Review Round 1, 2023 - Port Adelaide vs. Brisbane Lions

[On the quiet]

Bwahaha Joey Montagna just said this is our one Muligan game for the season.

And, Montagna and King both showed footage of where our game plan lets us down, and individual players let us down. Highlighted the mids wanting to run forward and be accountable for their opponent, and our defenders playing isolated, one on one too often.

I saw that also and for once King was a little reserved.

The 1 v 1 can be effective, if we have an intercept marker and whilst Payne (only played 26 or 27 games and not all of them at fullback) is still learning, Harris also has to play 1 v 1 and therefore we have no one intercepting.

I believe Cam could possibly be our intercept marker for the next few weeks, and then we can reassess when/IF Gardiner returns with Payne and Gardiner 1 v 1 and Andrews doing what he is better at intercepting, and Cam spending minutes in the midfield and playing forward.

 

[Jivlain]

A look at a few of those centre stoppages from Q3.

First stoppage.
Oscar h/o to Dunkley but Dunkley is immediately surrounded. The closest players to Dunkley are all Port and noone is offering a vector for a handball out. Dunkley is tackled, well, preventing a handball, but he also has nowhere he could potentially get the ball out that would not be a turnover. Free against awarded.
Need: players to offer receives to Dunkley.
View attachment q3_s1.mp4

Second stoppage.
Contested hitout to space. Neale runs through, past the ball with Rozee in his back. Dunkley comes through and splits the contest, forces ball between McCluggage and McInerney. Clug gathers but is immediately tackled by Lycett, spilling the ball backwards. Coleman goes for it desperately but apart from him Port have pushed both up and back harder and Coleman is immediately surrounded and bumped off it.
Need: push harder to even numbers on the loose ball.
View attachment q3_s2.mp4

Third stoppage.
Lycett h/o to Drew's advantage. Bailey prevents Drew's possession but he taps forward to JHF, who fends off Neale.
This one is a hard one I think, the tap offers a solid advantage and it all steamrolls from there.

Fourth stoppage.
Lycett h/o to advantage. Ball lands between Drew, Wines, Lycett and Neale. Ashcroft is behind Drew & Lycett. Wines gathers, Ashcroft and Neale are both drawn into the Wines tackle who nonetheless has his hands extremely free and hands off to Drew. Bailey leaves his opponent to pressure Drew, but suddenly that leaves three Port players unopposed forward of the ball. Drew handballs over the top to Lycett who is free to handball to JHF.
Need: someone opposed to Wines with the physical strength to prevent a handball.
View attachment q3_s4.mp4

Fifth stoppage.
Lycett taps to space. Clug is first to it despite two Port players on his heels, knocks it to Ashcroft who gets a boot to it. Robertson does well chasing, interrupting his man (Duursma) and follows through to tackle Lycett. However, Houston has pushed up harder and gotten off his opponent. He's able to take the handball from Lycett and deliver to Rioli in space.
Need: as a forward, be prepared to match your defender imposing themselves on the contest.

A lot of it is working for each other. In the first, we need players ready to support each other. If players are hanging back in the assumption that Dunkley and Coleman can magically get it through a ring of opponents without actually having a vector out, or that their opponent introducing themselves into a contest isn't actually going to upset the numbers, that's a bit of an issue.

 

[nup]

I have cancelled my kayo and I go for collingwood now

 

[Kickit2brown]

A look at a few of those centre stoppages from Q3.

First stoppage.
Oscar h/o to Dunkley but Dunkley is immediately surrounded. The closest players to Dunkley are all Port and noone is offering a vector for a handball out. Dunkley is tackled, well, preventing a handball, but he also has nowhere he could potentially get the ball out that would not be a turnover. Free against awarded.
Need: players to offer receives to Dunkley.
View attachment 1634327

Second stoppage.
Contested hitout to space. Neale runs through, past the ball with Rozee in his back. Dunkley comes through and splits the contest, forces ball between McCluggage and McInerney. Clug gathers but is immediately tackled by Lycett, spilling the ball backwards. Coleman goes for it desperately but apart from him Port have pushed both up and back harder and Coleman is immediately surrounded and bumped off it.
Need: push harder to even numbers on the loose ball.
View attachment 1634328

Third stoppage.
Lycett h/o to Drew's advantage. Bailey prevents Drew's possession but he taps forward to JHF, who fends off Neale.
This one is a hard one I think, the tap offers a solid advantage and it all steamrolls from there.

