2012 draft

[Wacky Tiger]

Crappy wage though. Wonder if they'd bother

What is the going rookie rate these days??? Still more than an average wage i would have thought. Isnt Stephenson a teacher? Fair enough if rookie wasnt worth it to him but id imagine Wood would be keen unless he has something post football already organised.

 

[Waltz17]

Seriously? Look at their past drafting. I'm sure they have their reasons but to me Vlastuin is the better prospect due to his kicking and leadership. Vlastuin's injury has meant he hasn't played midfield which Wines has all year and that would be the appeal to him.



It's not even a media report it's based of Mock Drafts. Vlastuin is often in the 15-20 range therefore he is average for a pick 9. Whereas most mock drafts have Wines going top 10 so therefore is a better prospect. The club watches every game these kids play (either live or on video) to decide whose the best fit.

FWIW Knightmare had Wright and Atkins around 15 at stages through the year so people should be wrapped on that. We are getting bargains.

very true. I think I'll put my faith in FJ and co.'s opinion on which player is best suited to Richmond over KM's or Chris25's!

 

[Richo83]

Would mean we have a shit load of rucks again which ****s their development.

Yeah I really can't see the point in drafting Wood or Stevenson if Grundy is picked. Maric, Grundy and Vickery are fine.

 

[tigs2010]

Yeah I really can't see the point in drafting Wood or Stevenson if Grundy is picked. Maric, Grundy and Vickery are fine.

And Derickx. We already had too many last year. The problem was quality. If we were to take Grundy the quality is there and we'd have 4 which is heaps.

 

[Riskingheadandshin]

Yes let's all just wait until every player has been retired for 10 years first before daring to express an opinion on an internet messageboard.

Geez what were we thinking taking Ellis when Hayden Crozier was available?!? Will haunt us for this decade.

 

[Harmichael]

Geez what were we thinking taking Ellis when Hayden Crozier was available?!? Will haunt us for this decade.

Agreed. Should've cut our losses and traded him to Port for Jacobs.

Oh well, maybe we can still send him to GWS next year as part of the Tyson deal.

 

[theflea]

Sorry, but that is ******* terrible and will see us missing the finals if injury to Maric occurs.

If the club wants to role the dice fine, I sure as hell won't be excited to see us rely on Derickx, Wood, Petterd.... Wow.

We have the chance to set the club up for years here. We have three other picks with chances to get mids, and next year another Vlastuin will be around, they come most years. Grundy types don't. Brisbane will be kicking themselves now.

tb do you think gws ignored longer knowing grundy was in the wings?

 

[NZ_Tiger]

tb do you think gws ignored longer knowing grundy was in the wings?

I think they are going to stink it up on the AFL's tab and load up on first round mids and the odd key defender and then use them in trade to fill their ruck stocks when they are ready to have a crack.

 

[Riskingheadandshin]

Agreed. Should've cut our losses and traded him to Port for Jacobs.

Oh well, maybe we can still send him to GWS next year as part of the Tyson deal.

Just trying to get into your short sighted, narrow minded negative outlook on life...
Enjoy the view on your soapbox.

 

[Harmichael]

Just trying to get into your short sighted, narrow minded negative outlook on life...
Enjoy the view on your soapbox.

Well, maybe if you were also standing on some kind of elevated platform things wouldn't sail over your head quite so easily.

 

[theflea]

Would mean we have a shit load of rucks again which ****s their development.

totally agree 3 main rucks only thanks.

 

[theflea]

Conca was FJ trying to be "clever" and "outsmart" everyone, when Heppell was the obvious choice. I'd prefer FJ just take the obvious choice and best available for a change rather than trying to be too "cute" with his picks. When clubs try to "outsmart" everyone in drafts they usually just end up outsmating themselves.

nah i disagree. fj just thought he was a better prospect. the fact that he got injured and couldnt show his stuff in the champs or test at the combine made him slide a little in the eyes of draft watchers. i still think conca will be a better player than heppell.

 

[living_in_syd]

Are you pro ruck draft or pro ruck trade???

Ottens was a gun pick. If we had of traded him off in 2001 we could have got hodge and Judd as in his breakout year in 2001 he was going to touch the moon.

The trades were okay and although Maric has been terrific I was not expecting a dud effort from him.

