Preview RND 1 - Carlton v Richmond - Thursday 21st March 7:20PM @ MCG - Team Post #1412

[inyourcool]

You just beat me to the punch SB.
It could isolate Cas deep in the forward line one on one against Rance. Not sure if Rance would be too confident in defending the long bomb one out.

Levi is only good jumping at the ball. He is hopeless 1-on-1

 

[bigm386]

A fit and confident Pickett running off the wing and half forward line would be great

Any idea when he will be back?

I am honestly thinking his papers are stamped unfortunately, has been in the AFL system 5 years now drafted in 2014.

All the talent is there, but sadly application seems to be the ongoing issue.

 

[Soapy V]

Setterfield? Not sure there's enough time to protect players in the midfield.

Setterfield is a while off and protecting players is by more rotations and having the bigger bodies around the contest more. That's why i want Jack and hopefully Kennedy. Allows Dow Walsh Fisher etc to play more quality minutes and a bit more outside

 

[Soapy V]

I am honestly thinking his papers are stamped unfortunately, has been in the AFL system 5 years now drafted in 2014.

All the talent is there, but sadly application seems to be the ongoing issue.

How he treats his rehab will tell us a lot

 

[HARKER]

Setterfield is a while off and protecting players is by more rotations and having the bigger bodies around the contest more. That's why i want Jack and hopefully Kennedy. Allows Dow Walsh Fisher etc to play more quality minutes and a bit more outside

I want players that can get first hands to ball, unless they're specifically guarding/marking an opponent.

We'll see with JSilvagni, but I don't see the first few steps being what may be required from midfielder.
Highlights from the NB's practice match were quite underwhelming, but that means little as you saw the whole game, but it was a lower key practice match

 

[bigm386]

I want players that can get first hands to ball, unless they're specifically guarding/marking an opponent.

We'll see with JSilvagni, but I don't see the first few steps being what may be required from midfielder.
Highlights from the NB's practice match were quite underwhelming, but that means little as you saw the whole game, but it was a lower key practice match

I think with JSOS I don't see him as a savior of our midfield, but the reward for effort for me is a big message to send. He will likely be fringe best 22 all year but for me should get a spot round 1 for either Plowman or McGovern.

 

[Soapy V]

I want players that can get first hands to ball, unless they're specifically guarding/marking an opponent.

We'll see with JSilvagni, but I don't see the first few steps being what may be required from midfielder.
Highlights from the NB's practice match were quite underwhelming, but that means little as you saw the whole game, but it was a lower key practice match

Looked like a midfielder to me and I wasn’t a fan previously. Pies had some decent mids in as well

 

[Coona Blues]

I don't think we need to debate the defence, Weitering, Jones, Plowman, Simpson, Newman, Thomas and Garlett will be there.

The midfield group has also seemingly been consolidated in the short term. Personally, would love O'Brien in, his disposal just offers so much to the forwards and our overall cohesion and ball retention, but this is looking unlikely. Our ruck position may not be as clear cut as people think. Phillips certainly offers a bit more elevation and potential taps to advantage, however, I don't discount Lobbe who is more durable and out works Phillips around the ground and with TOG, releasing Harry to more forward time, and thus less fatigue.

Forwards are the big question. We will play the big three and Cuningham has cemented his spot. I want Ed to resume midfield duties with a chop out to enable rotations. Actually a 50/50 with the other tackling machine Setterfield, might be the go short term, while we condition Setters. I really don't want both Polson and Gibbons playing primarily defensive roles. One or the other please, Gibbons offers more of an offensive threat, but we know Bolts loves CamPo. I really want Jack played predominantly forward and as a utility where required. His improving midfield credentials are still a work in progress, but his learnings should add to his effectiveness forward or back. Has always been able to find space in attack, as well as bringing good pressure. I just have the feeling he will hold a lot more marks, and can be used in rotation with Harry's ruck minutes, Charlie and Mitch drifting up on to the wing for a chop out and general rotations. There is no need for our ruckmen to rest or drift forward with our marking power and Crippa drifting forward like a ruck traditionally does. Fasolo is a genuine threat both at ground level and on the lead and will ultimately find his way in. Just a poor message and a little desperate to rush him in. His transgression should not be forgotten, make him work at it a little longer.

I really don't want us to try to replicate the other sides with a myriad of smalls playing defensive, pressure roles. Modern AFL level players need to bring pressure as a prerequisite (that is why a great servant like Levi is now a break glass option). Our three talls are all capable of bringing considerable pressure at ground level, so structure is more important than pressure.

