Review Good/Bad v North Melbourne, R1 2016

[baldandbroke]

VB was bad. Fumbles galore. Not convinced he was worst on ground. Tom Lynch mounted a pretty strong case for that particular honor. Walker and Betts both get honourable mentions too.

Really? Betts? I thought he was one of our better players. He didn't finish off as well as he has in past, but his effort and work rate looked great. He didn;t get much love from the umps, but he was no way one of our worst?

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Three AFL games ago, Walker had a Captain's Game to pull us over the line in an elimination final. Eddie Betts kicked 5. Sam Jacobs destroyed the ruck. Sloane was very servicable particularly with defensive efforts. Lynch was key on the wings.

Meanwhile VB put in his usual shit after a terrible season.

To say VB has runs on the board is a blatant lie and you're kidding yourself if you actually believe that. Sure, he has played well in the past, but we're talking about 3-4 seasons ago. Those runs no longer count

Everyone talks about "Gold Passes" ........if everyone is true to that thought, then every player is criticised / lauded on an individual game ......not on what said player did 6 months ago

That said ....coach's take one off bad games into account at Team Selection .....depending on who's available in the wings

 

[Vader]

So you suggest we were vastly undersized - why wouldn't Hartigan have made any difference then?

If you look at what I wrote, you'll see that's a reference to Seedsman and Smith. The fact that they were involved in marking contests against the likes of Petrie & Waite is due to our defensive structure (i.e. the web defence), not the personnel.

Cheney wasn't the problem and replacing him with Hartigan wasn't the answer. Cheney was arguably the best of our 3 tall defenders last night.

Of all of the reasons why we lost, the non-selection of Hartigan was by far and away the least significant.

 

[MRB37]

I love that we scream out for years to play anti social football and then we get 2 brothers who are elite anti-social mongrels and we're up in arms calling them stupid and saying they need to tone it down.

Sections of this supporter base are just awful.

Got to pick your battles unfortunately. What Lever did wasn't "unsociable" it was just stupid, especially when you do it against a side that dives as bad as a soccer team. Brad Crouch should have just let Thompson scraggle him some more to draw a 50m penalty and an easy goal. Instead it went the other way and North kicked one.

 

[MRB37]

Everyone talks about "Gold Passes" ........if everyone is true to that thought, then every player is criticised / lauded on an individual game ......not on what said player did 6 months ago

That said ....coach's take one off bad games into account at Team Selection .....depending on who's available in the wings

It's not a singular event from VB and Mackay though. That's why they're judged more harshly than Walker/Betts/Sloane for 1 bad game.

 

[baldandbroke]

Got to pick your battles unfortunately. What Lever did wasn't "unsociable" it was just stupid, especially when you do it against a side that dives as bad as a soccer team. Brad Crouch should have just let Thompson scraggle him some more to draw a 50m penalty and an easy goal. Instead it went the other way and North kicked one.

You can't even look at Thomas too hard or he'll fall over. Smacking him in the back is dumb.

Remember when man-bun shoved Porps in the back in the 2012 Prelim? Reversal and we kicked a goal that brought us back into the game - it's not ok.

 

[Cap]

I wonder how Hamptons injury threw the selection team out?

 

[WaynesWorld19]

If you want to keep accepting shithouse performances from a player with a record of shithouse performances then you can keep believing that somehow Sloane and Walker were worse than VB last night

I do partially agree with Vader though, Lynch was unsighted as he was tagged out of it by McDonald. However, VB had an active negative contribution to the team whereas Lynch did absolutely nothing

Who said that ?

 

[Paladin]

If you look at what I wrote, you'll see that's a reference to Seedsman and Smith. The fact that they were involved in marking contests against the likes of Petrie & Waite is due to our defensive structure (i.e. the web defence), not the personnel.

Cheney wasn't the problem and replacing him with Hartigan wasn't the answer. Cheney was arguably the best of our 3 tall defenders last night.

Of all of the reasons why we lost, the non-selection of Hartigan was by far and away the least significant.

But if Hartigan was in the defensive structure we would have had one extra big player in that defensive structure. So we would have been outsized on fewer occasions. So he would have made a difference unlike your throwaway comment.

Cheney isn't a tall defender he could have played instead of VB.

 

[Pugsley]

Me too - just saw the replay. Joke.

Holding the ball when Brown was tackled by Laird, he put the effing ball on the ground FFS - not paid - then Waite goes down like he was shot.

If MCrouch gets suspended for hitting the contest and getting the ball

View attachment 228930

Unless his head is under his armpit, that is NOT high.

Do the umpires have an illicit drugs policy ? You'd have to be on something to see that as reckless.

