What do you expect of the Federal ALP?

[HairyO]

I think the bulk of commitments are supported by the ALP, Greens, Pocock and the Teals.

Action on climate change and a Federal ICAC are cerAction on indigenous recognition as well.

It's not until 10 months from now, at budget time, that the ALP will start to hit hot water. Until then, they have a popular agenda, supported in both houses.

Let's hope they don't squib on the ICAC being retrospective.

People will be very disappointed at the Federal ICAC. My bet is it is as useless as Victoria's toothless model.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

"They said they have the answers" - picked that up on Sky after dark did you?

What have they actually promised?

1. ICAC - That will happen - half the LNP will be in jail before the next election.
2. Childcare - they'll do that
3. Aged care - Colbeck is gone so that is good
4. Wages - that will happen
5. Foreign policy - they have already done more in 2 weeks than Morrison did in his whole time (which was a net negative amount)

Labor's main election promise was that Morrison is a campaigner.

What are all these "answers" you speak of?

“We have a clear plan.” Elmer stated this time and again. It all sounds good but I’ll be interested to see if any of the above happen in the current state of the world. No, I don’t watch Sky , Google is fine .

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

People will be very disappointed at the Federal ICAC. My bet is it is as useless as Victoria's toothless model.

Why? I heard Marles talking about it just the other day and he seems encouragingly determined to introduce a really formidable model.

You might cynically say “don’t believe anything politicians say”. How about let’s continue with that cynicism for a moment, and ask whether Labor at this point might see that they are in a unique position to do something which on the one hand delivers something the voters have loudly demanded, and on the other hands tears some of their Coalition opponents to pieces?

They are in lockstep with the Greens and most of the independents on this, so it should be pretty easy to get a really tough version set up and operating pretty swiftly.

There may be a bit of collateral damage in it to Labor, but there’s no way anyone could claim they are as bad as what we’ve just lived through.

 

[HairyO]

Why? I heard Marles talking about it just the other day and he seems encouragingly determined to introduce a really formidable model.

You might cynically say “don’t believe anything politicians say”. How about let’s continue with that cynicism for a moment, and ask whether Labor at this point might see that they are in a unique position to do something which on the one hand delivers something the voters have loudly demanded, and on the other hands tears some of their Coalition opponents to pieces?

They are in lockstep with the Greens and most of the independents on this, so it should be pretty easy to get a really tough version set up and operating pretty swiftly.

There may be a bit of collateral damage in it to Labor, but there’s no way anyone could claim they are as bad as what we’ve just lived through.

They have been there 3 weeks. Wait and see what happens after they win another election.

Every government does dodgy things once in power for a while. Its not a left and right thing.

 

[Achy Blakey Heart]

Why? I heard Marles talking about it just the other day and he seems encouragingly determined to introduce a really formidable model.

You might cynically say “don’t believe anything politicians say”. How about let’s continue with that cynicism for a moment, and ask whether Labor at this point might see that they are in a unique position to do something which on the one hand delivers something the voters have loudly demanded, and on the other hands tears some of their Coalition opponents to pieces?

They are in lockstep with the Greens and most of the independents on this, so it should be pretty easy to get a really tough version set up and operating pretty swiftly.

There may be a bit of collateral damage in it to Labor, but there’s no way anyone could claim they are as bad as what we’ve just lived through.

I hope so. Im pessimistic because of the way the Victorian version has protected Dan and his corruption. I hop labor doesn't set something up that is tailored to protect their own side of politics.

 

[Gough]

‘Negligent in the extreme’: Labor inherits crises across portfolios

As Labor ministers take up their portfolios, the party has uncovered a mess of unmade decisions and funding holes across Arts, Energy and the NDIS.

www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au

I kind of expected them to find this.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

I hope so. Im pessimistic because of the way the Victorian version has protected Dan and his corruption. I hop labor doesn't set something up that is tailored to protect their own side of politics.

