Live Event 2017 Charles Sutton Medal - 4 October, 7pm @ Crown Palladium

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Igloo said:
Troll. You've been against Suckling from day one. You don't even deserve to be in the same stadium.
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The funniest part is, you were actually there to see my heart melt when I saw him kick the ball for the first time in a pre-season warm-up.
 
two senior coaches were pretty annoyed with the details in bevo speech tonight
 

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Almost as odd as the JJ result is Easton Wood finishing 4th. I thought he had a very ordinary season and I wouldn't have had him in my top 10. From now on when I attend the games and reflect on the best players I had better think like a coach! :huh:
 
threenewpadlocks said:
It seems so ridiculous that I have to open the possibility that the AFL.com.au reporting of how we vote seems a bit off. Maybe there's some sort of weighing involved to prioritise Beveridge's votes over the assistants? Maybe line coaches only vote for the players that they directly coach?
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Seems to me the way the website explained it must be wrong, or at least written poorly enough that it's being interpreted the wrong way by everyone. The numbers make far more sense if it's actually just the simple system of each of the five coaches choosing a their 5-4-3-2-1 vote players each game.

Assuming that's the case, it means the five coaches each have 15 votes available to give per game (5+4+3+2+1), over 22 games. That means there are 1650 votes up for grabs over the course of the season. 1339 of the votes went to the top ten, leaving 311 for the remaining players. That sounds far more realistic than the best player at our club being rated on average 1.7 out of 5 each match.

It would also explain JJ's result a little better - the 5-4-3-2-1 method of voting naturally favours players who play a few brilliant games over those who play many above average games. JJ's 5 or 6 brilliant games (and he had some rippers) where he would've been viewed as one of our top couple of players would account for the majority of his votes right away, while a smattering of other 'good' games would make up his remaining votes. I guess, in comparison, Dahlhaus just didn't have enough games where he was one of our top 5 players, even if he would've probably been in our top 10ish every match.
 

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Mahama said:
Seems to me the way the website explained it must be wrong, or at least written poorly enough that it's being interpreted the wrong way by everyone. The numbers make far more sense if it's actually just the simple system of each of the five coaches choosing a their 5-4-3-2-1 vote players each game.

Assuming that's the case, it means the five coaches each have 15 votes available to give per game (5+4+3+2+1), over 22 games. That means there are 1650 votes up for grabs over the course of the season. 1339 of the votes went to the top ten, leaving 311 for the remaining players. That sounds far more realistic than the best player at our club being rated on average 1.7 out of 5 each match.

It would also explain JJ's result a little better - the 5-4-3-2-1 method of voting naturally favours players who play a few brilliant games over those who play many above average games. JJ's 5 or 6 brilliant games (and he had some rippers) where he would've been viewed as one of our top couple of players would account for the majority of his votes right away, while a smattering of other 'good' games would make up his remaining votes. I guess, in comparison, Dahlhaus just didn't have enough games where he was one of our top 5 players, even if he would've probably been in our top 10ish every match.
Click to expand...
Unlikely.
After 8 rounds Roberts had 54 votes so even if he got NO more votes for the rest of the year that would only leave 257 votes among about 27 players or an average of about 9 each. It's possible but seems unlikely to me, especially when we haven't seen what Dahl and McLean got yet. Between them they would surely have taken another 100+ votes out of the residue. Then there's M.Boyd who most people rated our BoG in Rd 23, Murphy, Wallis, Cloke, Libba etc.
 
