M Hayden begins his community contribution

Remove this Banner Ad

Dudley

Dudley

Club Legend
Suspended
Veteran
Jun 24, 2005
1,492
2
Paddo
AFL Club
Sydney
Other Teams
point piper jelly wrestle
After having his retainer docked by CA, (because he was injured chasing extra cash in the IPL) and therefore missed a tour.

M Hayden approachs the Australian Players Association and asks them to give him compensation. M Hayden then takes the cash from the association fund designed for players in financial difficulty.

M Hayden 13 years on a central contract and millions in endorsements.

Terrific work Matthew, i am sure the cricket community applauds your contribution to the fund.
 
Dudley said:
After having his retainer docked by CA, (because he was injured chasing extra cash in the IPL) and therefore missed a tour.

M Hayden approachs the Australian Players Association and asks them to give him compensation. M Hayden then takes the cash from the association fund designed for players in financial difficulty.

M Hayden 13 years on a central contract and millions in endorsements.

Terrific work Matthew, i am sure the cricket community applauds your contribution to the fund.
Click to expand...

When was this conveyed to the public?
 

Log in to remove this ad.

I've found a few articles quoting the docked pay but it claims Hayden took the pay from the associations player insurance pool.


Most professional associations and unions run such a scheme and it's not unfair to assume as a member he contributed to this and therefore is entitled to claim.

I certainly maintain an insurance policy that should I get a condition that would render me unable to work I will be paid for from the insurance fund.

However if someone can link me to a source of the Hard ship fund having being accessed I would be willing to read.


this is one of the article's I've found.



http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,24933792-952,00.html
 
  • Thread starter
  • Banned
  • #9
It is an insurance 'pool' not a policy.

He was docked by CA for being in breach of a contract condition. If it was a 'policy' it would not be valid. The payment was out of a fund designed for players who are in strife/hardship. As you point out, he contributed, therefore he is entitled to a payout (if the administrators believe it valid).

My point is it is morally weak from a bloke who was on a central contract for 13 years and who did very very well from selling junk food wearing Aussie colours. More importantly from a man who intends 'contributing to the community' not bleeding its pool dry
 
Dudley said:
It is an insurance 'pool' not a policy.

He was docked by CA for being in breach of a contract condition. If it was a 'policy' it would not be valid. The payement was out of a fund designed for players who are in strife/hardship. As you point out, he contributed, therefore he is entitled to a payout (if the administrators believe it valid).

My point is it is morally weak from a bloke who was on a central contract for 13 years and who did very very well from selling junk food wearing Aussie colours. More importantly from a man who intends contributing to the community' not bleeding its pool dry
Click to expand...

As I said... It Says insurance fund,I belive it is an insurance policy and fund that is being referred too. The kind most if not all professional associations and Unions for that matter have for their members. And insurance company work on the pool and investment principal.

Its insurance on your health. Hayden pays in he collects. We all have it or should. Sportsman in particular who are reliant on their body have it, you can bet most of the swans have it.

It's not weak it's common bloody sense. What your issue with calling him weak for collecting insurance payments when he was unable to work.
And if the insurance fund is the same as the Hardship fund than they really should call it

No article quotes the hardship fund in any way. I think you've associated which fund he took the money from incorrectly.
 
CAS79 said:
As I said... It Says insurance fund,I belive it is an insurance policy and fund that is being referred too. The kind most if not all professional associations and Unions for that matter have for their members. And insurance company work on the pool and investment principal.

Its insurance on your health. Hayden pays in he collects. We all have it or should. Sportsman in particular who are reliant on their body have it, you can bet most of the swans have it.

It's not weak it's common bloody sense. What your issue with calling him weak for collecting insurance payments when he was unable to work.
And if the insurance fund is the same as the Hardship fund than they really should call it

No article quotes the hardship fund in any way. I think you've associated which fund he took the money from incorrectly.
Click to expand...

I think you will find i am not.

Explain to me how you buy insurance on your health/loss of earnings which comes into effect when your employer ' enacts a clause in its Overseas Club Playing Agreement denying you a portion of your retainer and any compensation or insurance' ?

I think you will find it is a pool/fund of members money used for instances where the administrators of the fund believe a player has suffered a financial penalty. Mainly aimed at injury/hardship associated with same.
 
Dudley said:
I think you will find i am not.

Explain to me how you buy insurance on your health/loss of earnings which comes into effect when your employer ' enacts a clause in its Overseas Club Playing Agreement denying you a portion of your retainer and any compensation or insurance' ?

