Discussion Hickey and Longer

[Joffaboy]

I remember because Hickey and Giles were playing on each other towards the end of that first quarter or so, and Hickey floated forward to nab a few, likewise did Giles.

No Stanley_Manamal is correct, Giles kicked his goals on Gilbert.

Hickey matched it with Mumford and we win. Longer gets comprehensively beaten and we lose.

Hickey is a much better ruck than Longer. Mumford kllled us today and was probably the difference in the end.

 

[hayes]

Gilbert shut Jeremy Cameron down.

 

[SK_MD_#7]

Gwilt I think it was.

Yeah thought I was missing someone with Delaney had Patton and Gilbert had Cameron most of the match.

 

[Big Mart]

Sobraz

Are you denying those numbers?

Mumford dominated the clearances that day.

Hickey kicked 3

Read how Kingsley answered the question about why Longer was picked. It might give you some insight.

 

[bird_man]

No he wasn't. Hickey won us the game with those goals. Played well too, better than Longer did today. Hickey a much better ruck at this time

Hickey had 20 hit outs and 3 goals
Mumford had 46 hit outs and 1 goal
Mumford was named GWS' best

I'd hardly say Hickey killed Mumford.

I'm a Hickey fan but the truth is he was underdone and would have done no better than Longer today.

I'm not sure why you think Mumford was so influential today, he had less of the footy them last time we played them and he didn't kick a goal. He was hardly the difference between the sides.

 

[dewah07]

Hickey had 20 hit outs and 3 goals
Mumford had 42 hit outs and 1 goal

I'd hardly say Hickey killed Mumford.

I'm a Hickey fan but the truth is he was underdone and would have done no better than Longer today.

I'm not sure why you think Mumford was so influential today, he had less of the footy them last time we played them and he didn't kick a goal. He was hardly the difference between the sides.

Do you have hit outs to ad?

 

[bird_man]

Do you have hit outs to ad?

Can't find it, maybe you can track it down.

 

[aussierulesrules]

Hickey was just dominating that game v GWS last year through the 2nd and 3rd quarters. He was everywhere, just getting touch after touch, mark after mark and kicking goals. One of the neutrals on the MB that day described it as a Dean Cox-like performance and I dare say it would have continued had it not been for the fact he clearly injured or re-injured his foot/toe late in the 3rd quarter that day, after which he hobbled around and his dominance ended. Mumford may have also played well, but that doesn't mean Hickey wasn't also outstanding, until injured. Anyone that saw the game and tries to suggest that he wasn't is kidding themselves.

 

[gringo2011]

So Bunkmoreland haha

Hickey comes in and kicks 3 next week, because he kicked 3 that game? Is that his average?
How did he kick them?
Did he get on the end of play, did he create the goals?
How did his opponent play?
From where I sat, Mummy controlled the contest from the Middle.
One game, where his opponent dominated?! And he's miles ahead Kosi played 5 where he was BOG FFS
How many career goals has he kicked?
If he's miles ahead... What are his massive numbers... Because in terms of HOs Clearances and around the ground numbers... He's an average player at best... He will get better, but until he adds some physicality... He can be exploited

People carry on like he's a star we are missing.

He's been fit for 4 weeks
Why didn't he play if he is miles ahead??

BTW
Why did we win because of Hickeys goals? Did we only kick three for the game?no one else scored??
I'd say we won because we played well?!

Stand by my call
Mummy would have rag dolled Hickey who is still a rake ... Hickey may have snuck fwd for a goal or two but we would have been smashed in the clearances.

I'm a fan of both but Hickey is probably overall a better player at this point in their respective careers. Longer is a big kid still so plenty of time. Hickey is much bigger this year too. It might not help him though as he loses pace and mobility. Anyway there is a distinct possibility we will end up like last year where someone gets an extended run because all other options injured. It looks like you could argue Hickeys ability to score goals and general game play could have won us the game tonight, then you could argue Mumford would have torn him apart in the ruck. We didn't win so the guy who didn't play wins

 

[Joffaboy]

Hickey was just dominating that game v GWS last year through the 2nd and 3rd quarters. He was everywhere, just getting touch after touch, mark after mark and kicking goals. One of the neutrals on the MB that day described it as a Dean Cox-like performance and I dare say it would have continued had it not been for the fact he clearly injured or re-injured his foot/toe late in the 3rd quarter that day, after which he hobbled around and his dominance ended. Mumford may have also played well, but that doesn't mean Hickey wasn't also outstanding, until injured. Anyone that saw the game and tries to suggest that he wasn't is kidding themselves.

