Preview Rnd 12 - Carlton v Brisbane Sat 8th June 1.45PM @ Etihad - Team Post #319 *Stocker injured, not dropped

[PP34]

The club knows what happened, and they choose to try and brush it over.
Again Caro reports that he made a dick of himself and spilt his drink on Robbie Warnock. I will believe her before I believe anything the club reports about this.

You have Pickett coming back to the club seriously over weight and as a consequence he was kicked out of the senior group. He subsequently got injured probably because he was not fit enough. Thomas and his drinking before a match. There are park footy clubs that have better discipline than this.

End of the day footy clubs are always going to treat a player with runs on the board better than a bloke who can’t get on the park when it comes to incidents like this.

Thomas has runs on the board, was playing some good footy and made a stupid mistake. Correct me if I’m wrong but I don’t remember him doing anything else wrong at Carlton.

It differs from when we punted guys like Robinson because right now the club cannot afford to lose any more age and experience. If Carlton were a better team the last few years Daisy wouldn’t even be on our list right now.

 

[Mr_Plow]

There is a reason why Brisbane is a genuine finals contender and we are at the bottom of the ladder...again.
It has nothing to do with what Robinson does or does not think. You are judged by your actions. We are a joke at the moment in the eyes of every other AFL Club, and it will continue to be the case until we get some basic standards into the place.

Drug and alcohol misuse are rife in the league. It would be a mistake to assume that Brisbane are any cleaner than we are.

 

[Gethelred]

Does being said after the fact make it any less credible?

Arguably.

 

[Moody Blue]

And he copped his punishment and played the best VFL game of any Carlton listed player for the year.

A kid like Walsh who gives everything, would look at Thomas with disdain. Thomas better not point or have a go at anyone on the weekend. He better keep his head down and play the game of this life. Either way if they re-sign him then you can guarantee another year of mediocrity.

 

[Bluebag13]

Has it been stated somewhere the game plan has changed?

My understanding is Teague has just released the players to play with a bit more freedom and dare and simplified things a bit

How would you do that without changing the gameplan?

 

[Moody Blue]

Drug and alcohol misuse are rife in the league. It would be a mistake to assume that Brisbane are any cleaner than we are.

Excuses...This is why we are at the bottom. Always with the excuse.

 

[Curnivore]

There is a reason why Brisbane is a genuine finals contender and we are at the bottom of the ladder...again.
It has nothing to do with what Robinson does or does not think. You are judged by your actions. We are a joke at the moment in the eyes of every other AFL Club, and it will continue to be the case until we get some basic standards into the place.

I don't think Daisy being called back into the side after a best on ground performance and being the only one all year to show some physically when our Captain is been targeted makes us a joke. That said if you have any articles that say otherwise I'm happy to see them.

 

[Macca43]

There is a reason why Brisbane is a genuine finals contender and we are at the bottom of the ladder...again.
It has nothing to do with what Robinson does or does not think. You are judged by your actions. We are a joke at the moment in the eyes of every other AFL Club, and it will continue to be the case until we get some basic standards into the place.

Perhaps the fact they have a more mature list, started their rebuild in 2013 (5 picks inside the first 35 in that year) rather than 2015 and have had almost no injuries in the last 2i seasons?

 

[Mr_Plow]

Excuses...This is why we are at the bottom. Always with the excuse.

We're at the bottom because we suck, not because some guy on the internet said that Brisbane aren't any cleaner than Carlton players.

 

[Gethelred]

A kid like Walsh who gives everything, would look at Thomas with disdain. Thomas better not point or have a go at anyone on the weekend. He better keep his head down and play the game of this life. Either way if they re-sign him then you can guarantee another year of mediocrity.

A kid like Walsh would look at Thomas and say, "He's a premiership player, when I've a medal around MY neck then I have the right to judge other people for their indiscretions!"

Moody, I get that when you're upset you genuinely plumb the depths of despair, but this is too pessimistic even for words.

 

[Arr0w]

Does being said after the fact make it any less credible?

Does to me, especially with all the discussions around Bolton, none of this was mentioned at all, prior to his sacking. I find that strange

 

[Moody Blue]

A kid like Walsh would look at Thomas and say, "He's a premiership player, when I've a medal around MY neck then I have the right to judge other people for their indiscretions!"

