It really is amateur hour at the VAFA.

[Ron Jeremy 69]

Can you believe the stuff ups with finals venues this year? The late notice about the actual venues, the time and venue changes?

What a disaster! Imagine being a Premier 19 section second semi finalist and finding out Thursday afternoon, your game has been postponed and you won't be playing until the following weekend? What about the people who had holidays planned, venues booked etc, to suddenly find out they have another week to play. Not to mention that De la could potentially add players form the seniors this week that they couldn't add last week. Imagine if they could add say four guns if they lost the final on Sunday?

All because of some mud? Did it only surface(pardon the pun!) midway through last week? Isn't it a winter sport? Isn't it the same conditions for both sides? Surely, they could have sourced other grounds from the EFL/SFl where they charge people every week to get in? I know of several that were available. To end up playing at venue where you can't charge(eg Harry Trott) is a disaster for the vafa, because they were so incompetent.

What about all the day and time changes? Premier C prelim is now on a
Sunday, so a fully rested Caulfield will face a side off a six day break in the granny. Nice one Fields! To suddenly change arguably the most important match for thre season( it determines who goes up and who doesn't) is simply not good enough. Several of the under 19/18 games have had several venue and time changes. They are playing games at venues where you can watch from the street for free( De la) or you don't pay to get in. It is a dogs breakfast.

Please, no bleeding hearts telling me about a wet winter etc. They simply should have done better.
To top it off, they ran out of Hamburgers at EP on Sunday at ..wait for it..1.00pm. What, weren't expecting a big crowd for the Premier finals?

 

[The Panther]

Apparently there were 10 changes from the last Old Melbournians 3rd 18 to the one on the w/e. All were reserves players, who made way as a result of senior players coming back in the reserves side.

Kind of defeats the purpose.

 

[Bluebird]

Can you believe the stuff ups with finals venues this year? The late notice about the actual venues, the time and venue changes?


What about all the day and time changes? Premier C prelim is now on a
Sunday, so a fully rested Caulfield will face a side off a six day break in the granny. Nice one Fields! To suddenly change arguably the most important match for thre season( it determines who goes up and who doesn't) is simply not good enough. Several of the under 19/18 games have had several venue and time changes. They are playing games at venues where you can watch from the street for free( De la) or you don't pay to get in. It is a dogs breakfast.

The change is inconvenient for lots of reasons, but Premier C Grand Final now most likely to be held on Sunday 12th (not Saturday) so preliminary winner will still have a full week recovery.

 

[RockyBalboa]

This is South Croydon's ground in round 18
First division EFL...now that's mud!

 

[bedford]

I believe the so called Premier C clubs still remaining in finals have protested very strongly about the change of days. Why should promotion finals be shifted to accomodate u/19 finals which have no bearing on next seasons grades.

 

[the ox1]

I believe the so called Premier C clubs still remaining in finals have protested very strongly about the change of days. Why should promotion finals be shifted to accomodate u/19 finals which have no bearing on next seasons grades.

Well i think the Under 19s finals have been moved to avoid a clash with Senior club finals. Xavier have a final on Sunday afternoon and the Xavier 19s will be playing also. And in future Weeks it is likely De La Salle and Beaumaris could clash with the respective senior teams whether it be ones twos or threes.
The point you make about next seasons grades has little bearing also....hasnt week one of C grade finals already been played? Thus meaning that one team is already in the grandfinal and the match this week will decide which is the second team to advance ? (or does the premier only advance)
The VAFA have a strong belief of "Fostering Family Football" this would mean giving all families and supporters of the one club an opportunity to support all teams.
The C grade teams should not winge to much about being pushed back one day considering 4 teams, full of school kids and uni students have had a week missed all together, pushing there games back a whole week, which pushed the last game into school holidays, potentially causing major headaches for families as Holidays could of been planned.
Dont get me wrong i think what the VAFA have done shows a lack of preparation and professionalism as no real questions have been answered but to change the games again would again create further headaches as teams now are preparing to play at there arranged times and locations.

 

[bedford]

But why couldn't the 19's been on the Sunday.

 

[table tennis]

That ground was a treat last cricket season.

