will tip Carlton's midfield into the best midfield brgiade in the leaguie over the next two years. I'm def excited by that!

Good post BG2011. I'm just wondering why you don't think inflammation of the tendons in the hamstring in an eighteen year old is that important?

I personally think every injury should be assessed on its merits and not other peoples unrelated injuries.

 

[Bluebear]

Probably the same winging minority that protested getting rid of Fev.

Actually I think it's the same minority that were "shattered" we didn't take Rich, now telling us we can't fit in any more midfielders.

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

Good post BG2011. I'm just wondering why you don't think inflammation of the tendons in the hamstring in an eighteen year old is that important?

I personally think every injury should be assessed on its merits and not other peoples unrelated injuries.

It is important Sin but Adelaide still chose him knowing that as well and I rate Craig probably the highest of all the AFL coaches going round at the minute. He knows what he is doing and understands injury/fitness mgmt having held that position previously. Also, you have to remember Judd's shoulder meant he dropped and Selwood's injury also meant he dropped. Sometimes the concerns don't work out in the long run.

Mostly Adelaide still picked him anyway and they are a VERY professional crew.

 

[Bluebear]

WH's stating Talia injury as a concern could be offset by the Judd/Selwood arguments and many more. He should just stick to best available without the injury stuff for mine.

Right.......because Talia was actually a replacement for Hartlett, not Fev.

I agree to some extent that injury concerns should be assessed on their merits.........and players will slide due to those concerns sometimes. However, WH went for best available, and most PD's that I saw had Lucas firmly inside the top 10. End of story. Moore to Port bumped him out and we were the lucky ones.

As for whether you take a punt on a young KPP with dodgy hammies:

Gumbleton board.

 

[40yearBLUE]

Aside from the name calling and post degeneration, there was nothing wrong with having the discussion on these boards (Talia vs Lucas). Carlton having a meeting and asking WHs about his selections to discuss it only validates that it worth a discussion on these boards.

Of course bigfooty discussions are permeated with half the people crying over spilt milk for not choosing a tall, who are equally offset by WHs personal secret service. This means any discussion hits the skids pretty quickly.

WH's stating Talia injury as a concern could be offset by the Judd/Selwood arguments and many more. He should just stick to best available without the injury stuff for mine.

Despite being an instigator of discussion on a tall, i was hardly crying in my milk, I just wanted Carlton to take Talia for structure. Lucas will def improve our midfield a lot and is a welcome addition to the Carlton ranks. I also think Lucas will tip Carlton's midfield into the best midfield brgiade in the leaguie over the next two years. I'm def excited by that!

Hughes did not mention the injury concerns over Talia, the journo that wrote the piece did.

And unless it has slipped your attention, YOU (and those like you, I dont need to list you we all know who you are) are the ferals that were mentioned in the article complaining like sissies on internet forums.

 

[Bluebear]

It is important Sin but Adelaide still chose him knowing that as well and I rate Craig probably the highest of all the AFL coaches going round at the minute. He knows what he is doing and understands injury/fitness mgmt having held that position previously. Also, you have to remember Judd's shoulder meant he dropped and Selwood's injury also meant he dropped. Sometimes the concerns don't work out in the long run.

Mostly Adelaide still picked him anyway and they are a VERY professional crew.

You might want to look back at their history......they did take Pfieffer in the first round........Brad Moran........there are others.

You pick 2 players that have gone on to be amongst the best in the AFL.

Possibly the exceptions that prove the rule............and if you read the article, WH doesn't actually say the injury had anything to do with his selections, the author of the article did:

"I really hope Daniel has a good career with Adelaide, but as I said earlier, we are comfortable with our selections," Hughes said.

Before the draft there was a slight medical query on Talia given some recent hamstring problems that were said to be "tendinitis on the hamstrings". (This is not a quote from WH)

But Hughes preferred to concentrate on the players taken by Carlton:

 

[GPW1]

hey remember when geelong only had mooney as a key forward, but still went and recuited joel selwood, despite already having ablett, bartel, corey, ling, enright, chapman, wojo. what a complete balls up that was. i can just see us heading down that disasterous path.


oh wait...

 

[Shambolic]

The saddest thing is that Hughes honestly believes he has to come out in the media and justify why he has drafted the players he has. What a media whore. That alone should send alarm bells ringing.

Fact is:

It takes a good recruiter to take the best avaliable.

It takes a GREAT recruiter to take the best available with a view to the club's next premiership.

WH is a good recruiter, but is NOT EVEN CLOSE to a great one.

If youve ever talked to Wayne you'd realise he is anything but a media whore. no doubt he'd prefer to stay quiet on all things publicly.

STG your facts might be right, but must be weighed up with:

It is moronic to take a lower rated player with your first pick. Hughes thinks he's got a top 10 pick here.