Moody, I get that when you're upset you genuinely plumb the depths of despair, but this is too pessimistic even for words.

This is why we will remain at the bottom for a few more years.

 

[Mr_Plow]

Does to me, especially with all the discussions around Bolton, none of this was mentioned at all, prior to his sacking. I find that strange

Perhaps sensitive information cannot be disclosed before the fact? Is that not the reason ep and b70 hold their information close?

 

[Gethelred]

This is why we will remain at the bottom for a few more years.

... because Walsh has Thomas to look up to? He had Selwood and Danger for the years heading into the draft.

So, which is it? Does he look on Thomas as an example, or does he look upon him with distain? You're the one that made the pessimistic claim, not me; I'm not trying to be anything other than realistic. And of course we'll be at the bottom for a few more years; the list build is incomplete.

 

[Arr0w]

So Levi can play in the back-line?

I wanted Levi playing in the Northern Blues back-line and didn't expect him to be of the service he has been in the main team.
One thing we have to know though, is that it will be short-lived. This is not going to be a Jones-type resurrection, but in the meantime.....Good on him.

It was also clear that Kennedy and Lang weren't ready for the main team, given their NB's output.
I don't care for the possession but for the work-rate, effort, intent and quality of disposal and neither were up to scratch, unfortunately.
I know Lang is listed as injured, but it may not have mattered.

Murphy just couldn't get up for this game. Never mind. Next week, maybe.

I guess it highlights the value of Levi where he can cover, forward, ruck or back, yet so many people want him dropped and or gone. Would also allow us to move on Lobbe and Phillips and target the right players

 

[Aphrodite]

Can't believe the last 10 pages I have just read this morning.

This thread had hardly any posts until the Team was announced yesterday afternoon.

Bitching, moaning, attacking posters, baiting/stalking, abuse. Should I go on.

Carlton Board and site posting rules are the same for EVERYONE.

No one is a protected species and for those undermining Mods saying as such, YOU ARE WRONG!

 

[Arr0w]

Perhaps sensitive information cannot be disclosed before the fact? Is that not the reason ep and b70 hold their information close?

Or could it be that they wait until it's confirmed rather than possible innuendo?

 

[Soapy V]

How would you do that without changing the gameplan?

Just seemed to me it was more a change in attitude than game plan. I don't know. Changing the game plan is a massive thing to do especially in just one week

 

[Curnivore]

... because Walsh has Thomas to look up to? He had Selwood and Danger for the years heading into the draft.

So, which is it? Does he look on Thomas as an example, or does he look upon him with distain? You're the one that made the pessimistic claim, not me; I'm not trying to be anything other than realistic. And of course we'll be at the bottom for a few more years; the list build is incomplete.

If Walsh is looking at Daisy, a premiership champion and at his peak the best gut runner in the game, with distain then we have a massive problem with Walshs attitude and sense of entitlement.

 

[Soapy V]

Let's hope that's the case, Soap! I'm cautiously optimistic, but my expectations are tempered as I'm not sure how many tangible, practical changes can be implemented in the space of a week.

Much of our team has only heard one coaching message, and learned only a single 'structure' at AFL level, and I'm not sure how much of this can be undone or released from muscle memory this quickly. We'll hopefully see some signs, at least - I'm sure Teaguey will be giving it all he's got.

Agree. My only hesitation on getting too excited is we are still very young and unfit and/or undeveloped. Can't be fixed in a week. Still the biggest issue for me and will simply take time

 

[Bluebag13]

Just seemed to me it was more a change in attitude than game plan. I don't know. Changing the game plan is a massive thing to do especially in just one week

I doubt it will be too drastic of a change. But surely a change of some sorts will happen (i would think)

 

[Mr_Plow]

Or could it be that they wait until it's confirmed rather than possible innuendo?

ep and b70 don't get innuendo from their sources. They know their information is as true as can be at that particular point in time, but wait for the appropriate time to disclose that information. Case in point, ep's post-trade/draft summaries or OR's post-sacking monologue.

Perhaps sensitive information regarding dissent within coaching ranks wasn't allowed to spill prior to the sacking? Why then, must we openly disregard a rumour which unveils itself after the fact?

I know we all have high standings on this board and see ourselves as an authority, but there's no need to discredit other posters.

Essentially, I'm putting my hand up for the opposition ballot.

