List Mgmt. 2025 List Management II 📃

[Aphrodite]

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Hello - I come in peace etc.

I shared this hypothetical on our board, was interested in your thoughts.

Just spit balling and trying to gauge perceived value.

Disclaimer of course that I am aware you aren't keen to trade Charlie and that he is a ****ing gun.

Give
WC - Pick 1 or 2* + Haw R1 + Chesser (if he's Carlton bound, if not, Haw R3)
GC - Walter + Pick 7
Carlton - Curnow + Acres (a friend for Owies!)

Get
WC - Walter + Pick 7 + Acres
GC - Curnow
Carlton - Pick 1 or 2* + Haw R1 + Chesser (or Haw R3)

Who says no?

Walter to WCE as a WA boy and a known Eagles nuffie - someone our fans have always had an eye on.

The Pick 1 or 2 depends who Carlton are keen on - and ideally it syncs with who WCE are keen on - say Carlton want Dursmaa and WCE are into Sharpe (or whoever, I am no draft expert).

GC motivated to sell the Pick 7 obviously but Carlton don't want something in that range due to the Harry Dean bids. I get that the Hawthorn R1 might be a sticking point - might require a bit more to make that part work.

Thoughts?

Again, not trying to incite a riot, just ideas.

I don't mind this...

Opens up some doors for us,

pick 1 gives us Duursma,
We match the Dean bid using our TDK compo or we end up with another early player (maybe Grlj) and match the Dean bid with pick 14.
JSOS pick we might get Dovaston

I think Carlton will prefer your F1 over pick 1/2 though.

 

[teagueyubeauty]

Nick Haynes wasn’t young.

Given the way we have run senior players into the ground over the last two years chasing wins I simply don’t agree at all.

Are you telling me going into 2024 the club thought it wasn’t good enough to win a flag?

No cash here mate, no cash

That’s why I’m flipping perplexed with Docs comments

They thought they were a huge shot at the flag in both 24 and 25, they had the players already to get us there but there literally was 2 bits of fk all left.

Whether it was a deliberate strategy or not I got no idea, but you have to start thinking about the future at some stage and pre 2024 we were making trades and using our collateral to make them happen ie Saad, Cerra etc etc

Right now, it will be about strengthening that group of youngsters with more younguns…save the cash and probably look to get a free agent or two next year.

Thats why I’d prefer Charlie goes firstly and to the Goldy, they have some nice pieces that can strengthen the next generation coming through who will hopefully drive the culture not sook it up.

 

[We may never win again]

What have we got, 2yrs?
App is showing BK top-5 moments but no story.

Yep 2 years

 

[JTTheKing]

No cash here mate, no cash

That’s why I’m flipping perplexed with Docs comments

They thought they were a huge shot at the flag in both 24 and 25, they had the players already to get us there but there literally was 2 bits of fk all left.

Whether it was a deliberate strategy or not I got no idea, but you have to start thinking about the future at some stage and pre 2024 we were making trades and using our collateral to make them happen ie Saad, Cerra etc etc

Right now, it will be about strengthening that group of youngsters with more younguns…save the cash and probably look to get a free agent or two next year.

Thats why I’d prefer Charlie goes firstly and to the Goldy, they have some nice pieces that can strengthen the next generation coming through who will hopefully drive the culture not sook it up.

Well yeah it’s clear they ****ed up the cap.

I don’t think it was any well thought out plan or anything heading into 2024 and 2025.

Hence why I can understand the views of Docherty and others (if they thought the same). I don’t hold it against him for spending a decade at the club, getting to a prelim and then being frustrated the list goes completely backwards. Also don’t understand him being potted like he was holding the club back for years. Until the ACL last year in March he was still absolutely best 22 and one of our best players in 2023.

 

[TheThunderboltKid]

Nick Haynes wasn’t young.

Given the way we have run senior players into the ground over the last two years chasing wins I simply don’t agree at all.

Are you telling me going into 2024 the club thought it wasn’t good enough to win a flag?

I reckon we're so inconsistent it would be hard to have a clear and coherent recruiting strategy. Halfway through 2023 they were probably preparing for a mini-rebuild.

 

[No1Suspect]

I reckon we're so inconsistent it would be hard to have a clear and coherent recruiting strategy. Halfway through 2023 they were probably preparing for a mini-rebuild.

I don't feel like any of our departments have aligned at the same time

 

[Stamos]

I reckon we're so inconsistent it would be hard to have a clear and coherent recruiting strategy. Halfway through 2023 they were probably preparing for a mini-rebuild.

