Preview AFL Round 8 - Collingwood v Geelong, MCG, 7:40PM Saturday 18 May

[FredLeDeux]

My Nana used to have a chest of drawers full of prescription this and that - and I imagine that the venerable Fred is just the same.

Shheesh!

Exits left, muttering to himself "How many times have I told myself, do not tell people myths are myths, when will I ever learn, etc, etc"

 

[catempire]

I presume they will be playing him in the BP? Makes our backline rather mature. But while Poodle Hunt is out , I suppose there are not many other options. At least ones ready to play.
Still I do agree he is a bit lucky. Id have not brought him in , I'd rather have brought in Kersten to help Hawkins. But with the quality around him , do you really doubt he will look well enough to hold his spot?

I think it's inevitable, in the position he plays, that the time will come when small forwards make him look old and slow. It may not be here yet but that day is coming. When I look at the likes of Guthrie and Thurlow, I've got no apprehension about it.

 

[year of the cat]

I think it's inevitable, in the position he plays, that the time will come when small forwards make him look old and slow. It may not be here yet but that day is coming. When I look at the likes of Guthrie and Thurlow, I've got no apprehension about it.

It's looking more and more likely with the direction the match committee are taking this year that it could be Josh's last year. He actually had a reasonable year last year I thought, but we need to be getting games into the likes of Guthrie, Thurlow and maybe even Bews and Cowan later in the year. Josh might be one to be given a tap on the shoulder a little earlier than he may have anticipated.

 

[AM]

Well, this is a big game for Josh Hunt. It's fair to say I haven't been his biggest fan over the journey. There are a lot of young players playing out of their skin at the moment. This and the coming weeks are his chance to send a message that he still belongs. I have my doubts...

The people who count appear to think he's still an important part of our best unit. I'm with you though, I have my doubts too.

 

[catempire]

The people who count appear to think he's still an important part of our best unit. I'm with you though, I have my doubts too.

There was never any doubt that he'd be brought back at some point to have a crack. This is it. I don't believe he is still factored in to best 22 calculations though. And don't believe for a second one of CS's "best 22" calls. As I've said before, he has about 800 blokes in his "best 22"!

 

[AM]

Don't forget it also brings highly skilled teams back to the level of lower skilled teams.... Whilst the lower skilled teams level doesn't drop at all

There are some who believe the more talented players actually cope with the wet better than the plodders.

 

[winty]

I suspect Witts is in because they have watched how the West/Blicavs combo outlasted the (effectively) one-ruckman set-ups of Richmond and Essendon and rolled over them in the second half.

That might backfire on them though. In the pre-season game against the Pies, Blicavs rucked solo against both Jolly and Witts and the latter was subbed on in the second half. Blicavs had his best game of the pre-season against those two, and that was without West giving him a chop out in the ruck.

 

[FredLeDeux]

There was never any doubt that he'd be brought back at some point to have a crack. This is it. I don't believe he is still factored in to best 22 calculations though. And don't believe for a second one of CS's "best 22" calls. As I've said before, he has about 800 blokes in his "best 22"!

If he reaches and stays at last year's levels, he's well ahead of Thurlow and Guthrie at their present levels, and will stay in the side.
If he doesn't reach that level, or drops off, and the gap narrows, then the MC has to make a couple of more difficult choices, first about this season and who's going to be best come the finals, and secondly about next season.

 

[AM]

There was never any doubt that he'd be brought back at some point to have a crack. This is it. I don't believe he is still factored in to best 22 calculations though. And don't believe for a second one of CS's "best 22" calls. As I've said before, he has about 800 blokes in his "best 22"!

Agree that he was always going to get another crack when the circumstances were right.

The one thing in his favour is that you'd think any player mentioned by CS as being in his best (whatever number) outfit would at least be in the mix when the powers that be sit around the selection table.

 

[catempire]

Yeah FredLeDeux, as I said, I've never been his greatest fan so I can't pretend to call his place in the side objectively. You may well be right.

