List Mgmt. 2025 List Management discussion

[Joffaboy]

But they get to keep the best ones. C'mon, Joff, you and I both know this can't endure.

I understand the game development aspect of the northern academies, which is why I would tolerate one selection outside the draft per season. Everyone else just goes into the draft.

But it will endure. The AFL will point to crowd numbers ( manipulated FIXture) ratings and membership numbers to say the competition is in rude good health.

They don't care about the legacy members and supporters from the sandbelt. They would rather Saints, North and Bulldogs fold or relocate. They don't give a fig about tradition or 'romance' unless otherwise suits their goals like FS.

 

[Joffaboy]

Will be interesting how the suns fit rowell, anderson, touk, rogers, humphrey, graham, long, ainsworth, lombard, uwland, patterson, addinsall all into the team as medium sized attacking/midfield players

Thought you were going to say under the SC, but we know players up there get 'ambassador' money outside the cap.

 

[thekizzler]

Losing Nas basically says the lad wants to return to his home state and play footy in front of his family.

I don’t believe it signals anything else.

This is 100% spot on.

The only good thing about NAS leaving will be watching some of our irrational supporters melt over non-existent issues.

Where melting is lifestyle and not a choice

 

[Joffaboy]

This is 100% spot on.

The only good thing about NAS leaving will be watching some of our irrational supporters melt over non-existent issues.

Where melting is lifestyle and not a choice

So they don't have TV'S in Adelaide? Playing in front of his family is such bs. Every one of these ' I want to go home' players wouldn't think twice about it if they were offered half of what they currently get on their contract.
It will be a monumental failure of the club not to resign NAZ for a whole number of reasons, not the least their loudly trumpeted ' we want to be the best club for indigenous players' initiative. Fancy publishing that and losing the best indigenous player at the club since Nicky Winmar?
Can sugar coat it with as much copium you like, but to lose him will be an unmitigated disaster.
A required player in Battle lost and an even more required player in NAZ lost in consecutive off seasons just cannot be blithely explained away as ' oh you know, homesick'

 

[Dard Ball Get]

At what point do we seriously consider dropping Jack Steele?

There'd be less fuss about it if he wasn't captain.

When Combover Clark is available

 

[Joffaboy]

When Combover Clark is available

Shut up Dard, he wear a headband to keep the flowing locks back when he is streaming out of the centre square, don't you know?

 

[Diehard Saint]

Shut up Dard, he wear a headband to keep the flowing locks back when he is streaming out of the centre square, don't you know?

Well it’s good enough for all those Cats players….

Oh, and the Richmond dude, forgot his name, who doesn’t even have hair at all

 

[thekizzler]

So they don't have TV'S in Adelaide? Playing in front of his family is such bs. Every one of these ' I want to go home' players wouldn't think twice about it if they were offered half of what they currently get on their contract.
It will be a monumental failure of the club not to resign NAZ for a whole number of reasons, not the least their loudly trumpeted ' we want to be the best club for indigenous players' initiative. Fancy publishing that and losing the best indigenous player at the club since Nicky Winmar?
Can sugar coat it with as much copium you like, but to lose him will be an unmitigated disaster.
A required player in Battle lost and an even more required player in NAZ lost in consecutive off seasons just cannot be blithely explained away as ' oh you know, homesick'

I see where you are coming from. I think in some cases, it's a load of shit. Players looking to get to better clubs but use home and family as an excuse.

It's different with the indigenous lads. Family is different and more connected than others. I'm talking stereotypically. Not always the case. But I'm sure you get me.

In the particular case of NWM, the club have done everything right in my eyes. He has a great contract in front of him. They have supported him. They have put no pressure on him. Ross even said that he could meet with the Adelaide clubs if he chose. Which he didn't do mind you. At least publicly.

The club has also developed him superbly. Trusted him as a key distributor. Eased him in via half back and are now setting him loose in a more attacking fashion to devastating effect.

I can't see one mistake made by the club in regards to NWM. Battle is a completely different story. Plenty of mistakes. But to be fair to the club, they have acknowledged quite a few of them publicly.

If NWM wants to play at a club closer to his family, I'm not sure what else the Saints can do. This is not an excuse but a reality of the situation.

This is not to say the Saints haven't cooked things in the past but for me, my original post stands on NWM. Melters will always melt.

 

[gubby88]

I see where you are coming from. I think in some cases, it's a load of shit. Players looking to get to better clubs but use home and family as an excuse.

It's different with the indigenous lads. Family is different and more connected than others. I'm talking stereotypically. Not always the case. But I'm sure you get me.

In the particular case of NWM, the club have done everything right in my eyes. He has a great contract in front of him. They have supported him. They have put no pressure on him. Ross even said that he could meet with the Adelaide clubs if he chose. Which he didn't do mind you. At least publicly.