Fourth stoppage.
Lycett h/o to advantage. Ball lands between Drew, Wines, Lycett and Neale. Ashcroft is behind Drew & Lycett. Wines gathers, Ashcroft and Neale are both drawn into the Wines tackle who nonetheless has his hands extremely free and hands off to Drew. Bailey leaves his opponent to pressure Drew, but suddenly that leaves three Port players unopposed forward of the ball. Drew handballs over the top to Lycett who is free to handball to JHF.
Need: someone opposed to Wines with the physical strength to prevent a handball.
View attachment 1634329

Fifth stoppage.
Lycett taps to space. Clug is first to it despite two Port players on his heels, knocks it to Ashcroft who gets a boot to it. Robertson does well chasing, interrupting his man (Duursma) and follows through to tackle Lycett. However, Houston has pushed up harder and gotten off his opponent. He's able to take the handball from Lycett and deliver to Rioli in space.
Need: as a forward, be prepared to match your defender imposing themselves on the contest.

A lot of it is working for each other. In the first, we need players ready to support each other. If players are hanging back in the assumption that Dunkley and Coleman can magically get it through a ring of opponents without actually having a vector out, or that their opponent introducing themselves into a contest isn't actually going to upset the numbers, that's a bit of an issue.

Great analysis.

A lot of things going wrong but number 4 is the one that gets me when we are playing bad. It's like every player gets sucked into the tackle and leaves the obvious handball receiver open. Happens so many times.

 

[Grasshopper17]

Bwahaha Joey Montagna just said this is our one Muligan game for the season.

And, Montagna and King both showed footage of where our game plan lets us down, and individual players let us down. Highlighted the mids wanting to run forward and be accountable for their opponent, and our defenders playing isolated, one on one too often.

But this is exactly it! The way we PLAYED was in a manner that DEMANDS we win one on one contests, whether that's in the air or on the ground. But our body types no longer suit that physical style of game. Didn't matter whether it was a second year midfielder manhandling blokes 5-10 years older than him, or Dixon destroying Andrews (after spending basically 4 years at the bottom of his pocket).

But noooo let's work on improving our run instead.



So it's either all the coaches deciding "let's physically condition our players to play a very team-oriented style of game which couples on-ball pressure with hard tracking back inside defensive 50 to maintain a strong zone presence", and then saying "you know what, everyone just play on your man, simples". OR the game plan has been put in place and soundly practiced all summer, and the players are simply not capable of or are choosing not to follow it in the heat of the moment.

The second one seems far more obvious but with the heat some of our coaches cop on this forum, perhaps it's hard to know. It all looked pretty simple against Geelong at Springfield... Did Port go to town on that tape and completely work it out after a single game? Or is it actually too complicated and the players literally are confused? Or is the plan physically impossible to put into practice?

I don't have these answers... Just trying to put in place sort of a framework for what happened beyond simply "there was insufficient effort".

 

[Gadzorks]

So basically it’s just the same old Brisbane from the past 2-3 years under Fages.

Pretty much, when the going gets tough - all the players just turn into witches hats

Not sure it's on Fagan cause the players are responsible for their attitude on field but yes, they do turn into witches hats periodically.

That's where our on field leaders need to stand up.

Off field calm, considered personalities are probably perfect but on field leaders need the white haze to descend once the siren goes.

zorko had it, lachie doesn't.

 

[Tom14]

Not sure it's on Fagan cause the players are responsible for their attitude on field but yes, they do turn into witches hats periodically.

That's where our on field leaders need to stand up.

Off field calm, considered personalities are probably perfect but on field leaders need the white haze to descend once the siren goes.

zorko had it, lachie doesn't.

