Players that didnt live up to their hype?

[Yoda_]

One of the worst is probably slightly hyperbolic but he is a seriously average player.

22 under 22 means nothing and racking up games and being club captain in a big average team doesn’t scream living up to the hype.

can i ask, where is the "hype" coming from?

the 2016 AFL draft should widely be considered one of the weakest this century, Tom Stewart (mature ager, pick 49) arguarbly the pick of the bunch.

The number 1 pick was a raffle between up to 4 players (McGrath, Taranto, McCluggage, Setterfield) so hardly a consensus pick 1. We obviously had the drugs saga over our heads so went for the safepick. No point being a hindsight hero as Taranto may not have been a B&F winner in his third year or Mcclugage was a premiership player and multiple AA squad player with us


so again, where is the 'hype' coming from? people who think the number 1 pick has to be the best player from the draft.

 

[Freomaniac]

The debate is flags have no influence on the quality of a player during or post career.

Its just a plain out and out fact.

Dew had a great 15 minutes, fantastic, but did that make him an overall better player, no.

Well Look at Darren Jarmans 3 AFL grand finals he played.

1991: played for the hawks and got his 1st medal. only 4 disposals.

1997: 6 goals he scored, 5 were in the final quarter

1998: 5 goals in the grand final

 

[Freomaniac]

Our biggest 'what if?' hype players are probably Andrew McDougall, Murray Newman and Tom Swift.

All top 25 picks and came with big wraps. McDougall was OK in 2004 kicking 35 goals but never looked like he was about to explode. Someone like Jobe Shanahan by comparison after a handful of games in his first year just looks like he could be a real player.

Swift was an extremely highly rated junior but never looked more than a role player at AFL level. Newman had talent but no application. In his brief time at WC he was beaten in the pre season time trial by 44 year old John Worsfold, left a WAFL game at quarter time, went to jail after being convicted of GBH and came back to play 2 games and be delisted.

I remember Andrew McDougall very well...

From 2002 to 2005, Eagles had a solid all round squad. Just needed that Tall forward to finish it all off.

He played 10 games and kicked 9 goals in 2003. So there was some promising signs. As you said a solid season kicking 35 goals in 2004. You would thought he would improve or at Worst become a 30 goal a season forward. After that 2004 season, he just got taken down with injuries.

Phillip Matera lead your teams goal kicking in 2004 and 2005 kicking 60 goals each.

 

[Sonny Hayes]

can i ask, where is the "hype" coming from?

the 2016 AFL draft should widely be considered one of the weakest this century, Tom Stewart (mature ager, pick 49) arguarbly the pick of the bunch.

The number 1 pick was a raffle between up to 4 players (McGrath, Taranto, McCluggage, Setterfield) so hardly a consensus pick 1. We obviously had the drugs saga over our heads so went for the safepick. No point being a hindsight hero as Taranto may not have been a B&F winner in his third year or Mcclugage was a premiership player and multiple AA squad player with us


so again, where is the 'hype' coming from? people who think the number 1 pick has to be the best player from the draft.

No it’s about what he had coming in to the league, I guarantee you all Bomber fans were expecting a better player than this when he was drafted.

He is a fine enough player but fell a long way short of expectations when he was coming in to the league

 

[Andyy]

I'm inferring there might be clubs who would choose Rayner, which is a perfectly acceptable position. LDU might end up the best, Naughton is probably worth the most.

I said he's 3-5 (hardly a large range)

Welcome back after 10 weeks or so mate.

Acceptable position if you're looking at it from an individual club's perspective, but I don't think that's what this thread is about. It's about players who didn't live up to their hype. Big things are expected and hoped for of a #1 pick.

Taking the position that 'a particular club might take Rayner over X player' because of their specific needs isn't really the point.


There are several players as good or better than Rayner, period. He's a decent player, has some great impact at times etc, but largely speaking I think anybody would be hoping to get more with pick #1.

 

[Andyy]

can i ask, where is the "hype" coming from?

the 2016 AFL draft should widely be considered one of the weakest this century, Tom Stewart (mature ager, pick 49) arguarbly the pick of the bunch.

To be honest, despite being a very good player, Stewart is one particular bloke who I think gets more hype than warranted. Cats fans will hate on me for saying he's not the best etc.

It's still a good draft though:
Taranto, McCluggage, English, Bolton, Darcy, Battle, D Cameron, Jaicos (yep he's included), L Ryan, Larkey, Short, Papley, Draper, Stengle, Marshall, McIerney, all found their way onto lists that year.