The club has also developed him superbly. Trusted him as a key distributor. Eased him in via half back and are now setting him loose in a more attacking fashion to devastating effect.

I can't see one mistake made by the club in regards to NWM. Battle is a completely different story. Plenty of mistakes. But to be fair to the club, they have acknowledged quite a few of them publicly.

If NWM wants to play at a club closer to his family, I'm not sure what else the Saints can do. This is not an excuse but a reality of the situation.

This is not to say the Saints haven't cooked things in the past but for me, my original post stands on NWM. Melters will always melt.

yeah cant exactly force the family to move to Victoria.....this country did that quite a few years ago with aboriginal families, kind of frowned upon these days

 

[Joffaboy]

I see where you are coming from. I think in some cases, it's a load of shit. Players looking to get to better clubs but use home and family as an excuse.

It's different with the indigenous lads. Family is different and more connected than others. I'm talking stereotypically. Not always the case. But I'm sure you get me.

In the particular case of NWM, the club have done everything right in my eyes. He has a great contract in front of him. They have supported him. They have put no pressure on him. Ross even said that he could meet with the Adelaide clubs if he chose. Which he didn't do mind you. At least publicly.

The club has also developed him superbly. Trusted him as a key distributor. Eased him in via half back and are now setting him loose in a more attacking fashion to devastating effect.

I can't see one mistake made by the club in regards to NWM. Battle is a completely different story. Plenty of mistakes. But to be fair to the club, they have acknowledged quite a few of them publicly.

If NWM wants to play at a club closer to his family, I'm not sure what else the Saints can do. This is not an excuse but a reality of the situation.

This is not to say the Saints haven't cooked things in the past but for me, my original post stands on NWM. Melters will always melt.

Yeah fair enough, all good points. The club has learned for their mistakes re Battle.
And you are correct, the club seems to have done everything right by the sounds to keep him, and his manager gave us the best indication.
I suppose my concern is the perception of a club that can’t keep required players, while looking 'desperate' by offering FA's 1.7 a season.
I usually don't worry about media or outside noise, but perception is reality in minds. A player is offered a good contract by the Saints, but the perception is nobody wanting to go there and their best up and leave. The question is ' what is wrong at that club? No thanks'.

It is an absolute necessity to retain NAZ and land as many of our recruiting targets at a minimum TDK and Aleer.

So yes I am a concern troll, but I am getting old and don't have another 15 years to wait before we have another title at the flag.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

Yeah fair enough, all good points. The club has learned for their mistakes re Battle.
And you are correct, the club seems to have done everything right by the sounds to keep him, and his manager gave us the best indication.
I suppose my concern is the perception of a club that can keep required players, while looking 'desperate' by offering FA's 1.7 a season.
I usually don't worry about media or outside noise, but perception is reality in minds. A player is offered a good contract by the Saints, but the perception is nobody wanting to go there and their best up and leave. The question is ' what is wrong at that club? No thanks'.

It is an absolute necessity to retain NAZ and land as many of our recruiting targets at a minimum TDK and Aleer.

So yes I am a concern troll, but I am getting old and don't have another 15 years to wait before we have another title at the flag.

You’ve got at least 25 in ya ol’ Joog

 

[XhazzafootyX]

Article on fox footy website indicating Brisbane are likely to kill it in the draft again with their bevy of players only they have access to.

‘What AFL wanted’: Top two teams already winning draft; new Pies ‘spanner in works’ — Draft Watch

‘From the clouds’: Pies puzzle gets tricky over rapid rise; why Pick 1 link will scare rivals — Draft watch

www.foxsports.com.au

makes me sick people criticising bassats rant. This is exactly why it’s not fair. And you’re an absolute idiot if think it’s fair

 

[True Believer]

So they don't have TV'S in Adelaide? Playing in front of his family is such bs. Every one of these ' I want to go home' players wouldn't think twice about it if they were offered half of what they currently get on their contract.
It will be a monumental failure of the club not to resign NAZ for a whole number of reasons, not the least their loudly trumpeted ' we want to be the best club for indigenous players' initiative. Fancy publishing that and losing the best indigenous player at the club since Nicky Winmar?
Can sugar coat it with as much copium you like, but to lose him will be an unmitigated disaster.
A required player in Battle lost and an even more required player in NAZ lost in consecutive off seasons just cannot be blithely explained away as ' oh you know, homesick'

Wait - did we lose Naz??? !!!

 

[Joffaboy]

You’ve got at least 25 in ya ol’ Joog

You think I am a curmudgeonly misanthrope now, wait until I am 25 years on, trying to be an edge lord as a nonagenarian using an obsolete service carriage, posting to myself about Billings and Bont, and McCartin v Petracca

 

[True Believer]

Shut up Dard, he wear a headband to keep the flowing locks back when he is streaming out of the centre square, don't you know?

