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Opinion Hinesight, Knightsight and Hindsight (end of 2013)

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Knightmare

Knightmare

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Sep 22, 2010
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A yearly favourite of mine is putting myself up against master recruiter Derek Hine and seeing what I can do.

I've added some insight into my thoughts on the eventual Collingwood selections and who I personally would have selected.



Hinesight (who Derek Hine selected):
Pick 6: Matthew Scharenberg
Thoughts: Excellent selection and will be a beauty. Toss up between Scharenberg and Aish and could have gone either way. Scharenberg fits our need perfectly and adds much needed rebound down back as a high level intercept mark who can generate meaningful rebound by foot. Has shown that he can compete in the SANFL (seniors) and dominated through the u18 championships so the production is on the board. He’s year one ready and has the ability from roughly the midyear point to break into the team as a regular.
Pick 10: Nathan Freeman
Thoughts: Super athletic midfielder who has tested off the charts. He adds much needed explosion to what is mostly a slow team. He’s an ok but not great inside ball winner and not a natural linkup player. It’s not due to lack of running ability with his endurance excellent so I’m interested to see how he’s going to find enough of it at AFL level but with his attributes he still has the opportunity to become something. Perhaps as a running back flanker would be my vision but I’m curious to see what Collingwood have in mind with him. I wouldn’t be playing him in season one but he’s got a strong body and running game so a season one debut isn’t entirely out of the question.
Pick 65: Tom Langdon
Thoughts: Back flanker who should have been drafted last year and finally receives his opportunity after another strong year in the TAC where he continued his improvement. Langdon is a tall back flanker and like Scharenberg is an excellent high production, rebounding type at his position with his ball use also excellent. Solid get late in the draft and someone I’d be prepared to take around this stage. A senior debut is possible but will most likely spend the majority of the year developing in the VFL.
Pick 77: Jonathon Marsh
Thoughts: Tall type with some incredible pace and the ability to do some freakish things at his height. Has played this year as a key forward but ultimately he’s more of a tall forward flanker. He’ll take on the game like few in the game at his height and is also excellent at ground level for his size. Has the production on the board and isn’t just flash in the pan freakish but also has the proven production and had some dominant performances through the u18 champs where he just looked a for much of the time with ball in hand better than anyone else. Looks like a late draft bargain and while he could go either way he has the opportunity to be a big impact player and would have also been my choice at this stage.

RD:
Corey Gault

Knightsight (who I would have selected):
Pick 6: James Aish
Thoughts: Was the consensus pick 2 coming into the year. Has been a part of back to back premiership teams in the SANFL for the past two seasons and has the most senior SANFL experience of any recruit in this draft which is absolutely incredible for a guy with a late year birthday. He’s round one ready to play and can fit onto either a wing or back flank as a classy, prediction ball user who can have a 250 game career.
Pick 10: Blake Acres
Thoughts: In my view Acres will be the best and most complete midfielder in this draft and the only tall midfielder who I feel is already an established player. He’s a tall, strong bodied midfielder who has proven that he can accumulate in a big way winning it inside the contest and finding it on the outside. He’s strong overhead and is all class with ball in hand with his ball use by hand and foot excellent. Athletically he’s an excellent mover and has an excellent sidestep on him for his size. He’s also versatile enough to play forward or back well. As a forward he’s capable of providing scoreboard impact and taking a grab while down back he’s an excellent intercept marker who can provide rebound by foot. He’s year one ready to play and can have the best career of anyone in this draft as someone who has consistently improved from year to year and has possibly the strongest scope to improve in this draft.
Pick 65: Mitch Thorp
Thoughts: More a third tall forward as a high volume accumulator by position as someone who finds plenty of the ball up the ground but has the proven production behind him in front of goal kicking 78 goals from 20 games in Tasmania. He captain/coached his team to a premiership last season and is someone who can add much needed leadership and another quality target up forward for a team.
Pick 77: Jonathon Marsh
Thoughts: As above. Could be a late draft bargain and adds some much needed pace and x-factor.

*RD. Corey Gault

*Note. Each of my choices was always the highest on the draft board and as such best available.
The exception was picking Aish before Acres but with the understanding that Blake Acres would almost certainly be available at pick 10 (which was made obvious as he wasn't invited up to the Gold Coast) I would have taken Aish first to ensure I get the get the greatest quantity of highly rated players in my power rankings possible.