 

[Pugsley]

What is Rory Sloane's best position?

Missionary.

 

[footy4ever]

The commentators saw it!

I'd turned the sound down by then. I was sick of them barracking for North.

 

[Glenno23]

VB was bad. Fumbles galore. Not convinced he was worst on ground. Tom Lynch mounted a pretty strong case for that particular honor. Walker and Betts both get honourable mentions too.

Lynch was tagged for the first time in his career. He'll need to earn how to deal with it though as Brad Scott has just given 16 other coaches a blueprint on how to slow him down and hurt our link up play.

Betts was actually ok outside of his finishing, played too high up the ground too often for mine. And Walker (outside of some very gettable goals) was ok. Down for him, but still contributed 18 touches and 2 goals

They were no where near as bad as VB. I disagree with that wholeheartedly

If you want to keep accepting shithouse performances from a player with a record of shithouse performances then you can keep believing that somehow Sloane and Walker were worse than VB last night

I do partially agree with Vader though, Lynch was unsighted as he was tagged out of it by McDonald. However, VB had an active negative contribution to the team whereas Lynch did absolutely nothing

Lynch will have to learn how to deal with a tagger, or just learn how to out run them

 

[Kickin Goals]

Not all doom and gloom, very disappointing to lose a after leading for most of the game, wasted way too many opportunitys. Can't wait to beat Port next week!

 

[Bay62]

Watching Gameday

Sando Bernie Sloaney and Tex all discussing the game

Long and funny segment with these guys

They ask Tex does he like Pyke more than Sando. Sando is sitting there.

Tex doesn't know what to say. Sando says he feels awkward and laughs

Then Sloaney says "I think I've had five coaches, you're in my top five Sando"

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I think there were a number of reasons why we lost last night. Isolating any one of these reasons and blaming it solely for the loss would be a major mistake.

Lack of input from senior players
Too many of our senior players were absolutely awful last night. VB had the worst case of the fumbles that I've ever seen from him. Tex and Betts were both liabilities when kicking for goal. First Tex missed from the point of the goal square, then Betts missed from 20m out running into an open goal. Neither redeemed themselves. Sloane was nowhere near his best and appears to be struggling with the extra attention he's receiving, now that He Who Must Not Be Named is no longer with us. Lynch was barely sighted and his shank in the final quarter was one of the final nails in our coffin.

Brad Crouch is much hyped as the player who is going to make up for losing Dangerfield. He was awful last night, but that's to be expected given the time he's spent out of the game due to injury. There's not a lot of point in playing him in the SANFL. His problems were caused by a failure to adjust to the increased speed and physicality of the AFL competition. Playing in the SANFL won't fix that - only more game time at the AFL level will make a difference.

Poor Discipline
I can give Brad Crouch some slack for struggling with the pace of the game, given that he's missed 18 months due to injury. What I can't forgive is his shocking lack of discipline throughout the game. He needs to pull his head in, and he needs to do it now. Matt Crouch got reported and it looked ugly in real time, though a number of posters seem to think slow motion replays may help his case. Either way, it was unnecessary and poorly disciplined.

Adelaide gave away a number of goals through 50m penalties. Laird's push, combined with Thomas' diving skills, gave North a 2nd goal without the ball being bounced - that halved our lead in an instant. Yes, it was in response to Sloane being punched in the jaw, but it was still dumb football. He shouldn't have allowed himself to get sucked in by North's niggling and diving tactics.

Murdering the ball
Adelaide had an abundance of wasted opportunities to win the game in the final quarter. We wasted every single one of them. Betts ran into an open goal, and missed. McGovern tried to kick a checkside goal, and missed. Walker had 2 misses from 50m, normally the only range where he does kick reliably. We had 2 players streaming towards the 50m arc, confronted by a single North player - a certain goal beckoned. The handball goes behind the player, and the opportunity goes begging. Time after time we bombed the ball into our 50m arc, hoping for the best - with the ball invariably being turned over.

Then there's the Brodie Smith hospital pass to Sloane, earlier in the game, when he should have been taking the shot himself. Smith turns the ball over and it goes down the other end for a goal - a 2 goal turnaround, in a game we lost by 10 points. Not to mention Tex's miss from the point of the goal square.

Goldstein
Unlike the other factors, which were entirely within Adelaide's control, there was nothing we could do about Goldstein. His marking and calm assurance in the final quarter was the biggest individual difference between the sides. I sincerely hope that he is rewarded with 3 Brownlow votes for this game, as he thoroughly deserves them.