Further to this, much more than the list build, we botched the coaching, development, direction etc.
We completely wasted 3 prime years of our rebuild (2019-2021), so that we hit contention 2-3 years after we should have.
And that's not to mention the completely wasted 24 and 25 when we still should have been in contention.

So Saad for example, instead of being at his prime and a crucial part in a contending team, had a single year when that aligned, and then fell significantly away.

 

[jj1978]

What or who are we trading for the chess set?

 

[swuzzlebubble]

What or who are we trading for the chess set?

Lij?

 

[jj1978]

Lij?

I’m thinking wing for a wing. Acres. Would be irresponsible sending Lij to the West Coke Eagles.

 

[David Sylvian]

Apologies posted a draft profile for Campbell Chester from rookie me central and forgot to link instead.

Campbell Chesser Draft Profile

central.rookieme.com

A reasonable pick up runs both ways can kick, concerned about the tackling and durability aspect.

First time doling the linking thing, hope it works and is acceptable to the mods.

 

[Aphrodite]

Apologies posted a draft profile for Campbell Chester from rookie me central and forgot to link instead.

Campbell Chesser Draft Profile

central.rookieme.com

A reasonable pick up runs both ways can kick, concerned about the tackling and durability aspect.

First time doling the linking thing, hope it works and is acceptable to the mods.

All good David

 

[Blue By Blood]

Our list is screaming out for some athletic players. Can see the logic in taking the punt on Chesser.

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

I think the Jury might be out on this CB. The look on Hardwick’s face is priceless…

Cos no forward has ever missed an easy shot at goal. Im pretty sure Ive watched Harry and Charlie miss simple shots.

 

[swuzzlebubble]

Our list is screaming out for some athletic players. Can see the logic in taking the punt on Chesser.

A gambit even

 

[tarczonandjane]

Josh Kennedy was in our best 22 when that trade went down. We lost that trade. Kennedy won a flag with the Eagles and Judd didn't win one with us.

I’m not saying Walter will be like Kennedy, because I genuinely wouldn’t know.

But were you at games where Kennedy played for us? For starters he copped a ton of abuse from fans who thought he was hopeless. And he was in and out of the team regularly. There was no certain best 22 player there when we traded him.

 

[Aphrodite]

As of today after Kemp re-signed for 2 more years …

2025
3. Jesse Motlop
11. Mitch McGovern

11

Mitch Mcgovern

Age

31

Ht

190cm

Wt

88kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.1

3star

K

7.2

3star

HB

2.9

3star

M

4.6

4star

T

2.2

4star

MG

189.8

3star

D

7.6

2star

K

6.5

3star

HB

1.1

1star

M

3.6

4star

T

1.9

3star

MG

179.6

3star

D

10.8

3star

K

6.8

3star

HB

4.0

3star

M

4.0

4star

T

3.0

5star

MG

218.0

4star

26. Nick Haynes
34. Rob Monahan (International Rookie Cat B)
38. Will White (Pre-Season SSP Rookie 2025) ?
41. Matt Duffy (International Rookie Cat B) ?
44. Francis Evans (Pre-Season SSP Rookie 2025) ?
45. Flynn Young (MSD Rookie 2025) ?



Apparently a couple above have also re-signed according to the AFL website but there has been nothing official from the Club.

 

[Jimmae]

Yep, made a preliminary in 2023, since then over the past 2 years have lost (or potentially losing):

• Jack Martin
• Caleb Marchbank
• David Cuningham
• Matt Kennedy
• Matt Owies
• Paddy Dow
• Zac Fisher
• Tom DeKoning
• Jack Silvagni
• Sam Docherty
• Orazio Fantasia
• Elijah Hollands (?)
• Mitch McGovern (?)
• Charlie Curnow (?)
• Jesse Motlop (?)

* that's not including delistings and retirements like Ed, LOB, Plowman, Carroll, Philp, Honey, Cincotta etc

And the 'mature' players we've brought in during that period:

• Elijah Hollands (likely gone)
• Orazio Fantasia (gone)
• Francis Evans
• Nick Haynes
• Flynn Young

That's a hell of a lot of talent that's gone over the past 2 years, and mostly replaced by kids. Which is why our slide since 2023 isn't surprising.

And which is why our new CEO has stated that we need to bring in more good players, and why we would be reluctant to trade Charlie for more draft picks....unless they were used to bring in an A-grade talent. Which is highly unlikely.