Hindsight:
Pick 6: Patrick Cripps
Pick 10: Zac Merrett
Pick 65: Charlie Cameron
Pick 77: Tim Kelly (picked years later)

RD.
7. Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti (picked years later)

With apologies to: Reilly O'Brien (picked in 2014 draft as overager)




Summary notes:
Langdon was a good pick by the Pies but has had to retire prematurely. I've still got the two remaining players in the competition in James Aish and Blake Acres, but they would need to have meaningful contributions from this point onwards to surpass the initial impact of Langdon. Though Langdon I picked in my 2012 knightsight v hinesight v hindsight piece as one of my rookie picks so I wouldn't have needed to have taken him again in 2013. Either way, neither I nor Dekka had a terrific draft.




For those curious to know how I went last year in the national draft.
Hinesight: (Collingwood actual draft)
18: Grundy
19: Kennedy
20: Broomhead
38: Ramsay


Knightsight: (How I would have drafted)
18: Grundy
19: Tom Clurey (Port Adelaide)
20: Nathan Hrovat (Western Bulldogs)
38: Dayle Garlett (Hawthorn as of tonight)




For those daring enough go ahead and post your own picks as to who we should have selected.
I'm equally happy for this to be a draft discussion thread if anyone has questions about the draft but ultimately I see this thread as a time capsule type thing to come back to 5, 6 years from now and look back on and see what went right/what went wrong on a personal and club level.
 
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thanks for the post - as usual excellent analysis.

I am certainly no expert so I'll trust your analysis but I'm not too dismayed about missing out on Aish. We are quite a slow side and while Freeman alone is not the answer, he will help provide that Dangerfield-like element. Of course there are concerns about his kicking under pressure but if he was better with his disposal he probably would've gone top 5.

I've also read that Freeman is a bit of a bouncy energetic character (Heath Shaw?) and in years to come he might be the rally the troops type of personality. All speculation of course but the whole draft is.

Having said that if Aish and Freeman were still around at 10, we would've gone for Aish.

After today's effort at the cricket I'm really really looking forward to the start of the season!
 
Great read KM..thanks. It seems like Bucks said to Hine we need big bodies and SPEED.

It looks like it was Scharenberg or Aish; then Salem or Freeman. I am sure there were a few players around the pick 65 with Langdon being best available to fill a need. However, Marsh seems to be the surprise that Hine had to unwrap instead of a PASS.

The time capsule thread idea reminds me of 'Ellis at 2, Thomas at 5' for the Pies but we went Thomas at 2 and some kid called Pendlebury at 5. I thought we screwed up big time because i clearly recall Billy Morrison being 'the next Jonathon Brown' years earlier.
 

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I won't quote your whole post Knightmare but I would have gone nearly exactly same as you with our picks.

Only possible difference is at pick 10. I liked Lennon but would have been happy with Acres.

Just to add another possible point of discussion. Your favourite pies pick and least favourite.

My favourite was definitely Marsh. Least favourite Freeman. I worry massively about his kicking efficiency and the last thing we need is another poor kicking efficiency.

In saying all that, Hine has proven himself so I fully trust his picks.
 
Great work KM.

In the end the top 10 of the draft fell more or less how I had anticipated. The top ten was more or less logic, but after that it got a bit unpredictable.

How I would have picked:

Pick 6 Matt Sharenburg
Scharenburg being available at 6 was the key. He had to be picked. He ticked all the boxes of what we need plus some. Aish was the temptation there at 6, but there were plenty of quality mids on the board at that stage so it was prudent to leave him and hope he was around at 10. I couldn't have picked anyone but Scharenburg at 6. I had him at number 3 on my list of choices after Boyd & Billings. Not only is he a quality player he fits our needs like a glove.

Pick 10 Dom Sheed
Pick 10 was always going to be a bit tougher. My hope was that one of Aish or Salem were available here. I love them both because of their superb footskills - something we really need and had high on my list of needs. But alas they both went with the preceding two picks. Was a bit annoyed with this.

After Scharenburg we needed one of those quality mids & would not have picked McCarthy or Lennon as a result. Lennon has been one of my favourites, but couldn't justify him as a real need.