 

[Plumber49]

Well i think the Under 19s finals have been moved to avoid a clash with Senior club finals. Xavier have a final on Sunday afternoon and the Xavier 19s will be playing also. And in future Weeks it is likely De La Salle and Beaumaris could clash with the respective senior teams whether it be ones twos or threes.
The point you make about next seasons grades has little bearing also....hasnt week one of C grade finals already been played? Thus meaning that one team is already in the grandfinal and the match this week will decide which is the second team to advance ? (or does the premier only advance)
The VAFA have a strong belief of "Fostering Family Football" this would mean giving all families and supporters of the one club an opportunity to support all teams.
The C grade teams should not winge to much about being pushed back one day considering 4 teams, full of school kids and uni students have had a week missed all together, pushing there games back a whole week, which pushed the last game into school holidays, potentially causing major headaches for families as Holidays could of been planned.
Dont get me wrong i think what the VAFA have done shows a lack of preparation and professionalism as no real questions have been answered but to change the games again would again create further headaches as teams now are preparing to play at there arranged times and locations.

Ox1 please - are you seriously trying to tell me that the VAFA have changed the traditional scheduling of finals in C grade that has been happening since Jesus played full back for Nazareth so that 2 clubs in A grade would have the opportunity to be able to watch their under 19's teams???? If that is the case the entire VAFA executive should be fired on the spot for even entertaining the concept let alone actually putting the plan into action!!!

You'd be lucky it you had 20 people who took up the opportunity of "supporting" both teams by attending both matches at those clubs and in the process have directly affected 3 teams in C plus their supporters plus the opposing teams in the U/19's. That’s up to 6 teams by my calculations at maybe 300 to 350 people a team (players, supporters etc) for a grand total of 1800-2000. Hope the 20 people (1%) really appreciate the inconvenience caused to the 99%.....

And with regards to the state of the ground being such an influence on finals footy that as to cause this last minute changes here is a fact that the executive must have missed – EP is the worst ground for footy in A and B grade bar none and gets even worse in September when the wind blows its t*ts off!! The joint is a disgrace and if they were serious about playing the most important games of the year at the best venues they wouldn’t even unlock the gates. Has anyone that wears the blue blazer ever heard of the Junction?????

I'm with you on this one Ron - the VAFA makes the NSW Labour Party look like a well run, disciplined, intelligent team. Lucky they had the foresight to change all the names of the divisions to strengthen our great comp - a decision that Sholley has credited with the results now getting published in the Sunday Age and Monday HS – IS THIS BLOKE FOR F*CKING REAL????????? Try explaining to your mates that you have been relegated from Premier C to Division 1 and see if they can follow the logic!!

End rant

 

[the ox1]

Ox1 please - are you seriously trying to tell me that the VAFA have changed the traditional scheduling of finals in C grade that has been happening since Jesus played full back for Nazareth so that 2 clubs in A grade would have the opportunity to be able to watch their under 19's teams???? If that is the case the entire VAFA executive should be fired on the spot for even entertaining the concept let alone actually putting the plan into action!!!

You'd be lucky it you had 20 people who took up the opportunity of "supporting" both teams by attending both matches at those clubs and in the process have directly affected 3 teams in C plus their supporters plus the opposing teams in the U/19's. That’s up to 6 teams by my calculations at maybe 300 to 350 people a team (players, supporters etc) for a grand total of 1800-2000. Hope the 20 people (1%) really appreciate the inconvenience caused to the 99%.....

And with regards to the state of the ground being such an influence on finals footy that as to cause this last minute changes here is a fact that the executive must have missed – EP is the worst ground for footy in A and B grade bar none and gets even worse in September when the wind blows its t*ts off!! The joint is a disgrace and if they were serious about playing the most important games of the year at the best venues they wouldn’t even unlock the gates. Has anyone that wears the blue blazer ever heard of the Junction?????

I'm with you on this one Ron - the VAFA makes the NSW Labour Party look like a well run, disciplined, intelligent team. Lucky they had the foresight to change all the names of the divisions to strengthen our great comp - a decision that Sholley has credited with the results now getting published in the Sunday Age and Monday HS – IS THIS BLOKE FOR F*CKING REAL????????? Try explaining to your mates that you have been relegated from Premier C to Division 1 and see if they can follow the logic!!

