Society/Culture Should Australia Reinstate a The Death Penalty?

[Sydney Bloods]

I'm not saying it exists. But it will.

same tired bullshit, was said about sociopath the only link found (which is strenuous at best and no way an indicator that the person is prone to being sociopath) was brain structures that develop during childhood.

and more then that its found that the vast majority of people who would be judged as a sociopaths are not violent anyway.

it just isn't supported by the overwhelming majority of studies. a few routinely pop up and then get shot down under peer review its happened time and time again.

 

[Bomberboyokay]

I'll be as succinct as possible: If you support the death penalty you don't support human rights.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

No. But the question will be revisited in New terms very soon imo when we find out the likes of Adrian Bayley are literally genetically different.

I'm firmly of the view that some, not all, violent sexual offenders have different "hard wiring" and soon we'll be able to test for it.

Raises some interesting ethical questions.

A - Do you go ahead with your pregnancy knowing your little boy is 50 per cent more likely to become a serious sex offender?

B - Johnny commits a hideous sex murder but his defence shows he carries the gene. How responsible is he?

Nature vs nurture in criminal pathology - is there any bigger question for society in a legal sense?

http://criminologyassignments.blogspot.com.au/2007/11/nature-vs-nurture.html

 

[Little Big John]

Phrenology is dead stop trying to reinvent it.

blackcat

 

[blackcat]

blackcat

eugenics>phrenology

 

[SterlingArcher]

If killing a murderer brings a victim back, I might be for it.

If the death penalty is fool-proof, and no innocent person will ever be murdered as part of the 'death penalty', I might be for it.

So no. What a backwards rule. Lives should not be in the hand of emotions or vigilantes.

 

[Jiska]

Yes. For Pedophiles only. They will never ever be rehabilitated and will almost certainly reoffend on release. The scourge of society praying on children.

 

[skilts]

Yes. For Pedophiles only. They will never ever be rehabilitated and will almost certainly reoffend on release. The scourge of society praying on children.

Your plan, if implemented, would certainly cull the priest class.

 

[blackcat]

Your plan, if implemented, would certainly cull the priest class.

i think they just would just have to lose some weight.

they would not have to lose their vestments.

so i respectfully disagree with you skilts

and also disrespectfully disagree

 

[skilts]

i think they just would just have to lose some weight.

they would not have to lose their vestments.

so i respectfully disagree with you skilts

and also disrespectfully disagree

So much respect. No more than I deserve though.

 

[evo]

blackcat

It is heartening to see his reputation precedes him.

My work here is done.

 

[Jiska]

Your plan, if implemented, would certainly cull the priest class.

So be it. People assaulting children in our society deserve no compassion.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

Yes. For Pedophiles only. They will never ever be rehabilitated and will almost certainly reoffend on release. The scourge of society praying on children.

I am always told this, but are there some actual statistics for recidivism after receiving a sentence for committing such crimes? Of course we hear about all the ones that continually reoffend following their release (as we do with cases like Adrian Bayley and Sean Price) and we'll see Noel McNamara on the TV, but I can't imagine that there's a 100% strike rate for people convicted of any offence to reoffend upon their release. They're hardly going to show us/tell us about a man convicted of a sexual assault that was released ten years ago and is (apparently) a rehabilitated, functioning, law-abiding member of society. Partly, of course, because the mark is against their name for life and even if they reoffend 30 years later, that's still reoffending.

Plus, of course, it's a pretty broad canvas of people that could fit under the category of 'paedophiles'. Has Karen Ellis reoffended? Lethal injection for her?

 

[blackcat]

It is heartening to see his reputation precedes him.

My work here is done.

thought this was a capital punishment thread. i am so gung-ho about its reinstatement, I volunteer to be the first patron

 

[Slax]

If you are going to sentence someone to life in jail you might as well kill them, because clearly the court has deemed no chance for recovery so it is just a waste of money keeping them alive.

 

[Jiska]

I am always told this, but are there some actual statistics for recidivism after receiving a sentence for committing such crimes? Of course we hear about all the ones that continually reoffend following their release (as we do with cases like Adrian Bayley and Sean Price) and we'll see Noel McNamara on the TV, but I can't imagine that there's a 100% strike rate for people convicted of any offence to reoffend upon their release. They're hardly going to show us/tell us about a man convicted of a sexual assault that was released ten years ago and is (apparently) a rehabilitated, functioning, law-abiding member of society. Partly, of course, because the mark is against their name for life and even if they reoffend 30 years later, that's still reoffending.

Plus, of course, it's a pretty broad canvas of people that could fit under the category of 'paedophiles'. Has Karen Ellis reoffended? Lethal injection for her?