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

Right.......because Talia was actually a replacement for Hartlett, not Fev.

I agree to some extent that injury concerns should be assessed on their merits.........and players will slide due to those concerns sometimes. However, WH went for best available, and most PD's that I saw had Lucas firmly inside the top 10. End of story. Moore to Port bumped him out and we were the lucky ones.

As for whether you take a punt on a young KPP with dodgy hammies:

Gumbleton board.

Hi Bluebear

I dont really want to start more posts on this whole topic as it has been done to death and incites craziness. More than the Judd/Selwood injury argument, the most important factor I would say is Adelaide would know about his injury and despite this took him at 13 anyway.

Also, I have never said he is a replacement for Fev...all previous discussion were about him being a tall who could potential play multiple positions as required. Most of our non rucks are at the lower end of 190 cms except Waite, Talia is 195+ cm and just gives that bit more height option when we play certain teams. Of course..Lucas gives us just that much more quality/speed in them midfield. All personal preference discussed to death.

I'm ok with Lucas. No one is wrong who wanted Lucas, and no one is wrong who wanted Talia as a different recruiter may have picked Talia for Carlton. It is simply a preference point.

 

[40yearBLUE]

hey remember when geelong only had mooney as a key forward, but still went and recuited joel selwood, despite already having ablett, bartel, corey, ling, enright, chapman, wojo. what a complete balls up that was. i can just see us heading down that disasterous path.


oh wait...

For no other reason than this post (POTY nomination for mine) deserves to be repeated.

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

Hughes did not mention the injury concerns over Talia, the journo that wrote the piece did.

And unless it has slipped your attention, YOU (and those like you, I dont need to list you we all know who you are) are the ferals that were mentioned in the article complaining like sissies on internet forums.

You have just degenerated the post 30y. i'm not sure why you cant understand the underlying point of all my posts in this section.

Given a mid was taken at 12...and a tall was taken at 13...depending on your own personal opinions you should be able to have a decent discussion on these boards without being called a feral.

I have read the numerous posts about mids being the future and you cant have too many...i agree up to a point, but i also think Hawthorn's structuring around buddy/roughie up forward is also an awesome path to follow meaning recruting talls is a viable alternative to lots of mids. All worth discussing without the word feral.

I also agree we have needs all over...mids, winger and flankers. I want us to spend a high pick on each.

 

[ThePine]

hey remember when geelong only had mooney as a key forward, but still went and recuited joel selwood, despite already having ablett, bartel, corey, ling, enright, chapman, wojo. what a complete balls up that was. i can just see us heading down that disasterous path.


oh wait...

I would like to second that nom for POTY.

How could Geelong not have taken Ben Reid! (KPF taken the very next pick) What where they thinking!

 

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

Everyone needs to take two steps back and relax.

If you listen to his demeanor and read between the lines of this answers about not picking a tall at #12 .. what Hugh's is really saying is:

The decision is MINE mofo's.

 

[Alpha1]

I think some people tend to throw in the personal insults to get their point across. We obviously need some more in and under midfielders as well, and Kane and the other boys in Carlton's opinion would do the job for us. Covering the loss of Stevens and building for the future at the same time. Yes we should have maybe picked up a KPP, but I trust the club's decisions and I am definitely not going to sit here on the outside and bag them for picking the best players they could get their hands on. Like I have said according to all reports the three boys we have drafted are gems, Kane is said to have elite skill with his feet and we definitely need a player like that to deliver the ball, the other two are hard nuts and we need more players like Mitch, who can go in hard and get the ball and protect players like Murphy, Gibbs, Judd etc. If we can keep our tall KPP players injury free for the year we have the makings of a very well balanced side.

 

[Bluebear]

I'm glad to see your tone is not one of getting upset, but more discussion. Thanks.

the most important factor I would say is Adelaide would know about his injury and despite this took him at 13 anyway.

True, but different clubs see different things.

The Hawks saw Thorpe and took him at pick 6......the Dogs saw Grant and took him at ? 4 or 5........Henderson went at pick 8.

Henderson is well beyond both. Again I can only come back to the multiple phantom drafts that all had Lucas going top 10.

Everyone had him rated a better player than Talia. So did WH it seems.

Also, I have never said he is a replacement for Fev...all previous discussion were about him being a tall who could potential play multiple positions as required.

The Hartlett comment was tongue in cheek.

Most of our non rucks are at the lower end of 190 cms except Waite, Talia is 195+ cm and just gives that bit more height option when we play certain teams. Of course..Lucas gives us just that much more quality/speed in them midfield. All personal preference discussed to death.

You've touched on a bug bear of mine, and I;m not sure your being accurate.
Henderson is 196, Setanta 199, Austin 194-5, Waite you have mentioned.

Fev was only 191cm.