 

[ferrisb]

There is a reason why Brisbane is a genuine finals contender and we are at the bottom of the ladder...again.
It has nothing to do with what Robinson does or does not think. You are judged by your actions. We are a joke at the moment in the eyes of every other AFL Club, and it will continue to be the case until we get some basic standards into the place.

Sorry Moody, your comparison of standards Carlton vs Brisbane doesn't really match up.

We sacked Robinson for a big night out and lying to the club. Brisbane then willingly recruited him despite his history.

Luke Hodge got caught drink driving a week before finals (an actual crime, not just poor form). Brisbane willingly recruited him down the track.

While I disagree with your view on Daisy, I can at least understand your view on having tough standards. However.....I don't think Brisbane is providing the contrasting example on standard you think it is.

 

[Curnivore]

Sorry Moody, your comparison of standards Carlton vs Brisbane doesn't really match up.

We sacked Robinson for a big night out and lying to the club. Brisbane then willingly recruited him despite his history.

Luke Hodge got caught drink driving a week before finals (an actual crime, not just poor form). Brisbane willingly recruited him down the track.

While I disagree with your view on Daisy, I can at least understand your view on having tough standards. However.....I don't think Brisbane is providing the contrasting example on standard you think it is.

Add Fev to that list. Moody, due to the drinking at the charity function Brisbane are offering Daisy a five year contract.

 

[JustaBattler]

Well according to Bolton - the leadership group handed out Thomas' suspension - not Bolton. Apart from the two Captains one of which has been unavailable for selection for season 2018 and 2019 - I don't know who 'the leaders' are and don't give a brass razoo either. I think it is somewhat ironic that many posters have lauded Thomas' contribution off field as a leader and now it seems many posters want him gone.

Clearly all was not 'right' at the Club - I would be surprised if some if not all players were conscious of the mounting pressure on Bolton and I would be more surprised if Bolton's own personal behaviour and processing ability didn't suffer under the stress. To think that maybe Thomas was feeling off because of the combination of what he could see was happening as well as any personal issues he has apparently been dealing with - leading to a few more drinks than appropriate isn't a big stretch.

Does anyone really think that getting pizzed a couple of nights before a game would actually change Thomas's on field performance ability for the game against St Kilda? I don't. This is all a big beat up - standards that matter to me as a member are displayed on field - it is what players do when they are wearing the jumper that matters to me - all this PC nonsense about whether someone should or shouldn't 'like' this or that twitter or whether 5 drinks is worse than 2 drinks is over engineered codswallop - if that is what millenial 'correctness' is - good luck with that - tick every PC box you like - wont make one iota of difference regarding on field performance or not.

I support Carlton football - I come on here to read about football and AFl - I don't give one flying toss what any of you think is politically correct or religiously correct and how or why or when these so called 'standards' should apply to players- as if they are some special species of human being that has to not only be 'perfect' but also 'look' perfect - all the time.

As for the game against Brisbane - and 'talk' about players being allowed to play with more 'freedom' or whatever - I put it in the BS baffles brains basket. If players cant kick a 15 meter pass or handball to each other or make regualtion tackles or even kcik goals from 25 meters out - no coach can do anything.

What has to be addressed and can't be in one week is the failure of Bolton's so called zone system - which amounted pretty much to stacking numbers behind the ball - ceding control of the middle of the ground and insisting players look first to cover 'space' and then think about tackling the opposition. Carlton's 'zone' system has delivered a most unaccountable defensive structure and system and also pretty much destroyed any forward structure - I've been banging on about this lack of forward structure for nearly two years now - how many times does a mid win teh ball and then look forward and see 2- 3 Carlton forwards instead of 6 - and ll of them double manned - so teh game is held up and we see a sideways kick to no one in advantage and then another nothing kick followed by a turnover or a kick down the line - rinse and repeat - PATHETIC FOOTBALL!!

maybe with the talent we have in talls up front - it is a good idea to insist that they hold position and structure instead of being used as some sort of part time wingmen and space filling plodders between the arcs. You can't actually play a defense first game with a bunch of short people between the arcs- so you may as well play the fast entertaining aggressive game - and actually kick some goals - since very few midfielders actually want to stick tackles.

I've put a line through the first half of the year - lets see what the players under this new apprentice's apprentice coach come up with.