2018 Demons

[AmericanAFL]

Hello all. I'm in the process of looking for a team to support in 2019 and beyond. As part of that process I've begun to watch all 2018 games from teams I have an early interest in.

First up was Melbourne/Geelong round 1. I'll probably have a lot more thoughts to post, but as I've just finished watching my immediate thoughts all come down to:

WTF GAWN!

 

[harry000]

Hello all. I'm in the process of looking for a team to support in 2019 and beyond. As part of that process I've begun to watch all 2018 games from teams I have an early interest in.

First up was Melbourne/Geelong round 1. I'll probably have a lot more thoughts to post, but as I've just finished watching my immediate thoughts all come down to:

WTF GAWN!

I'm confused.

Did you choose Melbourne to support?

Or come here to troll?

 

[00Stinger]

I'm confused.

Did you choose Melbourne to support?

Or come here to troll?

 

[AmericanAFL]

I'm confused.

Did you choose Melbourne to support?

Or come here to troll?

Not trolling. I'm looking for a team to follow and from the games I have watched the Demons are a contender for my support.

in spite of the fact that this game ended 9 months ago, I was gutted when Gawn missed.

 

[Topkent]

Not trolling. I'm looking for a team to follow and from the games I have watched the Demons are a contender for my support.

in spite of the fact that this game ended 9 months ago, I was gutted when Gawn missed.

Yeah. Wait till we play Geelong the second time for a heartwarming finish.

 

[AmericanAFL]

Yeah. Wait till we play Geelong the second time for a heartwarming finish.

Haha. I've seen that one... and the finals match too!

Edit- after being really upset about that Gawn miss, and knowing how their second game went , I realized how special that finals win must have been for Dees fans.

 

[harry000]

Haha. I've seen that one... and the finals match too!

Edit- after being really upset about that Gawn miss, and knowing how their second game went , I realized how special that finals win must have been for Dees fans.

It was extremely special! MCG hasn't been that full of Melbourne supporters for a long time.

I suspect by your avatar you are choosing between Melbourne and three of my most hated clubs in Collingwood, West Coast and Essendon! Geelong rounding out my top 4.

 

[rhaz]

This video will give you an idea of the depths that we've risen from (and it's probably not too late to get on board).

 

[FootyGuy13]

Make sure that when you get up to our second game against St. Kinda this year, you replace it with our West Coast game from last year.

 

[Topkent]

This video will give you an idea of the depths that we've risen from (and it's probably not too late to get on board).

Reckon that video doesn't even come close to doing justice to what we faced as supporters in the last decade.

 

[Topkent]

Haha. I've seen that one... and the finals match too!

Edit- after being really upset about that Gawn miss, and knowing how their second game went , I realized how special that finals win must have been for Dees fans.

Mate I know you are going to decide on your own but just to let you know

Collingwood are the Manchester Utd of Australia, they are the La Lakers, the New England patriots.
You either love them or hate them. They are powerful and defisive. Rich and powerful and never too far away from success. They are also our historical rivals stretching back to the 50s and 60s

Essendon are also powerful, however they were found guilty of doping only 3 years ago and aren't exactly a club to be proud of right now. Exciting team though.

WC are massively powerful, 4 flags in the 30 odd years they've existed and seemingly never to far away. Massive supporter base in the West of Australia and you'll see plenty of wins no matter what. Arguably the most successful club in Aus.

Melbourne.... the most powerful club in the 60s we won a **** load of premierships in the 50s and 60s up until 1965 when we decided to sack our greatest coach in history Norm Smith. ( the best player in the grand final wins the medal named after him)

After we sacked him, we went from the biggest club in footy to missing finals for 23 years straight 1965-1987 ( the curse of norm Smith)
When we finally made it, we were one kick away from making the grand final but our now passed away former President Jim Stynes gave away a 15m penalty after the final siren which caused Gary Buckenara to be moved close enough to take a maybe kick into a much more certain one which he kicked and knocked us out of the finals.

We made 2 grand finals inbetween 88-06, in both those years we played arguably the 2 greatest teams of all time and were destroyed in both ( Hawks 88, Essendon 00)

The best player many think they have seen in Melbourne colours David Schwarz broke out and was running the competition in 93 before doing his ACL 3 times and losing all mobility. He never hit his potential.