Fair argument, the last one. I suppose I was thinking more of systematic abuse, or repeat offenders.

Their DNA is just wired differently. To say you can "rehabilitate" a career pedophile is like trying to say you can make a gay person straight.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

Fair argument, the last one. I suppose I was thinking more of systematic abuse, or repeat offenders.

Their DNA is just wired differently. To say you can "rehabilitate" a career pedophile is like trying to say you can make a gay person straight.

Well, since being homosexual isn't a crime, it's not really like that at all.

Anyway, convince me. Where's the evidence that shows you can't rehabilitate these people? By your logic, Karen Ellis would have continued to offend. Has she?

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

If you are going to sentence someone to life in jail you might as well kill them, because clearly the court has deemed no chance for recovery so it is just a waste of money keeping them alive.

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/costs-death-penalty

Assessment of Costs by Judge Arthur Alarcon and Prof. Paula Mitchell (2011, updated 2012)

The authors concluded that the cost of the death penalty in California has totaled over $4 billion since 1978:

• $1.94 billion--Pre-Trial and Trial Costs
• $925 million--Automatic Appeals and State Habeas Corpus Petitions
• $775 million--Federal Habeas Corpus Appeals
• $1 billion--Costs of Incarceration

The authors calculated that, if the Governor commuted the sentences of those remaining on death row to life without parole, it would result in an immediate savings of $170 million per year, with a savings of $5 billion over the next 20 years.

That's just California.

Texas death penalty cases cost more than non-capital cases

Each death penalty case in Texas costs taxpayers about $2.3 million. That is about three times the cost of imprisoning someone in a single cell at the highest security level for 40 years. ("Executions Cost Texas Millions," Dallas Morning News, March 8, 1992).

So, no. It wouldn't save money.

 

[Jiska]

Well, since being homosexual isn't a crime, it's not really like that at all.

Well actually it is, given that it's the way their brain works and we are talking about altering that. Whether it's a crime or not is largely irrelevant.

Anyway, convince me. Where's the evidence that shows you can't rehabilitate these people? By your logic, Karen Ellis would have continued to offend. Has she?

I've already answered this, in the post you quoted. Perhaps you've missed it. Scroll back.

 

[kfc1]

Well, since being homosexual isn't a crime, it's not really like that at all.

Anyway, convince me. Where's the evidence that shows you can't rehabilitate these people? By your logic, Karen Ellis would have continued to offend. Has she?

"Homosexual isnt a crime
Lol wooosh

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

Well actually it is, given that it's the way their brain works and we are talking about altering that. Whether it's a crime or not is largely irrelevant.

Of course it is. People refrain from doing all sorts of things because of the legal implications if they get caught, not because of their own moral convictions.

I've already answered this, in the post you quoted. Perhaps you've missed it. Scroll back.

No I didn't miss it. I saw you saying that paedophiles are wired to act that way. Yet, apparently, Karen Ellis isn't wired that way. You've just missed my point. How has she managed to stay out of trouble? She has that paedophile wiring in her DNA, or something.

I've seen some psychobabble. Where's the evidence?

 

[Power Raid]

I have no issue with the death penalty in isolation as a penalty. however it doesn't exist in isolation, it exists within a justice framework that isn't always just.

police lie, judges get it wrong, lawyers twist things around and some defendants have no hope of defending themselves even with help). So no to the death penalty.

That turkey who just set his three kids on fire starts to make me rethink my position though.

 

[little graham]

Bevan Spencer Von Einem was rumored would be looked after in gaol when he was convicted of crimes many know who did them with him. It's a family thing.

He has been accused of rape in port augusta prison after being supplied with Viagra by prison doctors.

His victims and their families should of had the option of calling for the death penalty.

 

[skilts]

So be it. People assaulting children in our society deserve no compassion.

It's not just paedophiles and praying priests you want murdered though, is it? I seem to recall your enthusiastic, if not orgiastic endorsement of the cold-blooded execution of fifty people in Bali, not so long ago. The determinism in your unsubstantiated, bald assertion of the impossibility of reform of paedophiles displays a shallowness of thought which you continues to expose your putrid murderous intent. Think before you get so enthusiastic about the gratuitous, unnecessary death of others. How many more have to die before your blood lust is sated? What a vile person you are.

 

[Jiska]

No I didn't miss it. I saw you saying that paedophiles are wired to act that way. Yet, apparently, Karen Ellis isn't wired that way. You've just missed my point. How has she managed to stay out of trouble? She has that paedophile wiring in her DNA, or something.

I've seen some psychobabble. Where's the evidence?

Fair argument, the last one. I suppose I was thinking more of systematic abuse, or repeat offenders.