Of the quality midfielders left I liked Freeman for his pace, but not overly excited by his foot skills. Acres has some capacity to be the big bodied mid we want. But I probably favoured Sheed ever so slightly as a better all round package - not much to not like about him, perhaps a touch slow, but everyone is compared to Freeman. His combination of inside & outside ball winning, endurance, marking prowess and good footskills is pretty hard to ignore. Not sure what the deal was with West Coast seemingly able to lock him in at will a long time ago, but I would have given the Eagles the bird & picked him.

Pick 65 Jonothan Marsh
I think I would have taken Marsh here. Clearly he has slipped right out of calculations & to us at 77 and even at 65 would have gobbled him up. I had this pick really reserved for a Brown or Conlon, some sort of key forward backup type. I see the merits in Thorp here too. Brown had gone & Conlon is probably more a rookie option & comes with more risk given he hasnt played much footy. Marsh is no key forward, but he is a good third tall/lead up option and a crazy hard match up for any team. We need this position filled and some talk of McCarthy being picked for this reason. Marsh can do this job and his physical attributes mean he could be anything. Wrapped we got him at 77.

Pick 77 Eli Templeton
Had not even considered we use this pick at all so quite surprised we did. However, if I made a pick I would have taken Templeton. I can see why he went undrafted, lets face it he is the runt of the litter and will take some time to size up. However, the last time we took a skinny little runt this late, it worked out pretty well - I am looking at you Mr Seedsman you bag of bones. Eli's time will come, but he has some great attributes which will make him a very good player. I think a lot of clubs are now passing on these types for more ready made options, especially the Pies, as they are not prepared to invest time in players who are going to take time. I support this view especially at this stage of our list management. None the less think Templeton will be a quality player and like Seedsman will surprise a few in 2-3 years.
 
Thanks KM. you're always very clear and consistent and I like the way you always put yourself out there.

A few remarks:

Scharenberg - I was completely line ball between him and Aish but I think I would have felt more of a sense of loss if we'd missed Schara. With his attributes if he is fit he will be an amazing, versatile acquisition and allow greater flexibility with our other taller players as well as strengthening the backline. From interview seems a modest and very good character. Further to this, while Aish is obviously an amazing talent who uses the ball so well, the HUN pointed to Champion Data stats today revealing that players who get too much of their ball on the outside struggle to make it in the AFL. Players with similar outside winning profiles to Aish were Kane Lucas and Jimmy Toumpas, food for thought. I would still have taken Aish ahead of Freeman at that stage, but it makes me less upset that we took Schara ahead of him.

Freeman - wasn't on my wish list but now that he's ours I'm going glass half full. Looking over his highlights I actually like his kicking, he has a nice compact style and seems to have no problem feeding a target when balanced. The knock for mine is he is probably either running too fast at times to just slow that one pace before delivery to weight the kick properly and often in traffic he just throws the ball on the boot. Seems to have less vision and composure. Hopefully with time and experience hell get a bit better in these areas. I was buoyed by his combine stats which have him in the elite category in some of the areas that really matter. Endurance is a huge bonus. With his strong frame hopefully he can develop a more aggressive attack on the ball and win his share. To me this was one of the big advances in Dangerfield as a player, that he started to really use his body in contests. I don't expect Freeman to become Danger but more inside ability would make him a great midfield package.

Players I'm sad to have missed - Acres, Sheed, Crouch

Players I'm not sad to have missed - Lennon, Garlett
 
I would have liked Sheed instead of Freeman but maybe it's just the WA bias coming out in me.

Though Freeman also looks readymade so not to fussed.
 
Getsomenuts I'd love to hear more of your thoughts on Freeman. You've been a pretty vocal supporter which is great to see. What else can you tell us about him? Have you seen him play a bit outside the highlights?
 
wednesdaywarrior said:
Ps as an afterthought one player who has carved out a career who often bursts into space and just throws the ball on the boot is Judd!
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There is a lot to like about Freeman. I was on his band wagon early, but after the move up the order to six thought we could do better on the foot skills front. In the end I was kind of hoping for Salem, knowing Aish was too good to be true at 10.

The comparisons with Dangerfield & Judd are exciting and one can only hope. One knock on him was his lack of top level performance at TAC level, I believe guys like Judd & Dangerfield were stand outs in this regard. However, his physical attributes and his stand out testing at the combine counter this to a degree.