End rant

Look i know the situation suits no-one and there isnt any real winner im just trying to make sense out of what the VAFA have said....


"Both U19 PREMIER semi-finals will be played Saturday at Sandringham, giving the four finalists the opportunity to play on the best available ground.
This change will also enable supporters of Old Xaverians and Beaumaris to take in their U19 clash and attend their senior game the following day."

I dare say there would be more then 20 people from de la salle attending both Senior and 19's game. Just because it is U/19s football doesnt mean they should be shunned to Sunday. My thinking is that the VAFA have thought by having the 19s Saturday this allows for all the 19s finals to be played on the Saturday's throughout the finals series, not clashing with any senior games, especially an A grade final. If they were to continue playing C Grade one day earlier, this would mean playing 19s on two sundays then back to a Saturday for the final further disrupting there finals series....
It no ones fault other then the VAFA's and im only trying to understand the reasoning behind there decisions as i to am still scratching my head at this mess, but whats done is done now and lets all play football.

 

[Phantom Strobler]

Well i think the Under 19s finals have been moved to avoid a clash with Senior club finals. Xavier have a final on Sunday afternoon and the Xavier 19s will be playing also. And in future Weeks it is likely De La Salle and Beaumaris could clash with the respective senior teams whether it be ones twos or threes.
The point you make about next seasons grades has little bearing also....hasnt week one of C grade finals already been played? Thus meaning that one team is already in the grandfinal and the match this week will decide which is the second team to advance ? (or does the premier only advance)
The VAFA have a strong belief of "Fostering Family Football" this would mean giving all families and supporters of the one club an opportunity to support all teams.
The C grade teams should not winge to much about being pushed back one day considering 4 teams, full of school kids and uni students have had a week missed all together, pushing there games back a whole week, which pushed the last game into school holidays, potentially causing major headaches for families as Holidays could of been planned.
Dont get me wrong i think what the VAFA have done shows a lack of preparation and professionalism as no real questions have been answered but to change the games again would again create further headaches as teams now are preparing to play at there arranged times and locations.

Fostering family football my ar#e. D2 finals moved to Sunday, FATHERS' DAY at Coburg where there is a fence so they can make money. Dont worry about the fathers' day with kids and grand kids. Does Sholly have kids?????

 

[Dr Truth]

Fostering family football my ar#e. D2 finals moved to Sunday, FATHERS' DAY at Coburg where there is a fence so they can make money. Dont worry about the fathers' day with kids and grand kids. Does Sholly have kids?????

Put your "money" on Sunday. Can't you guys work it out. Check the finals campaign so far & check history.

 

[BrianSpeaking]

In fairness to Sholly I would suggest Jeremy Bourke would be organising all of the grounds. It has been very, very wet and he can't control the weather, give him a fair go lads.

 

[Plumber49]

Look i know the situation suits no-one and there isnt any real winner im just trying to make sense out of what the VAFA have said....


"Both U19 PREMIER semi-finals will be played Saturday at Sandringham, giving the four finalists the opportunity to play on the best available ground.
This change will also enable supporters of Old Xaverians and Beaumaris to take in their U19 clash and attend their senior game the following day."

I dare say there would be more then 20 people from de la salle attending both Senior and 19's game. Just because it is U/19s football doesnt mean they should be shunned to Sunday. My thinking is that the VAFA have thought by having the 19s Saturday this allows for all the 19s finals to be played on the Saturday's throughout the finals series, not clashing with any senior games, especially an A grade final. If they were to continue playing C Grade one day earlier, this would mean playing 19s on two sundays then back to a Saturday for the final further disrupting there finals series....
It no ones fault other then the VAFA's and im only trying to understand the reasoning behind there decisions as i to am still scratching my head at this mess, but whats done is done now and lets all play football.

Ox1 - apologies if the rant sounded like it was directed at you, not the intention at all (unless you are part of the executive in which case lets resume hostilities!!!)

Appreciate your efforts in trying to apply logic to the situation!! Unfortunately though it’s a bit like the charge of the light brigade I think – an honourable thing to do but rather pointless and with no hope of succeeding….

 

[Plumber49]

In fairness to Sholly I would suggest Jeremy Bourke would be organising all of the grounds. It has been very, very wet and he can't control the weather, give him a fair go lads.