I think you will find it is a pool/fund of members money used for instances where the administrators of the fund believe a player has suffered a financial penalty. Mainly aimed at injury/hardship associated with same.
Click to expand...

Quite simply

Dear Mr Hayden As you were unable to play for the Australian cricket team due to an injury sustained in a non approved arena and therefore being unavaile for work we will not be paying you for the services as you were unable to provide them through no fault of our own (CA legitimacy to di this is being questioned by Hayden)

James S


Pick up the phone.

Paul.. You know that fund I pay 250 a month to protect me in in case I get injured, Maimed or Sick and cant play cricket. Well James just told me i'm not being paid for the time my Achilles injury flared up"

"Yeah he reckons I did it in the IPL the little S$%*"

"Anyway as I was injured and unable to fulfill my duties for a few months can i make a claim on the insurance policy".

"Paperwork" "Send it to me mate I'll fill it in the dressing room while the lads are batting at Melbourne, god knows I wont be"




.... As I said sports people have such Insurance as a matter of course and as the professional association why is it wrong to assume its being run by the ACA.
 
It is a 'pool' not a policy how many times !

Players all contribute, Hayden takes the cash. If you actually read what happened, the ACPA stepped in and agreed to pay him out of the pool, it did not lodge a claim on his behalf. Do you understand the difference ?

Again, IMO, morally corrupt behaviour from 'community service' man
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Dudley said:
It is a 'pool' not a policy how many times !

Players all contribute, Hayden takes the cash. If you actually read what happened, the ACPA stepped in and agreed to pay him out of the pool, it did not lodge a claim on his behalf. Do you understand the difference ?

Again, IMO, morally corrupt behaviour from 'community service' man
Click to expand...

I'll tell you how many times. All Insurance works on a pool policy.


Really Dudders, you come on all high and mighty, have you ever been in a membership organisation? Been a part of its benefits including the insurance pool....

Even if you have not why do you think you would claim differently from the pool to your insurance company. Just because it's titled a pool does not mean he has a policy with that organisation in relation to how to claim it Dudly. You still have a policy when your part of the pool dudly

In fact if you have an insurance policy with a company or mutual organisation your part of the pool too. If we all take out health insurance with MBF it pools our resources (as well as invests them) and 9 of us don’t need it that year the pool pays your psychology bills.

Regardless, you used the title hardship fund, which was reported the like of which Paul Hibbert have accessed and which has been labelled as specifically the Hardship Fund when it was reported as when he died.

This has specifically been reported too as the insurance pool by different Media as the pool. If you know it to be the same as the Hardship fund well done, than I wont call it an insurance pool because it would not be.... Nothing on the cricket board nothing found on the internet matches the ACA insurance pool and the hardship fund bar one... A search to reveal this thread.


But on one front thankyou, I’ts has been good few months since I’ve had a proper disagreement on bigfooty… it’s good to have even if it’s a claytons.
 
CAS79 said:
I'll tell you how many times. All Insurance works on a pool policy.


Really Dudders, you come on all high and mighty, have you ever been in a membership organisation? Been a part of its benefits including the insurance pool....

Even if you have not why do you think you would claim differently from the pool to your insurance company. Just because it's titled a pool does not mean he has a policy with that organisation in relation to how to claim it Dudly. You still have a policy when your part of the pool dudly

In fact if you have an insurance policy with a company or mutual organisation your part of the pool too. If we all take out health insurance with MBF it pools our resources (as well as invests them) and 9 of us don’t need it that year the pool pays your psychology bills.

Regardless, you used the title hardship fund, which was reported the like of which Paul Hibbert have accessed and which has been labelled as specifically the Hardship Fund when it was reported as when he died.

This has specifically been reported too as the insurance pool by different Media as the pool. If you know it to be the same as the Hardship fund well done, than I wont call it an insurance pool because it would not be.... Nothing on the cricket board nothing found on the internet matches the ACA insurance pool and the hardship fund bar one... A search to reveal this thread.


But on one front thankyou, I’ts has been good few months since I’ve had a proper disagreement on bigfooty… it’s good to have even if it’s a claytons.
Click to expand...

Gawd, where to start...

Oh well here goes, the reason you cannot find anything on the internet about the ACA is because it is the players association paying Hayden, not the ACA. Looking in the right place is a good first step.

Secondly, tell me which mutual fund allows a third party purchaser of their product to 'decide to step in and pay? Also, remind me which insurance company (not mutual) describes their policy as a pool?