Other than foot skills my only query on him is does he have the right footy smarts? I think this is where Aish, Sheed & Salem all have it over Freeman. Knowing where & when to run and making right decisions is the biggest skill in AFL you can have. It doesn't matter if you are tall, strong, fast, jump etc. if you aren't footy smart you will struggle.
 

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Based on how the night panned out, I would've done pretty similar.

Definitely would've gone Scharenberg at 6 over Aish. Not because I think he is better...but because I think they are both fantastic and Scharenberg just fits out list needs better.

At 10, I agree I would've liked Acres...but I think the correct pick was probably Sheed.

However, I have no doubt that we agreed to pass up on him to satisfy the Eagles. Ultimately I'm happy with that. It's because of the Eagles that we have Scharenberg and Grundy on our list. So creating those type of trade alliances is smart business.

Therefore, I definitely would've taken Freeman at 10. He was 11th on my list of preferences (with Sheed higher)...so we have taken him exactly where he should've gone.

Later on, I agree Marsh is a value selection, but I am curious about Thorp because I thought he was a lock to go in the 2nd or 3rd round. Not sure what Carlton are doing here. They must simply not rate key talls or feel Waite has another 10 years left in him.

Really like the look of Langdon but don't know enough to comment.
 
Lefthanded said:
My Hine list:
Click to expand...

My Hine list would have had us take Scharenberg & Acres (influenced by Knightmare's phantom & Power Rankings). Would also have taken Sheed, Lennon or Crouch ahead of Freeman but am happy enough with our selections (we need to take some risks and have them pay off to get premierships.)
 
Well there was not Much Difference in Aish and Sherenberg. Just was who you liked more and I guess we though Shezza would be better
 
Kevin Sheehan stated that this was close to the best top 12 of any AFL national draft and had Jesse Hogan and Jack Martin not gone as 17 year olds last year, this would have been the best top 12 of all time.

Big wraps on all these kids and hopefully all can carve out distinguished AFL careers for their respective clubs.

For me, Sharenberg fits our needs defensively almost immediately and potentially could be developed as a swingman type who can go into the forward 50 if needed.

Have been a massive fan of Christian Salem and if not for bloody Melbourne, he would more than likely have been selected over Freeman by Hine at pick 10. Had we gotten Salem, in my humble opinion we would have been the clear winners from this draft.

Having said that, Nathan Freeman is now a Collingwood player who will get my full support with the view that in time he becomes everything that the club sees in him both in terms of leg speed and using the ball efficiently.

Both Langdon and Marsh must have seems too good to pass up for Hine to commit to them in the main draft so hopefully they too become gems.

Looking forward to seeing their development as senior AFl footballers from 2014 and beyond.

Good luck boys, welcome to "The Club"....... :thumbsu:
 
Thanks for the fantastic info provided for the entire year Knightmare !:thumbsu:

Special mention to Snoop Dog also!:thumbsu:

Rapt with all our picks and would have gone with Freeman over Acres in the end based on your comment "Super athletic midfielder who has tested off the charts. He adds much needed explosion to what is mostly a slow team". He's also 85kg's and therefor a true power athlete with the speed to weight ratio.


As previously discussed I'm a big fan of Acres but 9 games with the colt's in 2013 does not provide us with a true guide as to how he would perform in the reserves let alone against the seniors. A VIC TAC cup side would smash a Colts side in WA.

The risk of using a top ten pick on Acres was to great for mine without having played senior footy. And as you have regularly stated Dekka and Rendell have been big on that in recent years.
 

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Yes, can I echo KJ's comments thanking the likes of Knighter and Snoop for their fantastic contributions to this forum. It's a point of pride for me as a Pies fan to have such great efforts to read at this time of the year, and the patience and goodwill with which you reply to people does you great credit too.
Cheers again, gents!
 
TradeDraft said:
Why did you have Aish ahead of Sharenberg knight?
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my view.....it was 50:50.....I think the great man said it himself.

the logic for me was you get only one Scharenberg and if you go Aish at #10 there is nobody else like him hence take him at #6 because there are a few other Aish like players at #10. I think it just came down to balance.

be interesting in Knighta view.
 