I’m sorry but Zorks would regularly lose his cool totally in games and make things worse. The game v st kilda at marvel last year is a case in point even ignoring the petty situation.

 

[Gadzorks]

I’m sorry but Zorks would regularly lose his cool totally in games and make things worse. The game v st kilda at marvel last year is a case in point even ignoring the petty situation.

Absolutely he'd go to fast. But I'd rather someone who drags the team with him and crossed the line occasionally than someone who has unbelievable skills but can't galvanise the team.

 

[Grasshopper17]

A look at a few of those centre stoppages from Q3.

First stoppage.
Oscar h/o to Dunkley but Dunkley is immediately surrounded. The closest players to Dunkley are all Port and noone is offering a vector for a handball out. Dunkley is tackled, well, preventing a handball, but he also has nowhere he could potentially get the ball out that would not be a turnover. Free against awarded.
Need: players to offer receives to Dunkley.
View attachment 1634327

Second stoppage.
Contested hitout to space. Neale runs through, past the ball with Rozee in his back. Dunkley comes through and splits the contest, forces ball between McCluggage and McInerney. Clug gathers but is immediately tackled by Lycett, spilling the ball backwards. Coleman goes for it desperately but apart from him Port have pushed both up and back harder and Coleman is immediately surrounded and bumped off it.
Need: push harder to even numbers on the loose ball.
View attachment 1634328

Third stoppage.
Lycett h/o to Drew's advantage. Bailey prevents Drew's possession but he taps forward to JHF, who fends off Neale.
This one is a hard one I think, the tap offers a solid advantage and it all steamrolls from there.

Fourth stoppage.
Lycett h/o to advantage. Ball lands between Drew, Wines, Lycett and Neale. Ashcroft is behind Drew & Lycett. Wines gathers, Ashcroft and Neale are both drawn into the Wines tackle who nonetheless has his hands extremely free and hands off to Drew. Bailey leaves his opponent to pressure Drew, but suddenly that leaves three Port players unopposed forward of the ball. Drew handballs over the top to Lycett who is free to handball to JHF.
Need: someone opposed to Wines with the physical strength to prevent a handball.
View attachment 1634329

Fifth stoppage.
Lycett taps to space. Clug is first to it despite two Port players on his heels, knocks it to Ashcroft who gets a boot to it. Robertson does well chasing, interrupting his man (Duursma) and follows through to tackle Lycett. However, Houston has pushed up harder and gotten off his opponent. He's able to take the handball from Lycett and deliver to Rioli in space.
Need: as a forward, be prepared to match your defender imposing themselves on the contest.

A lot of it is working for each other. In the first, we need players ready to support each other. If players are hanging back in the assumption that Dunkley and Coleman can magically get it through a ring of opponents without actually having a vector out, or that their opponent introducing themselves into a contest isn't actually going to upset the numbers, that's a bit of an issue.

Thanks for the analysis and those clips. Means we don't have to watch what came after them.

I know I'm banging on about this but it just seems so obvious to me. I'm no expert on midfield setups (I feel much more comfortable talking about forward line setups as I was never allowed into a centre square when I played ) but to me:

Stoppage #1: Dunkley lacked the strength to either break the tackle or at least get his arms free

Stoppage #2: Coleman just gets bulldozed out of the way by a bigger (and perhaps more desperate) body.

Stoppage #3: Horne-Francis fends off Neale. A 19 year old on a 29 year old. And our captain no less. That will do me.

Stoppage #4: I mean this has happened over and over again the last couple of years. This one looks just like the Essendon and Melbourne games last year at the Gabba. Everyone getting drawn to the ball, forgetting all about their man and leaving acres of space over the top. But to actually analyse it, it's players making the decision to leave their man to support their team mate making the tackle. Sounds really nice and really helpful of them right? OR perhaps more accurately, it sounds like something you'd do if you lack faith in your team mate to stick the tackle.

Stoppage #5: Without seeing the footage it reads like a work rate issue rather than a physical conditioning issue. I take the L on this one But also if you are having to chase over and over again as a result of the first 4 stoppages above, that wears you out much faster than if you had the ball in those first 4 stoppages.

