Don't really give a hoot about stats sorry. If you're going to win the GF you need to beat Melbourne, and we won't beat Melbourne with only English rucking.
1 Ruck or 2 ??? The Midfield Performance Misconception!
- Thread starter Charlie Bucket
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Don't really give a hoot about stats sorry. If you're going to win the GF you need to beat Melbourne, and we won't beat Melbourne with only English rucking.
- Nov 16, 2015
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- #52
What are you doing tomorrow champ? I’m building a deck and need a few holes dug.
At the rate you’re going today, you should have them knocked over pretty quickly.
- Sep 22, 2008
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- #53
You can’t answer because you know the correct answer proves your whole thread a complete and utter waste of time
Bravo buckets you’ve outdone yourself this time
100% of the games I've attended where Sweet has played as the lone ruckman, we've won. (3)
100% of the games I've attended where English and Martin rucked in tandem, we've won. (3)
100% of the games I've attended where Martin has played as the lone ruckman, we've won. (1)
I am yet to attend a game where English and Sweet have rucked together.
We haven't won all the games I've attended where English has rucked solo.
I think this is fairly conclusive, and will be the core proposition of a thesis I am working on.
For the record, I am attending tonight. I will be on level 1, city wing, holding a banner that says "What the ruck Bevo?"
100% of the games I've attended where English and Martin rucked in tandem, we've won. (3)
100% of the games I've attended where Martin has played as the lone ruckman, we've won. (1)
I am yet to attend a game where English and Sweet have rucked together.
We haven't won all the games I've attended where English has rucked solo.
I think this is fairly conclusive, and will be the core proposition of a thesis I am working on.
For the record, I am attending tonight. I will be on level 1, city wing, holding a banner that says "What the ruck Bevo?"
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- #55
You can’t answer because you know the correct answer proves your whole thread a complete and utter waste of time
Bravo buckets you’ve outdone yourself this time
To be honest, I haven’t even given the question a proper read.
All I know is it’s the footballing equivalent of asking someone if they’d prefer to meet Jesus or Santa Claus.
The threads not a waste of time. In fact it’s the complete opposite. And also very relevant considering the topic of conversation lately.
You and some others have gone hard that our midfield gets dominated having the sole ruckman, but the stats don’t back that claim up. In fact they reflect the complete opposite.
I’m happy to be shown the stats from other performance indicators by you or others, that coaches and footballing experts use to determine the influence one midfield has over another at stoppages. That’s your best chance of getting out of this hole you’ve dug and not looking like a complete noob.
This thread will be around forever, so feel free to take your time.
Sweet is a marginal upgrade on Martin and we didn’t beat them with that. At what point will the 2nd ruck brigade finally admit it’s nothing to do with Bevo and everything to do with the lack of a Lobb/Marshall/Jackson type on the list
So you only argument now is a ridiculously one sided hypothetical?
- Sep 22, 2008
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- #58
You’re literally claiming the only factor to determine our midfield performance with 1 ruck or 2, is clearance differential - with zero outside factors involved.
That’s how ******* simple your argument is, why would anyone bother proving you wrong when you’ve quite clearly shown just how little you actually know on the subject - you’ve done the job yourself
Quality quality stuff here
- Sep 22, 2008
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- #59
Which one would u choose tho foxy
You’re the one suggesting our midfield is getting destroyed by the lack of a 2nd ruck which is statistically not true.You’re literally claiming the only factor to determine our midfield performance with 1 ruck or 2, is clearance differential - with zero outside factors involved.
That’s how ******* simple your argument is, why would anyone bother proving you wrong when you’ve quite clearly shown just how little you actually know on the subject - you’ve done the job yourself
Quality quality stuff here
If we had a Lobb/Jackson/Marshall type life would be good we wouldn’t need to question Bevo however we don’t and Sweet is an average tap ruck and inept at everything else
Funnily enough I’d pick neither because it doesn’t say we won or lost either making them totally irrelevant.
- Sep 22, 2008
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- #63
You’ve just claimed it as a ridiculous one sided hypothetical correct?
Yet in this hypothetical Buckets would award the points to the 1 ruck column, and use it as evidence as to why he’s right that we’re better with 1 ruck.
Hmm
Btw in Hypothetical A we won by 354 points in hypothetical B we lost by 190 points
This has always been my big issue with small sides and one ruck.
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With our current options yes we are better with 1 ruck. It’s not 1980 anymore if your rucks don’t impact around the ground they’re useless. We have a very good midfield that wins the battle most weeks. Majority of the games we lose is because of unforced turnovers or poor structure around stoppages which isn’t relevant to the ruck dual. Go out and do some coaching it will help you out
Dog 36
Norm Smith Medallist
Personally I would play Sweet simply for insurance and we have more to gain playing Sweet than another HBF come midfielder come forward.
If English gets injured during a game we are done IMO
If English gets injured during a game we are done IMO
That’s like saying play Schache in every game too in case Naughton goes down because then we are stuffed injuries happen from time to time
- Sep 22, 2008
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- #68
Im not arguing whether we are better with 1 ruck or not, im asking A) or B)
- Jun 19, 2016
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Didn’t we beat them round 19 last year with just English rucking?
Dog 36
Norm Smith Medallist
or you could move English down there and get Sweet to ruck
English is a substantially better ruckman then Sweet why would we weaken our team for that?
Dog 36
Norm Smith Medallist
Agree but English forward is not too bad if Naughton gets injured and Sweet can ruck (he will never be an English but dont forget what English was like in his first 7 games).
English was a raw athletic talent Sweet is Tom Campbell 2.0 with less forward craft
- Nov 16, 2015
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- #74
Calm down champ. Don’t blow a fuse.
So these factors are no longer outside the stoppage? They’re at the stoppage?
So what are they?
lachy
Norm Smith Medallist
Around the ground English is massively better than Sweet basically giving us an extra midfielder.
Even in his early games English moved around the ground better than Sweet.
Sweet is not the worst backup ruck going around but if English is playing he has no role.
Our midfield is stronger whenever English is rucking as he becomes one.
We do not have a genuine 2nd ruck on our list so this whole debate is .......... well let's say going in with 1 ruck tonight will not influence the result 1 iota
Buku was pushed forward in the VFL and played ruck in the VFL to see how he would go.
He can easily ruck 20% be forward 40% including rucking stoppages there and will be of much more value than Sweet in the 2nd ruck role which covers his 60 to 65 percent on ground.
Some of us just do not like seeing Bont or Dunks in the ruck contest when there are better options already there.
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