I'd love to see Guthrie or Thurlow in the 22 come September though.

 

[FredLeDeux]

That might backfire on them though. In the pre-season game against the Pies, Blicavs rucked solo against both Jolly and Witts and the latter was subbed on in the second half. Blicavs had his best game of the pre-season against those two, and that was without West giving him a chop out in the ruck.

Yes, I don't know whether their idea will or won't work. Blicavs is an infinitely better player now than he was back then, and he and West have been working the two-up pretty well in the last couple of games.
On the other hand, Jolly/Witts will be fitter in the 2nd half than the rucks we've been facing (assuming that Witts rests off the ground, rather than trying to chase Blicavs).
It will be interesting, as will be watching to see who does chase Blicavs in the first half.

 

[catempire]

Agree that he was always going to get another crack when the circumstances were right.

The one thing in his favour is that you'd think any player mentioned by CS as being in his best (whatever number) outfit would at least be in the mix when the powers that be sit around the selection table.

That's the beauty of the squad though, isn't it? There legitimately are about 28 players who will be in the calculation for the 22 late in the year, fitness and injuries permitting. Can't argue that Hunt is in that group.

 

[FredLeDeux]

That's the beauty of the squad though, isn't it? There legitimately are about 28 players who will be in the calculation for the 22 late in the year, fitness and injuries permitting. Can't argue that Hunt is in that group.

At least 28-30 I reckon, and that's without any possible wildcards like Schroder, Stringer, Cowan.

 

[Turbocat]

It's looking more and more likely with the direction the match committee are taking this year that it could be Josh's last year. He actually had a reasonable year last year I thought, but we need to be getting games into the likes of Guthrie, Thurlow and maybe even Bews and Cowan later in the year. Josh might be one to be given a tap on the shoulder a little earlier than he may have anticipated.

YOTC , I have been an advocate of youth , a fairly strong one. I couldn't really complain so far about the way they are blending the kittens in. Obviously the maintenance of a strongly competitive side makes it a little more difficult , the temptation to flood them in if we were middle of the road might be greater but we are still hearing the music , we are still dancing to that Sept tune and have winning as a current goal. Yet we still are giving a substantial amount of the kids games. More than that , they play a key roles in the game plan. Just last week we gave another his first game.

Could we really find a way to keep pushing games down the throats of those in the 22 now , add a Thurlow , add a Schroder who we hope will be strong players in the future and need games to show their worth , re-engage the likes of Vardy , find a spot for Burbury and somehow still get Cowan and Bews in there... Perhaps a little too much I think YOTC. We must keep a reasonable balance or the house of cards will topple

As long as we keep the faith when all are fit and ready , our young group will have notched enough games.

 

[catempire]

At least 28-30 I reckon, and that's without any possible wildcards like Schroder, Stringer, Cowan.

Do I hear 31??

3 Bartel, Jimmy 232 29yr 5mth 4 Dec 1983 187cm 89kg Geelong Falcons Midfield
Forward


46 Blicavs, Mark 7 22yr 1mth 28 Mar 1991 198cm 95kg Geelong Vfl Midfield
Ruck


23 Caddy, Josh 29 20yr 7mth 28 Sep 1992 186cm 84kg Northern Knights Midfield
35 Chapman, Paul 247 31yr 6mth 5 Nov 1981 179cm 89kg Calder Cannons Midfield
Forward
28 Christensen, Allen 43 21yr 11mth 19 May 1991 177cm 80kg Geelong Falcons Midfield
Forward
11 Corey, Joel 259 31yr 2mth 17 Feb 1982 191cm 88kg East Perth Midfield

22 Duncan, Mitchell 58 21yr 11mth 10 Jun 1991 187cm 86kg East Perth Midfield

44 Enright, Corey 251 31yr 8mth 14 Sep 1981 187cm 91kg Port Adelaide Defender
29 Guthrie, Cameron 23 20yr 8mth 19 Aug 1992 186cm 82kg Calder Cannons Defender

