Autopsy Round 15, 2022: Sydney v St.Kilda

[D2D3]

He's a polarizing figure but GT is going completely ******* nuts on Twitter tonight. What is funny is that a lot of the current club big wigs follow him, so if they ever do use the platform he has had a few words to say about them too LOL

https://twitter.com/Thomo_Grant

He made a pretty interesting comment about David Rath doing too much in the box and being too influential to the decision making of the coaching group. I heard that same stuff back in March so either GT has a good sense of what's going on or someone is feeding him that info. Either way some of the stuff is along the same lines as what most of us have been saying the last few weeks.



Doesn't mince his words

I don’t always agree with GT but he’s 100% right here in his observations about non-negotiables, individuals vs the team and buy-in.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Just started watching the replay because I'd been away. Got to about the 5 minute mark of the 2nd qtr when I gave it away.

The reason - seeing Ben Long

22

Ben Long

Age

26

Ht

186cm

Wt

81kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.9

3star

K

6.2

2star

HB

4.7

3star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.7

4star

MG

166.8

3star

D

12.8

3star

K

6.7

3star

HB

6.2

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.3

3star

MG

129.0

2star

D

13.4

4star

K

6.8

3star

HB

6.6

4star

M

3.2

4star

T

3.2

5star

MG

223.0

4star

lose a ruck contest in the forward pocket to Hickey, the Swans clear the forward 50, we regain possession and kick it long back inside forward and guess who marks it!!!

I'm with GT!!

 

[sauce_head]

Not sure how Ratten can compare Max to Plugger. Plugger knew to move. Sure Max got pushed off the ball time and again and it was probably a free, but he’s got to actually move like he did in the first half of the season. Even if he’s just dragging the three blokes that are in him away from the ball. Then players like Higgins (who should never not play if available) and Sharman can get space.

It’s simple. Move your arse!

 

[Joffaboy]

I don’t always agree with GT but he’s 100% right here in his observations about non-negotiables, individuals vs the team and buy-in.

Like sueing the club for 400k after not repaying 1 mill to Butters?

Yes GT and his fundamentals.

 

[BrutThough]

Not sure how Ratten can compare Max to Plugger.

He wasnt comparing Max to Plugger.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Like sueing the club for 400k after not repaying 1 mill to Butters?

Yes GT and his fundamentals.

Not quite.

Butters sued Thomas for a $1m over a non club related personal loan that Butters made to Thomas when they were friends and before he was appointed coach.

Thomas sued the club for non payment of money of $200,00 related to us breaking his contract.

He won - which suggests he was right.

 

[The Punter]

I'm not sure where to put this so I think I'll just write.

Every day that passes it becomes less and less enjoyable. It's like a burden. I'm going this Friday because I already bought tickets and my son wants to go. It's commitments to others that keep me going.

I'm just at the point where it doesn't matter what the identified problem is. We get Clarko and he does what every other St Kilda coach bar one does. Another crop of new St Kilda players losing their skills at the club. Regimes pass through but the failure remains.

If Nick and Lenny couldn't win one, maybe it's just not possible. It's who we are. I've seen every team that existed when I was born win one except the one I support. It'll be Freo and Carlton next, then GWS and GC. Everyone gets a taste but us. It's who we are.

Over the last few years I've felt what it is like to support a team in another sport where you get to the point where you know they'll pull it out even if they are behind. That's not only a great feeling, it's a powerful feeling. The opposite is watching Essendon knowing they'll beat us because they always do. At the moment I'd settle for Essendon just telling our ruckman what they injected into him in 2012.

GT cares but he's grossly inconsistent. He talks about commitment then spruiks going and getting De Goey. At least he's consistent about the importance of strategy - the reason he never beat Port Adelaide when they were any good. Win contest, move ball, repeat step 1 was all he had. It worked to an extent. Still ended up the same as Alves and Lyon and Watters and Richardson and Sheldon and Jewell and Patterson and Gellie and Killegrew and all the others apart from one.

So I have no urge to write about selection and strategy or drafting or trading at the moment, because I struggle to see what difference any of it would make. The red, white and black would seep into their veins and suddenly they'd be no good at football any more. It's who we are.