But there we are. 4 (at least) out of the 5 stoppages Jivlain presents here are a direct consequence of what I describe as "men against boys". Size matters. Still.

 

[PattyKwasagun]

Absolutely he'd go to fast. But I'd rather someone who drags the team with him and crossed the line occasionally than someone who has unbelievable skills but can't galvanise the team.

I think that's very revisionist. Lachie has galvanised the team plenty more times than Zork has in recent years. Lachie's goal from 50 on the half time siren in the Tigers final of 2020 is one great example. His tackle on Shai Bolton in the dying seconds of the Richmond final last year is another. Can't remember the last time Zorko had a moment like that.

I think if Zorko was out there yesterday, exactly the same result happens and nobody would have rose-tinted glasses about how he could have been the difference.

 

[Jivlain]

Thanks for the analysis and those clips. Means we don't have to watch what came after them.

I know I'm banging on about this but it just seems so obvious to me. I'm no expert on midfield setups (I feel much more comfortable talking about forward line setups as I was never allowed into a centre square when I played ) but to me:

Stoppage #1: Dunkley lacked the strength to either break the tackle or at least get his arms free

Stoppage #2: Coleman just gets bulldozed out of the way by a bigger (and perhaps more desperate) body.

Stoppage #3: Horne-Francis fends off Neale. A 19 year old on a 29 year old. And our captain no less. That will do me.

Stoppage #4: I mean this has happened over and over again the last couple of years. This one looks just like the Essendon and Melbourne games last year at the Gabba. Everyone getting drawn to the ball, forgetting all about their man and leaving acres of space over the top. But to actually analyse it, it's players making the decision to leave their man to support their team mate making the tackle. Sounds really nice and really helpful of them right? OR perhaps more accurately, it sounds like something you'd do if you lack faith in your team mate to stick the tackle.

Stoppage #5: Without seeing the footage it reads like a work rate issue rather than a physical conditioning issue. I take the L on this one But also if you are having to chase over and over again as a result of the first 4 stoppages above, that wears you out much faster than if you had the ball in those first 4 stoppages.

But there we are. 4 (at least) out of the 5 stoppages Jivlain presents here are a direct consequence of what I describe as "men against boys". Size matters. Still.

One thing I would observe is how involved Lycett keeps being after making the h/os, as a tackler and a receiver, and using his body size to impact the contest. He tackles Dunkley in #1, tackles Clug in #2, is the receiver in #4, gathers the ball in #5 and manages to get the ball away (and Robertson's technique tackling him was actually pretty good, he just barely got the handball away before Dev wrapped his arms). Plus the decisive advantage in #3.

Pretty devastating few minutes from Lycett there tbqh.

 

[mpal6]

One thing I would observe is how involved Lycett keeps being after making the h/os, as a tackler and a receiver, and using his body size to impact the contest. He tackles Dunkley in #1, tackles Clug in #2, is the receiver in #4, gathers the ball in #5 and manages to get the ball away (and Robertson's technique tackling him was actually pretty good, he just barely got the handball away before Dev wrapped his arms). Plus the decisive advantage in #3.

Pretty devastating few minutes from Lycett there tbqh.

yep, this has been a shortcoming of Oscar even last season. The games where he's chasing footy, gets involved with the pack on the ground, thumps the ball out of center bounce wherever he desires, is when he plays his best. If he's instructed to just tap down to his feet and let the mids do their thing - he'll just stand around not knowing what to do next and that won't be good for him.

 

[mpal6]

Thanks for the analysis and those clips. Means we don't have to watch what came after them.

I know I'm banging on about this but it just seems so obvious to me. I'm no expert on midfield setups (I feel much more comfortable talking about forward line setups as I was never allowed into a centre square when I played ) but to me:

Stoppage #1: Dunkley lacked the strength to either break the tackle or at least get his arms free

Stoppage #2: Coleman just gets bulldozed out of the way by a bigger (and perhaps more desperate) body.

Stoppage #3: Horne-Francis fends off Neale. A 19 year old on a 29 year old. And our captain no less. That will do me.

