No Oppo Supporters 2016 General AFL Discussion Part 2 (Sydney Posters Only)

[sataris]

It's a rort, simple as that. Our academy has produced 2 good players so far. Two. How many players get drafted from Victoria each year. A massive overreaction to a non-existent problem.

It's idiotic. if the academy zones were in NSW/QLD you could at least make the claim they're trying to grow the game rather than appease Eddie.

 

[mark121]

In the article it says ''The AFL will meet with South Australian and West Australian clubs regarding the allocating of regions in those states, and is in the process of finalising the allocation of regions in Tasmania.'' so there are more to come.

 

[Millky95]

The solution is simple.

Have a club (that wants to) have an academy in a non-footy state. That grows the game. All this does is more trading for back ended picks to get the top picks in the draft.

 

[mark121]

What they really should have done is allow academies in areas of QLD and NSW not currently being developed I am not certain but there must be areas left under developed. They also should have included New Zealand, Papua New Guinea, Indonesia and other countries where suitable infrastructure Fields etc can be utilized and set a large cap on spending.

 

[Mister B]

So they have zoned based on traditional ties according to the article. The same traditional ties that every agreed gave particular teams an unfair advantage back in the day. Equalisation my arse. It reads as though it is intended to target Indigenous from rural communities and new Australians. Will believe it when I see it.

 

[Tuco]

So the Hawks get 1/5th of Victoria and a 1/3rd of the NT? Makes sense...

 

[Tuco]

Newbold has resigned. Will be a big loss for the Hawks....and Eddie
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-02-02/hawthorn-president-andrew-newbold-quits

Not so much of a big loss. He's Eddie's plant in the AFL Commission. He'll replace Mike Fitzpatrick. Newbold will be around for many years ensuring the Swans are slowly destroyed, and the Hawks are omnipresent.

 

[RW]

Not so much of a big loss. He's Eddie's plant in the AFL Commission. He'll replace Mike Fitzpatrick. Newbold will be around for many years ensuring the Swans are slowly destroyed, and the Hawks are omnipresent.

I wouldn't go as far as to say they want to see the Swans destroyed, more that vested interests will ensure that the Commission will continue to put the success of the heartland clubs first. The Swans will be fine, but the bias is hard to take at times.

 

[Tuco]

I wouldn't go as far as to say they want to see the Swans destroyed, more that vested interests will ensure that the Commission will continue to put the success of the heartland clubs first. The Swans will be fine, but the bias is hard to take at times.

I love it when someone argues my point for me in a more eloquent and reasoned manner.

 

[doona]

New academy zones announced http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-02-03/victorian-clubs-handed-afl-funding-for-academies
Thoughts?

In the Article

Under the plan unveiled to clubs on Tuesday, they will be given the chance to invest in specific regions to attract youngsters from diverse backgrounds and indigenous heritage to play AFL and develop elite talent within those areas.

From this it sounds like they will be restricted to the players that can actually join the academy.

I think we would need to read the fine print, but the sounds of it, i take it as they are trying to grow the game from non traditional AFL countries/indigenous players.

What baffles me is the vic clubs get a victorian zone and a NT zone.

 

[RW]

I love it when someone argues my point for me in a more eloquent and reasoned manner.

That's why they made me a mod I guess

But seriously, behind closed doors I've no doubt the AFL is well aware of Sydney's importance to the national competition, as the fortunes of the two Sydney clubs are linked -- if both are doing well it's a positive for the code here generally -- I just wish they would stand up to Eddie!

 

[GotTheGoodes]

So they are bringing back the old zone system or what?! Equalisation and growing the game or the VIC clubs whining and complaining and threatening and finally getting what they want (as always)??

Basically my reading of this was along the lines of the VIC clubs complained about NSW & QLD academies because they want to be able to "hoard" good young players that they can secure with later picks that would never have got them otherwise... which under the current arrangement they cannot do unless it's a father/son.

I am however not so one eyed to not see the benefit of such a system. I wouldn't have a problem with it if the areas selected were proven to be in actual need of development (remote, rural, not traditional recruiting zones). I'd also want to see the clubs invested into it (time, $, everything) as much as we are invested into ours.