Brian I’m going to have to respectfully disagree with you here!! Whether it’s Sholly or Bourke I don’t know but they are all part of the same organisation and Sholly being the chief would have had to approve it or otherwise so either way he needs to accept responsibility for the decision!!

The basic flaw in their argument is there for everyone to see starting with this little gem:

“giving the four finalists the opportunity to play on the best available ground”

The fact that the A or B grade finals aren’t played at places like Marcellin, Trinity, Carey, Junction etc when those home teams are not involved in either B grade (in the first 2) or A grade (in the second 2) or finals in either grade (in 3 of the 4) means that the best grounds are not being made available for finals at all. The list could go on almost endless for grounds better than EP (HR's Boss, Vic Park, Optus Oval and any and all VFL grounds) so I don’t believe that the condition of the ground is the driving reason at all!! Me thinks Dr Truth and the theory about the fence is closer to the truth and if so the VAFA should be ashamed that they are prepared to change everything on late notice but not be prepared to forgo such a pittance in coin in the process.

As for the weather and the conditions of the ground - if that’s what it serves up then that is what it serves up!!! It’s a winter game after all…

End second rant!!

 

[Jascave]

BTW, if you think the grounds at the VAFA-appointed finals venues are bad because of the wet weather we're getting now, you should see what those from the SFL finals venues are like..especially Meade Reserve which is hosting the SFL Div 3 finals, and at the moment it's in very bad shape. Heaven help the poor commentator trying to identify players when they are covered in mud...it would be a bit like calling the 1976 Melbourne Cup won by Van der Hum.

 

[Scribe]

Brian I’m going to have to respectfully disagree with you here!! Whether it’s Sholly or Bourke I don’t know but they are all part of the same organisation and Sholly being the chief would have had to approve it or otherwise so either way he needs to accept responsibility for the decision!!

The basic flaw in their argument is there for everyone to see starting with this little gem:

“giving the four finalists the opportunity to play on the best available ground”

The fact that the A or B grade finals aren’t played at places like Marcellin, Trinity, Carey, Junction etc when those home teams are not involved in either B grade (in the first 2) or A grade (in the second 2) or finals in either grade (in 3 of the 4) means that the best grounds are not being made available for finals at all. The list could go on almost endless for grounds better than EP (HR's Boss, Vic Park, Optus Oval and any and all VFL grounds) so I don’t believe that the condition of the ground is the driving reason at all!! Me thinks Dr Truth and the theory about the fence is closer to the truth and if so the VAFA should be ashamed that they are prepared to change everything on late notice but not be prepared to forgo such a pittance in coin in the process.

As for the weather and the conditions of the ground - if that’s what it serves up then that is what it serves up!!! It’s a winter game after all…

End second rant!!

The fact is neither Old Carey, Old Trinity nor Marcellin have any control over their school grounds and whether the VAFA can access them for finals. It's up to the schools themselves. OT's ground has been used for U19 finals recently, but I don't think Carey or Marcellin, or the Junction (which is controlled by Cricket Victoria as far as I'm aware) have hosted for some time.

In short, what you're proposing, that the best grounds me be available for finals is simply not possible. The tenant clubs can't force their landlords to make it available outside the strict usage arrangements these clubs usually have with their feeder schools.

 

[Letterman]

The hour is extended if a Club President is not provided with a "Please Explain" from HO after his disparaging comments against VAFA Umpires were reported in the media this week.

 

[Rissoles]

The fact is neither Old Carey, Old Trinity nor Marcellin have any control over their school grounds and whether the VAFA can access them for finals. It's up to the schools themselves. OT's ground has been used for U19 finals recently, but I don't think Carey or Marcellin, or the Junction (which is controlled by Cricket Victoria as far as I'm aware) have hosted for some time.

In short, what you're proposing, that the best grounds me be available for finals is simply not possible. The tenant clubs can't force their landlords to make it available outside the strict usage arrangements these clubs usually have with their feeder schools.

I think you'll find Plumber's premise still holds true, Scribe.
With in excess of 70 clubs and the same in venues, surely there are sufficient grounds in good condition that would suit finals.
The issue has always been limiting finals to fully secure grounds for revenue raising.
That being the case, why doesn't the VAFA look at what other leagues do?
I know Balwyn FC uses temporary fencing at every home game to control incoming crowds and to make money.
Whatever way you look at it, this has been a monumental ****-up that can only be attributed to a lack of planning and a lack of foresight.
I'd hate to see the VAFA manual for contingencies....

