List Mgmt. 2014 Draft Discussion

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

Honestly, I can't say I watch a whole lot of the Division 2 sides and when I do it has traditionally only been when they cross over to get pummeled by the boys in Division 1 so I haven't seen a lot of him. From what I have seen and from his short highlights reel on youtube, I can't say I'm much of a fan.

Reminds me a lot of Marco Paparone as a junior which isn't exactly a compliment... good mover and all that but just doesn't look like a footballer, kicking looks ok-ish when it's on and atrocious when it's not.

Also, I refuse to buy into the notion that athletes can make it as key position players, especially key forwards. I'm racking my brain trying to think of someone who has done it but I just can't. It's late, so surely I'm missing the obvious? Key position players, especially forwards, don't have the luxury afforded to other 'outfield' players in that they literally spend the entire 4 quarters being worked over by their opponent/s. I just think it's going to be extremely difficult, almost impossible, for someone like Hammelmann to step into the game at the next level and compete every week against guys who have had a lifetime of football behind them in that 1-on-1 style. Midfielders etc can get away with it because at times they will find themselves isolated from their opponents and are free to do as they wish, if you understand what I mean.

It's late. This probably won't make sense to me in the morning.

All makes sense and all very fair.

I've only seen two full Champs games of his and one was extremely impressive, the other was probably just average. I've been pretty keen on him since his really impressive game (think it was against NSW/ACT if I recall correctly) but I'm cooling on him a bit after watching more footage and hearing of his very average efforts in the NEAFL. Really like his movement and work rate though. Hands seem very solid and are what appealed to me in the first place but it's not good that he was struggling in the NEAFL at all. Not sure what to think of him now. You make pretty good points about athletes becoming genuine KPPs though. I can't really think of any at all either. Rhys Stanley is probably the closest I can think of, and...yeah, that doesn't make a great case for Hamm's selection.

Wish there was a bit more available on the Div 2 guys. Don't see a lot of them either and it's next to impossible to find out much about them.

 

[farstrider]

All makes sense and all very fair.

I've only seen two full Champs games of his and one was extremely impressive, the other was probably just average. I've been pretty keen on him since his really impressive game (think it was against NSW/ACT if I recall correctly) but I'm cooling on him a bit after watching more footage and hearing of his very average efforts in the NEAFL. Really like his movement and work rate though. Hands seem very solid and are what appealed to me in the first place but it's not good that he was struggling in the NEAFL at all. Not sure what to think of him now. You make pretty good points about athletes becoming genuine KPPs though. I can't really think of any at all either. Rhys Stanley is probably the closest I can think of, and...yeah, that doesn't make a great case for Hamm's selection.

Wish there was a bit more available on the Div 2 guys. Don't see a lot of them either and it's next to impossible to find out much about them.

Can I ask what you mean by athlete? I've only ever heard that used as a positive term.

 

[Snarls Barkley]

Can I ask what you mean by athlete? I've only ever heard that used as a positive term.

Usually means they've got the physical attributes but not the footy attributes.

 

[Zephiisdaman]

Ideally if we picked up Menadue, he'd play maybe 1 or 2 games right at the end of the year. Waaaay to thin to play many more than that. Kid is a stick. He's a similar build to Ayce when he first arrived. Little arms like chopsticks and legs like spiderwebs. Has to have a massive preseason in which he puts on 4-5kgs, then the same next year and the same the year after that. His ideal playing weight at 188-190cm would be close to 85kg's. He's currently 17kg's away from that just to put it in perspective for you guys. Would definitely be a long term prospect.

Size is over-rated early for mids. Speed and bravery early, size late as far as their career goes for me.
I look at Kayne Turner at the end of NMs year and he is a stick but hard as a cats head. Bonts is hardly Mr Olympia, WHE is not big either is Jasper Pittard.
Not every player needs to be muscular big, particularly runners.