In 2007 we sacked our coach and decided to go down the path of tanking (playing for draft picks to rebuild the side)

By 2013 we were almost out of existence, we won 4 games in 2 seasons, regularly lost by over 100 points and lost by 186 to Geelong in 2011 in a game many think the players deliberately lost.

Our Number 1 draft pick left for GWS after 2 seasons, our president passed away, one of our legends Robbie Flower passed away, our former coach of 2008-11 passed away. Our last coach to take us to a grand final Neale Daniher was diagnosed with motor neurone disease and is slowly dying in front of us on TV.
Myself and many other fans thought the club would fold. Halfway through 2013 we were almost all ready to give up

We missed finals from 2007 until 2018. In 2017 we were in the pole position to make finals before losing the final round to Collingwood and then WC beating Adelaide in the final game of the season which cause us to miss finals by the smallest percentage ever in the sports history.

To make matters worse west Coasts total scores for an against for the season were 1964 and 1858
The years of our last premiership and the year we were founded. You couldn't script that shit.

I've forgotten alot of things but Melbourne supporters have gone through hurt like no others.

The release of emotion after we beat Geelong was something else, I bloody wept when I realized we were gonna win because I hadn't seen Melbourne be anything other than a disgrace for most of my life. Imagine the poor bastards who didn't see us play finals for 23 years.

 

[Demonkings]

Mate I know you are going to decide on your own but just to let you know

Collingwood are the Manchester Utd of Australia, they are the La Lakers, the New England patriots.
You either love them or hate them. They are powerful and defisive. Rich and powerful and never too far away from success. They are also our historical rivals stretching back to the 50s and 60s

Essendon are also powerful, however they were found guilty of doping only 3 years ago and aren't exactly a club to be proud of right now. Exciting team though.

WC are massively powerful, 4 flags in the 30 odd years they've existed and seemingly never to far away. Massive supporter base in the West of Australia and you'll see plenty of wins no matter what. Arguably the most successful club in Aus.

Melbourne.... the most powerful club in the 60s we won a **** load of premierships in the 50s and 60s up until 1965 when we decided to sack our greatest coach in history Norm Smith. ( the best player in the grand final wins the medal named after him)

After we sacked him, we went from the biggest club in footy to missing finals for 23 years straight 1965-1987 ( the curse of norm Smith)
When we finally made it, we were one kick away from making the grand final but our now passed away former President Jim Stynes gave away a 15m penalty after the final siren which caused Gary Buckenara to be moved close enough to take a maybe kick into a much more certain one which he kicked and knocked us out of the finals.

We made 2 grand finals inbetween 88-06, in both those years we played arguably the 2 greatest teams of all time and were destroyed in both ( Hawks 88, Essendon 00)

The best player many think they have seen in Melbourne colours David Schwarz broke out and was running the competition in 93 before doing his ACL 3 times and losing all mobility. He never hit his potential.

In 2007 we sacked our coach and decided to go down the path of tanking (playing for draft picks to rebuild the side)

By 2013 we were almost out of existence, we won 4 games in 2 seasons, regularly lost by over 100 points and lost by 186 to Geelong in 2011 in a game many think the players deliberately lost.

Our Number 1 draft pick left for GWS after 2 seasons, our president passed away, one of our legends Robbie Flower passed away, our former coach of 2008-11 passed away. Our last coach to take us to a grand final Neale Daniher was diagnosed with motor neurone disease and is slowly dying in front of us on TV.
Myself and many other fans thought the club would fold. Halfway through 2013 we were almost all ready to give up

We missed finals from 2007 until 2018. In 2017 we were in the pole position to make finals before losing the final round to Collingwood and then WC beating Adelaide in the final game of the season which cause us to miss finals by the smallest percentage ever in the sports history.

To make matters worse west Coasts total scores for an against for the season were 1964 and 1858
The years of our last premiership and the year we were founded. You couldn't script that shit.

I've forgotten alot of things but Melbourne supporters have gone through hurt like no others.

The release of emotion after we beat Geelong was something else, I bloody wept when I realized we were gonna win because I hadn't seen Melbourne be anything other than a disgrace for most of my life. Imagine the poor bastards who didn't see us play finals for 23 years.

Good summation, Topkent. It’s interesting times being a Melbourne supporter right now, that’s for sure. AmericanAFL, we were hands down the worst club in the league from 07-15, but we’ve emerged out of this period with what I will personally say is the most promising player roster (what we call a playing list) that we’ve ever had in my lifetime. We have a great mix of young stars and some more established talent that are leading the club in the right direction. I think none of us Melbourne supporters can dare believe it, since we’ve seen so many false dawns but the list we have now should end our premiership drought sometime in the next few seasons.