Hardas said:
Yes, can I echo KJ's comments thanking the likes of Knighter and Snoop for their fantastic contributions to this forum. It's a point of pride for me as a Pies fan to have such great efforts to read at this time of the year, and the patience and goodwill with which you reply to people does you great credit too.
Cheers again, gents!
Click to expand...


I truly doubt any other club has the quality of information available at their doorstep as we do on the Magpie BF forum.:thumbsu:
 
Enforcer said:
Kevin Sheehan stated that this was close to the
Click to expand...

Wouldn't it be good if Shifter was "The List Manager" during trade/draft time rather than "What you talkin' about Terry?".
 
Hva sher a said:
thanks for the post - as usual excellent analysis.

I am certainly no expert so I'll trust your analysis but I'm not too dismayed about missing out on Aish. We are quite a slow side and while Freeman alone is not the answer, he will help provide that Dangerfield-like element. Of course there are concerns about his kicking under pressure but if he was better with his disposal he probably would've gone top 5.

I've also read that Freeman is a bit of a bouncy energetic character (Heath Shaw?) and in years to come he might be the rally the troops type of personality. All speculation of course but the whole draft is.

Having said that if Aish and Freeman were still around at 10, we would've gone for Aish.

After today's effort at the cricket I'm really really looking forward to the start of the season!
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With Freeman I'd be looking at a good outcome as Shuey rather than Dangerfield. While Freeman is strong bodied he's not nearly that same dominant contested ball winner Dangerfield is and isn't as tall either.

There were concerns about Freeman's kicking under pressure. He can mostly accelerate away and will probably do the same at AFL level. In congestion he's a bit happy to just get it onto his boot but it's not much different to say Beams in that regard. It's something that can be ammended.
I also don't have a problem with his field kicking as others seem to.

I don't know enough about Freeman as a character and I did find the description interesting when I heard it also. I can see it but he's not Heath Shaw ADD but probably in this regard more of a Dale Thomas type personality as someone who brings more that type of energy and personality to the club.

My concern mostly with Freeman is in a ball winning sense. I love all the ground he covers with ball in hand when you put it in his hands. Just for an early pick I have concerns with how he's going to find the ball as he isn't Dangerfield with his inside ball winning ok but not outstanding. And similarly on the outside also isn't a great linkup player so it will be interesting to see how he can develop that ability to accumulate. Improving his endurance isn't necessarily the answer because he finished top 10 in the endurnace testing but perhaps with time we can help him improve his running patterns and help him find the footy in space and more often so that he can influence games with his touches which he absolutely does.

Tbone McGraw said:
I won't quote your whole post Knightmare but I would have gone nearly exactly same as you with our picks.

Only possible difference is at pick 10. I liked Lennon but would have been happy with Acres.

Just to add another possible point of discussion. Your favourite pies pick and least favourite.

My favourite was definitely Marsh. Least favourite Freeman. I worry massively about his kicking efficiency and the last thing we need is another poor kicking efficiency.

In saying all that, Hine has proven himself so I fully trust his picks.
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As a favourite pick Marsh is my choice because he's the one I would have also made at that same point in the draft. I also like Langdon a lot. Neither are guaranteed guys to make it. You're kidding yourself this year if you think that. But I give them better chances of making it than most picked up around those points in the draft.

Freeman relatively speaking is the least favourite selection. Earlier in the year I touted him as the best midfielder in this draft but changed my mind the more I saw him. He's a risky pick for the top 10 and a guy who isn't assured of making it as I would say with many of those others selected inside the first round. He's got some real attributes and he can really do damage when he gets his hands on it. He is an exciting player so he'll probably be my favourite to watch along with Marsh but it just feels like we're trying too hard with Freeman to address our pace need when you can do that later in the draft more cheaply as we've seen with Seedman in the past and now Marsh as another who has the opportunity to surprise.

wednesdaywarrior said:
Thanks KM. you're always very clear and consistent and I like the way you always put yourself out there.

A few remarks:

Scharenberg - I was completely line ball between him and Aish but I think I would have felt more of a sense of loss if we'd missed Schara. With his attributes if he is fit he will be an amazing, versatile acquisition and allow greater flexibility with our other taller players as well as strengthening the backline. From interview seems a modest and very good character. Further to this, while Aish is obviously an amazing talent who uses the ball so well, the HUN pointed to Champion Data stats today revealing that players who get too much of their ball on the outside struggle to make it in the AFL. Players with similar outside winning profiles to Aish were Kane Lucas and Jimmy Toumpas, food for thought. I would still have taken Aish ahead of Freeman at that stage, but it makes me less upset that we took Schara ahead of him.