Where in your searches of cricket chat boards did it suggest a claim was lodged by the ACPA with any mutual organisition or insurance company?

Just because you dont like to think Hayden is rorting the ACPA, and its members, does not make your ludicrous assumptions correct. You have no facts whatsoever.

The basis of your argument is 'I cant find anything'
Pretty weak really.
 
Dudley said:

Oh well here goes, the reason you cannot find anything on the internet about the ACA is because it is the players association paying Hayden, not the ACA. Looking in the right place is a good first step.

I love you opening line. If your going to attack me for not knowing what i'm talking about check the facts before you type them.

ACA is a pretty good acronym for the Australian Cricketers Association
who are the professional body I was referring to by the ACA, there not the not the ACPA as claimed by yourself.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_Cricketers'_Association

I can find them on the internet all right.

Secondly, tell me which mutual fund allows a third party purchaser of their product to 'decide to step in and pay? Where did I say that happened? Where has anyone said that has happened? Who is the third party?

Also, remind me which insurance company (not mutual) describes their policy as a pool?

Read the quote at the end of the post.

Where in your searches of cricket chat boards did it suggest a claim was lodged by the ACPA with any mutual organisation or insurance company?

My referrel was to indicate you are the only one saying he took from the Hardship fund thats what I said was looked at, In fact I cant find any discussion of this on the two cricket boards about this iassiue at all.

Just because you don’t like to think Hayden is rorting the ACPA, and its members, does not make your ludicrous assumptions correct. You have no facts whatsoever.

Just because you don’t like Hayden and like an opportunity to get stuck into people does not make you tenuous link between insurance pool and Hardship fund correct either. You have presented no facts other than what you have put in your head that makes the link. You and I have quoted the Media outlets and have come up with insurance pool, not hardship fund, you drew the link all I asked was for you to show it.

My only assumption is that Hayden paid into an insurance pool being run or organised through the ACA because of a situation that left him unable to work claimed a payment from it. To me that hardly sounds unfeasible.

The basis of your argument is 'I can’t find anything'
Pretty weak really.

As always, the onus is on the accuser to prove guilt.

I went looking as believe me, I have an open mind on all issues and unlike the Kerryman I make sure I have two sources before quoting things as gospel, but before passing judgment I like evidence. Upon receiving proof, I will lower my sword and shield.

Click to expand...



Also regardless of what the insurance companies call their policy/plan here is a description on insurance basics from RGIB, in which they explain that insurance is a pool system, regardless of its title.

http://www.ruralandgeneral.com.au/insurance-consumer-insurance-basics.php#whatisinsurance


What is Insurance?
Insurance is a system under which individuals, businesses, and other organizations or entities (the insured), in exchange for payment of a sum of money (a premium), are guaranteed compensation for losses resulting from certain perils under specified conditions.
In general terms, insurance is funded by pooling premiums from insureds for the purposes of building a fund with sufficient reserves to pay for claims made on policies issued. Essentially, insurance involves a large number of people paying a small amount of money to make sure the few who need to make a claim are covered.
Insurance companies should try to make sure that every individual who has insurance pays a premium that reflects their risk. For example premium collected from home owners would ordinarily enter a home owners insurance pool as would premium collected from business owners ordinarily enter a business insurance pool".
This method helps insurance companies price and monitor group risk with a higher level of accuracy and ensures low risk insureds are not penalised by higher than necessary premiums to fund losses from higher risk insureds ie, hairdressing salon premiums increased because of losses from motor vehicle insurance.
However, this is not necessarily always the case as some insurance companies do in fact poolall premiums together in one central fund to cover various risks.
The advantage of having insurance is that it allows the community to pool risks. This takes away the need for people to pay the full cost of loss or damage on their own, which in some cases, could, if it occurred, leave people in great financial difficulty.
Click to expand...





pretty simple really
 
Oops, thought I'd logged into RWO by mistake! ;)
 
CAS79 said:
[/FONT][/COLOR]


Also regardless of what the insurance companies call their policy/plan here is a description on insurance basics from RGIB, in which they explain that insurance is a pool system, regardless of its title.

http://www.ruralandgeneral.com.au/insurance-consumer-insurance-basics.php#whatisinsurance








pretty simple really
Click to expand...

I really cant be arsed to respond to this point by point.

Again, show me where the players association lodged a claim with an insurance company on M Hayden behalf?

Every single report states; 'the players association stepped in and paid hayden from their pool' or words to that effect.