 

[Wizard17]

Award winners so far U15 player of the year, Lachlan Fogarty. U16 player of the year Harry Bult

Michael Fogarty have little brother at the Jets or something? I know he played for them so I gather they are related. Ah never mind it isn't this years draft anyways

 

[Wizard17]

While 15-year-old Lachlan Fogarty is a highly regarded basketballer, it seems the young Spotswood player is reaching new heights on the football field, having represented Victoria in the Under 15 Football Championships in Sydney last month. Following in the footsteps of older brothers Matthew and Michael who have successful football careers with the Spotswood Football Club and Footscray VFL team, Lachlan was the only WRFL player to pull on the big V jumper in the national competition. Having traditionally fielded separate Vic Metro and Country teams for the past 20 years, this season the representative team was combined into one powerhouse squad. With one sole Victorian team, Lachlan said that competition to earn a position in the side was fierce, with just nine metro boys and sixteen country boys making up the final squad. While there were three representatives from the neighbouring Essendon District Football League, Lachlan was the only WRFL player to make the cut. Kicking off on July 19, five games were played over seven days with ice baths and rehab sessions the order of the day after each match. In the initial game against traditional rivals South Australia, Lachlan was named best on field after a scintillating display in defence. As tradition would have it, Lachlan had to wear the special gold Victorian jumper to the team dinner that night in honour of his achievement. After coming off the field with concussion early in the third game, medical staff forced Lachlan to miss game four as a precaution, before allowing him to return to play in the grand final against a tall athletic Queensland team. The game was played at Spotless Stadium, the home of the AFL’s newest club, the GWS Giants. Again Lachlan was at his best and along with a very even, highly skilled and consistent team, Victoria was able to take home the trophy that had eluded them the previous year.

Yep he is Michael's brother sounds like a pretty good player coming through too though it is pretty early to say that.

"Defender with Basketball background" seeings as our recruiting teams watch these kids from day 1and we have liked kids who have basketball backgrounds I wonder if this is how we knew about Michael...

 

[Dry Rot]

total football I'm curious to hear your thoughts on Hammelmann. Looking around he seems pretty divisive, with some seeing him as a late 20s pick at the latest and others thinking he could go undrafted.

The Lions passed on nominating him as one of the Academy players. Puts a large question nark over him?

 

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

The Lions passed on nominating him as one of the Academy players. Puts a large question nark over him?

It sort of does, sort of doesn't. Collingwood didn't nominate James Stewart as a F/S last year, and GWS picked him in the 20s. Certainly did a good job of tearing us to shreds in round 23. It puts a question mark over him in some respects (ie. at least one side doesn't consider him to be amongst the top 60-70 prospects in the draft), but not in others - all it takes is one team to rate him and he'll be taken. Plenty of players slip through the cracks of one recruiter, then get picked up by another and perform admirably.

He got a national combine invite so that means at least 3-4 clubs see him as being in the top 100 prospects. Will be interesting to see where he ends up. He has some bloody nice attributes (moves extremely well, strong hands), but some others that may be difficult to overcome at AFL level (not very physical, very average one-on-one, inconsistent, doesn't always move to the right spots, etc). I haven't made up my mind on him yet.

 

[Dav1d]

He got a national combine invite so that means at least 3-4 clubs see him as being in the top 100 prospects. Will be interesting to see where he ends up. He has some bloody nice attributes (moves extremely well, strong hands), but some others that may be difficult to overcome at AFL level (not very physical, very average one-on-one, inconsistent, doesn't always move to the right spots, etc). I haven't made up my mind on him yet.

some of his weaknesses might be easily worked on though
once he has put on more muscle and has that confidence his physical and 1v1 game might improve

just needs to be in the right development

Matthew Uebergang is still a player that I wouldn't mind us rookie-ing

has some great closing down speed for a key defender and an effective mark as well as an effective spoiler

 

[Wizard17]

I might be alone on this but I kind of hope we rookie a possession gathering inside mid with reasonable skills with Boyd coming to the end and Smith getting injured all the time I'd like to have a bit of backup there (remember the games without smith and wallis last year? I'm trying to forget about them ). Maybe someone like a Grace or a Hislop?