If we get Grundy, doubt he would last is he the next General aka Mark Lee?

Going completely on my own assumption, I think rucks in general are harder to predict successfully than a midfielder. However, since rucks are a limited 1-2 per side, the payoff is obviously better. However, the benefit of picking a midfielder is that if he doesn't live up to Judd standards, there will prob be still a role for him in the 22, rather than being stuck in the revserves like Barry brooks.

The point is the midfielder will always be the safer pick. So if you pick a ruck, you have to be dam sure.

The only offset is that rucks will take longer to develop - hitting peak at 24-25, whereas a midfielder could provide contributions and hit their peak if good, closer to around 21-22.

Which then i turn means return on investment, you simply get less years at peak.

 

[Harmichael]

nah i disagree. fj just thought he was a better prospect. the fact that he got injured and couldnt show his stuff in the champs or test at the combine made him slide a little in the eyes of draft watchers. i still think conca will be a better player than heppell.

I hope so. Like I said, still early and I don't think it was particularly strong draft as it was. It's not as though I think Conca is shit and it was a major stuff up of Oakley-Nicholls-like preportions- as certain other posters seem to be labouring under the illussion that I did.

IIRC Batchelor & Dea were quite were considered left-field picks for us that year too. I'm quite happy atm with the former at least.

 

[Morro]

Going completely on my own assumption, I think rucks in general are harder to predict successfully than a midfielder. However, since rucks are a limited 1-2 per side, the payoff is obviously better. However, the benefit of picking a midfielder is that if he doesn't live up to Judd standards, there will prob be still a role for him in the 22, rather than being stuck in the revserves like Barry brooks.

The point is the midfielder will always be the safer pick. So if you pick a ruck, you have to be dam sure.

The only offset is that rucks will take longer to develop - hitting peak at 24-25, whereas a midfielder could provide contributions and hit their peak if good, closer to around 21-22.

Which then i turn means return on investment, you simply get less years at peak.

For me we need to build depth quickly, not taking short cuts, but as quick as we can through the draft. Mids selected at 18 years of age are far more likely to have an impact in years 1 and 2 in particular. In our position, list wise, we cant afford to wait 3-4 years for our first pick to offer something.

This may seem short sighted to some, but I feel this is our best option. Vas (Tigger) for me.

So we can all have a party after the draft and the RFC can bring the VAS

 

[tigs2010]

I hope so. Like I said, still early and I don't think it was particularly strong draft as it was. It's not as though I think Conca is shit and it was a major stuff up of Oakley-Nicholls-like preportions- as certain other posters seem to be labouring under the illussion that I did.

IIRC Batchelor & Dea were quite were considered left-field picks for us that year too. I'm quite happy atm with the former at least.

Dea was the year before. We snuck both in before Collingwood got them FWIW.

 

[fred swift]

All this Vlastuin love has me F***d !

If Grundy,Plowman,Wines,O'Rourke are there at pick #9 we take pure talent ahead of 'workmanlike' any day of the week.

You can Never have enough class & talent in your team-
Buy the cream at #9
Save buying the veg,potatos for #32,#34,#43

spot on gun , i would add garlett and atkins to the list. i think M R has alot of explaining to do. lol.

 

[Cotchinsastar]

If we take the chance of getting Grundy our ruck stocks should be set for a while and we could get other Mids and stuff other years. But IMO we should still get a mid whether it be vlaustin, Macrae, stringer, Menzel, Plowman, wines, O'Rourke etc

 

[Wacky Tiger]

If we take the chance of getting Grundy our ruck stocks should be set for a while and we could get other Mids and stuff other years. But IMO we should still get a mid whether it be vlaustin, Macrae, stringer, Menzel, Plowman, wines, O'Rourke etc

Like Tyson next year

 

[Cotchinsastar]

Vlastuin isn't just a workmanlike player though. He may not be flashy type but he's classy in the sense he's a great user of the ball by both hand and foot. The fact he has the workmanlike traits is an added bonus. Interesting you put Wines in the class & talent category over Vlastuin. Out of the 5 you have there I'd take Grundy over Vlastuin on what he would ensure for our side for the next 10-12 years. (succession plan of Maric to Grundy with no worries about having to find a ruckman later down the track) Plowman I'd be 50/50 over and we'd want to be sure he can transition into a midfielder. Wines no thanks. He's Vlastuin without the kicking. O'Rourke doesn't have that pure ball-winning in close that Vlastuin has when he plays midfield, though he is an elite user so he is tempting. Won't be available so doesn't really matter.