Finally, the "zones" need to be allocated on a completely random &/or fair basis and there needs to be safeguards against unfair distribution of future talent somehow. Maybe if you nominate an academy pick one year it reduces the discount the next year in proportion to the # picks historically taken. A rolling discount factor to the pick discount you receive based on the proportionate use of the academy picks in the past? The more you use the academy system the lower the discount for using the system the following year and so on. Maybe everyone get's 1 "free" shot each year (without future penalty) then for each pick thereafter their future discount factor is temporarily reduced..... Anyway, something for much higher thinking individuals than myself.

Just sounds like a rort. I hope I'm wrong but I wouldn't lend the AFL a packet of sugar let alone entrust with them an idea to let the VIC clubs "help grow the game".... Please, abuse the privilege of doing so is more like it.

 

[GoTheSwannies]

This whole thing will be exploited. I wonder how stringent their guidelines will be. Not very I'd imagine.

Slight of hand by the afl. Name it one thing, but set it up so the vic clubs can poach more talent.

I wonder how many high end talent has come from those regions in the last 10 years.

 

[Tuco]

Anything that increases the talent pool is a good thing. Remains to be seen if this will actually deliver that, though.

It'll be interesting to see how the Vic clubs are incentivized to set up the Academies. The Swans have been forced to invest millions to get a couple of kids on the list, and whenever a kid looks the goods they've changed the rules on us.

I get the sense this 'seed' money the AFL is offering the VIC clubs could simply become a backdoor way for the AFL to deliver talent to the clubs it wants outside the draft (and they will be funding it themselves). Can't see the Bulldogs spending a million a year, can you?

But if the VIC clubs do not face the stringent rules the Northern Academies do regarding Academy bidding it will be a rort of epic proportions.

 

[CD__]

If this is going to be bringing kids who might otherwise be playing soccer etc. to Australian Rules football then it can only be a good thing**. Hopefully it will also stop other clubs and other clubs supporters' complaining about our supposed advantage

**Unless the system is rorted...going to be really interesting seeing how it is policed.

 

[Wolftone]

The South Australians came up with the slogan 'Kick A Vic' after losing the Grand Prix (mind you I think the state government wanted to lose it as fast as possible. thousands of petrolheads in town was a nighmare, cars turned over, firebombs, drunken brawls, noise pollution). Personally I'd kick Eddie or Newbold any day.

 

[Millky95]

Anything that increases the talent pool is a good thing. Remains to be seen if this will actually deliver that, though.

Unless 12 clubs have the lion's share of it and the other 6 don't

 

[Swansujelly]

meh, as long as the same bidding rules apply, let them have them.

 

[Lakeside Swan]

The way the article reads to me is that these clubs can attract anyone to their academies. It refers to attracting youngsters from non-traditional football backgrounds but how will they determine whether a kid is from a non-traditional background or not? Are they going to ban Caucasian kids? They can't do that. The simple fact is that the best young players will be included.

And why has the NT been included? Indigenous kids in the NT are surrounded by football and it's a big part of the culture for kids up there. Why do these kids need to be "attracted" to the game when they already have been. This is just going to be a huge advantage for Essendon, Geelong, Hawthorn, Collingwood and Melbourne.

This will be impossible to police. I fail to see how clubs aren't going to exploit any loopholes.

The end result is that the NSW and Qld academies are in non-traditional football areas whereas all other clubs will have zones where AFL is very popular. Clubs in the traditional states will be in a position to take the cream of the crop. This is going to be a huge disadvantage for the NSW and Qld clubs and the net result will be that we will be worse off than we were prior to academies.

 

[sataris]

The way the article reads to me is that these clubs can attract anyone to their academies. It refers to attracting youngsters from non-traditional football backgrounds but how will they determine whether a kid is from a non-traditional background or not? Are they going to ban Caucasian kids? They can't do that. The simple fact is that the best young players will be included.

And why has the NT been included? Indigenous kids in the NT are surrounded by football and it's a big part of the culture for kids up there. Why do these kids need to be "attracted" to the game when they already have been. This is just going to be a huge advantage for Essendon, Geelong, Hawthorn, Collingwood and Melbourne.

