Young Guns

[Bombers36]

I was thinking our list is a little on the 'mature' side so I decided to try put together a team from our current list of players who were born in 1990 or after - and I have to say I was pleasantly surprised that it was much easier than I thought;-

Ambrose Hartley Dea
Gleeson Hurley McKenna
Colyer Heppell Parish
Laverde Daniher Fantasia
Francis Brown Tippa

McKernan Zakka Z.Merrett

Langford Long Redman A.Heppell

I am very exited by the development of a lot of these guys - Long, McKenna & A.Heppell come to mind as 3 that can really make big improvements in 2017.

 

[eth-dog]

Aaron Heppell isn't even on our AFL list ffs.

Also, 26 isn't exactly "young" either.

 

[Bombers36]

Aaron Heppell isn't even on our AFL list ffs.

Also, 26 isn't exactly "young" either.

Will be sup list in 2017 bookmark it

 

[Donakebab]

If 26 is considered young then there's hope for us old timers yet.

 

[Big Fresh]

Aaron Heppell isn't even on our AFL list ffs.

Also, 26 isn't exactly "young" either.

If 26 is considered young then there's hope for us old timers yet.

There's a decent chance they'd still be on the list in five years; they're relevant to the long term future of the team.

 

[Bombers36]

There's a decent chance they'd still be on the list in five years; they're relevant to the long term future of the team.

yeah thanks Big Fresh - that was my point

 

[eth-dog]

There's a decent chance they'd still be on the list in five years; they're relevant to the long term future of the team.

26 years old is above the average age of the AFL; ergo not "young".

 

[Big Fresh]

26 years old is above the average age of the AFL; ergo not "young".

It's not young, but discussions of youth at a club are really about the future of the list, and 26 year olds are a factor in that, even if there's less room for development in them.

 

[Bombers36]

26 years old is above the average age of the AFL; ergo not "young".

OK ethan - whatever - there's only 4 in that team of 22 that are over the hill at 26 then...
Its still a good young side and hopefully most of those names will be on our list in 4 or 5 years

 

[eth-dog]

It's not young, but discussions of youth at a club are really about the future of the list, and 26 year olds are a factor in that, even if there's less room for development in them.

"Young guns" imply that they're below the average age of the AFL. 26 is above the average age of the AFL, and therefore not young.

Also fail to see why this couldn't be in the "makeup of our list" thread.

 

[eth-dog]

OK ethan - whatever - there's only 4 in that team of 22 that are over the hill at 26 then...
Its still a good young side and hopefully most of those names will be on our list in 4 or 5 years

Where did I say they were over the hill? I said they're not young; which they aren't.

 

[Doss]

If your benchmark is 26 then Jackson Merrett absolutely needs to be in the conversation.

 

[Bombers36]

If your benchmark is 26 then Jackson Merrett absolutely needs to be in the conversation.

haha - yep fair call I did miss Jackson

 

[Seagrave_Holmes]

22 and under is 'young'.

 

[scanlon]

The retirement age is going up at the moment. Players are more durable and can play for longer. Would t worry too much about 26 year olds still playing good footy in 5 years

 

[Lore]

I was thinking our list is a little on the 'mature' side so I decided to try put together a team from our current list of players who were born in 1990 or after - and I have to say I was pleasantly surprised that it was much easier than I thought;-

Ambrose Hartley Dea
Gleeson Hurley McKenna
Colyer Heppell Parish
Laverde Daniher Fantasia
Francis Brown Tippa

McKernan Zakka Z.Merrett

Langford Long Redman A.Heppell

I am very exited by the development of a lot of these guys - Long, McKenna & A.Heppell come to mind as 3 that can really make big improvements in 2017.

Well maybe 'young' was the wrong term, but I like the idea and I think a cut-off of 26 is fair. It's probably more technically a 'not "mature"' 22

Over 30s across the league that haven't retired or been delisted (yet?);
6 - Fremantle
5 - Greater Western Sydney, Hawthorn, St Kilda
4 - Essendon, Geelong, North Melbourne, Western Bulldogs
3 - Gold Coast Suns, West Coast Eagles
2 - Sydney
1 - Adelaide, Carlton, Melbourne, Richmond

The age profiles of all teams (as of April next year) actually look like this;

(Totals include rookies, I imagine teams with bigger lists at this point are anticipating trading a few out. Age brackets are arbitrary.)

