Wicket-Keeper

[ICCHILL007]

Can someone please explain to me how Wade is in the current one day team. He is in really bad form with the bat and the gloves and I can't see why he is in the team. The commentators were saying it must be really hard for Wade at the momment being in the team when he is struggling so much with the bat and gloves. It isnt fair on other players that deserve a chance and it isn't fair on Wade to keep playing him when he is in this form.

 

[bungwahl]

Can someone please explain to me how Wade is in the current one day team. He is in really bad form with the bat and the gloves and I can't see why he is in the team. The commentators were saying it must be really hard for Wade at the momment being in the team when he is struggling so much with the bat and gloves. It isnt fair on other players that deserve a chance and it isn't fair on Wade to keep playing him when he is in this form.

I'm not a big fan of Wade, though he's played one ODI game on this tour so it's probably a tad harsh to be judging him based on the one ball he faced?

 

[ICCHILL007]

I'm not a big fan of Wade, though he's played one ODI game on this tour so it's probably a tad harsh to be judging him based on the one ball he faced?

No, current form below:

Recent matches
Bat & BowlTeamOppositionGroundMatch DateScorecard
0, 1c/0s Australia v England Manchester 8 Sep 2013 ODI # 3412
1c/0s Australia v Scotland Edinburgh 3 Sep 2013 ODI # 3410
1c/0s, 4 Australia v England Chester-le-Street 31 Aug 2013 T20I # 329
15*, 2c/0s Australia v England Southampton 29 Aug 2013 T20I # 328
1c/0s, 38* Australians v Eng Lions Northampton 16 Aug 2013 Other
0, 1c/0s, 30* Australians v Sussex Hove 26 Jul 2013 FC
3*, 3c/0s, 28, 2c/0s Australia A v Gloucs Bristol 21 Jun 2013 FC
0c/0s, 31 Australia v Sri Lanka The Oval 17 Jun 2013 ODI # 3374
29, 0c/0s Australia v New Zealand Birmingham 12 Jun 2013 ODI # 3369
2c/0s, 1 Australia v England Birmingham 8 Jun 2013 ODI # 3365

 

[bungwahl]

No, current form below:

Recent matches
Bat & BowlTeamOppositionGroundMatch DateScorecard
0, 1c/0s Australia v England Manchester 8 Sep 2013 ODI # 3412
1c/0s Australia v Scotland Edinburgh 3 Sep 2013 ODI # 3410
1c/0s, 4 Australia v England Chester-le-Street 31 Aug 2013 T20I # 329
15*, 2c/0s Australia v England Southampton 29 Aug 2013 T20I # 328
1c/0s, 38* Australians v Eng Lions Northampton 16 Aug 2013 Other
0, 1c/0s, 30* Australians v Sussex Hove 26 Jul 2013 FC
3*, 3c/0s, 28, 2c/0s Australia A v Gloucs Bristol 21 Jun 2013 FC
0c/0s, 31 Australia v Sri Lanka The Oval 17 Jun 2013 ODI # 3374
29, 0c/0s Australia v New Zealand Birmingham 12 Jun 2013 ODI # 3369
2c/0s, 1 Australia v England Birmingham 8 Jun 2013 ODI # 3365

Wait, you asked why Wade was in the current one day team right? Why are you quoting T20 and FC stats in amongst a sprinkle of ODI games?

 

[ICCHILL007]

Wait, you asked why Wade was in the current one day team right? Why are you quoting T20 and FC stats in amongst a sprinkle of ODI games?

Because that shows what his current form is like

 

[bungwahl]

Because that shows what his current form is like

Not at all.

Conditions and game situations are totally different. It's like Mitchell Johnson bowling a good T20 spell and the newspapers suggesting he's ready for the 1st Test in Brisbane...

Unfortunately an over reliance on statistics is a common pitfall. Wade could well have come in during the slog fest of the T20 games, or just as the ball was reversing in a FC game. If you're talking about ODI cricket you need to be considering ODI form - or at the very least List A form. Wade has played 2 ODI since mid June for a DNB and a golden duck. It's hardly a form line.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

He is currently the most likely for the World Cup, the only time results cound for anything in the 50 over game, and also perhaps the selectors feel that game time is the only way he will gain form.

I don't rate him as a gloveman, but he can bat and if he finds form that's often enough in the shorter versions. Unless his keeping improves beyond what seems possible, he should never get near the Test team again (as a keeper at least). He probably should not be Victoria's number one keeper in the Shield.

 

[courtjester]

Should be opening in ODIs

 

[Wallaby]

Should be opening in ODIs

He might tonight -surely the Shaun Marsh experiment is over.

 

[TassieEagle]

He might tonight -surely the Shaun Marsh experiment is over.

His ton against Scotland will keep him in the side for the rest of the series.

 

[ICCHILL007]

He might tonight -surely the Shaun Marsh experiment is over.

lol Shaun Marsh is a good player, one of very few class players in Australia at the momment

 

[ICCHILL007]

Not at all.

Conditions and game situations are totally different. It's like Mitchell Johnson bowling a good T20 spell and the newspapers suggesting he's ready for the 1st Test in Brisbane...

Unfortunately an over reliance on statistics is a common pitfall. Wade could well have come in during the slog fest of the T20 games, or just as the ball was reversing in a FC game. If you're talking about ODI cricket you need to be considering ODI form - or at the very least List A form. Wade has played 2 ODI since mid June for a DNB and a golden duck. It's hardly a form line.