Not that it’s a given though, clubs like Collingwood, Essendon and West Coast are all accustomed to success and look as if they will all be challenging for flags in the near future. But if you want to support the underdog then get on us, because those three are the big boys of the league and it looks like we’ll be slugging it out with them for flags over the next few years.

 

[harry000]

Mate I know you are going to decide on your own but just to let you know

Collingwood are the Manchester Utd of Australia, they are the La Lakers, the New England patriots.
You either love them or hate them. They are powerful and defisive. Rich and powerful and never too far away from success. They are also our historical rivals stretching back to the 50s and 60s

Essendon are also powerful, however they were found guilty of doping only 3 years ago and aren't exactly a club to be proud of right now. Exciting team though.

WC are massively powerful, 4 flags in the 30 odd years they've existed and seemingly never to far away. Massive supporter base in the West of Australia and you'll see plenty of wins no matter what. Arguably the most successful club in Aus.

Melbourne.... the most powerful club in the 60s we won a **** load of premierships in the 50s and 60s up until 1965 when we decided to sack our greatest coach in history Norm Smith. ( the best player in the grand final wins the medal named after him)

After we sacked him, we went from the biggest club in footy to missing finals for 23 years straight 1965-1987 ( the curse of norm Smith)
When we finally made it, we were one kick away from making the grand final but our now passed away former President Jim Stynes gave away a 15m penalty after the final siren which caused Gary Buckenara to be moved close enough to take a maybe kick into a much more certain one which he kicked and knocked us out of the finals.

We made 2 grand finals inbetween 88-06, in both those years we played arguably the 2 greatest teams of all time and were destroyed in both ( Hawks 88, Essendon 00)

The best player many think they have seen in Melbourne colours David Schwarz broke out and was running the competition in 93 before doing his ACL 3 times and losing all mobility. He never hit his potential.

In 2007 we sacked our coach and decided to go down the path of tanking (playing for draft picks to rebuild the side)

By 2013 we were almost out of existence, we won 4 games in 2 seasons, regularly lost by over 100 points and lost by 186 to Geelong in 2011 in a game many think the players deliberately lost.

Our Number 1 draft pick left for GWS after 2 seasons, our president passed away, one of our legends Robbie Flower passed away, our former coach of 2008-11 passed away. Our last coach to take us to a grand final Neale Daniher was diagnosed with motor neurone disease and is slowly dying in front of us on TV.
Myself and many other fans thought the club would fold. Halfway through 2013 we were almost all ready to give up

We missed finals from 2007 until 2018. In 2017 we were in the pole position to make finals before losing the final round to Collingwood and then WC beating Adelaide in the final game of the season which cause us to miss finals by the smallest percentage ever in the sports history.

To make matters worse west Coasts total scores for an against for the season were 1964 and 1858
The years of our last premiership and the year we were founded. You couldn't script that shit.

I've forgotten alot of things but Melbourne supporters have gone through hurt like no others.

The release of emotion after we beat Geelong was something else, I bloody wept when I realized we were gonna win because I hadn't seen Melbourne be anything other than a disgrace for most of my life. Imagine the poor bastards who didn't see us play finals for 23 years.

Topkent, always careful to not let emotion control his assessment of things. Something I respect.

So I, as an emotional campaigner will add a little more sauce about the other three clubs (I think Topkent has gone easy on them).

1. Collingwood - correct, they are a powerhouse like the franchises you mentioned. Their president is an Australian Donald Trump, albeit probably a bit smarter than Trump. Every now and then his true colours shine though letting our racist and inappropriate remarks. Collingwood's fan base is absolutely feral. There are fights in the crowd before, during, on the way home from games quite consistently when this club is involved. They are everyones club they love to hate. But I prefer them as a team to Essendon and West Coast (I just don't like their fans).

2. Essendon - not only got caught doping. But they arguably actually came out the better for it. Spent one year at the bottom of the ladder and got themselves some handy draft picks and due to AFL favouritism of clubs with a larger fan base they were basically assisted by AFL advertising and AFL run media pumping up their come back as if it is the resurrection of Jesus. Despite disgracing the competition they have been awarded more 'marquee' match ups and prime time slots since it happened and their membership has actually grown. I find this very frustrating.