 

[StCicatriz]

Dmac missing really hurt out structure defensively but lets not kid out selves. 1 player should not impact us that much!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I concur..

Ratten says our brand of footy is contested footy, yet we’re not good at winning contested ball, our midfield/backline do not win enough (first possesion), so he sets up the entire team to tackle, apply pressure to win the ball back for easy turnover goals.. if the opposition don’t crack under our pressure, we are toast..

how about try to win the ball first, use it well.. then worry about the tackling when opposition gets it..

Team stats on that game:

Disposals, Sydney slightly more ( not really an issue ).
Inside 50s Sydney significantly more ( 55- 44).
Efficiency inside 50 : Sydney 47% vs 34%.
Free Kicks 27 -12 .
Clearances , Saints 36-33 ( From 45-22 Hitouts ).
Contested Possessions 136( Sydney ) vs 130.
Marks inside 50 Sydney 13, vs 5
Contested Marks , Saints 11 vs 8
Tackles , Saints 61 vs 56.
One Percenters Sydney 54 vs 38.
Turnovers Sydney 70, Saints 75.

Tom Hickey had the most contested possessions on the ground (15).

I think it was more what we did with it when we had with it.
Saints : did...stuff.
Swans : Kicked it to an uncontested mark inside the 50.

 

[MordySaint]

I'm an unashamed GT discipline, love the bloke and everything he stands for.

He is the type of leader you could go to war with... None of the current St Kilda leadership I would say that for.

When he was forced out of the club after another finals series under his belt, he looked after his family first and made sure that he could look after his wife and kids financially.

He then went on to create a successful online bank and sold his share.

The guy is a natural leader of men, a winner, a mentor and doesn't rely on the over complication of a simple game that is football.

Our club is constantly looking for quick fixes which is destroying the soul of the club.

GT said he has one last fight in him, I say we take on that fight with him.

 

[Joffaboy]

Not quite.

Butters sued Thomas for a $1m over a non club related personal loan that Butters made to Thomas when they were friends and before he was appointed coach.

Thomas sued the club for non payment of money of $200,00 related to us breaking his contract.

He won - which suggests he was right.

Yes Thomas's fundamentals related to what is in it for him.

 

[Joffaboy]

I'm an unashamed GT discipline, love the bloke and everything he stands for.

He is the type of leader you could go to war with... None of the current St Kilda leadership I would say that for.

When he was forced out of the club after another finals series under his belt, he looked after his family first and made sure that he could look after his wife and kids financially.

He then went on to create a successful online bank and sold his share.

The guy is a natural leader of men, a winner, a mentor and doesn't rely on the over complication of a simple game that is football.

Our club is constantly looking for quick fixes which is destroying the soul of the club.

GT said he has one last fight in him, I say we take on that fight with him.

The failed messiah complex. No wonder we will never win a flag with this attitude.

 

[MordySaint]

The failed messiah complex. No wonder we will never win a flag with this attitude.

Mate, what you saw in 09-10 was because of him.

Ross Lyin couldn't recruit a snowflake in a snow storm.

 

[MordySaint]

Holding Sydney
High Sydney
In the back Sydney
Want your utensil sucked Sydney?

Don't accept your attitude at all.

 

[gringo2011]

The failed messiah complex. No wonder we will never win a flag with this attitude.

Same could be said about bringing in s**t salary earners with no interest in the club. Neither works. At least his culture first stuff got us our best era in my life time. I was actually proud of the club after his legacy. We’ve wasted 10 years already. We need to start straightening up soon or another 10 will drift by.

 

[Joffaboy]

Mate, what you saw in 09-10 was because of him.

Ross Lyin couldn't recruit a snowflake in a snow storm.

He cost us flag in 04 and 05 because of his ego and the fact he didn't train the player correctly resulting in multiple and continual soft tissue injuries.

Took Lyon all of 07 to get the list match fit.

Lyon has made 3 GF's, Thomas couldn't even get us to a Grand Final.