Can we please ditch the loser/underdog mentality and structure our forward line aggressively. Charlie, Harry and McGovern are all mobile talls who can take a grab. Surely they are better getting moving on the lead than calling for the bomb to a pack. Fasolo and Jack are both intelligent players capable of finding space and offering realistic focal options. As an aside, I was astounded with the drills I witnessed at Maroochydore during training, so many had the starting point for a forward entry having multiple talls and smalls starting from a consolidated pack situation. Three offensive talls, marked by three defenders, with two smalls either setting up front and back or attempting to block. Not sure if this was our way of playing the 6-6-6 centre break, trying to drag the defenders deep off the 50 metre line, clearly it is more difficult to spread inside the 50 arc. I don't get to watch games live, but would have been interesting to see set up variation V Magpies after quarter time was way more effective. The new rules have added an interesting new dimension with how each club is going to address it.

Round 1.
Thomas, Jones, Plowman
Simpson, Weitering, Newman
Ed Curnow, Cripps, Walsh
Cuningham, Curnow, Fisher
Silvagni, McKay, Gibbons/Polson
Phillips/Lobbe, Setterfield, Petrevski-Seton
Int: Dow, Murphy, Garlett, McGovern

Emerg: Polson/Gibbons, Lobbe/Phillips, O'Brien, Fasolo, Kennedy(if fit)

 

[Blue__Balls]

I want players that can get first hands to ball, unless they're specifically guarding/marking an opponent.

We'll see with JSilvagni, but I don't see the first few steps being what may be required from midfielder.
Highlights from the NB's practice match were quite underwhelming, but that means little as you saw the whole game, but it was a lower key practice match

Balance is key.

You're spot on that Jack lacks a bit of acceleration, but every midfield has a few of those types. The trick for Jack will be finding an area he can improve and specialise in, to complement the other players. Bulk up and a play a more inside role, feeding the ball out to the quicker players. Build his endurance and play a run-with role on an opposition accumulator, or as a link-up player on the wing using his height and reach.

Personally, wouldn't mind seeing him put some pressure on Plowman for that undersized defender role. Otherwise, develop him as the future replacement for Ed Curnow as a defensive midfielder who can drift forward and kick the odd goal.

If he continues to present as a "Jack of all trades" he's probably going to get overtaken in the coming years. We have too much talent on the list, and it's all so young that we're going to be adding more of it regularly without losing much to retirement, for him to hold a regular spot in the seniors as a Mr Fix-it. So he needs to specialise, and perhaps become the player that sacrifices his own game to allow others to prosper.

 

[gbatman]

B: Plowman Jones Newman
HB: Thomas Weitering Simpson
C: Murphy Cripps Fisher
HF: Gibbons Curnow Cuningham
F: McGovern McKay Fasolo
OB: Phillips SPS Dow
IC: Setterfield Walsh Curnow Garlett
EM: O'Brien Silvagni Polson Kennedy

NEW:
Newman Gibbons Fasolo Setterfield Walsh

Notable Absentees:
Kreuzer Docherty Marchbank Williamson

Richmond have a good group of missing players and underdone players, some racing the clock to be fit, some will miss, others will play but have missed good portions of the preseason. They are a good side but will be highly vulnerable. We are missing some good players but we won't be fielding too many players who you could say will be really underdone and that's why I think this is one we will win. We're a young side fielding a lot of new players though and that's where we could come undone.

McGovern needs to find form and our three tall forwards needs to learn to function together and quick. Our backline is missing three but the fillings look ok, they just don't quite offer the rebounding run of the three who are out. Our midfield looks deep and reasonably good but it's young and we will need a big game from Cripps. It's going to come down to how much the young ones step up. The smaller forwards I think are reasonable without being stars. Fasolo has to play for mine. Cuningham hopefully continues some strong form and Gibbons could become a good option if we persist. We genuinely have rotation options on the bench this time too which is going to help a lot, particularly late in games. The take away from JLT will be our ability to keep the ball in our forward line. I think it was exposed against Collingwood, us going forward and it coming straight back out. Delivery and our efforts to keep it in there by possessing it and applying pressure on the opposition will be a big defining factor and IMO could be game deciding.

I think it's important that we are close to Richmond in the last quarter. I am hoping that our rotations and some of their notable outs/underdone players means we will come home strong.

 

[JohnnyFontane90]

Think it is possible to play the 4 KP forwards if we are going to continue to bomb it long you could use Harry and Casboult as the deep forwards for the bomb contested mark with Cunners and Fas at there feet, while using Charlie and McG on the lead and even pushing up to the wings as the link up targets for the ball coming out of defence this might actually stretch Richmond’s tall defenders. Also leaves Casboult to play second ruck instead of risking Harry.

i admit casboults ability to play ruck puts him in contention with kruezer out. But i think philips has shown he's a solid back up.

If mcgovern is not fully fity then he won't have the legs to be leading up the ground all day. he'll need to stay deep at for the first few games at least.

casboult was handy the last couple of years to take the top defender while we develop charlie and harry, but those days are over. if we don't want to play an underdone mcgovern then we're better off playing JSOS/Kerr as the third tall.

