List Mgmt. 2014 Draft Prospects

[Barrels]

Are we seriously having a debate of having at least 1 gun fwd in the team??

we would not have got to those GF's if it wasn't in a large part to Roo's efforts. You still have to kick goals.

Even having an average Kosi up there made a massive difference to our structure.

And yet most people wanted Boyd last year... go figure.

Boyd was the dominant TAC Cup player (and pretty nationwide) at the time. None of the KPFs have dominated in the same way thus far, the closest to 'dominant' has been Petracca, hence everyone wants on board the bandwagon.

I'm as guilty as anyone.

 

[Defacto]

Are we seriously having a debate of having at least 1 gun fwd in the team??

we would not have got to those GF's if it wasn't in a large part to Roo's efforts. You still have to kick goals.

Even having an average Kosi up there made a massive difference to our structure.

And yet most people wanted Boyd last year... go figure.

yet we were still beaten by sides that had an inferior CHF

 

[Periphery]

Am I the only one that is getting a bit tired of this discussion? Seems like we have been going round and round in circles for ages.

 

[Manimal_Dunstan]

Am I the only one that is getting a bit tired of this discussion? Seems like we have been going round and round in circles for ages.

Definitely not.

I'll just back in the recruiters they know more then any of us put together.. So who ever they select i support no matter what.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

I would argue that Mooney was made to look very good by the midfield of that Cats team.

1 talented tall appears to be enough to win a GF. I would prefer to find that tall somewhere else in the draft, not because of talent but because of the mental application of supporters, the media and players.

Some people either don't see it or can't admit it but the Riewoldt mentality is killing us right now.

If we draft McCartin he will be anointed as the next Roo. Its already started in the media. He is the 'Chosen One' and that's the end of it.

The pressure to perform will be on from day 1. We think the Tom Lee shit is annoying? Pick 1 will be worse.

There are talented talls available deeper in the draft. We can build enough of a forward line to push back up the ladder with the likes of White, Lee, Bruce and hopefully Keitel, McKenzie and Jaksch.

I won't be upset if the club deems McCartin (or Wright) the best player, but if I had to make the pick I would be taking Petracca at #1 because I believe that he can have a bigger impact in a shorter time and that in the long run he will give the club more to work with than McCartin.

Mooney played in a good team. Did it make him look good? Probably but he was still a major component to their premiership winning teams. Not just the GF but getting there throughout the season. in '07 he was AA and kicked 67 goals...Another 45 in '09.

Finding quality talls outside of the first round into todays recruitment is not an easy task. The quality talls are far more obvious than the quality mids. Quality mids are often found anywhere in the draft. Quality talls are not. Then theres the argument for poaching a GWS tall. Who says they want to leave GWS let alone come to the Saints?

I agree the Riewoldt mentality is killing us. Lets not make the same mistake with McCartin if we indeed get him.

No doubt Petracca will have a bigger impact in a shorter period of time. He's a mid and they come on quicker. But we are in no hurry. Actually, we need to get a wriggle on picking a tall because he's likely not going to be ready for 3-4 years and that's when we are going to need one when we are competing again. We can't depend on Patton, Jaksch etc coming to the Saints as I stated earlier on in my post.

 

[Plugger_87]

yet we were still beaten by sides that had an inferior CHF

The ross lyon effect - concentrate on tackling and defensive pressure and dont worry bout kicking a score

 

[VDS66]

yet we were still beaten by sides that had an inferior CHF

No we were beaten by sides who were able to null our best forward and delivery. I am not arguing against midfielders, but you need a balance surely? As Last Emp pointed out that because talls take longer then we better grab him sooner rather than later. There are no guarantees that you can trade for one later. Whereas there are plenty of mids you can target via trade and FA in the coming years.

You say tomatoes I say tomatoes.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

Boyd was the dominant TAC Cup player (and pretty nationwide) at the time. None of the KPFs have dominated in the same way thus far, the closest to 'dominant' has been Petracca, hence everyone wants on board the bandwagon.

I'm as guilty as anyone.

Did you see the stats I posted earlier? Paddy is averaging more goals than Boyd. Lets see how the last month of the comp plays out. The gap may yet widen.

 

[VDS66]

Mooney played in a good team. Did it make him look good? Probably but he was still a major component to their premiership winning teams. Not just the GF but getting there throughout the season. in '07 he was AA and kicked 67 goals...Another 45 in '09.

Finding quality talls outside of the first round into todays recruitment is not an easy task. The quality talls are far more obvious than the quality mids. Quality mids are often found anywhere in the draft. Quality talls are not. Then theres the argument for poaching a GWS tall. Who says they want to leave GWS let alone come to the Saints?

I agree the Riewoldt mentality is killing us. Lets not make the same mistake with McCartin if we indeed get him.

No doubt Petracca will have a bigger impact in a shorter period of time. He's a mid and they come on quicker. But we are in no hurry. Actually, we need to get a wriggle on picking a tall because he's likely not going to be ready for 3-4 years and that's when we are going to need one when we are competing again. We can't depend on Patton, Jaksch etc coming to the Saints as I stated earlier on in my post.

we have a Roo mentality because Kosi was adissapointment and we have not had another option since GTrain retired. I never heard anyone complaing that we were too top heavy for KPF's whn they dominated.

Even in 2009, how many goals did Roo and Kosi kick between them??

 

[Defacto]

No we were beaten by sides who were able to null our best forward and delivery. I am not arguing against midfielders, but you need a balance surely? As Last Emp pointed out that because talls take longer then we better grab him sooner rather than later. There are no guarantees that you can trade for one later. Whereas there are plenty of mids you can target via trade and FA in the coming years.