Stoppage #4: I mean this has happened over and over again the last couple of years. This one looks just like the Essendon and Melbourne games last year at the Gabba. Everyone getting drawn to the ball, forgetting all about their man and leaving acres of space over the top. But to actually analyse it, it's players making the decision to leave their man to support their team mate making the tackle. Sounds really nice and really helpful of them right? OR perhaps more accurately, it sounds like something you'd do if you lack faith in your team mate to stick the tackle.

Stoppage #5: Without seeing the footage it reads like a work rate issue rather than a physical conditioning issue. I take the L on this one But also if you are having to chase over and over again as a result of the first 4 stoppages above, that wears you out much faster than if you had the ball in those first 4 stoppages.

But there we are. 4 (at least) out of the 5 stoppages Jivlain presents here are a direct consequence of what I describe as "men against boys". Size matters. Still.

Stoppage 3 gave another interesting view - Neale got fend off but you'll see Rich at the corner of screen unsure whether to come forward and stop JHF or pedal back. In the end, he'll be in no man's land and end up running side by side with Horne Francis and waiting for him to kick the ball into F50. We clearly panicked across the board and never got out of it which is a shame.

 

[Bucking Beads]

Monday morning and I'm still not over how poorly we played. Across the board it was disgusting. The players weren't ready to work and the coaches were once again left for dead. Being out coached and out worked is all some of things we can control as a footy club. Sure if we get some bad luck or bulk injuries but none of those things have been an issue for us over the past 4 years that is for sure.

If one of Hipwood and Daniher doesn't stand up and kick 60 goals this year we will once again be making up the numbers.

 

[M Malice]

A look at a few of those centre stoppages from Q3.

First stoppage.
Oscar h/o to Dunkley but Dunkley is immediately surrounded. The closest players to Dunkley are all Port and noone is offering a vector for a handball out. Dunkley is tackled, well, preventing a handball, but he also has nowhere he could potentially get the ball out that would not be a turnover. Free against awarded.
Need: players to offer receives to Dunkley.
View attachment 1634327

Second stoppage.
Contested hitout to space. Neale runs through, past the ball with Rozee in his back. Dunkley comes through and splits the contest, forces ball between McCluggage and McInerney. Clug gathers but is immediately tackled by Lycett, spilling the ball backwards. Coleman goes for it desperately but apart from him Port have pushed both up and back harder and Coleman is immediately surrounded and bumped off it.
Need: push harder to even numbers on the loose ball.
View attachment 1634328

Third stoppage.
Lycett h/o to Drew's advantage. Bailey prevents Drew's possession but he taps forward to JHF, who fends off Neale.
This one is a hard one I think, the tap offers a solid advantage and it all steamrolls from there.

Fourth stoppage.
Lycett h/o to advantage. Ball lands between Drew, Wines, Lycett and Neale. Ashcroft is behind Drew & Lycett. Wines gathers, Ashcroft and Neale are both drawn into the Wines tackle who nonetheless has his hands extremely free and hands off to Drew. Bailey leaves his opponent to pressure Drew, but suddenly that leaves three Port players unopposed forward of the ball. Drew handballs over the top to Lycett who is free to handball to JHF.
Need: someone opposed to Wines with the physical strength to prevent a handball.
View attachment 1634329

Fifth stoppage.
Lycett taps to space. Clug is first to it despite two Port players on his heels, knocks it to Ashcroft who gets a boot to it. Robertson does well chasing, interrupting his man (Duursma) and follows through to tackle Lycett. However, Houston has pushed up harder and gotten off his opponent. He's able to take the handball from Lycett and deliver to Rioli in space.
Need: as a forward, be prepared to match your defender imposing themselves on the contest.

A lot of it is working for each other. In the first, we need players ready to support each other. If players are hanging back in the assumption that Dunkley and Coleman can magically get it through a ring of opponents without actually having a vector out, or that their opponent introducing themselves into a contest isn't actually going to upset the numbers, that's a bit of an issue.

Send that to the club before the review please Jiv... Mighty Lions ?

 

[Nunez]

It will 100% happen again.

