Society/Culture The Manosphere - Andrew Tate, the PUA grift, and other such nasties.

[peetoo]

The adverts seem to imply if parents take their sons in hand, educate, discipline them, they won’t turn out criminally violent to family members.
Leave so many questions Un answered

Are people to assume every male child will become a violent partner unless ‘reconditioned’ , and go to work on them?

Go to work on them how? Bully them, react violently? Use shaming tactics?

You may think I’m projecting but the shallowness of all those adverts seems to allow that.

 

[Chief]

The adverts seem to imply if parents take their sons in hand, educate, discipline them, they won’t turn out criminally violent to family members.
Leave so many questions Un answered

Are people to assume every male child will become a violent partner unless ‘reconditioned’ , and go to work on them?

Go to work on them how? Bully them, react violently? Use shaming tactics?

You may think I’m projecting but the shallowness of all those adverts seems to allow that.

Perhaps just model good behaviour and respect for the people in their life.

 

[phantom13]

The adverts seem to imply if parents take their sons in hand, educate, discipline them, they won’t turn out criminally violent to family members.
Leave so many questions Un answered

Are people to assume every male child will become a violent partner unless ‘reconditioned’ , and go to work on them?

Go to work on them how? Bully them, react violently? Use shaming tactics?

You may think I’m projecting but the shallowness of all those adverts seems to allow that.

I think in a 30 second ad (or a poster) you need a simple message.

Be a good parent is doable.

What youre asking for absolutely is not.

And i get it, there is a nuance to the message and outcome that requires ALOT of discussion but i take the ads to be a convo starter, not an all encompassing answer.

 

[cartwright]

I wouldn’t even have posted it if not badgered by gralin.

I’m saying a lot of advertising in the ‘toxic masculinity’ space is laughably shallow. I’m not saying toxic masculinity isn’t a problem. That advert was the worst of a poor bunch.

Ok..
yeah that advert was particularly bad

What would you prefer to see?

 

[peetoo]

Ok..
yeah that advert was particularly bad

What would you prefer to see?

???? For mine Daisy Turnbull nailed it. That was my point. I thought I was clear.

 

[Engimal v3]

Are people to assume every male child will become a violent partner unless ‘reconditioned’ , and go to work on them?

Go to work on them how? Bully them, react violently? Use shaming tactics?

Yes

 

[peetoo]

Yes

That’s abuse too

 

[Ghost Patrol]

That’s abuse too

So you're saying that men abuse men as well?

It's almost like, men are the problem.

 

[peetoo]

So you're saying that men abuse men as well?

It's almost like, men are the problem.

I didn’t specify males. There’s non violent abuse by all parents

 

[Engimal v3]

That’s abuse too

Good

 

[Blue1980]

Or maybe recognise that toxic behaviours exist whatever the gender and have programs reflecting this. Maybe thats too much to ask.

They do, but toxic masculinity results in murder/rape etc

I’m not sure there is toxic femininity per se in the same way, there are an equal amount of shit people who are male and female though. Due to physical strength differences though (in most cases) females use different tactics and forms of abuse to men.

 

[Blue1980]

Also let's be honest, this sort of money for a program is about enough to hit the news but that's it.

It's not going to do s**t to combat the problem

View attachment 1842206

3.5 million is peanuts really, when you think of it spread over all of Australia.

I’m happy something is being done, what is your suggestion? Nihilism that everyone and everything is terrible so why bother?

 

[Gralin]

3.5 million is peanuts really, when you think of it spread over all of Australia.

I’m happy something is being done, what is your suggestion? Nihilism that everyone and everything is terrible so why bother?

no, my point was that its the kind of announcement that is made to say see we're doing something

but they're not

its a pressure release valve move at best, its not going to achieve anything because its not designed to achieve anything

 

[Blue1980]

The adverts seem to imply if parents take their sons in hand, educate, discipline them, they won’t turn out criminally violent to family members.
Leave so many questions Un answered

Are people to assume every male child will become a violent partner unless ‘reconditioned’ , and go to work on them?

Go to work on them how? Bully them, react violently? Use shaming tactics?

You may think I’m projecting but the shallowness of all those adverts seems to allow that.

I don’t think anyone assumes all male children will be violent, the vast majority past and present of course won’t be.

I haven’t seen the ads, but yes if they do come across as preachy it may not have the desired effect.

I think the overall message to be it isn’t a zero sum game. It’s like men’s rights activists or people against thinking there is toxic masculinity (not saying you fit these categories), feel attacked personally by this stuff.

I don’t at all, I accept there has been undercurrents and things in society which have led males to do violent things, via a combination of neglect, unable to process emotions, social pressures, entitlement, broken homes etc.

 

[Gralin]

I don’t think anyone assumes all male children will be violent, the vast majority past and present of course won’t be.

