Autopsy 2025 Rd 13 Shaky Blues Hold on to Beat Bombers

[Stamos]

I am still very much in the execution failure over system failure camp - we constantly make mistakes that keep opposition teams in the game

It's both.
But a stronger system allows for less than perfect execution, and makes execution easier.

 

[Gavstar]

It's both.
But a stronger system allows for less than perfect execution, and makes execution easier.

Execution gets far worse in the 4th quarter (and late in non-downhill skiing quarters), possibly due to player fatigue. If it's not possible to increase fitness sufficiently to improve the execution, then shouldn't the game plan be adjusted to reflect the reality? Repetition and reinforcement cannot fix the problem even if Vossy thinks it should.

Was Vossy joking when he said it was solely Cripps decision to spend so much time forward?

 

[CarmenSandiego]

Yes. 99% of the rhetoric coming from the fans was purely “just win”. Now it’s evolved into “just win, but only the way I want”. You can’t expect to win then complain when it’s not done in the manner you like. I was firmly in the “just win” camp. That win doesn’t change any narrative that was around pre-bye

I'm not even taking the 'win' into account. It was the way we played.

I repeat, for the first time in yonks, our injury list was no worse than any other team. Essendon are a particularly young & poor squad as is, but have an injury crisis on top of that - it was a huge opportunity to play the way we want to play and improve what we need. More aggressive ball movement, some players finding form, etc.

We saw that for 1 quarter, then - as usual, when some heat was applied and the corridor got shut down, we were genuinely outplayed for the 2nd, 3rd & half of the 4th quarter.

And I didn't see it as a case of just doing enough then turning it on, we looked every bit at their level.

I repeat, I've been very measured about this year, I've called for some potential list changes at the end of the year, but no sacking Voss or claiming the sky is falling - but I thought Sundays game was the 2nd worst performance of the year.

Nice to get the 4pts, but we're so far off it right now it's not funny.

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Collingwood won a bunch of games in 2023 in similar fashion- close wins against weak teams. Were they mentally fragile morons also?

problem with your argument is that the Pies winning games like that is the exception, for us it's the norm - on a good day!

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

I'm not even taking the 'win' into account. It was the way we played.

I repeat, for the first time in yonks, our injury list was no worse than any other team. Essendon are a particularly young & poor squad as is, but have an injury crisis on top of that - it was a huge opportunity to play the way we want to play and improve what we need. More aggressive ball movement, some players finding form, etc.

We saw that for 1 quarter, then - as usual, when some heat was applied and the corridor got shut down, we were genuinely outplayed for the 2nd, 3rd & half of the 4th quarter.

And I didn't see it as a case of just doing enough then turning it on, we looked every bit at their level.

I repeat, I've been very measured about this year, I've called for some potential list changes at the end of the year, but no sacking Voss or claiming the sky is falling - but I thought Sundays game was the 2nd worst performance of the year.

Nice to get the 4pts, but we're so far off it right now it's not funny.

how much was it them lifting their game or us not working so hard?!!

 

[CarmenSandiego]

how much was it them lifting their game or us not working so hard?!!

it can't just be coincidence, that we seem to stop working hard when the other team lifts?

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

it can't just be coincidence, that we seem to stop working hard when the other team lifts?

Did we stop working hard? I don't remember anything about our pressure rating dropping off.

The Bombers lifted in the second quarter and they didn't really make a dent in the margin.

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

"Essendon are a particularly young & poor squad as is, but have an injury crisis on top of that - it was a huge opportunity to play the way we want to play and improve what we need." This is the same Essendon that had almost exactly the same game against the Lions just the week before?

 

[Iamcarlton]

Good observations. We are certainly not the supporter base we used to be. The overriding sentiment is pessimism and fear of failure, even when we are going ok. The TV cameras were focusing on our supporters late in the game.

Why is it? Is it just years of being no good? Do we feed off a playing group that lacks belief? Do they feed off us, not just at games, but general conversations throughout the week?

The finals in '23 showed that we still have it in us. Maybe leaving Princes Park has had more of an effect than any of us realise? We used to regularly experience positive passion there, and then were able to reproduce it at the 'G when they needed us. Now we just sit and wait for things to go wrong.

These days, it's like Carlton and Collingwood supporters have swapped brains (god forbid). They were terrified we'd always beat them when it mattered. I wish Julius Sumner Miller would tell us why it is so.

Supporter emotions will always vary when you're following a side who has a huge gap between their best & worst .
And much of the time within games .