3. West Coast - Always plenty of wins is correct. They have a home fortress like no other in Australia. Packed with booing fans that literally scare the umpires into paying decisions in their favor. Topkent will argue that umpires have no impact on games but I don't think this is true over West. The Eagles free kick (penalty) differential is plus 919 over the last ten years. The next closest team is plus 472!!! Yes, some years they are strong (obviously winning the premiership this year proves that). However, they are quite often just making up the numbers and appear to be better than they actually are with their win-loss differential skewed due to their home ground advantage. Also, anyone that has been to a game in Perth can confirm that their supporters are the worst in the AFL.

 

[AmericanAFL]

This video will give you an idea of the depths that we've risen from (and it's probably not too late to get on board).

Mate I know you are going to decide on your own but just to let you know

Collingwood are the Manchester Utd of Australia, they are the La Lakers, the New England patriots.
You either love them or hate them. They are powerful and defisive. Rich and powerful and never too far away from success. They are also our historical rivals stretching back to the 50s and 60s

Essendon are also powerful, however they were found guilty of doping only 3 years ago and aren't exactly a club to be proud of right now. Exciting team though.

WC are massively powerful, 4 flags in the 30 odd years they've existed and seemingly never to far away. Massive supporter base in the West of Australia and you'll see plenty of wins no matter what. Arguably the most successful club in Aus.

Melbourne.... the most powerful club in the 60s we won a **** load of premierships in the 50s and 60s up until 1965 when we decided to sack our greatest coach in history Norm Smith. ( the best player in the grand final wins the medal named after him)

After we sacked him, we went from the biggest club in footy to missing finals for 23 years straight 1965-1987 ( the curse of norm Smith)
When we finally made it, we were one kick away from making the grand final but our now passed away former President Jim Stynes gave away a 15m penalty after the final siren which caused Gary Buckenara to be moved close enough to take a maybe kick into a much more certain one which he kicked and knocked us out of the finals.

We made 2 grand finals inbetween 88-06, in both those years we played arguably the 2 greatest teams of all time and were destroyed in both ( Hawks 88, Essendon 00)

The best player many think they have seen in Melbourne colours David Schwarz broke out and was running the competition in 93 before doing his ACL 3 times and losing all mobility. He never hit his potential.

In 2007 we sacked our coach and decided to go down the path of tanking (playing for draft picks to rebuild the side)

By 2013 we were almost out of existence, we won 4 games in 2 seasons, regularly lost by over 100 points and lost by 186 to Geelong in 2011 in a game many think the players deliberately lost.

Our Number 1 draft pick left for GWS after 2 seasons, our president passed away, one of our legends Robbie Flower passed away, our former coach of 2008-11 passed away. Our last coach to take us to a grand final Neale Daniher was diagnosed with motor neurone disease and is slowly dying in front of us on TV.
Myself and many other fans thought the club would fold. Halfway through 2013 we were almost all ready to give up

We missed finals from 2007 until 2018. In 2017 we were in the pole position to make finals before losing the final round to Collingwood and then WC beating Adelaide in the final game of the season which cause us to miss finals by the smallest percentage ever in the sports history.

To make matters worse west Coasts total scores for an against for the season were 1964 and 1858
The years of our last premiership and the year we were founded. You couldn't script that shit.

I've forgotten alot of things but Melbourne supporters have gone through hurt like no others.

The release of emotion after we beat Geelong was something else, I bloody wept when I realized we were gonna win because I hadn't seen Melbourne be anything other than a disgrace for most of my life. Imagine the poor bastards who didn't see us play finals for 23 years.

This is amazing.

I'm actually speechless mate.

 

[AmericanAFL]

Make sure that when you get up to our second game against St. Kinda this year, you replace it with our West Coast game from last year.

I'm sure this is a joke that is over my head. I actually saw the game at WC (round 22 I think??) and it was one of the games that got me interested in the Dees. I haven't seen the prelim at WC, although I've heard about it.

So I guess I'm a little curious which one you suggest I swap out for the Saints game!?

 

[FootyGuy13]

I'm sure this is a joke that is over my head. I actually saw the game at WC (round 22 I think??) and it was one of the games that got me interested in the Dees. I haven't seen the prelim at WC, although I've heard about it.

So I guess I'm a little curious which one you suggest I swap out for the Saints game!?