Whether Austin has done a good job or not is a matter of opinion - but one thing we know is that with Wright on board, there's no better person to assess his performance - as well as the whole list management team.

Little bit of an exaggeration happening here:

• Hollands and Fantasia joined for the 2024 season, and were short term bets to boost the squad
• Martin, Marchbank, and Cuningham couldn't get on the park, still can't
• Fisher was a rubbish midfield selection that we couldn't turn into a flanker
• Dow was someone who we never adjusted tactics to allow him to excel, and broke him down trying to make him built like Dangerfield or Judd, Saints are struggling to get him on the park
• Kennedy and Jack both victims to depth (and Jack's apparent unwillingness to move to different parts of the ground)
• Owies was always a long shot project, and like most of our small forwards needs to be moved on from (or they need to be shifted into new roles, ala Motlop)

McGovern and TDK are the tragic ones: the former because of the insane cost of the trade and contract that Bolton pushed for, and TDK because we didn't nail down getting even more for him when the Saints opted to throw cash at the wall.

Talent ID and planning for a lot of this has varied from below average to shocking, so I'm looking forward to seeing what a new focus from the CEO down brings in terms of this.

 

[BlueJet]

we absolutely need depth. The right kind.

But Graham Wright is on record as saying we need more top line talent.

Reality is we actually don’t have that much a grade talent anymore and that matters. If Curnow goes, TDK gone and with Cripps heading into his 30s, we are starting to get bare there.

Not advocating throwing the kitchen sink at Butters. But we absolutely do need to be trying to bring in more a grade talents.

Yes, we need depth but we also need players that can be relied upon to play a role week in, week out. Which was my point. Do we need to/should we stump up massive salary & early picks given the glaring holes in our side?
In Charlie, H, Cripps, Walsh & Weiters, we have as many big ticket players as any other club. The expectation is that Jagga will join them given the outlay in acquiring him.
No issue in acquiring more A grade talent at all but burning multiple early picks & a massive salary seems reactionary rather than strategic

 

[Ninja Worrier]

Didn't mind Chesser in his draft year, feel like this is a relatively low risk potentially medium reward scenario

 

[TheThunderboltKid]

Apologies posted a draft profile for Campbell Chester from rookie me central and forgot to link instead.

Campbell Chesser Draft Profile

central.rookieme.com

A reasonable pick up runs both ways can kick, concerned about the tackling and durability aspect.

First time doling the linking thing, hope it works and is acceptable to the mods.

And so it begins....

 

[JTTheKing]

Further to this, much more than the list build, we botched the coaching, development, direction etc.
We completely wasted 3 prime years of our rebuild (2019-2021), so that we hit contention 2-3 years after we should have.
And that's not to mention the completely wasted 24 and 25 when we still should have been in contention.

So Saad for example, instead of being at his prime and a crucial part in a contending team, had a single year when that aligned, and then fell significantly away.

The coach is the biggest one.

Bolton and Teague were such bad misses.

Just have to look at Mitchell with Hawthorn. He comes in and sets standards and a style he wants and wasn’t afraid to make tough calls. Players bought in. Younger players have developed and players want to come and play for him.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Guess the Chesser haters will have to back in the recruiting team now. Looks set to become a Blue

Said back in April or May this would be a smart acquisition. Suspected/hoped Chesser would get to Carlton.

Get his body right and we will reap the rewards

 

[TheThunderboltKid]

The coach is the biggest one.

Bolton and Teague were such bad misses.

Just have to look at Mitchell with Hawthorn. He comes in and sets standards and a style he wants and wasn’t afraid to make tough calls. Players bought in. Younger players have developed and players want to come and play for him.

From memory we put ourselves in a position of choosing between Bolton or Barker...

 

[Blueyourmyboy!!]

As of today after Kemp re-signed for 2 more years …

2025
3. Jesse Motlop
11. Mitch McGovern
26. Nick Haynes
34. Rob Monahan (International Rookie Cat B)
38. Will White (Pre-Season SSP Rookie 2025) ?
41. Matt Duffy (International Rookie Cat B) ?
44. Francis Evans (Pre-Season SSP Rookie 2025) ?
45. Flynn Young (MSD Rookie 2025) ?



Apparently a couple above have also re-signed according to the AFL website but there has been nothing official from the Club.

Didn't Nick Haynes get a 1 year deal???