Thomas had a huge bunch of top 5 picks. No brainer, Kosi and Roo, No brainer Goddard, Ball over Judd, yup well done GT.

Which other egotistical clown could we come in to destroy the place. He is nothing but a wrecker.

 

[Joffaboy]

Same could be said about bringing in s**t salary earners with no interest in the club. Neither works. At least his culture first stuff got us our best era in my life time. I was actually proud of the club after his legacy. We’ve wasted 10 years already. We need to start straightening up soon or another 10 will drift by.

you were proud of a legacy of no flags? OK. whatever floats your boat. I just saw failure. Now people want to bring it back.

Messiah complex, a weak minded club, a weak minded supporter base if they think Thomas will lead us to the promised land.

He talks about fundamentals? What about the fundamental of getting the team conditioned. Injuries because of his incompetence cost us a flag in 04 or 05.

Took a real coach a year to get the conditioning right, and then in 08-10 we looked like a football team. GT was a failure and a divisive character, no doubt a passionate Saints man, but he had his go and he blew it.

 

[MordySaint]

He cost us flag in 04 and 05 because of his ego and the fact he didn't train the player correctly resulting in multiple and continual soft tissue injuries.

Took Lyon all of 07 to get the list match fit.

Lyon has made 3 GF's, Thomas couldn't even get us to a Grand Final.

Thomas had a huge bunch of top 5 picks. No brainer, Kosi and Roo, No brainer Goddard, Ball over Judd, yup well done GT.

Which other egotistical clown could we come in to destroy the place. He is nothing but a wrecker.

Yep, lets rewrite history.

I highly doubt GT would have let Ball go for nothing. He also would have made him a star which he was capable of being.

Lyon actually started the destruction of the place after he walked out of the club leaving us all blindsided.

 

[Joffaboy]

Yep, lets rewrite history.

I highly doubt GT would have let Ball go for nothing. He also would have made him a star which he was capable of being.

Lyon actually started the destruction of the place after he walked out of the club leaving us all blindsided.

What part is re writing history?

The fact we took Ball over Judd?

The fact we had constant and to a team cohesiveness, debilitanting stream of soft tissue injuries that cost us even a chance at a GF let alone a flag?

And why your arguing Lyon? Don't want him back either, but at least he gave us a shot at a flag, Thomas cruelled the best list the Saints ever had and Lyon squeezed the pips at out a list four years older.

Thomas was a fraud and his incompetence because of his micro managing and ego destroyed any chance we had of a flag in his years.

He is done, he blew it, Lyon is done, he blew it. I want neither back, they had their go. Look forward not to the past of failures.

 

[stavro#4]

Yep, lets rewrite history.

I highly doubt GT would have let Ball go for nothing. He also would have made him a star which he was capable of being.

Lyon actually started the destruction of the place after he walked out of the club leaving us all blindsided.

I think the easiest metric to measure Thomas against is that if he wants better.

What is he doing to achieve better for the club right now? Easy to talk on Twitter and slag people.

His time as coach was exciting. But arguably he had the greatest ever list at stkilda in 04/05 and we won nothing. Didn’t even get into a grand final.

 

[jwikked]

you were proud of a legacy of no flags? OK. whatever floats your boat. I just saw failure. Now people want to bring it back.

Messiah complex, a weak minded club, a weak minded supporter base if they think Thomas will lead us to the promised land.

He talks about fundamentals? What about the fundamental of getting the team conditioned. Injuries because of his incompetence cost us a flag in 04 or 05.

Took a real coach a year to get the conditioning right, and then in 08-10 we looked like a football team. GT was a failure and a divisive character, no doubt a passionate Saints man, but he had his go and he blew it.

I’ll take a coach who makes prelims and creates a team that can win games over the coaches that have us finishing anywhere from 16th to 10th.

Football isn’t enjoyable when the team is floundering for years on years. It’s been a decade and nothing has changed. From 2000-2010 it was all because of Grant Thomas. Sure, we didn’t win a flag but his methods and the culture he created was the backbone of what many say is the best team to not win a flag. He created a team full of leaders.

Riewoldts been gone for how long, and we still don’t have any leaders.