The game I was referring to was West Coast v Melbourne in Round 14 of the 2017 season.
If I could throw other games in from the Roos-Goodwin era, it'd be:
Round 12 v Collingwood, 2017
Round 1 v St. Kilda, 2017
Round 20 v Hawthorn, 2016
Round 12 v Geelong, 2015
Round 13 v Essendon, 2014
And any win we've had against Adelaide at Adelaide Oval. Nothing against them, we've just had weird success against Adelaide at Adelaide Oval.

 

[Spirit of 26]

Welcome. Let’s share the misery around.

 

[mrmonkey]

Mate I know you are going to decide on your own but just to let you know

Collingwood are the Manchester Utd of Australia, they are the La Lakers, the New England patriots.
You either love them or hate them. They are powerful and defisive. Rich and powerful and never too far away from success. They are also our historical rivals stretching back to the 50s and 60s

Essendon are also powerful, however they were found guilty of doping only 3 years ago and aren't exactly a club to be proud of right now. Exciting team though.

WC are massively powerful, 4 flags in the 30 odd years they've existed and seemingly never to far away. Massive supporter base in the West of Australia and you'll see plenty of wins no matter what. Arguably the most successful club in Aus.

Melbourne.... the most powerful club in the 60s we won a **** load of premierships in the 50s and 60s up until 1965 when we decided to sack our greatest coach in history Norm Smith. ( the best player in the grand final wins the medal named after him)

After we sacked him, we went from the biggest club in footy to missing finals for 23 years straight 1965-1987 ( the curse of norm Smith)
When we finally made it, we were one kick away from making the grand final but our now passed away former President Jim Stynes gave away a 15m penalty after the final siren which caused Gary Buckenara to be moved close enough to take a maybe kick into a much more certain one which he kicked and knocked us out of the finals.

We made 2 grand finals inbetween 88-06, in both those years we played arguably the 2 greatest teams of all time and were destroyed in both ( Hawks 88, Essendon 00)

The best player many think they have seen in Melbourne colours David Schwarz broke out and was running the competition in 93 before doing his ACL 3 times and losing all mobility. He never hit his potential.

In 2007 we sacked our coach and decided to go down the path of tanking (playing for draft picks to rebuild the side)

By 2013 we were almost out of existence, we won 4 games in 2 seasons, regularly lost by over 100 points and lost by 186 to Geelong in 2011 in a game many think the players deliberately lost.

Our Number 1 draft pick left for GWS after 2 seasons, our president passed away, one of our legends Robbie Flower passed away, our former coach of 2008-11 passed away. Our last coach to take us to a grand final Neale Daniher was diagnosed with motor neurone disease and is slowly dying in front of us on TV.
Myself and many other fans thought the club would fold. Halfway through 2013 we were almost all ready to give up

We missed finals from 2007 until 2018. In 2017 we were in the pole position to make finals before losing the final round to Collingwood and then WC beating Adelaide in the final game of the season which cause us to miss finals by the smallest percentage ever in the sports history.

To make matters worse west Coasts total scores for an against for the season were 1964 and 1858
The years of our last premiership and the year we were founded. You couldn't script that shit.

I've forgotten alot of things but Melbourne supporters have gone through hurt like no others.

The release of emotion after we beat Geelong was something else, I bloody wept when I realized we were gonna win because I hadn't seen Melbourne be anything other than a disgrace for most of my life. Imagine the poor bastards who didn't see us play finals for 23 years.

For an American comparisons our norm smith curse is the babe Ruth curse, ironically both teams wear red sox.

 

[AmericanAFL]

How best to view the round 2 win at Brisbane?

Concerning final 3 quarters after a fantastic opening quarter... or terrific interstate win in harsh, humid elements after blowing a huge early lead?

Hogan was great- how big a concern is his loss?

Where is Viney? Was he injured to start the season?

A few random thoughts:

I was just settling into a mood of "wow, you can always count on Jones", and then he immediately had a poor kick at a really bad moment.

I don't know the game well enough to really know but it looked to this rookie's eye that the tackle on Fritch was a bit dirty.

I've watched several dozen AFL games as a neutral. The experience goes to a whole new level when you have a rooting interest. Really a great game.

 

[FootyGuy13]

How best to view the round 2 win at Brisbane?

Concerning final 3 quarters after a fantastic opening quarter... or terrific interstate win in harsh, humid elements after blowing a huge early lead?

Hogan was great- how big a concern is his loss?

Where is Viney? Was he injured to start the season?