Umpiring
Adelaide had a pretty good run in the first half, but the price we paid in the second half - when the umpires decided to even things up - was just plain vicious. North were given free license to rip Adelaide heads off and throw the ball at will, with the umpires doing nothing to discourage them. In return, Adelaide just had to touch a player or go within 25m of them after a mark, and it was an instant 50m penalty. Shocking display of incompetence. I'm not accusing them of bias, just incompetence.

North's Tall Forwards
Brown, Petrie and Waite kicked 7 goals between them and looked dangerous whenever the ball was coming in high. None of our defenders looked like matching them in the air - not Talia, not Lever, not Cheney. Often they found themselves competing against vastly undersized opponents, such as Seedsman and Smith, with our taller defenders nowhere to be seen. I guess that's the nature of the web defence... Adelaide had no answer - and things weren't helped by these players receiving multiple 50m penalties, bringing them within scoring distance. Hartigan wouldn't have made one iota of difference.

Best post in this thread

 

[Vader]

Lynch was tagged for the first time in his career. He'll need to earn how to deal with it though as Brad Scott has just given 16 other coaches a blueprint on how to slow him down and hurt our link up play.

Betts was actually ok outside of his finishing, played too high up the ground too often for mine. And Walker (outside of some very gettable goals) was ok. Down for him, but still contributed 18 touches and 2 goals

They were no where near as bad as VB. I disagree with that wholeheartedly

Lynch will have to learn how to deal with a tagger, or just learn how to out run them

Lynch didn't get a lot of it because he was being tagged. However, even when he did get it his disposal was awful. 11 disposals, with 54.5% DE and 3 clangers, was a very poor return.

I'd have Lynch as our WOG, by a fairly comfortable margin. VB and Rat tie for 2nd.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Stats from todays paper.
View attachment 228943

Or you can use this site ....with filtering options

http://www.afl.com.au/stats

 

[creme_fraiche]

Got to pick your battles unfortunately. What Lever did wasn't "unsociable" it was just stupid, especially when you do it against a side that dives as bad as a soccer team. Brad Crouch should have just let Thompson scraggle him some more to draw a 50m penalty and an easy goal. Instead it went the other way and North kicked one.

Agree regarding picking their battles.

I just can't believe we're complaining about unsociable individuals. Last night was one of the niggliest Crows sides I've seen in a long time and I loved it.

 

[Vader]

But if Hartigan was in the defensive structure we would have had one extra big player in that defensive structure. So we would have been outsized on fewer occasions. So he would have made a difference unlike your throwaway comment.

Cheney isn't a tall defender he could have played instead of VB.

Hartigan wasn't the answer. Cheney isn't a tall defender, but that was the role he filled last night and he did it better than Talia & Lever.

I also think you're misunderstanding what I'm talking about with the structure. What you're suggesting would make sense if our defence went man on man, and Hartigan was directly responsible for Waite or Brown (Talia spent most of the night on Petrie). That's not the way our defence is structured these days, with the "web defence". Having an extra tall in that structure may well have caused more problems than it provided solutions.

 

[Paladin]

Hartigan wasn't the answer. Cheney isn't a tall defender, but that was the role he filled last night and he did it better than Talia & Lever.

I also think you're misunderstanding what I'm talking about with the structure. What you're suggesting would make sense if our defence went man on man, and Hartigan was directly responsible for Waite or Brown (Talia spent most of the night on Petrie). That's not the way our defence is structured these days, with the "web defence". Having an extra tall in that structure may well have caused more problems than it provided solutions.

You cant see if we had an extra tall that we would be outsized less often with a team or web defence?

Your being deliberately dense then

 

[creme_fraiche]

Did anyone else want to punch Sandy Roberts face in when he kept referring to the 'Couch' brothers.

Shut the **** up campaigner

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Really? Betts? I thought he was one of our better players. He didn't finish off as well as he has in past, but his effort and work rate looked great. He didn;t get much love from the umps, but he was no way one of our worst?

I agree .....really tried hard ...and IMO the ball just didn't run his way last night

Will say though when he got an opportunity to run into goal for a certainty, but chose to put the ball on his boot immediately rather than run with it ......I am dead set sure he remembered being run down in the goalsqaure against GC ......that affected his decision

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Agree regarding picking their battles.

I just can't believe we're complaining about unsociable individuals. Last night was one of the niggliest Crows sides I've seen in a long time and I loved it.

Have to agree .....Lever, Crouch Brothers, Sloane .....also suspect McGoven has a nasty side as well

 

[Vader]

You cant see if we had an extra tall that we would be outsized less often with a team or web defence?

Your being deliberately dense then

I can.. but you can't see that it comes at a price.

In all seriousness, this was the least of the reasons why Adelaide lost the game. Lack of input from our senior players, combined with poor discipline across the board, were much more significant factors.