Goodes - Seniors, NEAFL or both? What to do?

[vonn]

I thought there has been enough discussion on Goodes to warrant a proper thread.

First and foremost, we all know Goodes is a club AFL global legend, and his standing in the game cannot be doubted. This thread isn't about the unbelievable service he has given the club, and no one on this board doubts his status. However, the sad reality is we are pushing for a flag in which he may not take a part in.

We had the chance to freeze him until science could create an anti-ageing injection (probably still more legal than *) but we opted not to take that 3 years ago so here we are now. So what do we do? Over to you.

 

[alanlau34]

Copy and pasted;

I see Goodes as the icing on a delicious cake. He could come on when the game is well and truly won, as per Saturday night. OR he could be the game-breaker we need at a crucial time. Very small sample size at the moment, and we've never used the sub all that greatly before.

Dogs model of using Gia as super sub was fine as they needed on field leadership and coaching, hardly a reason for Goodes to play that role. The main issue would be if we got an injury in the first quarter whether the great man wouldn't be a liability.

Some great fence sitting on display here, but Goodes has enough credits in the bank to work his way into the season. I get the feeling there'll be a few more highlights to come.

 

[Millky95]

He will have a mixed year I think. He will start a few games, probably at the SCG, sub most of them particularly late in the season and finals and will miss some games as management. Play 15-18 games, bout half as sub before finals

 

[vonn]

For me, it's really hard to judge his solid 1 minute of game-time last week (thanks Horse.) I would have loved to see him perform the role of 'supersub' for longer than 5 seconds. He did not play as terrible as some on here made out in that game or VS. Essendon, but I know there are strong performances being put in in the reserves. I would like to persist with him as sub this week, but if the game had gone down to the wire last week the idea of Goodes coming on would not have made me feel much better, just like it won't vs. Freo or Hawthorn who would only take advantage of the amount of defensive pressure he puts in. I don't question his heart, and he was one of the only guys who tried in that 2014 game. I just question his body.

alanlau34 imma join you on that fence.

 

[swansfan51]

He is still very fast in a straight line, I'd say faster than at least 35 guys on our list. His issue seems to be lateral movement and a concerning turning circle. Hopefully that is something that can improve, and not a permanent hindrance.

 

[The King!]

Lets no pretend Goodes has been an issue this week only.

Its been since his inability to return to the side in 2013 from injury

The last time we saw Adam Goodes looking like himself was that point game v the pies

 

[RW]

Lets no pretend Goodes has been an issue this week only.

Its been since his inability to return to the side in 2013 from injury

The last time we saw Adam Goodes looking like himself was that point game v the pies

Well, his best games last year were probably the ones against Geelong and Hawthorn - saving himself for the big games maybe?

 

[grimlock]

I thought Longmire's response at the press conference was very revealing. "We picked our best side for the night." He picked the best 21 players that could go out and execute the maniacal chasing and tackling that won us the game. If Goodes has started instead of say Towers, Rohan or Lloyd, there was a good chance that game plan could have turned awry as that kind of pressing breaks down quickly even when there is one player not pulling his weight defensively.

Therefore I can't see him starting in the side anymore for the games on big grounds particularly when Tippett, Pyke and Buddy are in the same side. I think he can still play a role in our SCG games and I fully expect him to be involved this week against GWS.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Whilst I believe he is depth, he shouldn't be getting gifted games over Lloyd, Cunningham and Mitchell and that is where my view is. My belief hasn't changed, he played a good GF, he should have retired then, in fact he was planning to. What changed his mind (or whom)? Do I see value in him, yes. Purely as a sub in the Finals.

 

[The King!]

Ill vote at round 6

He has three weeks to convince me

For what that is worth as a non selector

 

[Ultimatt]

I worry whether the pace of the games gotten to much for him. Those 2 handballs when he came on, he tried to draw the player and leave it to the last split-second. That's something he would've pulled off 5 years ago but the top inside mids just get rid of it as quickly as possible. I think if he keeps trying to play with the flair he used to have he's going to be a liability. Better if we can get him to keep things simple; play him up front to draw a KPD off buddy/tippet, play him around the ruck to use his amazing game smarts to read the tap and extract.