 

[Drummer_19]

Read the title as Young campaigners

 

[sameolds33]

Well maybe 'young' was the wrong term, but I like the idea and I think a cut-off of 26 is fair. It's probably more technically a 'not "mature"' 22

Over 30s across the league that haven't retired or been delisted (yet?);
6 - Fremantle
5 - Greater Western Sydney, Hawthorn, St Kilda
4 - Essendon, Geelong, North Melbourne, Western Bulldogs
3 - Gold Coast Suns, West Coast Eagles
2 - Sydney
1 - Adelaide, Carlton, Melbourne, Richmond

The age profiles of all teams (as of April next year) actually look like this;
View attachment 297984
(Totals include rookies, I imagine teams with bigger lists at this point are anticipating trading a few out. Age brackets are arbitrary.)

Interesting table. Everyone (rightly) goes on about the GWS team being full of young guns and yet they have the equal highest number of players in the 30 - 33 bracket.

 

[TheBrightSide]

Leon Baker was 28 when he joined the Bombers, so 26 isn't too bad.

 

[BrunoV]

I think the way you judge the overall health of a list is when you look at the quality of the players who have 6 to 10+ years left in their careers and how they are complimented by the players who have 100 games left in their respective careers (excluding any players who are the wrong side of 30). There tends to be an overreaction to average ages which does not factor in the ability of a club to transition a side over time without rendering that side uncompetitive.

The next hundred games is what it will take to continue the turnover of a list with new recruits. I don't see there being a problem with a list as long as there are enough players with 100 quality games left to enable the continual evolution of a list. The days of bottoming out for two to four years should be a thing of the past (though teams who are at the top for extended periods might end up feeling the pinch because they justifiably hold on to veterans for a bit longer). Of course there will always be teams on the bottom of the ladder but it should end up being like Fremantle this year with one year dips which balance back out just as quickly.

As for the quality of our really young talent, I agree that we are as well placed as any club (though GWS will obviously have us covered for depth). While we've probably only got Daniher (who will be the best KPF of the next 8 or so years) and Hartley as long term key positions options we've easily got the next hundred games covered with Hooker, Hurley and Leuenberger still at the peak of their respective powers for the next 3 to 4 years. There is plenty of time to bring in the next generation of key position players.

It's the midfield that is probably most exciting (though it could just as easily be the forward line for the next few years depending on where certain players line up). It's unlike anything that we've assembled in the 20 years of footy that I can remember (probably since the mid-80s when we had a powerhouse midfield at least on paper).

Any side that can count on 10 years of footy from the likes of Heppell, Zach Merrett, Langford, Laverde and Parish has a core of midfielders that will set that club up for 10 years. There will be at least one more player of that quality, and possibly better, (pick 1) added in a month together with what will almost certainly be one more quality midfielder (pick 19).

Fantasia and McKenna have numerous elite attributes. If Fantasia plays 2017 at the same standard as 2016 he'll be in the top handful of small forwards in the game (while I don't expect non-Essendon opinion to agree my view is that he is already there). He could also add genuine pace and run to the middle.

McKenna is a powerhouse who will either settle at half back where he has the speed to be a game breaker or he could even move up to a wing or into the midfield proper. EFC fans ought to be as excited about McKenna as anyone, he's basically the prototype when it comes to his physical attributes and the rate of improvement displayed over two years suggests that he will have no trouble translating it into quality AFL football for the long term.

I look at Gleeson as someone who is good for another 200 games of high quality from this point as a mid-sized defender/half back.

Redman has been really impressive at half forward particularly at VFL level where he has shown the ability to control the forward line.

It's still difficult to predict where Francis will end up being used but he has as much ability as anyone.

As long as it is as a small forward Tippa is another with a long career ahead of him.

Long is the last player we've seen. He does not look out of place at AFL level. I take my lead from Dodoro who does absolutely nothing to manage expectations in relation to Long. Long's capacity to work off the ball that will make or break him as the rest of the game is in his genes. His performances at AFL level suggest to me that his making it is a formality.

That's thirteen players we have seen this year that I am confident we will see no less than 10 years from. With two additional picks inside the top 20 lets call it fifteen. That's without having seen anything of Eades, Morgan and Nyuon.

In Laverde and Langford I see two players who can be good enough to go past Zach Merrett (who I think is now our best midfielder). I can see McKenna as one of the most damaging half backs in the game and I think that Fantasia is pretty much already there as a small forward. Throw in Daniher who I think will be the best key forward in the game and there is a shit load of elite talent.

The best part of is that the talent is that it's on each line. It's part of the reason that I am so impatient with our current list management strategy. The longer we delay getting these players into our side permanently the longer we are delaying a run that will end up with a few flags.