With the cross bench lead by Haines involved (it's looking like she will be committee co-chair) I think that's unlikely

 

[Achy Blakey Heart]

With the cross bench lead by Haines involved (it's looking like she will be committee co-chair) I think that's unlikely

I’m Proud to have voted her back in!

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

They have been there 3 weeks. Wait and see what happens after they win another election.

Every government does dodgy things once in power for a while. Its not a left and right thing.

I’m not saying it’s a left and right thing. I’m talking about these two specific governments.

I’m saying Morrison’s government was arguably the most corrupt we’ve ever seen. And for anyone who’s been watching, the ALP, while no choirboys, have clearly done a lot to move on from the bad old days.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

With the cross bench lead by Haines involved (it's looking like she will be committee co-chair) I think that's unlikely

And a big Greens senate block. Labor has to deal with them, or with the Coalition to get anything made into law.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

I’m reasonably confident we’re going to see a seriously-powered anti corruption body instituted in this term.

Interesting question for me is whether the Greens are going to use their new muscle to push for political donations reform.

That is one that both Labor and Tories won’t even dare mention out loud, but it’s been a central plank in the Greens platform for a long time now.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

And a big Greens senate block. Labor has to deal with them, or with the Coalition to get anything made into law.

the greens is less a factor on this than Haines. She spearheaded this when Morrison was in charge, and was the one who got the crossbench onside

if she is co-chair and endorses the bill, everyone will be on board

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

the greens is less a factor on this than Haines. She spearheaded this when Morrison was in charge, and was the one who got the crossbench onside

if she is co-chair and endorses the bill, everyone will be on board

Yeah but it still has to pass the Senate.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Yeah but it still has to pass the Senate.

again, she has the crossbench behind her, and that includes the greens

the class of 2019 indi's will deserve the credit for this bill, not the ALP or the Greens. It was them who started this tilt as something more than rhetoric

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Yeah but it still has to pass the Senate.

Labor will ensure the Greens have input into it.
The Greens endorsed the Haines Bill and any amendments they want will only be minor and probably be an improvement

 

[Number37]

not emotional at all, can you please quote to support your claim?

I have provided you guidance included the tax framework and the legal precedence

but if you would link please find Transfer duty assessment

Thanks for that.
Those valuations are for a point in time.
Does your proposal include yearly tax time valuations?

How does your proposal account for changes in value?

 

[mill204]

I don't think there is any legislation that could be passed to prevent the hurt that is coming to people in rising cost of living.

Albo will wear the blame for it though. It's not fair but he would also enjoy the rewards for similar things entirely outside his control if they do well for Australians.

Only a fool would sheet home that blame to the incoming gov't after nine years of the most incompetent, unscrupulous, wasteful outfit in living memory.

 

[mill204]

People will be very disappointed at the Federal ICAC. My bet is it is as useless as Victoria's toothless model.

 

[Power Raid]

Thanks for that.
Those valuations are for a point in time.
Does your proposal include yearly tax time valuations?

How does your proposal account for changes in value?

your struggling with the concept of income vs wealth. As mentioned previously the measurement would be a balance sheet based on principles of tax. Balance Sheet ARE based on a point of time. but if you wanted a rolling average over three years or more, based on a quarterly basis, this might be a good idea to avoid valuation issues. Good idea!

Changes in valuation relating to income are already governed by income tax or capital gains laws.



As raised previously, I would recommend a wealth tax which is offset against income tax. Essentially guaranteeing a minimum income tax collection. A prime example would be Andrew Forrest.

Let's say he pays $500m in tax and franking credits. Then, as he does, declares $500m in tax offsets by "donating to charity" like his own Mindaroo. Then he pays zero tax.

A properly designed wealth tax would mitigate charities tax dodge, transfer pricing and overseas domiciled vehicles.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Only a fool would sheet home that blame to the incoming gov't after nine years of the most incompetent, unscrupulous, wasteful outfit in living memory.

True but there are plenty of fools out there

 

[Number37]

your struggling with the concept of income vs wealth. As mentioned previously the measurement would be a balance sheet based on principles of tax. Balance Sheet ARE based on a point of time. but if you wanted a rolling average over three years or more, based on a quarterly basis, this might be a good idea to avoid valuation issues. Good idea!