My quick summary of last night was:
  • really interested that Jake's name was never mentioned and the topic was never raised. Gordon only referenced it in vague terms around the club knowing what it was doing and that we should trust the people in charge because they have earned our trust. With media there and the posturing going on around trade value, it makes sense that we would not not to inflame the situation further
  • as mentioned elsewhere another 7 figure profit and notionally debt free. We will continue to invest in Whitten Oval and Gordon is hoping we host heritage round matches there again. Some sponsorship extensions VU for 5 years (keeping stadium naming rights and ball sponsor), Cape Grim another 4 years and Mercedes Vans as we knew starting from Nov 1
  • Bevo didn't give much away but confessed that maybe many at the club just didn't want to move on from last year. He implored that we need to rediscover the hunger and essentially rediscover the hunter mentality again. He referenced the lyrics of a song that I have never hear of from a band I've never heard from an album released in 2010 that Ive never heard of. If anyone remember the song and the band please let me know as I'd love to give it a listen.
  • Loved seeing Crossy back at the club.
  • Moyd needed a script writer! He spoke from the heart and it will be very very sad to see him go (and be in black and white)
  • The work of our psychologist & welfare (Brent Prismall) was highlighted. Obviously they have been busy with everything that's been going on! Maybe they need some help.
  • Bob was the highlight for me. Not saying anything that everyone doesn't know but he is such a natural and charismatic story teller and so genuine I could listen to him for hours. The line about the admin lady handing him the paper after he cleaned out his locker, really rammed home how brutal football is. "What's this?" Bob asked, "It means that you no longer play for us" she says. Imagine having that said to you when you are the heart and soul of the club. I know it was said with humour but think about it. Once you are done you are done and things move on. I really hope we find a way to have Bob around the club performing a similar role to 2016 whilst he was injured. It really dawned on me last night that without he and Moyd around the club an awful lot will fall on Woody / Bont leadership wise. The warmth, humour and humilty that Bob has I think will be needed this season.
  • I hadn't seen much of John Schultz at the games this year (maybe I just missed it) but his presence alone I think was underestimated in 2016. He is just so loved and respected by everyone I would live to see him being around the club and the boys as much as he seemed to be in 2016.
  • I was delighted to see the internal recognition that Zaine received. Really does seem to be the heir apparent to Moz. I just love his competitiveness.
  • Ballarat was barely mentioned (once by Gordon from memory), I though they'd make more of it particularly in the first year.
  • I thought the count it self was actually pretty ordinary, only ever showed the top 10 and it was almost downplayed.
  • Like many other I was stunned that Jack didn't poll better, thought it he was a certainty. I think the final results and where players ended up reflected our season... just not good enough.
  • I am now the proud owner of a signed JJ jumper courtesy the silent auction. Not sure where the hell I'm going to put it!
  • Desert was delicious
Most important of all...








I can confirm that I saw VD and Lynch in the same room at the same time. Didn't have time to take a picture but they are indeed 2 different people.
 
Mahama said:
Seems to me the way the website explained it must be wrong, or at least written poorly enough that it's being interpreted the wrong way by everyone. The numbers make far more sense if it's actually just the simple system of each of the five coaches choosing a their 5-4-3-2-1 vote players each game.

Assuming that's the case, it means the five coaches each have 15 votes available to give per game (5+4+3+2+1), over 22 games. That means there are 1650 votes up for grabs over the course of the season. 1339 of the votes went to the top ten, leaving 311 for the remaining players. That sounds far more realistic than the best player at our club being rated on average 1.7 out of 5 each match.

It would also explain JJ's result a little better - the 5-4-3-2-1 method of voting naturally favours players who play a few brilliant games over those who play many above average games. JJ's 5 or 6 brilliant games (and he had some rippers) where he would've been viewed as one of our top couple of players would account for the majority of his votes right away, while a smattering of other 'good' games would make up his remaining votes. I guess, in comparison, Dahlhaus just didn't have enough games where he was one of our top 5 players, even if he would've probably been in our top 10ish every match.
Click to expand...
dogwatch said:
Unlikely.
After 8 rounds Roberts had 54 votes so even if he got NO more votes for the rest of the year that would only leave 257 votes among about 27 players or an average of about 9 each. It's possible but seems unlikely to me, especially when we haven't seen what Dahl and McLean got yet. Between them they would surely have taken another 100+ votes out of the residue. Then there's M.Boyd who most people rated our BoG in Rd 23, Murphy, Wallis, Cloke, Libba etc.
Click to expand...
This is like the first 20 minutes of any hour long police procedural TV show, just a different type of investigation...
 
don't know how McLean didnt get in the top 10. He was our most consistent (at a high standard) all year next to Macrae
 