 

[Bombers36]

Great write up Bruno. Love this song;-

 

[Laverde2Smack]

I think the way you judge the overall health of a list is when you look at the quality of the players who have 6 to 10+ years left in their careers and how they are complimented by the players who have 100 games left in their respective careers (excluding any players who are the wrong side of 30). There tends to be an overreaction to average ages which does not factor in the ability of a club to transition a side over time without rendering that side uncompetitive.

The next hundred games is what it will take to continue the turnover of a list with new recruits. I don't see there being a problem with a list as long as there are enough players with 100 quality games left to enable the continual evolution of a list. The days of bottoming out for two to four years should be a thing of the past (though teams who are at the top for extended periods might end up feeling the pinch because they justifiably hold on to veterans for a bit longer). Of course there will always be teams on the bottom of the ladder but it should end up being like Fremantle this year with one year dips which balance back out just as quickly.

As for the quality of our really young talent, I agree that we are as well placed as any club (though GWS will obviously have us covered for depth). While we've probably only got Daniher (who will be the best KPF of the next 8 or so years) and Hartley as long term key positions options we've easily got the next hundred games covered with Hooker, Hurley and Leuenberger still at the peak of their respective powers for the next 3 to 4 years. There is plenty of time to bring in the next generation of key position players.

It's the midfield that is probably most exciting (though it could just as easily be the forward line for the next few years depending on where certain players line up). It's unlike anything that we've assembled in the 20 years of footy that I can remember (probably since the mid-80s when we had a powerhouse midfield at least on paper).

Any side that can count on 10 years of footy from the likes of Heppell, Zach Merrett, Langford, Laverde and Parish has a core of midfielders that will set that club up for 10 years. There will be at least one more player of that quality, and possibly better, (pick 1) added in a month together with what will almost certainly be one more quality midfielder (pick 19).

Fantasia and McKenna have numerous elite attributes. If Fantasia plays 2017 at the same standard as 2016 he'll be in the top handful of small forwards in the game (while I don't expect non-Essendon opinion to agree my view is that he is already there). He could also add genuine pace and run to the middle.

McKenna is a powerhouse who will either settle at half back where he has the speed to be a game breaker or he could even move up to a wing or into the midfield proper. EFC fans ought to be as excited about McKenna as anyone, he's basically the prototype when it comes to his physical attributes and the rate of improvement displayed over two years suggests that he will have no trouble translating it into quality AFL football for the long term.

I look at Gleeson as someone who is good for another 200 games of high quality from this point as a mid-sized defender/half back.

Redman has been really impressive at half forward particularly at VFL level where he has shown the ability to control the forward line.

It's still difficult to predict where Francis will end up being used but he has as much ability as anyone.

As long as it is as a small forward Tippa is another with a long career ahead of him.

Long is the last player we've seen. He does not look out of place at AFL level. I take my lead from Dodoro who does absolutely nothing to manage expectations in relation to Long. Long's capacity to work off the ball that will make or break him as the rest of the game is in his genes. His performances at AFL level suggest to me that his making it is a formality.

That's thirteen players we have seen this year that I am confident we will see no less than 10 years from. With two additional picks inside the top 20 lets call it fifteen. That's without having seen anything of Eades, Morgan and Nyuon.

In Laverde and Langford I see two players who can be good enough to go past Zach Merrett (who I think is now our best midfielder). I can see McKenna as one of the most damaging half backs in the game and I think that Fantasia is pretty much already there as a small forward. Throw in Daniher who I think will be the best key forward in the game and there is a shit load of elite talent.

The best part of is that the talent is that it's on each line. It's part of the reason that I am so impatient with our current list management strategy. The longer we delay getting these players into our side permanently the longer we are delaying a run that will end up with a few flags.

This is not the delusional pearlers thread is it?

 

[Doss]

Rather than the snide comment, why don't you provide a rebuttal L2S?

 

[DERO]

Not sold on Long TBH. I hope he makes it and his improvement is obvious but he is not clean enough at present. There is a long way to go for him (no pun intended). The rest of Bruno's post I agree 100% with.

 

[sameolds33]

Not sold on Long TBH. I hope he makes it and his improvement is obvious but he is not clean enough at present. There is a long way to go for him (no pun intended). The rest of Bruno's post I agree 100% with.

IDK, you think back to Jobe and his very rocky start to his AFL career and where he is now. There's no certainty with any of these players. I haven't seen much of Long but I like what I've seen so far - the spirit is there. Nothing wrong with also hoping that his body and footy brain will go the distance.