 

[Dav1d]

I might be alone on this but I kind of hope we rookie a possession gathering inside mid with reasonable skills with Boyd coming to the end and Smith getting injured all the time I'd like to have a bit of backup there (remember the games without smith and wallis last year? I'm trying to forget about them ). Maybe someone like a Grace or a Hislop?

are they both overagers?

preferably, I'd prefer we draft the younger one

 

[Wizard17]

Hislop isn't an overager been playing TSL since he was 16 I think.

are they both overagers?

preferably, I'd prefer we draft the younger one

 

[Pannalstaroz]

Spoke about drafting yesterday and the cards are up in the air, simply because we have our favs, (but TBH I didn't get them out of him) but it'll be best available, not recruiting for a purpose. Be confident that we'll get someone good at 26&27 but it's a massive lottery after that. I suggested that we needed speed, but the answer is you need good players with speed, not speed for speed's sake. We were going to take McCartin at pick 4 and the club's view was that we would have ended up with 4&7 if we didn't get Boyd, but they're much happier with Boyd. They reckon he's the biggest no brainer of all time.

 

[Dav1d]

Hislop isn't an overager been playing TSL since he was 16 I think.

Hislop it is then

I have no idea who we'll draft at our picks though, that startles me

 

[Dav1d]

Spoke about drafting yesterday and the cards are up in the air, simply because we have our favs, (but TBH I didn't get them out of him) but it'll be best available, not recruiting for a purpose. Be confident that we'll get someone good at 26&27 but it's a massive lottery after that. I suggested that we needed speed, but the answer is you need good players with speed, not speed for speed's sake. We were going to take McCartin at pick 4 and the club's view was that we would have ended up with 4&7 if we didn't get Boyd, but they're much happier with Boyd. They reckon he's the biggest no brainer of all time.

McCartin would have made it to 4?

Will be interesting to see who selects him now

the players available at 26-27 are higher because 3 picks above us are already committed

 

[Pannalstaroz]

McCartin would have made it to 4?

Will be interesting to see who selects him now

the players available at 26-27 are higher because 3 picks above us are already committed

Yeah he thought he would. He's convinced in the 20s we'll get quality, but I won't say he was as confident after that

 

[Dav1d]

Yeah he thought he would. He's convinced in the 20s we'll get quality, but I won't say he was as confident after that

Did he say we'd go mature age players early? I certainly hope not, get some talented kids in again
hes been on fire with that

 

[Pannalstaroz]

Did he say we'd go mature age players early? I certainly hope not, get some talented kids in again
hes been on fire with that

No, at this stage it'll be kids. But because there wasn't much confidence about the later picks I guess that could change. heck, I should have asked again about Foster. Oh well, I guess I'll see him again soon.

 

[doggies ftw]

Must admit I really really wish we could have gotten Melbournes pick 23 or similar back with Boyd, would have been nice

 

[Dav1d]

Must admit I really really wish we could have gotten Melbournes pick 23 or similar back with Boyd, would have been nice

I do to, its alright though

there will be more young talent again next year

I think I said earlier, any particular type of player we miss out on
there is likely to be a good one the next year

 

[Rookie]

Must admit I really really wish we could have gotten Melbournes pick 23 or similar back with Boyd, would have been nice

Don't worry, we'll get our revenge on GWS soon enough... in all likelihood we will have pick 1-3 in the PSD next year which will give us a bit of leverage when we only offer a second rounder for WHE

 

[Yojimbo]

I am wondering how many live draft picks we should take to the
November draft as we have Tom Boyd and Zaine Cordy who are
relative babies and Shane Biggs who is a 91 birth year already
locked in.Also with four spots open on the rookie list should we
pick two mature types off the DFA list and two best remaining
talent types for development.I am drawn to James Polkinghorne
maybe cause he has a weird name or maybe for his 92 games
and age profile 89 birth year.Maybe we are better sticking with the
kids re Brisbane it's hard to know.

 

[_M_16_]

Any chance we will draft any of the Footscray boys with our picks in the 40's instead of taking a gamble on an unknown? Assuming they can nominate for the main draft that is

 

[Hrovat24]

total football I'm curious to hear your thoughts on Hammelmann. Looking around he seems pretty divisive, with some seeing him as a late 20s pick at the latest and others thinking he could go undrafted.

I'll laugh if he doesn't get drafted

 

[Wizard17]

If we take any of the footscray boys it will be as rookies.

Any chance we will draft any of the Footscray boys with our picks in the 40's instead of taking a gamble on an unknown? Assuming they can nominate for the main draft that is