Well obviously they will lose again and some losses will be worse than others, but this was a historically bad loss for us. I don't expect a loss of this magnitude will happen again this year.

 

[mpal6]

Well obviously they will lose again and some losses will be worse than others, but this was a historically bad loss for us. I don't expect a loss of this magnitude will happen again this year.

yep its usually we go to sleep for a quarter and then we flick the switch on. Umpires kept us close in the first 2 quarters and we went to deep sleep in 3rd + 4th. This was not a bad quarter but a whole bad game. That hasn't happened to us in a while.

 

[FeastOrFamine]

Well obviously they will lose again and some losses will be worse than others, but this was a historically bad loss for us. I don't expect a loss of this magnitude will happen again this year.

I can accept the loss if the effort is there but we're simply out-played by a better team, but it's losses like that where we get destroyed due to a lack of work rate that makes me pull my hair out. Really makes me question the mettle of this group when we continually lose in the same manner. We can see the problem so why can't we fix it?

 

[M Malice]

I can accept the loss if the effort is there but we're simply out-played by a better team, but it's losses like that where we get destroyed due to a lack of work rate that makes me pull my hair out. Really makes me question the mettle of this group when we continually lose in the same manner. We can see the problem so why can't we fix it?

Lachie's interview in the sheds after the game is worth a look, was very down and he highlighted the lack of intensity. If we don't come out breathing fire on Friday night I will be flabbergasted.

 

[FeastOrFamine]

Lachie's interview in the sheds after the game is worth a look, was very down and he highlighted the lack of intensity. If we don't come out breathing fire on Friday night I will be flabbergasted.

Just watched that interview this morning. Him highlighting the lack of intensity was surprising. We really didn't prepare well for that game at all

 

[Gadzorks]

I think that's very revisionist. Lachie has galvanised the team plenty more times than Zork has in recent years. Lachie's goal from 50 on the half time siren in the Tigers final of 2020 is one great example. His tackle on Shai Bolton in the dying seconds of the Richmond final last year is another. Can't remember the last time Zorko had a moment like that.

I think if Zorko was out there yesterday, exactly the same result happens and nobody would have rose-tinted glasses about how he could have been the difference.

The game isn't the reason in not a fan of Lachie as captain.

I'm a fan of the heart on the sleeve, go down with the ship type leaders who put others before their own success. They can be tricky and sometimes cross the decorum line and be too much 'one of the boys', but I think they bring an inclusive energy and belief that lifts teams above their combined skill level.

Lachie is a driven perfectionist who set personal goals and shows team mates how to get the best out of themselves by example. Definately a leader of the quiet, determined type.

Just don't think he has the lifting energy that ignites and fires up the group belief that this team needs.

 

[M Malice]

There will never be another Michael Voss when it comes to inspirational on field leaders. #vossgoatleader

 

[briztoon]

I'm not sold on O to be honest- really good honest toiler he is, but I think we need a ruckman like Stef Martin was that could make that second and third contest like a lot of modern day ruckman. O is a second ruckman and in my eyes, Fort more resembles Stef, just a much better kick than Stef. A combo of those would be great.

Unless a good player leaves and we get some trade currency, I think there is quite a bit we need - a better ruck, another KPD (Adams should retire for his LT wellbeing and Darcy is to injured prone), a wingman and could always do with gun mids - i guess all clubs need it tho but that would be my shopping list.

I believe we have the wings we need. It’s just that the coaches see McCluggage playing in the centre square, and we only just drafted Fletcher and he’s coming back from a back injury.

 

[thedigger]

Remember 2001,got belting from Carlton,never got beaten sgain and then won the flag.
I thought they played like a side that was flat.

 

[Tom14]

I believe we have the wings we need. It’s just that the coaches see McCluggage playing in the centre square, and we only just drafted Fletcher and he’s coming back from a back injury.

Clug had a stinker on Saturday but I'm not having this idea that he isn't good in the middle (know that isn't necessarily your point - my understanding of your thinking is that he's a better wing than our other options). Frankly we can't afford for him to play wing given the lack of depth in the middle, and if he's not the first receiver in close we don't have an inside mid that regularly hits a target.