A few random thoughts:

I was just settling into a mood of "wow, you can always count on Jones", and then he immediately had a poor kick at a really bad moment.

I don't know the game well enough to really know but it looked to this rookie's eye that the tackle on Fritch was a bit dirty.

I've watched several dozen AFL games as a neutral. The experience goes to a whole new level when you have a rooting interest. Really a great game.

At the time, it was seen as a HUGE wasted opportunity to get a percentage boost from a bottom-4 side. Now that the season is over, we still nearly lost a game where we had a seven-goal lead, it was 1 point from being Brisbane's biggest loss at home this year, their first season since the last time they made finals (play-offs) that they hadn't had a 5-goal loss at home

Considering how well we did in finals this year, the loss of Hogan became less of a concern but still a bit of a blow. The concensus was that Hogan had become too predictable by the end of the season.

Viney comes back in Round 9 v Carlton, first big game comes a week later v Adelaide.

Nathan Jones was Melbourne's one and only rock through the dark ages of 2007-2017, 2018 was the first season of showing his age (though the disposal count and Melbourne's coaching staff don't know that)

Fritsch was going for a mark, so any attempt of a tackle (or whatever that was) would've nearly gotten penalised with a free kick.

 

[Headless]

Going to enjoy this thread. Welcome to the best game in the world, and good luck with your decision.

 

[Topkent]

How best to view the round 2 win at Brisbane?

Concerning final 3 quarters after a fantastic opening quarter... or terrific interstate win in harsh, humid elements after blowing a huge early lead?

Hogan was great- how big a concern is his loss?

Where is Viney? Was he injured to start the season?

A few random thoughts:

I was just settling into a mood of "wow, you can always count on Jones", and then he immediately had a poor kick at a really bad moment.

I don't know the game well enough to really know but it looked to this rookie's eye that the tackle on Fritch was a bit dirty.

I've watched several dozen AFL games as a neutral. The experience goes to a whole new level when you have a rooting interest. Really a great game.

I think with hindsight Brisbane were a good side and it was a good win. Early season form is hard to read as teams can tire.

I'm biased on Hogan but reality is we have no idea how big his loss is. Tom McDonald was injured for that game and he is our first choice FF.

Yeah Viney had some planta fascia issues so missed the first 6 or 7 weeks.

Nathan Jones isn't the most talented player but when we were losing by 100 points every week he was busting a gut for our footy club. He's untouchable for some, played a full season a couple years ago needing a neck fusion. He's a Melbourne champion.

 

[dee_mac]

The experience goes to a whole new level when you have a rooting interest.

Agree. There are better websites than BigFooty to satisfy those interests though.

 

[AmericanAFL]

Going to enjoy this thread. Welcome to the best game in the world, and good luck with your decision.

Thanks mate. I would say I'm 75% in for the Dees at the moment. There's a strong chance they're the team. TopKent and Harry made strong cases against the others (they are arguments I'd already considered honestly).

An additional mark against the Eagles is that I had a strong preference going in to choose a Vic side, for a few reasons. One being the obvious fact that it's a Vic-centric competition. If I ever do get down to Australia for a match or two, it makes sense to be where the most footy action is. Secondly, I'd like to watch as many games as possible live, and the game times for the Vic games seem to give me better and more frequent opportunities for that.

My biggest and maybe only remaining reason for keeping Collingwood in the mix is Cox.

Essendon played in the first game I happened to see on tv 4-5 years ago and Daniher was electric, and that's why they remain in the mix. The drug scandal, however, is a big negative.

As for the Dees, I've been a Philadelphia sports fan my whole life, and I would venture that on the whole, that experience seems to be very similar to what you Dee fans have experienced and lived with your team.

Cheers.

 

[AmericanAFL]

I think with hindsight Brisbane were a good side and it was a good win. Early season form is hard to read as teams can tire.

I'm biased on Hogan but reality is we have no idea how big his loss is. Tom McDonald was injured for that game and he is our first choice FF.

Yeah Viney had some planta fascia issues so missed the first 6 or 7 weeks.

Nathan Jones isn't the most talented player but when we were losing by 100 points every week he was busting a gut for our footy club. He's untouchable for some, played a full season a couple years ago needing a neck fusion. He's a Melbourne champion.

Is your Hogan bias positive or negative? I don't think McDonald has been in any of the Dees games I've watched so far, but if he's a central piece of the list I'm looking forward to seeing him play.

Great info on Jones- I'm definitely a fan.