Not sure why we need this "extra height" and who that would need to cover. Henderson has played on rucks resting forward and aqcuitted himself well, Setanta and Waite, and Austin for that matter can all play either end.

Jamison, Bower and Thornton are versatile enough to play tall or small.

Height up forward? I'd take Le Cras or Porplyzia over Thorpe or Gumbleton.........or Hawkins for that matter. Neither would look don on Yarran height wise.

I'm ok with Lucas. No one is wrong who wanted Lucas, and no one is wrong who wanted Talia as a different recruiter may have picked Talia for Carlton. It is simply a preference point.

That's fine.
Just making discussion as to why I see it differently.

 

[Salaryman]

Can be a huge difference between being tall and a KP player. Ask the Bulldogs. Every man and his dog but Hughes knows we needed a KP player.

There's still a rookie draft to go, bloody hell, relax man.

If we had taken Talia at 12 and traded Adcock for Fevola you wouldn't be saying boo.

 

[Salaryman]

I can see why people we p1ssed and and he had to explain to the Board.

youtube recruiting??

 

[Alpha1]

That's right we have Hendo as well....But don't let facts get in the way of a good sledging.

 

[celtic_pride]

It's ridiculous to suggest the club has made the wrong call at the draft when it's still 4 months away before a ball is kicked in anger in the season proper.
I take the good faith that Carlton's recruiting staff have in Kane Lucas, although clearly they will be hell to pay by some fans if he doesn't have an immediate impact, sadly the pressure placed on these draftees these days is unfair and borderlines on the absurd.

However if the club struggles next year to manage to kick winning/big scores on a consistent basis without an notable reliable tall foward capable of kicking 50 plus goals a season (The irish man will play most of the year around the CHF I suspect and realistically I can't see any other player at Carlton capable of a 50 plus haul next year) then they will have to try and address that issue in next year's draft.

Would hope for improvement from within though, with regards to the development of other smaller fowards like Garlett and Yarran, and hopefully Warnock can come through healthy and be a success in the ruck, which would help have Kruezer spend more time as a foward.

I think though as it stands now criticism of the recruiting of the draftees is pointless and somewhat stupid, considering they have yet to play a game for the navy blue.

 

[Salaryman]

I'm just wondering why you don't think inflammation of the tendons in the hamstring in an eighteen year old is that important?

I personally think every injury should be assessed on its merits and not other peoples unrelated injuries.

Bingo

 

[40yearBLUE]

You have just degenerated the post 30y. i'm not sure why you cant understand the underlying point of all my posts in this section.

Given a mid was taken at 12...and a tall was taken at 13...depending on your own personal opinions you should be able to have a decent discussion on these boards without being called a feral.

I have read the numerous posts about mids being the future and you cant have too many...i agree up to a point, but i also think Hawthorn's structuring around buddy/roughie up forward is also an awesome path to follow meaning recruting talls is a viable alternative to lots of mids. All worth discussing without the word feral.

I also agree we have needs all over...mids, winger and flankers. I want us to spend a high pick on each.

I dont appoligise for one minute about calling the ferals exactly what I think they are.

I did not alert the media to the fact we have ferals here? How do you think they found out?

There is no logical discussion because you have had the flaw in your logic pointed out to you again and again and again but you still come out swinging. Some people just want to whinge for the sake of it. It brings them attention, they are the fish swimming against the tide. Whatever. Even C_P is showing more grace these days.

In my mind, and this is not something new, you can easily read back through hundreds of posts where I display this: you are either a supporter or a barracker. Supporters support the decisions the club makes, barrackers nitpick, the more articulate barrackers manage to disguise their bleak view of the world under the guise of rational discussion.

Same Same to me, all it has done is alert the world that WE are no better than the rabble of Punt Road. And to you (as the bandleader of your merry band of naysayers) I say again a hearty WELL DONE on that score.

 

[Sin City]

It is important Sin but Adelaide still chose him knowing that as well and I rate Craig probably the highest of all the AFL coaches going round at the minute. He knows what he is doing and understands injury/fitness mgmt having held that position previously. Also, you have to remember Judd's shoulder meant he dropped and Selwood's injury also meant he dropped. Sometimes the concerns don't work out in the long run.

Mostly Adelaide still picked him anyway and they are a VERY professional crew.

I can't say i really agree with you there, for a start Craig isn't the recruiter, and as well as the guys BlueBear mentioned, this is the team that drafted James Sellar and Fergus Watts with recent first round picks. Not to mention trading #2 and #18 for Wayne Carey.

In regards to Judd and Selwood's injuries, this was my point, their injuries got better, but neither of them were infammation of the tendons in the hamstring. This is totally different and his training will have to be reduced at best, meaning he will be very underdone. At worst it will hold him back for the rest of his career. If Adelaide want to take that risk then so be it, but as we've pointed out, they don't have a very good track record.