Streaming???

 

[Joffaboy]

Wait - did we lose Naz??? !!!

In my alternate universe

 

[Joffaboy]

Well it’s good enough for all those Cats players….

Oh, and the Richmond dude, forgot his name, who doesn’t even have hair at all

You will be drooling over Vikings headband then

 

[Diehard Saint]

You will be drooling over Vikings headband then

You mean the headgear?
Nah. A little bit much for me.
Would enjoy seeing kids wearing it - but adults not so much.

 

[SurfySainter99]

But they get to keep the best ones. C'mon, Joff, you and I both know this can't endure.

I understand the game development aspect of the northern academies, which is why I would tolerate one selection outside the draft per season. Everyone else just goes into the draft.

As a QLDer, I understood why the academies were brought in, particularly when both GC and the Lions were struggling and couldn’t keep players to save themselves. They also were big on attracting athletes from other codes to come across to AFL and fast track them through an “elite system”, but that seems to have disappeared in recent years, as we’re seeing more Jaspa Fletchers drafted over say Lachie Keefe’s who came from another sport.

But with the growth of the game in places like SEQ as Victorian expats continue to move up in droves, they are now creating an unfair advantage.

The AFL should set up these academies as independent entities from the clubs. Coaches appointed by the AFL, everything run by the AFL, no affiliation with any club except kids get to maybe use their facilities to train etc… and the better ones get to play VFL there or do a week of pre season. Every player other than F/S is available to all clubs no matter where you come from.

NGAs shouldn’t exist either IMO, as happy as I am to get Owens and Windhager from there, they did not need St Kilda’s help to get drafted. They were involved in a program that has produced hundreds of AFL players over a number of years, I’m sure they would’ve been fine with or without our NGA.

NGAS should only be used for remote indigenous communities in the NT or the Kimberley Region in WA where they don’t have access to quality facilities or resources.

 

[Mangus]

Yeah fair enough, all good points. The club has learned for their mistakes re Battle.
And you are correct, the club seems to have done everything right by the sounds to keep him, and his manager gave us the best indication.
I suppose my concern is the perception of a club that can’t keep required players, while looking 'desperate' by offering FA's 1.7 a season.
I usually don't worry about media or outside noise, but perception is reality in minds. A player is offered a good contract by the Saints, but the perception is nobody wanting to go there and their best up and leave. The question is ' what is wrong at that club? No thanks'.

It is an absolute necessity to retain NAZ and land as many of our recruiting targets at a minimum TDK and Aleer.

So yes I am a concern troll, but I am getting old and don't have another 15 years to wait before we have another title at the flag.

Reasonable concern but reality is we have never had a problem keeping players even in bad times problem has always been attracting players. Of the big names who left in the last 20 years only Battle was remotely fought for and even that fight was a bit half hearted given the compensation we expected.

I think Jamie Cripps was the last one who took the homesick route and he was hardly a must keep.

Generally we have been pretty conservative holding players too long and of those that have left recently Acres and Long are the only ones to really make a career with the move.

I think Naz will stay but if he leaves it won't be because we didn't offer him everything we could or provided an environment that would make him want to stay. Remember his dad gave up an AFL career with us to play SANFL for his families sake. If he leaves family will be the reason. If he does then we just have to maximise the return no sweetheart deal for a homesick player on this trade.

Bigger question is if we land TDK do we consider trading Marshall I think a ruthless club would do it. I really worry how they are going to work as a pair. Marshall is turning 30 but probably has 5 years left but not sure he is going to want to be our 2nd ruck / forward for those 5 years. Would be a tough call given how much he has given to the club but if the offers are good enough it is probably the smart move.

 

[St Neil]

IMO , Hugo has gone from making up numbers last season, to clearly picked before Jones this season.

On the First Crack last night David King dedicated 2 minutes talking about Garcia and the way he plays.

King is a huge fan. And he used footage to effectively compare Garcia to Tom Liberatore. Especially the way Garcia uses different types of handball to start a phase of motion.

King said Garcia is the number one player in the competition whose possession starts a forward movement that leads to a score.

Amazing the stats they keep these days.

 

[NuffNuff]

Am i missing something with Kings long term injuries + people wanting to trade him? Yet the same people want to bring in De Koning who has played the same amount of games in 1 less year in the league? I love the de koning acquisition, but also think that Max will be injury free at some point

 

[StCicatriz]

All good and well, but if Carlton matches, TDK stays at Carlton.

does he? sounds like its not just about the $$$

 

[dudeintheswamp]

I dare say Hugo will spend a bit of time up against Libba on Sunday, will be a good watch.

 

[Joffaboy]

does he? sounds like its not just about the $$$

Thought it was just about the money..
Go on....