This will be impossible to police. I fail to see how clubs aren't going to exploit any loopholes.

The end result is that the NSW and Qld academies are in non-traditional football areas whereas all other clubs will have zones where AFL is very popular. Clubs in the traditional states will be in a position to take the cream of the crop. This is going to be a huge disadvantage for the NSW and Qld clubs and the net result will be that we will be worse off than we were prior to academies.

The only benefit I see from that in theory they should keep their hands off the NSW academy kids, which will help us reduce our go-home factor..

but like I said on the mb thread. Let's see how this plays out.

 

[Superstar swan]

Just posted this in the grinding gears thread on the bay (yes i know thats asking for it, but it needs to be said )

Not only disgusts me but pisses me off no end.

Wa media



Channel 7 running a fluff piece this week about the triumphant return of ben cousins to west coast and him helping out at training.



Makes me sick.



Like him or not, adam goodes has never put a foot wrong off the field, yes il give you that he sometimes played for frees (hes far from beinh the only one on afl) and some peoplw question a few incidents where he went lwga first. However , that is the only knocks on the guy. He was mercilessly booed out of the game. Whether it was racial or not or just people were doing it because everyone else did it is beside the point. He is a legend of the game and got made to feel that he was not welcome, he even felt that he could not make a proper goodebye at the afl grand final. Absolute disgusting way to to both ruin and end a true legends career.



Yet sir ben cousins, who brought shame and disgust to our code, a self confessed drug cheat and addict can get welcomed back with open arms and celebrated.



Again not trying to reignite the racism debate and im ingnoring that all together.



You have 2 extremely different characters with 2 extremely different receptions. Cannot for the life of me see the logoc behind it

 

[doona]

Just posted this in the grinding gears thread on the bay (yes i know thats asking for it, but it needs to be said )

Not only disgusts me but pisses me off no end.

Wa media



Channel 7 running a fluff piece this week about the triumphant return of ben cousins to west coast and him helping out at training.



Makes me sick.



Like him or not, adam goodes has never put a foot wrong off the field, yes il give you that he sometimes played for frees (hes far from beinh the only one on afl) and some peoplw question a few incidents where he went lwga first. However , that is the only knocks on the guy. He was mercilessly booed out of the game. Whether it was racial or not or just people were doing it because everyone else did it is beside the point. He is a legend of the game and got made to feel that he was not welcome, he even felt that he could not make a proper goodebye at the afl grand final. Absolute disgusting way to to both ruin and end a true legends career.



Yet sir ben cousins, who brought shame and disgust to our code, a self confessed drug cheat and addict can get welcomed back with open arms and celebrated.



Again not trying to reignite the racism debate and im ingnoring that all together.



You have 2 extremely different characters with 2 extremely different receptions. Cannot for the life of me see the logoc behind it

To be honest, Cousins had a massive problem. He had an addictive personality that played a part in him being the footy player he was, but also in the drug addiction. B. Cousins has gone through a lot of issues.

Someone battling a drug addiction that comes out the other side not in a coffin/jail/etc.... Is a good story. Some people go through massive struggles in their life, they should be given the support/ability to come through

Just because someone has used drugs, become an alcoholic etc... does not mean that they are a bad perosn. It means they need help.

And by the way, Cousins was not a drug cheat. A drug cheat infers that he used drugs for performance enhance his abilities. He was a drug addict that used recreational drugs that would not help in AFL what so ever.

 

[Superstar swan]

My argument is not against cousins in particular, but rather how a player with his past is treated compared to someone like goodesy with an impeccable character

 

[ScrewInStuds]

And by the way, Cousins was not a drug cheat. A drug cheat infers that he used drugs for performance enhance his abilities. He was a drug addict that used recreational drugs that would not help in AFL what so ever.

Sorry, you make some good points, but using crystal meth on game day would 100% give you a competitive advantage in AFL

 

[doona]

Sorry, you make some good points, but using crystal meth on game day would 100% give you a competitive advantage in AFL

Haha, I can see how shrooms would help with quiditch, but crystal meth and AFL.....