I haven’t seen the ads, but yes if they do come across as preachy it may not have the desired effect.

I think the overall message to be it isn’t a zero sum game. It’s like men’s rights activists or people against thinking there is toxic masculinity (not saying you fit these categories), feel attacked personally by this stuff.

I don’t at all, I accept there has been undercurrents and things in society which have led males to do violent things, via a combination of neglect, unable to process emotions, social pressures, entitlement, broken homes etc.

Statistically someone you know will have been a victim of sexual assault, statistically someone you know will be a perpetrator

more people know the victims in their circles than the perpetrators but they're both there

and while the perps aren't always guys, the vast majority of them are, and the themes that come up over and over again, the patterns are largely the same

they point to wider issues in our society and yet currently something like 25% of males between 16-25 think women's equality has gone to far and that they are the real victims, and in part its because scum like Tate tell them

there is an entire machine dedicated to maintaining the status quo and pushing back against change that might reduce power imbalances or get rid of unfair advantages

they call it culture wars but its oppression in action and people fighting to maintain their power bases

the government isn't really interested in combating that so they're never going to put the resources in without pressure that are needed

$3.5m for a program and look at the push back when its not actually going to do anything to fix the problems, imagine the push back against real change

 

[peetoo]

I don’t count myself in the ‘push back’ group. I want these programs t be effective

Adverts about sex avoiding using the word? Do we want youngsters to communicate better with each other or not?


Also the attitudes prevail among lots of people that in a partnership, the females prefer to ‘marry up’ as well as similar male attitudes. You tend to end up with two dissapointed groups, successful financial females and unsuccessful unfinancial males.

Not saying it’s right, but the imbalance is still there

 

[FireKrakouer]

Due to physical strength differences though (in most cases) females use different tactics and forms of abuse to men.

Indeed

 

[Blue1980]

Indeed

View attachment 1849361

Do we have multiple deaths/hospitalisations a week due to women killing men via mushroom poisoning?

There are shit people everywhere, in both sexes.

 

[Chief]

Indeed

Was that domestic abuse?

 

[FireKrakouer]

Was that domestic abuse?

Depends on your definition, I would think the 3? times she's alleged to have poisoned her ex husband may count. I wasn't trying to make a point either way, other than to offer an obvious recent example of Blue1980's point about females tending to use different tactics to men.

 

[ferball]

Depends on your definition, I would think the 3? times she's alleged to have poisoned her ex husband may count. I wasn't trying to make a point either way, other than to offer an obvious recent example of Blue1980's point about females tending to use different tactics to men.

Shee's a massive outlier.

The reason we all know about her is because what she did is unusual and attention grabbing. Most abuse by men is so common its not reported or shocking when it is reported.

 

[the_interloper]

Came across this one on YT last week. Her thing to get attention is saying women shouldn't be allowed to vote, sells tshirts with this on it evidently.

Slightly different given it's a woman (maybe she gets away with misogyny a bit more) but her messages appear to be similar to Tate etc. Unfortunately given it's a woman more blokes may really take heed of her "wisdom", in short she seems to be targeting incels, divorced blokes etc

 

[bourbons]

Came across this one on YT last week. Her thing to get attention is saying women shouldn't be allowed to vote, sells tshirts with this on it evidently.

Slightly different given it's a woman (maybe she gets away with misogyny a bit more) but her messages appear to be similar to Tate etc. Unfortunately given it's a woman more blokes may really take heed of her "wisdom", in short she seems to be targeting incels, divorced blokes etc

She's been called the female Andrew Tate from memory.

One of the most melted brains you will ever see.

 

[phantom13]

Came across this one on YT last week. Her thing to get attention is saying women shouldn't be allowed to vote, sells tshirts with this on it evidently.

Slightly different given it's a woman (maybe she gets away with misogyny a bit more) but her messages appear to be similar to Tate etc. Unfortunately given it's a woman more blokes may really take heed of her "wisdom", in short she seems to be targeting incels, divorced blokes etc

Case study in confirmation bias "heres a bunch of shit i value more than other shit that supports my contention".

She even dismisses Nurses and Teaching (predominantly female industries) because youll still get food and water (not sure how those engineers are gonna do the infrastucture jobs without an education but okay).

She's been called the female Andrew Tate from memory.

One of the most melted brains you will ever see.

Didnt she get ****ing owned in some interview as well?

 

[faible]

Came across this one on YT last week. Her thing to get attention is saying women shouldn't be allowed to vote, sells tshirts with this on it evidently.

Slightly different given it's a woman (maybe she gets away with misogyny a bit more) but her messages appear to be similar to Tate etc. Unfortunately given it's a woman more blokes may really take heed of her "wisdom", in short she seems to be targeting incels, divorced blokes etc

Easy to cash in on the Tate market as a woman.