Exactly right. Was the dominant ruckman until injured.

A fit Hickey would have been very influential today. Anyone saying Longer is the better option as ruckman just isn't fair dinkum.

It is true that Hickey was underdone for R1. But a fit Hickey is better than a fit Longer every time.

In seasons to come it may be different, but it is pretty obvious that Hickey is the better ruckman.

 

[FlyingSledghamer]

I vote for Hickey : )

 

[Joffaboy]

I vote for Hickey : )

Yes, you are correct, very wise of you.

Anyone saying Longer i better than Hickey at the moment know SFA about football.

 

[Smoke_Me_AKipper]

Yes, you are correct, very wise of you.

Anyone saying Longer i better than Hickey at the moment know SFA about football.

Holmes is the best - chuck out the rest!

 

[Hayes4PM]

Longer battled well...

Don't people remember last time Mummy played us... He had 46 hit outs and 19 touches and a goal. About 150 SC points

Not sure his numbers today, but I reckon he was less influential than that?
It's the reason Kingsley said Billy got picked... To give a better contest vs Mummy. He is a monster, not easy to shift or counter.... So good job Billy IMO

Hickey should be in the team next week.Longer tried hard but couldn't compete with Mumford and could go with him when he spread.

Last season Hickey killed Mumford, kicked three goals and these goals won us the game.

Hickey in this week, does the same and we win.

Longer is good, but Hickey is a better prospect

Wrong, Hickey kicked three goals but Mumford was best on ground that game.

You guys are comparing apples and oranges; one game was a shootout with both teams happy to back their attacking plays whereas this game was quite different.

 

[Joffaboy]

Not a comment on Longer v Hickey, but rather approaches to posting. A number that have taken up this call, that if you disagree with me, you know nothing about football. We can have different opinions, but is this the best that people can do? It could be that I know SFA about football, but still am right. Or it could be an acknowledged expert, but am wrong.

Put up an opinion, back it with your observations and comments. The personal comments on football knowledge are both irrelevant and not needed.

Wasn't directed toward anyone so I dont know what you are taking the moral high ground.

I maintain that Hickey is a much better ruckman than Longer AT THE MOMENT.

In the future Longer may well overtake Hickey, he is only 21 after all, but it is inconceivable to put him ahead of Hickey at the moment.

The only comparison being done is because Hickey was instrumental in our win against GWS last season and yesterday Mumford was the dominant ruckman with Longer trailing him for most of the game.

I have two posters on ignore. One is a serial troll and Hickey hater so I am assuming he is being personal towards others on this thread.

Thankfully I dont have to read his halfbaked dross. Anybody who disrespects our players like he does (calling McCartin a fat diabetic) deserves no oxygen.

 

[Barrels]

Wasn't directed toward anyone so I dont know what you are taking the moral high ground.

I maintain that Hickey is a much better ruckman than Longer AT THE MOMENT.

In the future Longer may well overtake Hickey, he is only 21 after all, but it is inconceivable to put him ahead of Hickey at the moment.

The only comparison being done is because Hickey was instrumental in our win against GWS last season and yesterday Mumford was the dominant ruckman with Longer trailing him for most of the game.

I have two posters on ignore. One is a serial troll and Hickey hater so I am assuming he is being personal towards others on this thread.

Thankfully I dont have to read his halfbaked dross. Anybody who disrespects our players like he does (calling McCartin a fat diabetic) deserves no oxygen.

Is the other one SK_MD_#7? Cos that guys a flog.

 

[Joffaboy]

Is the other one SK_MD_#7? Cos that guys a flog.

No, you are the other one, and I am not reading or responding to you either

 

[Barrels]

No, you are the other one, and I am not reading or responding to you either

Well **** you then BigJoff.