26 Hawkins, Tom 107 24yr 9mth 27 Jul 1988 197cm 105kg Melbourne Grammar Forward
33 Horlin-Smith, George 8 20yr 4mth 22 Dec 1992 186cm 83kg Oakleigh Chargers Midfield
8 Hunt, Josh 186 31yr 2mth 14 Mar 1982 183cm 80kg Bendigo Pioneers Defender
19 Hunt, Taylor 48 22yr 6mth 5 Nov 1990 185cm 101kg Sandringham Dragons Midfield
20 Johnson, Steve 201 29yr 10mth 4 Jul 1983 189cm 92kg Murray Bushrangers Midfield
Forward
9 Kelly, James 217 29yr 4mth 29 Dec 1983 183cm 86kg Calder Cannons Midfield

13 Lonergan, Tom 104 28yr 11mth 17 May 1984 197cm 93kg Calder Cannons Defender
4 Mackie, Andrew 180 28yr 9mth 7 Aug 1984 192cm 86kg Glenelg Defender

17 McIntosh, Hamish 107 28yr 8mth 4 Sep 1984 203cm 103kg Murray Bushrangers Ruck

32 Motlop, Steven 34 22yr 2mth 12 Mar 1991 183cm 76kg Wanderers Forward
21 Murdoch, Jordan 11 21yr 1mth 23 Mar 1992 190cm 85kg Glenelg Defender
31 Podsiadly, James 67 31yr 8mth 10 Sep 1981 193cm 100kg Geelong Forward
25 Rivers, Jared 153 28yr 6mth 18 Oct 1984 192cm 92kg North Adelaide Defender

14 Selwood, Joel 142 24yr 11mth 26 May 1988 182cm 87kg Bendigo Midfield

2 Smedts, Billie 21 20yr 11mth 8 Jun 1992 189cm 83kg Geelong Falcons Forward
27 Stokes, Mathew 138 28yr 5mth 22 Nov 1984 175cm 77kg Woodville West Torrens Forward

7 Taylor, Harry 119 26yr 11mth 12 Jun 1986 193cm 96kg East Fremantle Defender
40 Thurlow, Jackson 1 19yr 1mth 28 Mar 1994 190cm 79kg Launceston Defender
5 Varcoe, Travis 104 25yr 1mth 10 Apr 1988 180cm 82kg Central District Midfield
Forward
30 Vardy, Nathan 11 21yr 10mth 25 Jun 1991 198cm 101kg Gippsland Power Ruck
34 Walker, Joshua 7 20yr 6mth 12 Nov 1992 196cm 91kg Geelong Falcons Forward
12 West, Trent 48 25yr 6mth 17 Oct 1987 199cm 102kg Gippsland Power Ruck

 

[AM]

That's the beauty of the squad though, isn't it? There legitimately are about 28 players who will be in the calculation for the 22 late in the year, fitness and injuries permitting. Can't argue that Hunt is in that group.

I'm inclined to agree with Fred that if all those capable of cutting it at AFL level were available the list probably runs deeper than 28.

What will be interesting is whether the coach will be true to his word that if comparative older and younger players are on equal terms form wise he will go for the younger.

 

[FredLeDeux]

catempire that's actually identical to the list I quickly came up with too, without counting the other 3 I mentioned.

I'm inclined to agree with Fred that if all those capable of cutting it at AFL level were available the list probably runs deeper than 28.

What will be interesting is whether the coach will be true to his word that if comparative older and younger players are on equal terms form wise he will go for the younger.

I have said all along that the younger if equal principle is the one we should apply, and it just seems obvious. Of course, it can sometimes be hard to judge in practice, and it may sometimes be traded off for another factor such as team balance or history in particular player match-ups.
There are, of course, always some trade-offs in close selection choices, because never are "all things equal".