 

[gbatman]

Pickett is 0 chance of playing AFL this season.

Struggled to get a game and was dropped at times last year when we were one of the worst AFL sides fielded in recent history. Wasn't fit then.
Turned up to preseason really unfit.
Got injured and is going through a really long recovery process and will come out of that really really unfit.

Pickett will need to recover, go through rehab and then work on getting himself AFL level fit starting from a fitness base of 0. IMO Pickett will struggle to be fit for round 1 2020 if he doesn't come back early enough this season to training/playing.

We need to rookie list him, give Andrew Russell a crack at him and at getting him properly fit for AFL and see where he ends up and maybe he will be there midway through next season.

Pickett needs to focus on being fit enough for AFL at some stage in 2020 and then keeping that fitness and building on top of that to go to the next level in 2021.

I think some of us are underestimating just how fit you need to be to play AFL and how far back someone like Pickett would be.

 

[gbatman]

I think if McGovern doesn't play and there's a reasonable chance of that then Silvagni plays. I would think he will feature in the VFL practice matches. Harry McKay is proving a good backup ruck, I think we would be happy with what Harry has done on the ball and Phillips is a good ruckman. I wouldn't take too much notice of his game V Grundy, Grundy is going to flog opposition ruckman in most of the games he plays and will be right up the for the AA spot.

Casboult is looking in pretty good shape and has gone well in the VFL but he's more of a McKay or Curnow replacement as is TDK.

I just think Jack Silvagni has decent form and fitness and brings some versatility. If he plays instead then that doesn't bother me at all.

 

[thylacine60]

we may just have gibbs-yarraned garlett and I like it so far..........

 

[Jeremias]

I’ll be stunned if McGovern doesn’t play.

Clearly he’s not fit but that can hardly be a surprise to anyone given the injury.

We won’t see the best of him for a while but he now has three preseason hit outs under his belt and he’s too important not to be there.

I’m taking a less than 100% fit Gov into this one well before I contemplate a fully fit Casboult.

 

[thylacine60]

if he'd have marked and goaled and won the game we wouldn't be having discussions on whether he will play or not..........

 

[Soapy V]

Unfortunately people are getting lost in the Casboult mention. It was only an option

My comment is purely about should we play McGovern when he is obviously not fit? Given the pre season we have had and the fit players available I see massive positives in rewarding fitness in Rd One and having McGovern do a mini pre season and come in fit and firing after a few weeks. These days being fit means so much.

Jack Casboult Kerr TDK have all had great pre seasons

Just my take BUT I have no doubt McGovern will play

 

[Blue__Balls]

if he'd have marked and goaled and won the game we wouldn't be having discussions on whether he will play or not..........

But he didn't, so now he's sacked.

 

[thylacine60]

can't argue with that.......

 

[HBF]

As a Richmond supporter i would rather see McGovern in the Carlton lineup than Casboult due to our ability to matchup better on McGovern than McKay,Casboult,Curnow foward set up.

Casboult would cause Richmond a bigger headache than McGovern imo

Assuming that Casboult has his kicking boots on. Gov is clearly the better player, but he is still struggling with being unable to complete a full preseason.

 

[JustaBattler]

if he'd have marked and goaled and won the game we wouldn't be having discussions on whether he will play or not..........

I liked the fact that the team played the quarter out and was in a position to steal a win at the end - no matter how much 'slicker' the Collingwood midfield was compared to Carlton - their defense was tested by a fat/unfit McGovern, a mucking around Charlie and an L plated Harry - I'm amazed at how even a semblance of structure and competitiveness can bring flag contenders down to earth against a Club that deservedly picked up another last placed finish a few months ago.

It seems to me that the difference between the top sides and everyone else is just how many developed(meaning strong) and fit bodies coaches have at their disposal - and game plans are mainly just hordes of players running back and forth as fast as they can - whoever runs better/faster when it matters for longer wins.

I saw no evidence of improved skills from Carlton players except in new boy Walsh and a fitter SPS - the rest played like they always play - but could run better and for longer.

Buckley has invested in elite runners for years and it is now paying off.

 

[TooBlue14]

Russell:
https://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/2019-03-13/injury-update-round-1

 

[Soapy V]

Russell:
https://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/2019-03-13/injury-update-round-1

All sounds as good as could have hoped coming into Rd One.

 

[thylacine60]

gonna be a nice dilemma if kreuz gets up......

 

[Soapy V]

It seems to me that the difference between the top sides and everyone else is just how many developed(meaning strong) and fit bodies coaches have at their disposal - and game plans are mainly just hordes of players running back and forth as fast as they can - whoever runs better/faster when it matters for longer wins.

100% agree. It's why we need patience. We are still Boys against Men when it comes to the top sides