I don't get the knock on Vlastuin that people have with this he's pretty much a hard nut plodder. Is it because Knightmare had him 15-20 in his mock draft most of the year? At the beginning of the year he had him at 2 behind Whitfield. Would be interesting if Knightmare had kept him at 2 all year I reckon everyone would be jizzing over getting Vlastuin to the club. As a player comparison Knightmare has him compared to Michael Voss. Chris has him compared to Luke Hodge. He may never reach those heights but he certainly has the ball-winning, skills and leadership to pave a great career in his own right and we will look back in 10 years and be comparing future top picks making comparisons and calling them the next Nick Vlastuin.

If he hadn't of been injured and forced to play HBF we wouldn't be a chance of getting him IMO. The bonus to him playing HBF this year is he has added that versatility to his game and become a dual position player.

Athletically people knock him but not knowing how he tested and just watching him play he's an absolute bull, strong as an ox. His leap looks better than average. Not saying he's ever going to be a guy who can take hangers but watching him defend he can always get up over the top to get a punch in. Endurance wise, again no idea how he tested but he seems to be able to get himself to contest after contest and go all day. Speed wise, he's no Lewis Jetta but he's not a complete plodder. I'd say he has ok pace which is well and truly good enough for an inside mid role. I'd say he'd be a fair bit quicker than Tuck, Jackson, Sewell and all those types.

If I was Melbourne and I was picking for needs at pick 4 (which they appear to be doing) I'd be going Vlastuin over Wines every day of the week. They want tough ball winners which they both are, they also need guys who can use the footy and hit targets. Vlastuin ticks that box comfortably over Wines for mine. They are also short of leaders at that club. Again Vlastuin has him covered and would be captain of that club in no time.

Good right up, after reading that I established that I 100% want to go for Vlaustin on draft day. But if Grundy is available i would still go for him. I wonder if Vlaustin could be a prolific ball winner when moved to the centre. I saw somewhere he averaged 16 possessions, is that of the HBF? I wonder if he could become a 25+ disposal winner, if so that would be amazing. He would be that tough 'Sam Mitchell' type player feeding it out to cotch, lids and Martin, that would be unstoppable. Add Grigg, Newman, tuck, foley, Ellis, Conca and knights to it makes great depth and ability.

 

[Cotchinsastar]

Like Tyson next year

I wish , he will be my Christmas present for next year

 

[Harmichael]

Dea was the year before. We snuck both in before Collingwood got them FWIW.

I meant Helbig - who we nicked from under the Bummer's noses.

I don't think we were expected to grab any of Batchelor, Helbig or even Dea the year before. I remember many thought Batchelor was taken to high.

I also know many were stunned when we called out Arnot's name.

 

[Tomnat Tigers]

Kind of related to the draft... Jayden post is playing for Altona next year and has not nominated for the draft.

 

[Cotchinsastar]

Just a question, if Vlaustin hit the gym could he become a 'Sam Mitchell' mold player? That would be ideal if we were to get him

 

[tigs2010]

Good right up, after reading that I established that I 100% want to go for Vlaustin on draft day. But if Grundy is available i would still go for him. I wonder if Vlaustin could be a prolific ball winner when moved to the centre. I saw somewhere he averaged 16 possessions, is that of the HBF? I wonder if he could become a 25+ disposal winner, if so that would be amazing. He would be that tough 'Sam Mitchell' type player feeding it out to cotch, lids and Martin, that would be unstoppable. Add Grigg, Newman, tuck, foley, Ellis, Conca and knights to it makes great depth and ability.

Yer, off a HBF mainly this year. Could quite easily get to being a 25 possession per game player eventually.

I meant Helbig - who we nicked from under the Bummer's noses.

I don't think we were expected to grab any of Batchelor, Helbig or even Dea the year before. I remember many thought Batchelor was taken to high.

I also know many were stunned when we called out Arnot's name.

We did want others at that Batchelor pick but they were gone just before our pick. Darling, Lycett and Harper I believe.
I think Batchelor has well and truly justified his draft position. Helbig needs some continuity and I think he will too.