You are wrong and have zero proof, yet somehow i have to prove you wrong. I think the standard is, someone makes an assertion, a second person proves them wrong, you have failed miseraby, even by your own admission. You are now just applying the long winded blathering principle.

Sorry, but that is the truth.
 
Dudley said:
I really cant be arsed to respond to this point by point.

Again, show me where the players association lodged a claim with an insurance company on M Hayden behalf?

Every single report states; 'the players association stepped in and paid hayden from their pool' or words to that effect.

You are wrong and have zero proof, yet somehow i have to prove you wrong. I think the standard is, someone makes an assertion, a second person proves them wrong, you have failed miseraby, even by your own admission. You are now just applying the long winded blathering principle.

Sorry, but that is the truth.
Click to expand...




From the article you posted comes the evidence.

the Australian Cricketers Association stepped in to compensate the Test legend out of its own player insurance pool.
Click to expand...

A big difference from the associations own insurance pool as you implied above and throughout this thread

Its an insurance pool run for players, as titled in the article.

This is evidence you wont accept because it does not support your argument therefore it is conveniently ignored by yourself. In the lack of any contradiction evidence to this you accused any points arguing your own as not being worth of notice.

you have stopped arguing points and just blew metaphoric loud noise.
 
Dudley said:
Which bit of this do you not understand, so again....
Click to expand...

Responded to already Dudly.

I said they didn't. Perhaps you should read the points I responded to rather than just writing them off as irrelevant.

I'm saying Hayden would be a contributor personally to this pool.

And as such when it states the Australian Cricketers Association stepped in through the pool it runs on behalf of the players, like a policy before you cover old ground again. There is no third party involvement it's just a one sentence media terminology in a sports page confusing you.

Regardless you have shown nothing and I mean nothing at all that links the insurance pool to the hardship fund.

perhaps your next post could focus on that rather than losing your original accusation in verbose irrelevancy.
 
CAS79 said:
Responded to already Dudly.

I said they didn't. Perhaps you should read the points I responded to rather than just writing them off as irrelevant.

I'm saying Hayden would be a contributor personally to this pool.
Click to expand...

LOl,

So, if that was your assertion, when i posted.

"I think you will find it is a pool/fund of members money used for instances where the administrators of the fund believe a player has suffered a financial penalty. Mainly aimed at injury/hardship associated with same."

and

"It is an insurance 'pool' not a policy.

He was docked by CA for being in breach of a contract condition. If it was a 'policy' it would not be valid. The payment was out of a fund designed for players who are in strife/hardship. As you point out, he contributed, therefore he is entitled to a payout (if the administrators believe it valid).

My point is it is morally weak from a bloke who was on a central contract for 13 years and who did very very well from selling junk food wearing Aussie colours. More importantly from a man who intends 'contributing to the community' not bleeding its pool dry

Did you respond with;

"As I said... It Says insurance fund,I belive it is an insurance policy and fund that is being referred too. The kind most if not all professional associations and Unions for that matter have for their members. And insurance company work on the pool and investment principal.


Sorry champ but you are now trying to argue my original point! That point being, Hayden is claiming from a self funded pool which is designed to assist injured players in financial hardship.

So, again, for a player on 13 years of central contract and a fat IPL payout, i find it morally corrupt to drain a self funded insurance pool designed for less well off, players doing it tough, of funds.

You my friend were trying to suggest it was merely a claim on a policy which he had paid for with an insurance company.

And, again, i made the original assertion, you 'cant find anything on chat sites'

You have no argument, it is weak, sorry.
 
Dudley said:
LOl,



Sorry champ but you are now trying to argue my original point! That point being, Hayden is claiming from a self funded pool which is designed to assist injured players in financial hardship.
.
Click to expand...

What Hayden claimed from is exactly like that of an insurance pool that membership organizations run for there members because his injury prevented him from earning an income. Not dissimilar to that of an insurance company and to that point I still hold and it may well be underwritten by a company.

Regardless it was not the Hardship fund that was set up to help players the less well off which is specifically Harddship fund the likes of which Paul Hibbert have accessed which is a different fund altogether.

Anyway this has reached stale mate so its time to move on.

So

......

this space below is for your final say.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

J
Can someone please explain Toasties to me
2 3 4 5 6
Replies
127
Views
8K
Kirkswan
Kirkswan
SwansProudly
Random Makes me smile :)
Replies
19
Views
3K
SwansProudly
SwansProudly

Remove this Banner Ad

Back
Top