Rumour Bluemour Discussion XLI

[Aphrodite]

#BUMP from February


Re: 'Alleged' rumours resurfacing ...

Folks, this is the way things are here.

Posters are responsible for what they post. Moderators can not attest to the accuracy or otherwise of any rumour posted.

Moderators will intervene for a couple of reasons.

1. If a thread is threatening to be derailed because of a post.

2. If invested parties request the removal of material.

None of this draws a conclusion as to the accuracy or otherwise of the original post.

There is no need to further speculate. What will be will be.

Also, you need to remember that this thread like all parts of this forum is bound by the rules of poster conduct. If you want to express skepticism towards a rumour that's fine, but having a crack at posters who are contributors to this forum is simply not on and will be acted upon.

Simply put, don't be a dick.

Thanks all!

 

[AndyLucimitis]

Agree with most of the Charlie assessment, but our supporters are the worst in the league - entitled bullies, sooks and cowards who keep at the negativity and abuse long after the game is over. I wouldn't hang around for it (even without being on social media) it's a shocking vibe.

Message to all who think it's ok - take a breath and a long look in the mirror.

That was my point. It wasn't necessarily about Charlie but an overall review of ourselves as a supporter base.

Can we be better ?

 

[T2B_]

Sad to hear that about Elijah, I'd really love for it to work out

 

[AndyLucimitis]

Some second hand info coming out of trade period:

• Boak a good chance to join as a development coach.
• Crippa happy to hand over the captaincy if senior personnel think it’s time. Will do what’s in the best interests of the club.
• Jagga‘s professionalism really standing out within the four walls already.
• Gov was gone if Buku joined. Now club is weighing up keeping him or bringing in a replacement via DFA or during the SSP period.
• Elijah has broken the club’s trust and it’s seen as very unlikely that there’s a road back for him.

Is it just me ? - I know Buku is younger but I'd have McGovern way ahead of Buku on ability.

 

[ctwenty1]

Is it just me ? - I know Buku is younger but I'd have McGovern way ahead of Buku on ability.

maybe its about availability? Know nothing of Buku but is he more durable?

 

[JJBagger]

We definitely need a 2 year stop gap. Frost as an SSP?

I know we all have high hopes on Dean, but I don’t think a combo of Weitering/Dean/Gov/Young /Hayes as our tall defenders (you can argue most of those aren’t KPD) is going to cut it.

I think the Jack lose is bigger than TDK & Curnow

We will certainly miss Jack for the 10 games he would’ve played next year

 

[Robertio]

Sad to hear that about Elijah, I'd really love for it to work out

I'm with you on that one mate, from the outside and not knowing the full story i reckon we should give the kid a break and try and help him if he wants another chance.

 

[passmark]

Is it just me ? - I know Buku is younger but I'd have McGovern way ahead of Buku on ability.

Might be his professionalism as well.

We know he came back fat at least once. Maybe he doesn’t do the recovery he should and that impedes his availability.

But I remember last pre-season and he was about our best player……..then got injured.

 

[Blue1980]

With respect, what a crock.

We have a membership base of 100k, with that yes, you will get ferals. To blame the supporter base as a reason for a change is such a weak argument, and if it is the reason he has left then I am glad. He doesn't recall the years (2 years) where he injured but the club and supporter base looked after him and wished him well. He doesn't remember when he came back from injury and the supporters were patient and realistic what a return would look like and how he may take some time to get back into the swing of things. He doesn't remember playing in front of 90k at the G, against Collingwood and the supporters getting behind him every kick. What a crock!

The supporters got sick of the lack of effort, the lack of want to tackle, to hunt, to chase, and it wasn't like they turned after 1 week, this was over a year which saw him put in very little effort. The years of winning Coleman's were a band-aid for his lack of effort. The lack of effort was always there but at least he was kicking goals.

FWIF, I would like to just point out some stats for you with Charlie: 2023 (81 goals)

View attachment 2459417
View attachment 2459418
View attachment 2459419
View attachment 2459420

A year where he kicked 81 goals - 78 for the home and away season. In 4 games 31 goals, one of which he received 5 free kicks (Collingwood) If you factor in he beat up on some average teams, his return for the year was 47.

We received 3 first round picks and a decent player in Hayward. This deal is bigger than the Judd trade, we have made out like bandits. Time will tell if we are the winners from this trade, but, my early thoughts are a leopard doesn't change his spots. Charlie will continue to dish up the same lacklustre efforts when things don't go his way. I hope Papley sheds off those kegs that Greene said he put on because he's going to be covering a lot of KM's covering ground Charlie refuses to cover.