Cricket is cricket , why do you think that Wade will suddenly dominate 50 overs games if he can't score any runs against poor sides in a 4 day games , poor batting form doesnt just disappear because you are now playing a 50 over game, look at Trott is last one dayer - same problem he had in the test matches.

 

[Phone]

scoring tons against scotland and registering ducks against england is hardly helping his PR....

but anyway, if marsh gets dropped, watson returns to opening and hughes comes back into the team and wade stays where he is. in fact, far more criticism should be coming the team's way for stupidly moving watson down.

 

[Zach Package]

lol Shaun Marsh is a good player, one of very few class players in Australia at the momment

If Shaun Marsh could get his head and his body right, he could average 45+ for Australia, extremely elegant and talented.

Problem with that is he'll never get his shit together

 

[bungwahl]

Cricket is cricket , why do you think that Wade will suddenly dominate 50 overs games if he can't score any runs against poor sides in a 4 day games , poor batting form doesnt just disappear because you are now playing a 50 over game, look at Trott is last one dayer - same problem he had in the test matches.

That's an overly simplistic view which fails to acknowledge that there is a vast difference between each of the formats. All the great players will tell you that cricket is a mental game, and the mentality between each format is not necessarily the same.

To say poor ODI form can be judged by looking across different formats means you must apply the same logic to good form, right? So a batsman who grinds out 100* from 350 balls in a determined FC innings must therefore be acknowledged as being in-form in ODI or T20? It simply doesn't make sense.

Yes the skills are the same, but the mentality is different.

 

[Caesar]

Wade was dire again last night. Who's next in line for the ODI gig, out of interest?

 

[CakeEater]

Wade was dire again last night. Who's next in line for the ODI gig, out of interest?

Phil Hughes Caesar

Was a nice drop of Bopara by Wade.

 

[Caesar]

I mean real keeper.

 

[CakeEater]

Well Triffit is done for- couldnt even crack a game for WA.
Its either Paine or Hartley really at this stage.

 

[The_Reaper]

Would love Hartley in the test team.

Much to be said for a top quality keeper.

 

[Ashton Agar]

That drop yesterday when Watson was bowling, well... It was simply pathetic.

Paine is the man. I like Wade but come on... (I like Paine too lol.)

 

[passmark]

Wade is just not neat enough with the gloves.
We need better.

 

[Phone]

It's a bit like his T20 problem in that he bats so far down the order he often has more attention on his gloves than his batting. But as long as Watson remains in the team and we decide to bat someone like Voges at number 6 instead of a bit part all-rounder at 7, the keeper will bat no higher than 7.

Last game Wade actually got to come in before the game was lost/with more than 5 overs to bat and did fairly decently, but the reality is in 16 games at 7 or lower he's not batted in 3 innings, and faced an average of 15 balls in the other 13 innings. For comparison, in the 16 games where he's batted in the top 3, he's faced on average 40 balls an innings. Just like in T20 cricket, it's debatable how suitable Wade is for the role he's filling, he's having not much asked of him with the bat, which means the pressure to avoid mistakes with the gloves is higher.

Of course, the main thing saving Wade is that in domestic cricket we don't have a wicket-keeper playing a good and important role in the middle order, like a Jos Butler or MSD. Nevill is the closest, but he's not performing the role in a manner that could be described good. We just have a bunch of guys like Hartley, Luderman and Paine who are thrown up and down the order. The selectors would be smart to advise their state counterparts to bat their wicket-keepers outside the opening spots in the forthcoming Ryobi cup....

 

[ICCHILL007]

That's an overly simplistic view which fails to acknowledge that there is a vast difference between each of the formats. All the great players will tell you that cricket is a mental game, and the mentality between each format is not necessarily the same.

To say poor ODI form can be judged by looking across different formats means you must apply the same logic to good form, right? So a batsman who grinds out 100* from 350 balls in a determined FC innings must therefore be acknowledged as being in-form in ODI or T20? It simply doesn't make sense.

Yes the skills are the same, but the mentality is different.

No, I said nothing about good form by scoring slow runs in 4 day cricket transferring to one day cricket form. All I was saying is bad form follows you in all forms of cricket. If you are in bad form in 4 day cricket and can't score a run then you will also be in bad form in one day cricket.

If you like Wade so much go and watch the replays of the last two matches and you will see why he isnt up to playing for Australia. Dropped a simple catch again two games ago and in the last game scored another duck against poor bowlers on a easy batting wicket.

 

[bungwahl]

No, I said nothing about good form by scoring slow runs in 4 day cricket transferring to one day cricket form. All I was saying is bad form follows you in all forms of cricket. If you are in bad form in 4 day cricket and can't score a run then you will also be in bad form in one day cricket.

If you like Wade so much go and watch the replays of the last two matches and you will see why he isnt up to playing for Australia. Dropped a simple catch again two games ago and in the last game scored another duck against poor bowlers on a easy batting wicket.

Read the very first response I gave you: "I'm not a big fan of Wade" ... I have merely argued that your logic is flawed. At no time have I said anything in defence of Wade or tried to argue that he was in good form.

Do you not see the glaring issue with your logic? Bad form follows you in all types of cricket, but good form doesn't?? That's absurd - it has to be both or none. Personally I'd say that each format of cricket is a different game and form does not always transcend formats. Go back through the records and look at batsman such as Shane Watson who has had many bad spells in the longer forms, whilst often putting in a good performance in an ODI or T20.

One thing is for sure, you cannot use a mix of stats from ODI, FC, T20, List A, and Tests to form your analysis on ODI cricket.