Freeman - wasn't on my wish list but now that he's ours I'm going glass half full. Looking over his highlights I actually like his kicking, he has a nice compact style and seems to have no problem feeding a target when balanced. The knock for mine is he is probably either running too fast at times to just slow that one pace before delivery to weight the kick properly and often in traffic he just throws the ball on the boot. Seems to have less vision and composure. Hopefully with time and experience hell get a bit better in these areas. I was buoyed by his combine stats which have him in the elite category in some of the areas that really matter. Endurance is a huge bonus. With his strong frame hopefully he can develop a more aggressive attack on the ball and win his share. To me this was one of the big advances in Dangerfield as a player, that he started to really use his body in contests. I don't expect Freeman to become Danger but more inside ability would make him a great midfield package.

Players I'm sad to have missed - Acres, Sheed, Crouch

Players I'm not sad to have missed - Lennon, Garlett
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I really like that you brought up the discussion point of outside types taken early. My pet hate in the draft is outside guys taken too early. You see so many misses with those outside types taken early draft, particularly those lower production outside types with weapons but no contested ball winning ability. Early picks if going for midfielders I feel should almost always go to those inside types (and really Acres was my priority so it would have).

As a result of this I rated Kelly outside the top 10 in my power rankings with the understanding of how much u18 football caters for those outside types.

On Aish I feel he is an exception to an extent because of what he has done at a senior SANFL level and with his game at another level from those others. His game has for a long, long time stacked up against the big bodies who play a physical brand and as an outside type dominating in a state league with those leagues so suited to the inside types it shows how talented Aish is doing what he's doing and with a tag every week. Aish last year was better than Toumpas was in his draft year and he doesn't have the issues by foot of Kane Lucas as someone who had a 100% disposal efficiency in the SANFL grand final from his 15 disposals.

I'm not predicting Aish to be the best in this draft but I'm very confident he'll be one of the better players in this draft certainly and one who will have among the longest and best careers of anyone in this draft, as well as one of the better immediate impacts.

On Freeman I'm hoping he can boost that inside ball winning ability. He'll need it to become a full time midfielder as most hope he will become. If not then I'm ever curious as to what he could do down back as a running back pocket. It's something I haven't seen of him and how well he reads it down back or how well he marks it as an intercept marker I'm not sure. But athletically and for strength he's right up there and should be able to go with anyone and with his run and carry at such a high level with the way he can take on the game but then really just keep running and go the length of the field if you let him and he's someone who could really generate some meaningful drive and in a big way like we probably haven't seen on this list.
Perhaps this vision speaks more of my scepticism of Freeman developing into a midfielder but with our midfield and front half batting so deep it's something I'd have no hesitation doing as a way to find him a role and a role he can play to a high level.

4#Didak#4 said:
There is a lot to like about Freeman. I was on his band wagon early, but after the move up the order to six thought we could do better on the foot skills front. In the end I was kind of hoping for Salem, knowing Aish was too good to be true at 10.

The comparisons with Dangerfield & Judd are exciting and one can only hope. One knock on him was his lack of top level performance at TAC level, I believe guys like Judd & Dangerfield were stand outs in this regard. However, his physical attributes and his stand out testing at the combine counter this to a degree.

Other than foot skills my only query on him is does he have the right footy smarts? I think this is where Aish, Sheed & Salem all have it over Freeman. Knowing where & when to run and making right decisions is the biggest skill in AFL you can have. It doesn't matter if you are tall, strong, fast, jump etc. if you aren't footy smart you will struggle.
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Dangerfield wasn't a big accumulator as his endurance was very low but what he did have was proven production in a AIS match against a VFL team from memory where he stood out and showed that he could match it with the bigger bodies and win his own footy. He ran out of puff but he showed that he was that class above even at that level which convinced Rendell.
Judd was mostly injured with his shoulder but he was one of the absolute better performed players in his draft in those games he had played.