Supporters can see the potential there but it just doesn't click enough .
For a supporter base frothing at the mouth craving success given the clubs long drought of success .
The mixed emotions are understandable given the top end talent we possess .
Although they've spluttered this year .

Collingwood atm are the consumate professionals they do the basics right usually make less mistakes than their oppo .
And more often than not make the most of their opportunities in front of goal .
It's why they win so many close games just do the basics right .
With Collingwood you know what you get win or lose with us it's pot luck what carlton turns up...

 

[CarmenSandiego]

"Essendon are a particularly young & poor squad as is, but have an injury crisis on top of that - it was a huge opportunity to play the way we want to play and improve what we need." This is the same Essendon that had almost exactly the same game against the Lions just the week before?

Read previous posts. Brisbane have, what you call - tickets in the bank. They're 2nd on the ladder, coming off a flag, and anyone can see they are 'just going'. We've shown very few positive signs this year, came into the game fresh off a bye, 15th on the ladder.. do you really think that's a position to do 'just enough', as Brisbane did?

 

[CarmenSandiego]

Did we stop working hard? I don't remember anything about our pressure rating dropping off.

The Bombers lifted in the second quarter and they didn't really make a dent in the margin.

It did drop off, went from 200+ to 160-ish.

Essendon cut the margin from 6 goals to 1, to 8 goals to 4, to 9 goals to 8, to 11 goals to 11. So, not sure what you mean by your last statement.

 

[Stamos]

Coaches' Votes

10 Tom De Koning

21

Tom De Koning

Age

26

Ht

201cm

Wt

102kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.0

2star

K

3.0

1star

HB

5.0

4star

CL

0.5

2star

HO

1.5

4star

No current season stats available

D

8.0

2star

K

3.0

1star

HB

5.0

4star

CL

0.5

3star

HO

1.5

5star

(CARL)
7 Sam Walsh

18

Sam Walsh

Age

25

Ht

184cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

25.1

5star

K

13.5

5star

HB

11.6

5star

M

5.1

5star

T

3.2

5star

CL

3.4

5star

No current season stats available

D

26.2

5star

K

15.4

5star

HB

10.8

5star

M

6.0

5star

T

3.2

5star

CL

4.8

5star

(CARL)
5 Jack Silvagni

3

Jack Silvagni

Age

28

Ht

194cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

D/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.0

3star

K

7.1

3star

HB

3.8

3star

M

3.8

4star

T

2.9

4star

MG

176.9

3star

D

5.3

1star

K

4.0

1star

HB

1.3

1star

M

1.7

2star

T

0.7

1star

MG

91.0

2star

D

9.2

3star

K

6.2

3star

HB

3.0

3star

M

3.4

4star

T

2.8

5star

MG

131.4

3star

(CARL)
5 Nic Martin (ESS)
2 George Hewett

29

George Hewett

Age

30

Ht

187cm

Wt

87kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.7

4star

K

7.4

3star

HB

10.3

5star

M

2.7

3star

T

4.1

5star

CL

3.3

5star

D

13.8

3star

K

4.8

2star

HB

9.0

4star

M

1.8

2star

T

3.2

4star

CL

2.8

4star

D

11.2

3star

K

7.8

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

3.4

4star

T

4.0

5star

CL

0.4

3star

(CARL)
1 Xavier Duursma

28

Xavier Duursma

Age

25

Ht

186cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.5

5star

K

10.0

4star

HB

8.5

5star

M

5.4

5star

T

2.1

4star

CL

1.6

4star

D

13.0

3star

K

8.8

4star

HB

4.3

3star

M

3.8

4star

T

2.3

3star

CL

0.5

3star

D

16.8

4star

K

8.4

4star

HB

8.4

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

2.0

4star

CL

1.6

4star

(ESS)

 

[JK61]

problem with your argument is that the Pies winning games like that is the exception, for us it's the norm - on a good day!

Hardly the exception - in 2023 they were the most successful team in close games, this includes games where they were expected to win easily.

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

It did drop off, went from 200+ to 160-ish.

Essendon cut the margin from 6 goals to 1, to 8 goals to 4, to 9 goals to 8, to 11 goals to 11. So, not sure what you mean by your last statement.

The bombers lifted in the second and yet the margin in the second only diminished by 5 points in the second was my point.