 

[year of the cat]

YOTC , I have been an advocate of youth , a fairly strong one. I couldn't really complain so far about the way they are blending the kittens in. Obviously the maintenance of a strongly competitive side makes it a little more difficult , the temptation to flood them in if we were middle of the road might be greater but we are still hearing the music , we are still dancing to that Sept tune and have winning as a current goal. Yet we still are giving a substantial amount of the kids games. More than that , they play a key roles in the game plan. Just last week we gave another his first game.

Could we really find a way to keep pushing games down the throats of those in the 22 now , add a Thurlow , add a Schroder who we hope will be strong players in the future and need games to show their worth , re-engage the likes of Vardy , find a spot for Burbury and somehow still get Cowan and Bews in there... Perhaps a little too much I think YOTC. We must keep a reasonable balance or the house of cards will topple

As long as we keep the faith when all are fit and ready , our young group will have notched enough games.

I think they are currently striking a really nice balance between youth and experience. The problem occurs when you have a fit J.Hunt, a fit J.Corey and a fit P.Chapman. With Enright, Kelly, SJ, Pods, Bartel you start to change the balance of the team from what we have seen so far this year. It's no coincidence that we look quicker, and more energetic with this influx of youth. I just hope the MC will be prepared, as they did in previous years with both Milburn and Mooney to continue to make the hard decisions when all these players are back.

 

[AM]

I have said all along that the younger if equal principle is the one we should apply, and it just seems obvious. Of course, it can sometimes be hard to judge in practice, and it may sometimes be traded off for another factor such as team balance or history in particular player match-ups.
There are, of course, always some trade-offs in close selection choices, because never are "all things equal".

Of course there are a multiplicity of factors that go into team selection and it's no revelation really that youth gets precedence when all the key boxes are ticked. It's what good sporting clubs do.

 

[FredLeDeux]

I think they are currently striking a really nice balance between youth and experience. The problem occurs when you have a fit J.Hunt, a fit J.Corey and a fit P.Chapman. With Enright, Kelly, SJ, Pods, Bartel you start to change the balance of the team from what we have seen so far this year. It's no coincidence that we look quicker, and more energetic with this influx of youth. I just hope the MC will be prepared, as they did in previous years with both Milburn and Mooney to continue to make the hard decisions when all these players are back.

On revealed form this season, Corey and Chapman are not, as yet, anywhere near the Mooney/Milburn stage. Of course, Hunt is still an unknown quantity, and there's a lot of games to be played yet.

 

[Moley Russels Wart]

Yeah FredLeDeux, as I said, I've never been his greatest fan so I can't pretend to call his place in the side objectively. You may well be right.

I'd love to see Guthrie or Thurlow in the 22 come September though.

I'm with you cat empire (re j hunt), but whom am I to doubt the MC???

 

[AM]

Yeah FredLeDeux, as I said, I've never been his greatest fan so I can't pretend to call his place in the side objectively. You may well be right.

I'd love to see Guthrie or Thurlow in the 22 come September though.

Too early to make the call on Thurlow (for this year) yet. I know it's borderline sacrilege here to question Guthrie but I'm still not entirely convinced he's in our best back half.

 

[footscore]

I'm still not entirely convinced he's in our best back half.

yes he is because if he wasn't, he would have been dropped for Hunt against Essendon so the MC have much more faith in him than you do

 

[footscore]

champion data stats would have been an interesting read for Guthrie's game last weekend, reckon he had at least 13 pressure acts himself

 

[AM]

yes he is because if he wasn't, he would have been dropped for Hunt against Essendon so the MC have much more faith in him than you do

If the coach can be believed Hunt was not in the mix for that game. But putting that to one side, we don't have our full list available yet so you're making an very early call.

I did add the caveat that it is sacrilege to suggest he's not in our best back half hereabout.

BTW. Are you our only full time poster Bobby?