Pfft! Far more telling I think is Jeffy having better season high and game high goal totals. That's all the proof you need. Disposals counts are a pretty meaningless measure of what was being said.
Luke Breust vs Jeff Garlett
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Pfft! Far more telling I think is Jeffy having better season high and game high goal totals. That's all the proof you need. Disposals counts are a pretty meaningless measure of what was being said.
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Breust already ahead of Garlett in career possessions and goals per game. The gap will only widen unless the inconsistent Garlett gets his act together.
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That is a very bad argument. Bruest IS better. Garlett WAS better. And on that basis Garlett is the better player?
And Garlett has better season high results than a player who hasn't yet played a full season. You'd be pretty worried if he didn't
Better season high and game high goal totals???
Season Goals
Garlett 16
Breust 25
Best Return
Garlett 3 goals x 2 games
Breust 3 goals x 5 games
Quiet games
Garlett zero goals x 5 games
Breust zero goals x 3 games
Add to this Breust's better work rate in terms of tackles, clearances makes Breust clearly the better player thus far in 2012
LOL. And Garlett WAS better than Breust IS.
You might not like the runs on the board argument, but that doesn't mean it's a bad one. I mean s**t, from where I stand, your argument is that Breust is better not because he's exceeded Garlett's top form, but because Garlett's form has dropped this year and Breust has comparatively been better. Now that's a bad argument.
That's right. Garlett has higher benchmarks in these stats than Breust.
But yes, Breust's 2012 in these areas have been better than Garlett's 2012 in those areas.
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One player playing better than another is a bad argument for rating a player? Thought it would be just about the only argument.
Take Garlett by all means, but don't pretend that he has some unquantifiable characteristic Breust doesn't. And don't pretend that it is a foregone conclusion that Garlett will return to the player he was.
And even then, Breust's year this year is every bit as good as Garlett's last year. Garlett was kicking and extra goal every 5 games while Breust is getting more of the ball, impacting through the middle more and is better defensively.
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So can we get this straight? Is Breust currently a better player than Garlett and performing better on the footy field?
Chris Grant may have played better than Carey in 1997, but Carey was the better player and this showed with his higher peak performance over a game and season. So yeah, for me, it's pretty poor logic to use current form as the only guide for assessing who is a better player. Not saying it means nothing, but it's not the everything you're saying it is.
And while I agree its no foregone conclusion that Garlett will return to the form he's shown since debut, the same could be said for Breust continuing as he is, so it's kind of a moot point. What we have is exposed form and an unwritten future.
Yeah nah. Garlett was a top 12 goal kicker last season - the the top echelon of small forwards; Breust is a little off that at the moment, surely even you can see that. Terms like "impacting more through the middle" are so wanky and meaningless. And better defensively ... not sure why you say that; Garlett was a defensive machine up forward last season. And please, don't just cite tackle counts, defensive impact is so much more than notching up a tackle stat.
I can agree that Breust is currently playing better football than Garlett. How's that?
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It's a start. And it's really all I care about.
I've never claimed otherwise. It's what this means in broader terms that is under contention.
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Where would you rate "defensive impact" on your wanky and meaningless scale?
Unfortunately the only stats that are available for us to measure defensive effectiveness are tackles... It is unfortunate for Jeffy that they cannot measure running past someone and saying "BOOOOOO" to try to scare them into a turnover..
Not too far behind impacting more through the middle actually, but at least that's a discussion point for many, whereas the other one is a Hawthorn special usually reserved for explaining why Rioli doesn't quite match it with the top tier of small forwards. And here it pops its head up again in a similar discussion with Breust. No surprises there, but it's high on wank factor, that's for sure. I mean Garlett has always had an impact through the middle of the ground and while he averages a couple of disposal more, Garlett actually averages more kicks by a bigger margin.
Poor measurement gives poor conclusion. Here's a Jeffy defensive act without laying a tackle.
Poor measurement gives poor conclusion. Here's a Jeffy defensive act without laying a tackle.
Mistaken a defensive act with a s**t gold coast hand ball...
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Yeah, I was just hanging s**t on your blatant hypocrisy, I don't actually care. As for Cyril, maybe one day he'll be in Jeffy's league, the "top echelon".
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So defensive preassure (tackles), clearances, disposals don't matter because they're wanky
But Garlett is better because of a MASSIVE 0.2 goal per game differential and some unmeasurable, unexplainable, magical illusion of "impact". Also the fact that he is "top-echelon" just because, well..... um..... because he just is
Could you post another 20+ of these from the one season so it would make any significant difference over a season?
But Garlett is better because of a MASSIVE 0.2 goal per game differential and some unmeasurable, unexplainable, magical illusion of "impact". Also the fact that he is "top-echelon" just because, well..... um..... because he just is
Poor measurement gives poor conclusion. Here's a Jeffy defensive act without laying a tackle.
Could you post another 20+ of these from the one season so it would make any significant difference over a season?
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Bruest has developed into much more than a goal sneak.
His actual strength that the club are now building on is his time and space that he finds in contested situations. He has a very neat sidestep, and can find his way through a lot of congested situations. His mentoring from Mitchell and Sewell in this regard has seen him get more and more chances in the middle, and he's taken them with both hands.
He's now a very dangerous player, capable of rotating through the middle, while also kicking 2 or 3 goals a week.
Garlett on the other hand is having a form slump, but is more of your natural forward, who bases more of his game on elusiveness around goal.
His actual strength that the club are now building on is his time and space that he finds in contested situations. He has a very neat sidestep, and can find his way through a lot of congested situations. His mentoring from Mitchell and Sewell in this regard has seen him get more and more chances in the middle, and he's taken them with both hands.
He's now a very dangerous player, capable of rotating through the middle, while also kicking 2 or 3 goals a week.
Garlett on the other hand is having a form slump, but is more of your natural forward, who bases more of his game on elusiveness around goal.
Nah! Without the defensive act, Garlett wouldn't have the ball.
Strange comment. Clearances are nearly identical between these players and Jeffy has more kicks than Breust. What's wanky is the "impacts more through the midfield" claim. It's just what Hawks posters seem to do when their small forward's numbers don't match up to others. What, you don't think Jeffy has a run through the midfield time to time?
As for tackles, the difference is pretty slight to begin with, but as my example shows, defensive pressure is not just tackles and it would be flawed to conclude on that basis. Jeffy was lauded for his defensive work last year, with commentators even observing the inferred pressure he created on opposition ball carriers.
For a start, Breust hasn't finished his season yet, so don't be counting your chicken's. Hawthorn have been the form team of the comp and Breust has improved his form with the team. At the moment, he's sitting around guys like Ian Callinan and Josh Hill outside the top 20 goal kickers. Last year Garlett was right among the top few small forwards well within the top 20 goal kickers.
Breust 30 goals for the year, 4th of the "small forwards" only 6 behind the leader Lewis Jetta...
Breust is a complete player was yet to really perform in a massive game until today. Absolutely proved he has it today...
Breust is a complete player was yet to really perform in a massive game until today. Absolutely proved he has it today...
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Breust now averages just as many goals as Jeffy did last year. More disposals, more tackles.
Jeffy had more kicks but that's pretty much it.
Clutching at straws now if you are going to make a 'runs on the board' argument
Jeffy had more kicks but that's pretty much it.
Clutching at straws now if you are going to make a 'runs on the board' argument