 

[MickyG]

Jude Bolton in the SMH:

http://www.smh.com.au/afl/adam-goodes-went-on-for-one-too-many-says-jude-bolton-20150412-1mjki3.html

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Jude Bolton in the SMH:

http://www.smh.com.au/afl/adam-goodes-went-on-for-one-too-many-says-jude-bolton-20150412-1mjki3.html

Bolton was quite scathing but honest.

"He played a shocking game against Essendon"

 

[MickyG]

I posted this in the General Discussion thread:

Luke Ablett impresses with his writing once again:

http://www.theroar.com.au/2015/04/08/the-age-old-afl-problem/

Interesting in terms of Goodes.

Comment at the bottom, "One thing that occurred to me while watching Juddy being burned off on a wing by the Tigers’ young Kamdyn McIntosh last week is that you’d rarely see Sam Mitchell venturing out onto a wing. Mitchell’s learned that slower players belong down the spine of the ground, whereas Juddy might be learning that the hard way this year (just like Vossy in his final year)." Images of Goodes trying to chase last week came to mind.


I re-watched the Essendon game and saw good acceleration but after the first twenty metres he can not match average players. I cannot see him impacting as a sub. We do not need him as a coach on the side lines for three quarters for young players a la Gianciracusa at the Dogs. Lloyd was a fantastic sub during the Essendon game and shows what you need from a sub. I don't think 2015 Goodes is that player. If he is not best 21 against Port in round 2, he won't be in a Grand Final.

Sad but probably needs to call time.

 

[Banyo Bloods]

Where is the option for Goodes to play on in 2016 ?

Maybe I just don't want to believe it's the end, but I just don't see it. Well after 1 game in the rain I certainly don't see it. If the coaches go that way so be it but surely he gets as long as Ryan O'keefe to answer the doubters.

 

[The King!]

Where is the option for Goodes to play on in 2016 ?

Maybe I just don't want to believe it's the end, but I just don't see it. Well after 1 game in the rain I certainly don't see it. If the coaches go that way so be it but surely he gets as long as Ryan O'keefe to answer the doubters.

The side winning helps

 

[LukeParkerno1]

If the coaches go that way so be it but surely he gets as long as Ryan O'keefe to answer the doubters.

O'Keefe got 1 poor game against GWS practically. If anything Goodes got more.

 

[MickyG]

Where is the option for Goodes to play on in 2016 ?

Maybe I just don't want to believe it's the end, but I just don't see it. Well after 1 game in the rain I certainly don't see it. If the coaches go that way so be it but surely he gets as long as Ryan O'keefe to answer the doubters.

I agree, see how he goes for a few more games as he has usually been a slow starter. Unfortunately I'd take the risk with GWS this week but not so sure about Freo in Perth.

 

[Banyo Bloods]

O'Keefe got 1 poor game against GWS practically. If anything Goodes got more.

Rubbish

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Rubbish

Do tell how many opportunities O'Keefe got. If anything he was more unlucky than Goodes.

 

[Banyo Bloods]

Do tell how many opportunities O'Keefe got. If anything he was more unlucky than Goodes.

4 starting games I think

 

[The King!]

Who cares what happened with Okeefe, different players, different time

He got 4 games last year. Though writing was on the wall when he could only make it as a late inclusion round 1

 

[MickyG]

Rubbish

Yes. He played four very poor games at the start of last year. I think he was a scapegoat in some ways but it was Cunningham or him and the coaches picked Cunningham. It may now be Goodes or McGlynn and for me it is McGlynn.

 

[Banyo Bloods]

To be honest it's a bit hazy so I shouldn't call rubbish without facts

 

[replicant]

The problem is his legend status. The best thing for the Swans in general would be for Goodes to come forward and say he was going to move to a playing/teaching role in the NEAFL, and go and be a leader for the ressies. But I imagine it'd be incredibly hard for him to make that step back. If he wanted to hang up the boots rather than that, it'd be perfectly understandable.

I can see him hanging on as either sub or being subbed. There is a chance that he can build through the year and be solid best 22 again. It's very hard to judge off 1.5 games. It's tough to say, but when you put down your best 22 purely on what they can give to the team over 4 quarters, Goodes is fringe at best.

So i'd say the ball is mostly in his court, but Jude making the comments he did, and our leading teams system means that if the team thinks he's done, they'll let him know. I'm happy to wait for the great man to make his own call.