Changes in valuation relating to income are already governed by income tax or capital gains laws.



As raised previously, I would recommend a wealth tax which is offset against income tax. Essentially guaranteeing a minimum income tax collection. A prime example would be Andrew Forrest.

Let's say he pays $500m in tax and franking credits. Then, as he does, declares $500m in tax offsets by "donating to charity" like his own Mindaroo. Then he pays zero tax.

A properly designed wealth tax would mitigate charities tax dodge, transfer pricing and overseas domiciled vehicles.

You're getting emotional again and it's making you jibber jabber.

Ok, so we have a valuation. And that's it. Can it be changed? If yes, who decides the change? How is the change recorded in your balance sheet?
Do you pay income tax on any gains in value? Do you get income tax relief for any losses in value?
Bearing in mind that income tax laws only apply where an asset is used to derive assessable income...if you're talking about wealth, measured by a balance sheet, it is difficult to see how gains &/or losses could come within the scope of the Income Tax Act on assets that are in all likelihood passively held as "wealth".
Let's say you own a painting worth $1m. Then next year it's only worth $750k. What happens to the $250 loss in value? Does your grand scheme just ignore it and a wealth tax is applied to the new valuation?
Then if we circle back around, what's going to stop people writing down their balance sheet assets?
Bearing in mind the valuations processes you referred to rely on the existence of a market.
What happens if we hit another GFC and markets become useless?
( don't say it can't happen....during the GFC the US suspended mark-to-market accounting when s**t got real, because those valuation "markets" were adding fuel to the crisis)

No need to get emotional, let's just deal with the practicalities.

 

[Power Raid]

You're getting emotional again and it's making you jibber jabber.

Ok, so we have a valuation. And that's it. Can it be changed? If yes, who decides the change? How is the change recorded in your balance sheet?
Do you pay income tax on any gains in value? Do you get income tax relief for any losses in value?
Bearing in mind that income tax laws only apply where an asset is used to derive assessable income...if you're talking about wealth, measured by a balance sheet, it is difficult to see how gains &/or losses could come within the scope of the Income Tax Act on assets that are in all likelihood passively held as "wealth".
Let's say you own a painting worth $1m. Then next year it's only worth $750k. What happens to the $250 loss in value? Does your grand scheme just ignore it and a wealth tax is applied to the new valuation?
Then if we circle back around, what's going to stop people writing down their balance sheet assets?
Bearing in mind the valuations processes you referred to rely on the existence of a market.
What happens if we hit another GFC and markets become useless?
( don't say it can't happen....during the GFC the US suspended mark-to-market accounting when s**t got real, because those valuation "markets" were adding fuel to the crisis)

No need to get emotional, let's just deal with the practicalities.

your not making much sense here.

in terms of who decides the change..............we have a self assessment concept with tax returns. So the decision is the tax payer.

we have also discussed your confusion by considering income, so need need to discuss further other than repeat it is not relevant. In terms of your example of $250k change in value.........IT IS NOT RELEVANT. What is relevant for a wealth tax is the remaining $750k.

In regards to write downs, we already have rules on valuation of assets that are not market value as per the links provided previously.

You seem to be getting very excited, in your confused state. Perhaps focus on the relevant issues at hand and consider the existing tax framework for guidance before asking silly questions over and over.

 

[Present Not Past]

Not to lease Australian based ports to the Chinese Communist Party for 99 years for a pile a cash would be a good start.
I mean, the LNP were so poor over the last 9 years.
Australians have been ripped off blind.

 

[Present Not Past]

People will be very disappointed at the Federal ICAC. My bet is it is as useless as Victoria's toothless model.

NSW ICAC is already the model for the Federal ICAC.

 

[Mick F]

True but there are plenty of fools out there

In the past the deplorables decided elections, hence the effectiveness of ‘gaslighting’. I feel this election saw engaged voters come into play, through community based independents. The drop in blind support for LNP, Labor and Hanson augers well for the future.