You are right to question Freeman's footy smarts and as many tricks as he has it's something he does lack. He doesn't know where to run and can at times make poor decisions and rush things more than he perhaps needs to.
He's someone you buy because athletically he's a freak with that speed, endurance, repeat speed but then also strength. They're athletic traits which he shows that he can use in game so it's not like Joel Wilkinson or Caolan Mooney who may test off the charts but struggle to use it in game, so that's a major attraction but his game still does need much developing but he's in the right environment to get that best from his game.

DaVe86 said:
Based on how the night panned out, I would've done pretty similar.

Definitely would've gone Scharenberg at 6 over Aish. Not because I think he is better...but because I think they are both fantastic and Scharenberg just fits out list needs better.

At 10, I agree I would've liked Acres...but I think the correct pick was probably Sheed.

However, I have no doubt that we agreed to pass up on him to satisfy the Eagles. Ultimately I'm happy with that. It's because of the Eagles that we have Scharenberg and Grundy on our list. So creating those type of trade alliances is smart business.

Therefore, I definitely would've taken Freeman at 10. He was 11th on my list of preferences (with Sheed higher)...so we have taken him exactly where he should've gone.

Later on, I agree Marsh is a value selection, but I am curious about Thorp because I thought he was a lock to go in the 2nd or 3rd round. Not sure what Carlton are doing here. They must simply not rate key talls or feel Waite has another 10 years left in him.

Really like the look of Langdon but don't know enough to comment.
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I don't think it's so much letting Sheed go for the sake of letting him go. It's more I don't think he's necessarily someone we saw as a fit for our list as someone who doesn't fill such a specific need as our other recruits have with Freeman and Marsh adding much needed pace and Scharenberg and Langdon much needed rebound and ball use off a back flank with no meaningful rebounders by foot down back.

I agree with the idea of forming strong relationships with clubs though. It's clear Collingwood and West Coast these past couple of seasons have formed a strong relationship at the trade table and are willing to deal with eachother. It's a similar situation with Sydney in years past where we had a strong relationship for a period there. Collingwood as much as opposition clubs and people love to hate us, we have a positive reputation at the trade table as a team clubs seem to mostly enjoy dealing with, with Hawthorn another club as a club willing to trade and make things happen early in the trade period another team with this positive perception around the league. With Essendon in the other category entirely as a team who want to win the trade rather than help make themselves and their trading partner better which is where they struggle in this regard.

On Thorp as a mature ager you can never be sure of their draft position unless they are considered an absolute top end prospect. Thorp was always a mid draft on later guy if selected and in this draft those types aren't guaranteed a position on a list with so few clubs investing in this draft. Thorp isn't an answer as a key forward. While he kicked 78 goals he's more Jarrad Grant or Jack Watts as a forward and is a component of a front half rather than a power forward you build around or a goal kicking focal point. You'd draft him more as a third tall forward or tall forward flanker who can at times push back towards goal. But in saying that Carlton and a number of others teams could use him as a component to a successful forwardline. Collingwood with so many small forwards and few talls or quality third talls could also probably use him I'd argue.

Langdon is a good one. Overlooked last year and should have been selected then and rightfully selected this year. High production, tall, good ball user, effective rebounder. Has some versatility. He's handy.

TradeDraft said:
Why did you have Aish ahead of Sharenberg knight?
Click to expand...

It's a good question. Generally when there is quality height I take that, and that is what Scharenberg is so I'm not at all upset by our selection.

I favour what Aish has done. Two time premiership player. Has so much senior SANFL experience and is so good that he could have played in the AFL last year if draft age wasn't relevant. He's even played to a strong standard while getting a tag most weeks. He's round one ready to go. He comes from footballing royalty and when you have football in your blood like Aish does so often we see those guys reach great heights.
I also like what he brings. He's one of the best ball users in this draft as a precision ball user. Has more time and space than anyone in this draft and doesn't get caught with the ball. Has so much composure with ball in hand. Also injects more pace. And the versatility to play back flank, wing or even forward well.
He's not going to be a monster contested ball winner but he's in my view a sure thing to go on and have an excellent career regardless of this.

Brisbane are lucky to have Aish. He's a good one and should play 20+ games which I probably wouldn't project for Scharenberg who probably takes a little longer to find his feet as someone who more around the mid season point will most likely push for regular senior selection.
 

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Opinion Hinesight, Knightsight and Hindsight (end of 2013)

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