 

[Plumber49]

The fact is neither Old Carey, Old Trinity nor Marcellin have any control over their school grounds and whether the VAFA can access them for finals. It's up to the schools themselves. OT's ground has been used for U19 finals recently, but I don't think Carey or Marcellin, or the Junction (which is controlled by Cricket Victoria as far as I'm aware) have hosted for some time.

In short, what you're proposing, that the best grounds me be available for finals is simply not possible. The tenant clubs can't force their landlords to make it available outside the strict usage arrangements these clubs usually have with their feeder schools.

Scribe

I’m not proposing that “the best grounds be available for finals” – the VAFA is claiming that is the reason for turning the finals fixture on its head a week into it with the statement

“giving the four finalists the opportunity to play on the best available ground”

My point is that I don’t think that is the VAFA’s intent at all. And the evidence of this is that if they were anywhere near serious they would turn EP into a spare hole for Elsternwick golf course and depart post haste rather than play the biggest and best finals (A and B) there year in year out in the windiest joint in the world!!

The alternatively way of looking at it is that if that is their intent they are doing a pretty p*ss poor job of it. So I guess you can take your pick between labelling them as misleading or incompetent – neither are great really….

To respond to your points however I appreciate that the old boys clubs don't have complete control over the grounds and that other considerations need to be taken into account however there are a few points worth noting:

1. What happens if OT's, Marc, OM's or, in the relevant case this year, OC make finals?? I assume that they still train at the grounds?? Therefore the ultimate ground owners must be aware that there is a (hopeful) possibility each year that people in footy boots will be running up and down until the 3rd week in September???? Based on this it wouldn’t be a massive stretch to think that the largest footy comp in the land could work with the stake holders to try and come to an arrangement for the years that there is a possibility to play on the best grounds.

2. The VAFA should be willing to pay for the right to play at these places particularly if they are hell bent on charging punters to get into the place. I’m sure that the school’s groundskeepers would appreciate the extra coin.

Call me cynical but my point is that I doubt very much that the VAFA have even tried to secure these places for finals and are instead more interested in raising funds via finding places where they can charge people to watch. Therefore please don’t insult the VAFA community’s intelligence by claiming it’s for our own benefit rather than their gain!

End third rant

 

[Jascave]

Wonder what would happen if the VAFA grand final from ie Div 4 gets drawn after having to play two periods of extra time for no result-where would the VAFA book a ground for the replay even if the venue used for the drawn grand final is not avaliable? Especially if that ground the VAFA is looking to book for the replay grand final is being top dressed & the centre wicket relaid..for the cricket season?

 

[Dee Three]

The Division 3 Preliminary Final has been moved to Edinbugh Reserve in Springvale... uncovered concrete (carpet top) cricket pitch running through the middle!

Clubs notified today (Thursday) 3 days before the game!

This is a game that determines who gets promoted and who plays in a Grand Final.

Injury and risk issues not considered by the VAFA before making this ridiculous decision.

The treatment of these clubs is insulting, appalling and embarassing.

Are they serious??

 

[Over The Post]

The hour is extended if a Club President is not provided with a "Please Explain" from HO after his disparaging comments against VAFA Umpires were reported in the media this week.

Links to the articles or it didn't happen.

 

[Letterman]

Links to the articles or it didn't happen.

..and it did

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/report-challenged-by-beaumaris/story-fn53khnc-1225911851045


"We sometimes think the old schools (clubs which link to private schools) get looked after over district sides (clubs which are suburban based)."


Bagging umpires, just ok, but to report across the media that they traditionally favor some clubs over others, I would have thought your fraternity would be up in arms OTP.

I thought keep those comments to the club bar not broadcast to the general public, but, they are only my thoughts though

 

[Jascave]

Interesting to note that while the Premier C-Div 4 finals have been moved around (times, matchdays, finals venues) at virtually the last minute, the Premier and Premier B finals are continuing at Sportscover Arena regardless of the state of the ground and the weather conditions.