The number 1 pick was a raffle between up to 4 players (McGrath, Taranto, McCluggage, Setterfield) so hardly a consensus pick 1. We obviously had the drugs saga over our heads so went for the safepick. No point being a hindsight hero as Taranto may not have been a B&F winner in his third year or Mcclugage was a premiership player and multiple AA squad player with us

From memory, McGrath was the warm favourite for pick #1? A suitable pick at the time, and he's a good player. There's always players who tend to go past the #1 pick later on in their careers.

so again, where is the 'hype' coming from? people who think the number 1 pick has to be the best player from the draft.

Hype is absolutely warranted, whether a club wants the best player available or the best player to suit their list etc. It's directly linked to more successful career outcomes based off the history of the league/draft.

Nobody uses pick #1 and drafts a player than nobody gets excited about lol.

 

[DangerSloane]

Well Look at Darren Jarmans 3 AFL grand finals he played.

1991: played for the hawks and got his 1st medal. only 4 disposals.

1997: 6 goals he scored, 5 were in the final quarter

1998: 5 goals in the grand final

Not sure which side of the fence you're sitting on this.

Jarman was a gun prior to joining Adelaide and then even more so when he did join us. He was also a big game player.
Dunstall said he was shattered when he left just because of how many of his goals he was being handed on a silver platter.

Not really relevant in this convo though. Whether a player is a gun or not is not dependent on team success.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Gibbs sticks out for us. Had a decent career, but could have been much more. One of the most hyped and best juniors of the past 20 years. Had patches of seasons he tore up, but never developed the consistency of a true top liner. His decision to move to Adelaide finished his career 3-4 years prematurely.

I dont put Murphy in the same category. He was never as hyped and probably less talented. Was also an AA, 2 x B&F, Coaches MVP. Probably had 3-4 seasons worthy of AA selection, but being in a poor team cost him. Unfairly maligned by his own supporters at times.

Followed his draft class closely because of hawkins and the super draft tag..he is an interesting one.

I think his career fell short because he lacked a physical edge. If he was harder at contests and had more unside grunt, he would have stamped himself as an elite.

I honestly think gibbs is more suited to modern footy than his own era. His utility would have been something chris scott adores, switching fron midfield wing and HB.

Another obvious hugely hyped player who didnt live up to expectation is jack martin

 

[crowman2]

When a player gets a nickname THE FUTURE

You would expect that has a lot of expectation but Johnny Butcher clearly did not deliver on that nickname

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

the unbiased view of the public masses is probably more educated than people on a football forum, the fact he is in some pretty decent company for multiple selections suggests he is a decent enough footballer.

Do you understand what fan-voted means?

 

[Yoda_]

Do you understand what fan-voted means?

ive forgotten, is it a popularity contest? wouldn't that mean the majority think he is a decent enough AFL player to warrant that selection

 

[Jim Prideaux]

ive forgotten, is it a popularity contest? wouldn't that mean the majority think he is a decent enough AFL player to warrant that selection

Well, it depends doesn’t it. Do you trust that the most popular song is the best song, or the most critically acclaimed? The Beatles sold a lot of albums and had a boat load of number 1’s, but I’m not sure you’d say they’re the best band ever.

 

[Yoda_]

Well, it depends doesn’t it. Do you trust that the most popular song is the best song, or the most critically acclaimed? The Beatles sold a lot of albums and had a boat load of number 1’s, but I’m not sure you’d say they’re the best band ever.

they still stand the test of time

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

ive forgotten, is it a popularity contest? wouldn't that mean the majority think he is a decent enough AFL player to warrant that selection

Fan voted: Do Essendon have more fans than a lot of teams?

It’s really not that hard to understand how an Essendon back pocket could get so many 22 under 22 selections even if they’re not the best player for that position, but you’re making out like him being in the team is some sort of quasi-All Australian selection.

 

[boncer34]

Fan voted: Do Essendon have more fans than a lot of teams?

It’s really not that hard to understand how an Essendon back pocket could get so many 22 under 22 selections even if they’re not the best player for that position, but you’re making out like him being in the team is some sort of quasi-All Australian selection.

Explains why Bontempelli, Jackson, Naughton and Smith all have 4+.

The massive supporter bases of the Dogs and Dees.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Explains why Bontempelli, Jackson, Naughton and Smith all have 4+.

The massive supporter bases of the Dogs and Dees.

That would be because most supporters vote for them, regardless of allegiance.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Welcome back after 10 weeks or so mate.

Acceptable position if you're looking at it from an individual club's perspective, but I don't think that's what this thread is about. It's about players who didn't live up to their hype. Big things are expected and hoped for of a #1 pick.

Taking the position that 'a particular club might take Rayner over X player' because of their specific needs isn't really the point.


There are several players as good or better than Rayner, period. He's a decent player, has some great impact at times etc, but largely speaking I think anybody would be hoping to get more with pick #1.