Also in the first - 1st quarter it was 10 scoring shots to 2, second it was 4 scoring shots to 5, third it was 3 scoring shots to 6 and in the last it was 6 scoring shots to 4 - so outside of the third quarter - the bombers weren't hurting us - we were hurting ourselves

DO you have some evidence for your pressure facts? Is it reasonable to expect above 200 all game?

 

[CarmenSandiego]

The bombers lifted in the second and yet the margin in the second only diminished by 5 points in the second was my point.

Also in the first - 1st quarter it was 10 scoring shots to 2, second it was 4 scoring shots to 5, third it was 3 scoring shots to 6 and in the last it was 6 scoring shots to 4 - so outside of the third quarter - the bombers weren't hurting us - we were hurting ourselves

DO you have some evidence for your pressure facts? Is it reasonable to expect above 200 all game?

My original point wasn't about maintaining pressure.

It was about maintaining positive ball movement across 4 quarters - at the very least 2.5 quarters, along with our key players finding form. None of this happened.

We didn't play well.. AGAIN. That's the disappointing part that I'm (and others) are getting at.

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

Read previous posts. Brisbane have, what you call - tickets in the bank. They're 2nd on the ladder, coming off a flag, and anyone can see they are 'just going'. We've shown very few positive signs this year, came into the game fresh off a bye, 15th on the ladder.. do you really think that's a position to do 'just enough', as Brisbane did?

Firstly, a team second on the ladder is "just going"?

Secondly I don't think we did "just enough" - as I have said previously I think if you played that game 100 times that would be the closest the Bombers got.

Finally - I don't think you have good grasp on AFL football if you don't give some credit to the bombers in the last 2 weeks.

 

[Sector 7G]

The bombers lifted in the second and yet the margin in the second only diminished by 5 points in the second was my point.

Also in the first - 1st quarter it was 10 scoring shots to 2, second it was 4 scoring shots to 5, third it was 3 scoring shots to 6 and in the last it was 6 scoring shots to 4 - so outside of the third quarter - the bombers weren't hurting us - we were hurting ourselves
n
DO you have some evidence for your pressure facts? Is it reasonable to expect above 200 all game?

1 goal was from a dodgy 50m and the other from terrible defence with a minute to go.

 

[Stamos]

1 goal was from a dodgy 50m

What was that 50 for?
Couldn't work it out even with the replay on the screen.

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

1 goal was from a dodgy 50m and the other from terrible defence with a minute to go.

Throw in the 1 in a million goal form Caddy's soccer and then the Martin soccer forward hitting a target the led to a goal and it is clear things fell their way

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

What was that 50 for?
Couldn't work it out even with the replay on the screen.

The umpire must have called stand early as Lord was backing back to get outside 5m - it was rule of the week this week.

 

[Sector 7G]

What was that 50 for?
Couldn't work it out even with the replay on the screen.

Lord didn't stand, even though he was still moving away from the mark and was never stationary. There would be 20 incidents like that a game if paid consistently. Pies got a dodgy one like that yesterday. Would note in the first TDK took a mark I50 and Goldy manned the mark then ran off it which should be a 50. How often do you hear the umpire calling stand multiple times and not pay a free.

 

[Stamos]

The umpire must have called stand early as Lord was backing back to get outside 5m - it was rule of the week this week.

Shocking decision then.
Lord was never at the mark and started going back immediately.

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

My original point wasn't about maintaining pressure.

It was about maintaining positive ball movement across 4 quarters - at the very least 2.5 quarters, along with our key players finding form. None of this happened.

We didn't play well.. AGAIN. That's the disappointing part that I'm (and others) are getting at.

Well we had more scoring shots in 2 of the 4 quarters and basically broke even in a 3rd - had 8 more scoring shots for the night and Walsh did find some form.

And Essendon weren't going to just play dead and let us do what we want.

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

Shocking decision then.
Lord was never at the mark and started going back immediately.

Yep and that is why I keep saying, if you play that game 100 times that would be the best result the Bombers would get.

Even look at the last quarter again and see how many throws and holding the balls against the Bombers are just let go as the umpires went with the momentum

 

[Stamos]

Lord didn't stand, even though he was still moving away from the mark and was never stationary. There would be 20 incidents like that a game if paid consistently. Pies got a dodgy one like that yesterday. Would note in the first TDK took a mark I50 and Goldy manned the mark then ran off it which should be a 50. How often do you hear the umpire calling stand multiple times and not pay a free.

There was one in the 4th when the Essendon player came forward of the mark. Just a blatant 50, but they pay bullshit ones.

Was the one that we got for dissent?