Round 21: Hawthorn vs Port Adelaide - Etihad Stadium

[Freomaniac]

Thank you for raising my spirits. It was a very disappointing loss, but hearing a Freo fan criticise my club as potentially the worst 3 peaters ever has shifted my mood. By extension of your logic, If Freo win the flag this year, they'll be the worst team ever to have won only 1 flag. I doubt you'll be bothered much though, too busy celebrating, just as I was the last two years.

Well Hawks such as you were pot shotting my mob and kicking my mob when they were down, I am sur your a long suffering hawks fan from the 1940s.

 

[Freomaniac]

Got a few easy goals via fast ball movement that was hard to stop. Lost heaps of contests against Shoey.

No excuses, he is a Hawks player, I expected him to hold Schulz kickless. Who is to blame for letting Wingard and Gray loose?

 

[Freomaniac]

Remember it well do you?

Yep, they were more low scoring than the swans in the 2005 grand final. Hell the Port Magpies SANFL premiership side of 1884 would of beaten the Hawks.

 

[Claude Balls]

I thank you for your undoubtedly unbiased comparison of "equally successful outfits". I assume you don't include Geelong in that given their inability to win back to backs during their recent 3? If you really think we've won in spite of our list, why don't you list out current bottom 5 and then give us Geelong's bottom 5 from 2011?



I think it compares pretty favourably with all AFL era great teams. Very even, with very few holes. Brisbane had one of the best midfields of all time, but I'd back our forward line over theirs (especially including Buddy, which seems fair given he'd be part of any 3-peat (which is looking less likely after today's result)). Our forward line shits all over Geelong 07-11 forward line, while their backline is clearly better than ours - even with the inclusion of Lake who is clearly nearing the end now.

Of course I'm including Geelong. You can't seriously be telling me they're not equally successful because they didn't go back to back?

I suppose you probably are. Hawks fans just love the B2B tag because it suits their argument in relation to Geelong. History shows it's not even that difficult, having occurred 22 or 23 times. At least once and often twice a decade. On the other hand, how easy it is to set a record, such as most games won over a stretch of 100, or 200? Well, it's not easy at all, because it has to be better than everything that went before. I.e. it's unprecedented.

But that's neither here nor there. The point is that you have to look at things more qualitatively. Was Adelaide 97/98 a better team than West Coast 92/94, or North 96/99? Carlton '95 only won the single flag but there's a case to me made that they were better than all those teams on paper. Why couldn't Geelong do it? Well, injury, motivation, stagnant coaching, a bit of bad luck etc, are all huge factors. My point with relation to Hawthorn is precisely that in all those fore-mentioned areas, they have been exemplary. If they win 3 in a row it will be largely thanks to these elements.

As for comparing lists directly, if you think Hawthorn's compares favourably to Brisbane's in terms of depth of talent, we should probably just agree to disagree and leave it at that.

 

[Moggy]

Port look so much better without Lobbe. One dedicated ruck is enough. Ah Chee looks like he might make it at AFL level. Love seeing him use that long handball at every opportunity he gets.

If you think Ah Chee is good, you should see his brother Ah Choo!

I'll get my coat...

 

[a_fighting_fury]

if i ever see Brian Lake in real life Im gunna punch him in the balls as hard as I can and then run like a mofo

If you manage to punch him in the balls as hard as you can, you won't need to run.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Xtreme]

Question must be asked... The hawks in Perth in a qualifying final.. Are they really that good?

Depends which version shows up

The Ferrari
The Flintstone mobile

The team that was able to beat Fremantle Sydney and the Eagles
The team that played worse than Carlton when they lost to Essendon, GWS, Richmond and Port Adelaide

 

[Spook]

Port are a great side, they should do well in the finals.

 

[Spook]

There's no ruling on accidental v deliberate in free kicks ......High is high

High is high When tackling yes we all agree, however Gibson was not tackling him. Gibson punched the ball and wingard ran into Gibson.

 

[Naked_North]

Port are a great side, they should do well in the finals.

Sorry mate someone already cracked that joke

 

[Interstater]

Port are a great side, they should do well in the finals.

Thanks Spook, I now look forward to watching a team from Perth end your season.
We've done our bit to make it a little easier for them.

Us "interstaters" like to stick together sometimes

 

[gaelictiogar]

Is it a motivation thing?

Hawks have dropped a surprising number of games this year given that they are generally accepted to be still ahead of everyone.

Where they stand vis a vis other great champion teams is an argument we can have but that they are a great champion team is unarguable. Great teams rot from within at first clowly and unseen but then the fall is sharp. Are the failures to get up "when it doesn't matter" when "we are waiting for September" etc indicative of sated players in a sated team. Has the slide begun.

Irrespective of whether they win the flag I think the answer is yes. Still a great team, still legit favs for the lag but the worm is in the apple.

 

[Ron The Bear]

In Hawthorn's defence, Brisbane was erratic just prior to the three-peat. In 2003 they dropped 7 of 13 games from Round 11, culminating in a QF defeat before winning three finals on the trot.

Whether the Hawks can switch on when it really counts, remains to be seen.

 

[Concussion]

Port look so much better without Lobbe. One dedicated ruck is enough. Ah Chee looks like he might make it at AFL level. Love seeing him use that long handball at every opportunity he gets.

The short handballs 10m from goal are questionable

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Port just handed the premiership to the Dockers.