What we don’t know is how the coaches view a player’s game compared to us. If a midfield coach sets Jack or Toby some benchmarks to meet or gives them a specific role to fulfil and they go out and get 25-30 touches but don’t do what was asked then coach will mark them down. Ching voters go, well played on the 30 possessions, some amazing plays, here’s 5 votes. Personally, I’m more surprised Toby wasn’t Top 10 than Jack being 3rd. But the coaches clearly have different criteria to fans, media and even players. I remember during the JJ form slump a couple of times Bevo praises him for little things he was doing while everyone else was stressing over his lack of possessions and run. The last person I thought would be up there for most of the count was Easton Wood but clearly the coaches felt his efforts were vital defensively even though his overall game was nothing to 2 previous years. Same with Fletch. Would love to know what he was doing so well early in the year and what went wrong. Biggsy and Daniel were dropped early and came back and must have done more what the coaches were looking for than Toby. It’s interesting. Would loved to hear about the decision making processes behind the votes. Would be far more fascinating than the vacuous tripe we get from On the Couch interviews regarding recycled questions about surfing and skateboards!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Scotland said:
How did Dahlhaus miss the top 10 playing every game?
Click to expand...
In my view he wasn't in our best 10 players during 2017. Like plenty of others, his output was well done on 2016.

I was surprised that McLean wasn't in the top 10 though.
 
Turtle3 said:
My quick summary of last night was:
  • really interested that Jake's name was never mentioned and the topic was never raised. Gordon only referenced it in vague terms around the club knowing what it was doing and that we should trust the people in charge because they have earned our trust. With media there and the posturing going on around trade value, it makes sense that we would not not to inflame the situation further
  • as mentioned elsewhere another 7 figure profit and notionally debt free. We will continue to invest in Whitten Oval and Gordon is hoping we host heritage round matches there again. Some sponsorship extensions VU for 5 years (keeping stadium naming rights and ball sponsor), Cape Grim another 4 years and Mercedes Vans as we knew starting from Nov 1
  • Bevo didn't give much away but confessed that maybe many at the club just didn't want to move on from last year. He implored that we need to rediscover the hunger and essentially rediscover the hunter mentality again. He referenced the lyrics of a song that I have never hear of from a band I've never heard from an album released in 2010 that Ive never heard of. If anyone remember the song and the band please let me know as I'd love to give it a listen.
  • Loved seeing Crossy back at the club.
  • Moyd needed a script writer! He spoke from the heart and it will be very very sad to see him go (and be in black and white)
  • The work of our psychologist & welfare (Brent Prismall) was highlighted. Obviously they have been busy with everything that's been going on! Maybe they need some help.
  • Bob was the highlight for me. Not saying anything that everyone doesn't know but he is such a natural and charismatic story teller and so genuine I could listen to him for hours. The line about the admin lady handing him the paper after he cleaned out his locker, really rammed home how brutal football is. "What's this?" Bob asked, "It means that you no longer play for us" she says. Imagine having that said to you when you are the heart and soul of the club. I know it was said witWestern Bulldogsh humour but think about it. Once you are done you are done and things move on. I really hope we find a way to have Bob around the club performing a similar role to 2016 whilst he was injured. It really dawned on me last night that without he and Moyd around the club an awful lot will fall on Woody / Bont leadership wise. The warmth, humour and humilty that Bob has I think will be needed this season.
  • I hadn't seen much of John Schultz at the games this year (maybe I just missed it) but his presence alone I think was underestimated in 2016. He is just so loved and respected by everyone I would live to see him being around the club and the boys as much as he seemed to be in 2016.
  • I was delighted to see the internal recognition that Zaine received. Really does seem to be the heir apparent to Moz. I just love his competitiveness.
  • Ballarat was barely mentioned (once by Gordon from memory), I though they'd make more of it particularly in the first year.
  • I thought the count it self was actually pretty ordinary, only ever showed the top 10 and it was almost downplayed.
  • Like many other I was stunned that Jack didn't poll better, thought it he was a certainty. I think the final results and where players ended up reflected our season... just not good enough.
  • I am now the proud owner of a signed JJ jumper courtesy the silent auction. Not sure where the hell I'm going to put it!
  • Desert was delicious
Most important of all...








I can confirm that I saw VD and Lynch in the same room at the same time. Didn't have time to take a picture but they are indeed 2 different people.
Click to expand...
Thanks, that was really interesting :thumbsu:
 
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