You will find most forwards fill their boots against shit sides, which you kind of want them to. Also the free kicks were all there v Pies, its nuffy talk to say cos he got free kicks they don't count.

So Charlie isn't a shit flat track bully IMO, but at the same time, he won't sink us by not being there. The biggest risk with Charlie I think is will his body hold up? Seems he has been injury riddled ever since the GWS game later last year (which coincided with everything going to shit for us).

Guys we have coming in like Ainsworth, Heyward and Florent are all hard working solid pro's. It's telling that Heyward and Florent were drafted a season after Charlie and have both played 35 more games than him. Ainsworth was drafted 2 years after Charlie and has played 8 more games.

Also you know if these guys do get injured they will do everything they can to get themselves right to go again, not convinced Charlie is the most diligent guy in rehab.

 

[Blue1980]

Might be his professionalism as well.

We know he came back fat at least once. Maybe he doesn’t do the recovery he should and that impedes his availability.

But I remember last pre-season and he was about our best player……..then got injured.

Gov has been pretty consistently available the last 3 seasons. He has played 57 out of a total of 73 game we have played, and that number would be 60 if he didn't have a contract trigger and select him late this season.

He was playing some decent footy up forward when Harry was out of the team too, I am nowhere near as down on him as others are. I think when the side isn't going well people end up thinking everyone is shit.

 

[AndyLucimitis]

So Charlie isn't a shit flat track bully IMO, but at the same time, he won't sink us by not being there. The biggest risk with Charlie I think is will his body hold up? Seems he has been injury riddled ever since the GWS game later last year (which coincided with everything going to shit for us).

Re: Injuries - people are focused on his knee but I reckon it's his ankle that is really stuffed.

 

[NTBlue]

But wouldn’t Charlie also have got the back end of his front ended contract sorted as well
ie not getting paid $6-700k the next four years so say 4 years at a $M each
We should ask for our front end premiums back

I agree. If a player has signed a 5 year deal for $5 mil and the parties agree to front end load it so player gets $1.3m for first 3 years and then be due just 550,000 for final 2 years; if player decides to leave after 3 years they should have to repay the $900,000 that they have received as front loaded payment.
If this was written into all front loaded contracts it would be a strong incentive for players to honour the original long term contract.

 

[ajb72]

I am normally wary of an isolated Indian Summer form run for a more mature player, but I am convinced Frank’s run was a genuine “coming of age”. At the time Wickzki confirmed to me he had some direct mentoring from some Blues premiership stars.

I am highly optimistic he is the real deal and will force his way in to a now “stacked” small/forward line. (Williams, Ainsworth, Hayward and Evans along with developing Moir with the likes of Motlop, Cottrell and Fogarty pushing for inclusion)

living in SA and with a partner who supports Port, I probably see more of Port than I do of Carlton. I didnt mind Frank when he was at Port, the only real issue was his inconsistency. He would play 1 really good game, and then 3 where you didnt know he was there. He started the same at Carlton, so thought that is what it would end up being.
i am hoping his consistency at the end of the season shows that maybe things have started to twig for him, sometimes it takes a while and then it works out. Lets hope that is the case.

 

[Blue1980]

Re: Injuries - people are focused on his knee but I reckon it's his ankle that is really stuffed.

You could be right. Either way, I am not so sure Charlie would be the one to have done the most diligent rehab in the past or even now, so he seems less likely than say a Cameron, Hawkins, Buddy etc to play deep into his 30s, not to mention those 3 didn't have Charlie's injury history either.

 

[Blue1980]

living in SA and with a partner who supports Port, I probably see more of Port than I do of Carlton. I didnt mind Frank when he was at Port, the only real issue was his inconsistency. He would play 1 really good game, and then 3 where you didnt know he was there. He started the same at Carlton, so thought that is what it would end up being.
i am hoping his consistency at the end of the season shows that maybe things have started to twig for him, sometimes it takes a while and then it works out. Lets hope that is the case.

Well Frankie went from zero good games to like 5 good ones of his last 5. He said his lack of proper pre-season hurt, but we saw he is quite creative, good skills and a good pass too.

Sure, it may never happen again for him, but I am quietly confident he will be best 23 next year, with Heyward and Ainsworth it will mean Motlop won't be an automatic selection either unless he lifts (which I think he can).