 

[Papa G]

All this proves is that without significant umpire intervention, Hawthorn struggle to beat Port.

 

[ZingerB]

Are we judging a player off one game or even one season?

Wingard doesnt eat dinner at the same table as Cyril, particularly defensively which people seem to forget.

Most people are talking about All Australian (this year) so yeah Wingard is molesting Rioli this year with 20 more goals, more touches, more score assists, more everything. I don't understand your timeframe as Rioli hardly played last year while Wingard had a good year (so obviously Wingard was better), and Wingard was all Australian and won the B+F the year before, so Wingard has been better than Rioli in 3 out of the 4 seasons he has played, and the only one he wasn't better than Rioli was his 1st as an 18 year old.

 

[chazwazza]

High is high When tackling yes we all agree, however Gibson was not tackling him. Gibson punched the ball and wingard ran into Gibson.

Mate, if you make high contact in a marking contest it's a free kick, just accept it.

 

[SA HAWK]

In Hawthorn's defence, Brisbane was erratic just prior to the three-peat. In 2003 they dropped 7 of 13 games from Round 11, culminating in a QF defeat before winning three finals on the trot.

Whether the Hawks can switch on when it really counts, remains to be seen.

Apart from the Richmond game we have given a very good account of ourselves against the other top 8 sides.

Swans lost 3 out of their last 4 games before the 2012 finals and looked shot worked out ok for them.

 

[ZingerB]

Agree cant expect umpires to see something like that in the corner of there eye and not give a free.

Gibson has a right to be annoyed though, i know i would be in his situation he did nothing wrong.

Yeah it would be less hard to take if

The Gibbo free and umpire goal , should have been a ball up. That was a heavy collision but totally incidental /accidental, but it cost a goal , and it shouldn't have , its that simple, no change to the result , we don't make excuses, but umpires make terrible mistakes in the way they interpret the rules, its whats murdering the game. Gibbo went for a legitimate spoil and did it, he had no other option, but maybe to stand back and watch, you want one of your blokes to do that.

Stupid and misread by the umpire.

And effing Cometti saying how well he explained it, it was too late then when he created a score for your team.
What if it was on the other foot.

See I'm not talking about which team, but the umpires incapacity to see football in its raw reality as things happen , they can't , and now days they create situations they should not be able to.

Then they explain to the player "I didn't see it " or " I didn't see it that way", or, and this is a beauty , "I know it was an accident but you hit his head, "
well... yes you twit , but by accident in the action of playing football as a defender, Once again what does a defender do sit back and effing well watch!??

The umpire may as well have had the shot for the Port player. This is how these guys are being taught to adjudicate, in split seconds, on nonsenses.

Its very frustrating , you will suffer it too don't worry. But gee the more I see the less I feel like watching. By the way I've been saying this when we win too, and about other games as well. Its a blight on the sport.

And if it doesn't set up a backdoor operator getting umps to take a little grease off the paw, for crooked gamblers , nothing does.

Its wide open to that!

Yeah and if the umpires could adjudicate the holding the ball and holding rule you would have lost by 10 goals. It is funny that in 3 of the last 4 games against Hawthorn, the umpiring has been disgracefully in favour of Hawthorn. It doesn't seem to stop Hawthorn supporters telling everyone they were robbed though.

 

[shintemaster]

$10 was ridiculous. Easy to say in hindsight but I said from when I saw it That it was easy money

I had them at $10, the line & 40+. The latter got my hopes up for a bit, was looking at $800+ for about a $20 outlay for a while there. Will take the $280 though... sometimes you just have a good feeling and those sorts of odds in AFL often provide value. In a two horse race I think they're ridiculous.

 

[manureid]

Stevic just could not do enough on his own to get the Hawks over the line last night. Clarko will propably revoke his membership today.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Apart from the Richmond game we have given a very good account of ourselves against the other top 8 sides.

Swans lost 3 out of their last 4 games before the 2012 finals and looked shot worked out ok for them.

Few premiers drop games where they're 2+ years per player older than the opposition, and Hawthorn's done it twice in four weeks. The GWS game makes it three for the year, and only 1975 North have dropped three and won the flag.

Alarm bells are ringing, Clarko will be nervous.

 

[Gibbke]

Frustrating game for everyone...

Hawks had the chance to go undefeated for the rest of the roster season, putting massive pressure on WC to hang onto their home final, but didn't take it. Hopefully this was flatness after the awful events of last Sunday morning, as commentators were alluding to in the pre-match discussion based upon Clarkson's unusually spirited rev ups...

Port fans might look at that as a top scalp, but they should also look at the ten losses that will see a team who can do what they did last night miss the finals...scalps are for up and comers who need to go up a rung, not preseason premiership favourites...you're aiming low if you can't see negatives here, and this is not the mantra of the team who "exist solely to win premierships"...

On top of that, a few Hawk concerns...Hodge might get a holiday...two weeks no problems with Brisbane and Carlton, but three plus could be disastrous because that will be the QF...away...against WC...! Some of our players are passengers...Smith, Hill, Suckling...even Lewis, Gunston, Frawley and Gibson could use a few slaps across the jaw...spasmodic excellence from Roughead and Cyril (seriously, "best 12 possession game ever" against Geelong...!?!)...

 

[skipper kelly]

How come only 28,000 at this game?