 

[Sunshine Saint]

Wasn't directed toward anyone so I dont know what you are taking the moral high ground.

I maintain that Hickey is a much better ruckman than Longer AT THE MOMENT.

In the future Longer may well overtake Hickey, he is only 21 after all, but it is inconceivable to put him ahead of Hickey at the moment.

The only comparison being done is because Hickey was instrumental in our win against GWS last season and yesterday Mumford was the dominant ruckman with Longer trailing him for most of the game.

I have two posters on ignore. One is a serial troll and Hickey hater so I am assuming he is being personal towards others on this thread.

Thankfully I dont have to read his halfbaked dross. Anybody who disrespects our players like he does (calling McCartin a fat diabetic) deserves no oxygen.

Joffaboy, my comment wasn't in relation to the Hickey or Longer discussion, or aimed at you. I used your post as a comment that these increasing comments from a number of posters on here, questioning peoples football knowledge, as the basis for the superiority of their argument, are not needed.

If someones comment is backed up by reasons, examples and their own personal insight, we can all make our own judgements, irrespective of their football background. We have for example a number of international posters on here, who may not have played the game, or the life long involvement that some have had, but theirs and others opinions, bring fresh viewpoints and allow us to see many sides of any discussion.

The variety of opinions, observations, insights and colour are what makes this forum so successful. If we only wanted those who agreed with us, we could stay out fishing and merrily talking to ourselves.

 

[Big Mart]

It's funny... The Coaching Panel considered Longer the better match up for Mumford. This has been stated by them.

The underdone thing is rubbish, N Roo was underdone, Savage was underdone, Hickey has been fit to play since the week after the intraclub.

He's played 2 VFL games and two NAB challenge games. There was no mention of him being underdone post match like Billings.

Kingsley clearly knew the midfield of Treloar, Shiel, Ward, Griffen, Whitfield and Co didn't need an arm chair ride. And we needed a strong body to compete with Mummy. It worked... He had less influence than normal.

The post match presser, AR highlighted Billy as a reason we got back into the contest. I'd consider Mumford having the better in Q2

If one believes a Ruckmans primary job is to get on the end of a few and kick some goals.. They possibly have never played or don't understand footy. Whilst a goal or two is a bonus, a Ruckmans role is to give first use, secondary role is to give an aerial contest, particularly down back. There are between 50-75 ball ups per game... Clearances win games of footy, ruckmen are important for set ups. Thirdly it's to win footy as a midfielder. Because they are in effect mids. If they can rest fwd and kick a goal or two it's nice, no different to any other mid.

Goals, I find it interesting when people measure goals as an indicator of a players performance. It's like measuring wickets as to how well you bowled. It's an outcome measurement, not a performance measurement. How they got the goals is another thing..... Where they the beneficiary, did they create? Cameron kicked 4 yesterday, Bruce was far better. Coaches do NOT care who kicks goals... It's how they are created.

Next week I'd select Hickey, because of match ups, but having seen him live in the VFL. He has a long way to go physically, before he can be considered a #1 Ruckman of quality. A lot of Josh Fraser about Hickey. Billy is raw and lacks skill, but cracks in hard.

 

[CALL ME SNAKE]

I think the fact that half of us want Hickey and half of us want Longer proves that they were both good pick ups by our club
If we didnt want either we'd be in trouble .

 

[Persevering Saint]

I just hate that this thread was started by the dreaded P66 in his brief sojourn to ruin this place as well.

 

[joop]

I think the fact that half of us want Hickey and half of us want Longer proves that they were both good pick ups by our club
If we didnt want either we'd be in trouble .

But don't you know how bigfooty works? half are wrong & half are right.

 

[Winners Only]

If Hickey was fit and ready to play I beleive he and Longer should have played yesterday to combat Mumfords dominance. Hickey wouod have been a good option up forward at the expense of one of the small forwards.

 

[Joffaboy]

News is that Roo is OK and that Longer will keep his spot.

Obviously richo's job is safe and he is looking at Parish # 1 pick and Tucker with the PP.

Must not care if we lose every match having Longer ahead of Hickey.

Already the selections are starting to look more and more Watters like every week.

Hickey must be completely undone or has shagged Richo's missuus