 

[Blue1980]

Some second hand info coming out of trade period:

• Boak a good chance to join as a development coach.
• Crippa happy to hand over the captaincy if senior personnel think it’s time. Will do what’s in the best interests of the club.
• Jagga‘s professionalism really standing out within the four walls already.
• Gov was gone if Buku joined. Now club is weighing up keeping him or bringing in a replacement via DFA or during the SSP period.
• Elijah has broken the club’s trust and it’s seen as very unlikely that there’s a road back for him.

I'd be getting on Jagga for the rising star award next year. A further year to bulk up a bit more, reckon he will kill it.

 

[Blue Pulse]

They should have taken the deal for Merrett. They're not winning anything anytime soon, and with an arsenal of first round picks they really could have set themselves up.

Agree, but glad they didn't. It would have made Hawthorn very tough to beat. Merrit is a star with superb delivery.

 

[passmark]

Gov has been pretty consistently available the last 3 seasons. He has played 57 out of a total of 73 game we have played, and that number would be 60 if he didn't have a contract trigger and select him late this season.

He was playing some decent footy up forward when Harry was out of the team too, I am nowhere near as down on him as others are. I think when the side isn't going well people end up thinking everyone is shit.

No argument here. His best is elite.

 

[SurreyBlue]

I honestly don’t get into the Soap Opera of footy any more.

However, that little bloke jumping around in front of the Hawthorn guys yesterday.

Good heavens, who was that angry, slightly overweight, sweating, coked out, bald Geffen goblin, pointing his little finger.

When he tucked in his back pack & stomped his little tiny feet.

I just wanted to pat him.

Tom Petroro - Zac Merrett’s manager

 

[KnaveyBlue]

Is it just me ? - I know Buku is younger but I'd have McGovern way ahead of Buku on ability.

Glad we missed out on Buku. Especially as it seems we were going to play him as a backman, which he's not.

Would have become one of the all time great whipping boys.

 

[ForYouBlue]

Would be interesting to have an insight into govs mindset. I see him as a top 5 talent on our list, with strengths that we desperately need my preference would be to keep him on, and I think with the right motivation he would be an invaluable asset at either end of the ground.

 

[The Bighouse]

As good as the club has achieved during the trade period, adding pace to our midfield and evenness to our forward line, the lack of a genuine second KPD until our young ones develop, is going to be a serious concerns next year.

A contest will do ala HOK or LYoung, or a more mobile lot in Kempy (maybe MM as a fill in, if he can contest and go at 100% consistently) + Carlos & Hayward capable as well.

 

[Sucker for Trade Period]

Glad we missed out on Buku. Especially as it seems we were going to play him as a backman, which he's not.

Would have become one of the all time great whipping boys.

To that point, can we bin having whipping boys next year? We all know the likes of Motlop, Young and Hollands are going to play next year and I'd rather get behind them than shit in their cereal every week

 

[Blue1980]

Would be interesting to have an insight into govs mindset. I see him as a top 5 talent on our list, with strengths that we desperately need my preference would be to keep him on, and I think with the right motivation he would be an invaluable asset at either end of the ground.

I think he is a classic case of a guy people take for granted, also still many have an axe to grind with him over his initial contract (when I think ended end of 2023?). People seem to think you could replace Gov with just some random dude at pick 789 in the rookie draft, then when people see the reality of that, they are like "err well maybe Gov could play".

 

[The Bighouse]

Would be interesting to have an insight into govs mindset. I see him as a top 5 talent on our list, with strengths that we desperately need my preference would be to keep him on, and I think with the right motivation he would be an invaluable asset at either end of the ground.

7yrs in with us and it hasn’t clicked on being anymore than a spare parts man with inconsistency.

Needs to really put in and not hold back. Watch his bros highlights (or games for how to commit at AFL level)

 

[Blue1980]

To that point, can we bin having whipping boys next year? We all know the likes of Motlop, Young and Hollands are going to play next year and I'd rather get behind them than shit in their cereal every week

I like Ollie and defend Motlop a fair bit. Young we gave way too long a contract on the back of half a year of good footy end of 2022, which he has never replicated since.

That isn't his fault, he is a battler and backup, and most likely will be delisted end of 2026. But yes, I do find it odd when people have their pet players they dislike, it's like they want them to fail to be justified in their opinion.