Expectations, especially from fans, will be different depending upon draft position. Jye Clark at Geelong a good example. Looks like he'll carve out a solid if unspectacular career but because he went high in the draft hes regarded as a bust

 

[Yoda_]

That would be because most supporters vote for them, regardless of allegiance.

narrative + agenda = point of view

 

[dexter_]

Stephen Hill

32

Stephen Hill

Age

35

Ht

183cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.5

5star

K

11.7

4star

HB

7.8

5star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.9

4star

MG

223.5

3star

D

13.5

3star

K

8.8

4star

HB

4.8

3star

M

4.8

4star

T

0.8

1star

MG

223.5

3star

D

11.2

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

5.8

4star

M

2.2

3star

T

2.8

5star

looked like he was going to be a star in his first 2 seasons. Then clubs clamped down on him and he went into his shell. Ross came in and turned him into a more consistent, reliable player but he never really showed all his gifts consistently IMO. Dennis Cometti summed him up in commentary once - 'He's a wonderful talent, he just doesn't know how good he could be'

 

[Partridge]

Hype is absolutely warranted, whether a club wants the best player available or the best player to suit their list etc. It's directly linked to more successful career outcomes based off the history of the league/draft.

Nobody uses pick #1 and drafts a player than nobody gets excited about lol.

Yeah like it or not, if you have a #1 pick you're expecting a gun. Not a role player of any kind.

We obviously haven't had too many picks in the top 10 and none at the pointy end (which actually is a good thing to me - as it means you're finishing up the right end of the ladder), but every single one came with hype. Cockatoo kicked one spectacular goal in a pre-season game and was going to be a superstar. Guaranteed. In reality he never looked like becoming a regular senior player. And he was pick #10. Every club has them.

 

[boncer34]

That would be because most supporters vote for them, regardless of allegiance.

Ohhh so for non-Essendon players with 4+ its because people without club allegiance vote for them.

But for the Essendon player it's because Essendon fans voted for them.

Got it, right, perfectly reasonable take.

 

[Yoda_]

Yeah like it or not, if you have a #1 pick you're expecting a gun. Not a role player of any kind.

We obviously haven't had too many picks in the top 10 and none at the pointy end (which actually is a good thing to me - as it means you're finishing up the right end of the ladder), but every single one came with hype. Cockatoo kicked one spectacular goal in a pre-season game and was going to be a superstar. Guaranteed. In reality he never looked like becoming a regular senior player. And he was pick #10. Every club has them.

friendly reminder that on BigFooty Essendon is bashed on anything. Im not denying that we should have got more from a #1 pick but the absolute putrid hyperbole on this forum about McGrath is simply unwarranted. He is a good role player that most sides would take, sure, no superstar but that 2016 draft is going down as one of the poorest this century. Furthermore, with the #1 pick it was open to what type of player you wanted, we went for the safe bankable bet.

 

[Footy Smarts]

Is there a worse 200 gamer?

Yes.

Rohan won 67% of his games, played 26 finals and was a walk up start for top 4 teams for a decade. He wasn't a start but he was a good player.

Just to pick one Jack Newnes played 207 games. He never played in a team that made finals and was basically a fringe player through his entire career.

No way was Newnes a better player than Rohan.

 

[Andyy]

Expectations, especially from fans, will be different depending upon draft position. Jye Clark at Geelong a good example. Looks like he'll carve out a solid if unspectacular career but because he went high in the draft hes regarded as a bust

Yeah it's a fair point.

Pick #8 - what are your personal expectations?

Do you want a player with a 'solid, if unspectacular career' with a pick that high?

I think most people would want to be landing that in the 2nd round onwards personally.

It's not a complete bust, but haven't nailed it either.

 

[Andyy]

Yeah like it or not, if you have a #1 pick you're expecting a gun. Not a role player of any kind.

We obviously haven't had too many picks in the top 10 and none at the pointy end (which actually is a good thing to me - as it means you're finishing up the right end of the ladder), but every single one came with hype. Cockatoo kicked one spectacular goal in a pre-season game and was going to be a superstar. Guaranteed. In reality he never looked like becoming a regular senior player. And he was pick #10. Every club has them.

Thanks for reading and getting it mate.

Bottom line is, there are guns in every draft, and nobody has a crystal ball - but every club has recruiters, talent scouts, an interview process, there's draft combine results etc etc. It's actually never been easier to identify talent given how hard it must have been before the interview, online telecasts etc.

So yeah I think it's very reasonable that if your club has the first pick of the bunch that they should probably find one of those dead set guns or at least a good player, not a role player who bobs up from time to time to lay a tackle and jag a goal.


For anyone to suggest #1 only has hype attached to it if fans do so is laughable.