You say tomatoes I say tomatoes.

how many sides win a grand final when their midfield is beaten...i cant recall one

how many sides win a grand final when their fwd line is the worst of the two...i can think of a few

 

[SaintsSeptember]

No we were beaten by sides who were able to null our best forward and delivery. I am not arguing against midfielders, but you need a balance surely? As Last Emp pointed out that because talls take longer then we better grab him sooner rather than later. There are no guarantees that you can trade for one later. Whereas there are plenty of mids you can target via trade and FA in the coming years.

You say tomatoes I say tomatoes.

yeah we really should have drafted another 4 or 5 good midfielders with some of our draft picks between 2003 and 2010.
Do you really need me to make a list of decent midfielders that were available to us and would have got us over the line.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

we have a Roo mentality because Kosi was adissapointment and we have not had another option since GTrain retired. I never heard anyone complaing that we were too top heavy for KPF's whn they dominated.

Even in 2009, how many goals did Roo and Kosi kick between them??

Agree, that's probably the main reason. We have no one else to take the load and the issue has become worse since Milne retired. A lot of footy was delivered his way. We obviously lack a bit of talent in the front half. Stanley still building up fitness after an injury riddled start to his career. Lee likewise. We need some continuity...And quality.

 

[Manimal_Dunstan]

Then theres the argument for poaching a GWS tall. Who says they want to leave GWS let alone come to the Saints?

Well done i now like you more because you have common sense.

Flogging GWS talls would have to be the most overused bullshit on bigfooty currently.

 

[VDS66]

Not sure what the argument is about... you need both and unless you want to do a Sydney with Tippett and Buddy then you have to take the best option at the time.
@ Saints Sept: Ben Cousins would have done for start...

At the time, Ball had lost his zing, X was useless so yeah we should have gone more mids. FFS we had G, Kosi and roo and they took Watts!

 

[Defacto]

Well done i now like you more because you have common sense.

Flogging GWS talls would have to be the most overused bullshit on bigfooty currently.

i agree, i cant see the AFL letting the other 17 teams siphoning off their top end talent. not unless they see elite stars going up there in return

 

[TheLastEmperor]

Well done i now like you more because you have common sense.

Flogging GWS talls would have to be the most overused bullshit on bigfooty currently.

Yup. It's a totally flawed argument saying skip McCartin cos we can grab a Patton or Cameron next year.

 

[Manimal_Dunstan]

i agree, i cant see the AFL letting the other 17 teams siphoning off their top end talent. not unless they see elite stars going up there in return

One of them "might" get away but i highly doubt it'll be to St Kilda considering what other clubs would be after them.. But reading over these threads people go on like it's guaranteed they'll be saints . I'd put money on either GWS keeping them all or if any leave it will not be to St Kilda. (Talking Boyd, Patton and Cameron obviously).

 

[Manimal_Dunstan]

Yup. It's a totally flawed argument saying skip McCartin cos we can grab a Patton or Cameron next year.

I might be old school or something but i think rebuilding teams should seriously build around key position players, they're bastards to find where as you can find midfielders, rucks, etc anywhere.

 

[Defacto]

I might be old school or something but i think rebuilding teams should seriously build around key position players, they're bastards to find where as you can find midfielders, rucks, etc anywhere.

that approach sure has helped the eagles recently

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I might be old school or something but i think rebuilding teams should seriously build around key position players, they're bastards to find where as you can find midfielders, rucks, etc anywhere.

Bastards to find and take twice as long to develop.

 

[Manimal_Dunstan]

that approach sure has helped the eagles recently

Who have they recruited to build the team around from the KPP department? there would be reasons for it and one of them is all they do is recruit WA players rarely ever draft quality players from Vic, SA, etc.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

that approach sure has helped the eagles recently

They do have a penchant for midfielders that are undersized and lousy kicks.

 

[Plugger_87]

how many sides win a grand final when their midfield is beaten...i cant recall one

how many sides win a grand final when their fwd line is the worst of the two...i can think of a few

and whats this got to do with Paddy McCartins defensive pressure/second efforts

 

[God Save Max King]

Am I the only one that is getting a bit tired of this discussion? Seems like we have been going round and round in circles for ages.

Definitely not.

I'll just back in the recruiters they know more then any of us put together.. So who ever they select i support no matter what.

It's a forum to discuss the footy club and what we could hypothetically do, no reason to not do that

I might be old school or something but i think rebuilding teams should seriously build around key position players, they're bastards to find where as you can find midfielders, rucks, etc anywhere.

Don't care what school it is that builds around KPPs, but sign me the hell up. The spine is the most important thing in football, I think we look like this at present -

Delaney
????
Dunstan
????
????
Billings

Could Bruce fill the CHF role? Who knows. For now, let's get proper a full forward then worry about the midfielders later, possibly as Free Agents. Money talks, for $50-100k extra I'd move to any club as a <22 year old trying to earn a living.

 

[Defacto]

Who have they recruited to build the team around from the KPP department? there would be reasons for it and one of them is all they do is recruit WA players rarely ever draft quality players from Vic, SA, etc.

the point is theyve taken mids in droves. not all have been from WA, they chose the best talent on offer. theyve ended up with a very good fwd line, good ruck division and were very good down back, prior to glass going.

KPP stocks have never been better, yet theyre shit. why? because those mids never came on and never replaced the likes of kerr, cousins, judd, fletcher, braun,