What does the club stand for? It looks like the players still don’t care.

Msyve GT did wreck the club, but at least the fans had something to enjoy for a while. What have we got now? Getting excited over beating North Melbourne.

 

[MordySaint]

What part is re writing history?

The fact we took Ball over Judd?

The fact we had constant and to a team cohesiveness, debilitanting stream of soft tissue injuries that cost us even a chance at a GF let alone a flag?

And why your arguing Lyon? Don't want him back either, but at least he gave us a shot at a flag, Thomas cruelled the best list the Saints ever had and Lyon squeezed the pips at out a list four years older.

Thomas was a fraud and his incompetence because of his micro managing and ego destroyed any chance we had of a flag in his years.

He is done, he blew it, Lyon is done, he blew it. I want neither back, they had their go. Look forward not to the past of failures.

What I don't want is what we have now. A team and club of salary earners.

Jobs for mates, thats all I have seen the last 10 years.... never been a fan of Ratten and his Hawthorn crew. Anyone who thinks that you can win a game using an overpaid database guy and a team of psychologists is dreaming. God knows they have probably got the boys doing journals after every game and talking about their feelings.

You tell me anyone at the club who has a complete passion for our club (President accepted)

So he's on Twitter, you my friend are doing exactly the same thing to get your message across on BigFooty... the amount you post you are probably quite similar. Which is pretty cool, so respect due.

 

[stavro#4]

I’ll take a coach who makes prelims and creates a team that can win games over the coaches that have us finishing anywhere from 16th to 10th.

Football isn’t enjoyable when the team is floundering for years on years. It’s been a decade and nothing has changed. From 2000-2010 it was all because of Grant Thomas. Sure, we didn’t win a flag but his methods and the culture he created was the backbone of what many say is the best team to not win a flag. He created a team full of leaders.

Riewoldts been gone for how long, and we still don’t have any leaders.

What does the club stand for? It looks like the players still don’t care.

Msyve GT did wreck the club, but at least the fans had something to enjoy for a while. What have we got now? Getting excited over beating North Melbourne.

What I don't want is what we have now. A team and club of salary earners.

Jobs for mates, thats all I have seen the last 10 years.... never been a fan of Ratten and his Hawthorn crew. Anyone who thinks that you can win a game using an overpaid database guy and a team of psychologists is dreaming. God knows they have probably got the boys doing journals after every game and talking about their feelings.

You tell me anyone at the club who has a complete passion for our club (President accepted)

So he's on Twitter, you my friend are doing exactly the same thing to get your message across on BigFooty... the amount you post you are probably quite similar. Which is pretty cool, so respect due.

Joffa isn’t a stkilda figure head calling the club and it’s leading men out

He is a fan and a member. Voicing an opinion on a forum.

The best Thommo has done is nominate a dentist for a seat on the board. Doesn’t have the balls to step up himself.

He is completely irrelevant until he is willing to walk the walk and not just talk the talk.

jwikked the players care. There are leaders. I’m very confident of that

 

[pebblesofsand]

Yes Thomas's fundamentals related to what is in it for him.

And Butterss and the board had absolutely zero to do with the whole train wreck of the sacking of Thomas?

 

[Joffaboy]

What I don't want is what we have now. A team and club of salary earners.

Jobs for mates, thats all I have seen the last 10 years.... never been a fan of Ratten and his Hawthorn crew. Anyone who thinks that you can win a game using an overpaid database guy and a team of psychologists is dreaming. God knows they have probably got the boys doing journals after every game and talking about their feelings.

You tell me anyone at the club who has a complete passion for our club (President accepted)

So he's on Twitter, you my friend are doing exactly the same thing to get your message across on BigFooty... the amount you post you are probably quite similar. Which is pretty cool, so respect due.

Exactly my point, all GT now is a fan. He may as well be on Facebook pages spouting his stuff. And all power to him. Nobody ever said he is no a passionate Sainter.
I probably feel the same as him, but the difference between you and I is I don't want him anywhere near the club. He is unhealthy, we have enough problems.

Anyway agree to disagree. At least you and I agree that the current situation needs rectifying.