List Mgmt. 2024 List Management Part 2 📃

[BringFevBack2021]

We have too many mids that can't hit an i50 target... Kennedy is unfortunately the worst of them in that regard.

Yes, he's a great team player, plays wherever, but really what's his alternative? "Nah, Vossy, I don't wanna play forward this week" come on...

He was visibly pissed off at being subbed out, which I totally get given there were at least 5 other blokes that should've been given the vest ahead of him... the outcome of the game didn't hinge on that decision though...

His versatility is likely to be his most attractive trait for other clubs. If we aren't satisfied with what they're offering for him, he will remain a Carlton player as he is still contracted.

Think about this though, come opening round 2025 our forwards will likely be a mix of:

Harry, Charlie, Williams, JSOS, Kemp, Moir, Fogarty, Motlop (assuming Owies is gone too)

Our backs:

Weiters, Newman, Saad, Gov, Haynes, Cowan, new KPD (of course assuming we have a new KPD lined up in light of encouraging Young to look elsewhere)

So that means he can only play mid... that means:

Cripps, Walsh, Hewett, Cerra, Kennedy as the mainstays

That mix is not working. The club have rightly identified this.

+ B Campo is a centre bounce midfielder

Also Binns and Lord look likely to be 1’s players in that role eventually

 

[Skull Face]

Fantasy.

Even in strong drafts the whole system is a lottery.

Our flag window is open now.

Adding an all Australian is a no brainer.

Was Mcgovern worth pick 14?
Saad worth pick 8?
Cerra worth pick 6?

Our drafting being terrible hides the fact the only way to get the guy worth two 1st round picks with 1 is to draft well, we would have been far better served going to the draft and using the cash to get fringe players that cover a weakness like Acres then trying to top up early and being left with no young talent to drive competition and jump from the pack.

I don't think a couple of years of Houstan is worth it personally.

 

[Benaly28]

Houston said as much he was staying then met 4 other clubs goes on all the time.


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[T2B_]

Worst kick inside 50 in the entire afl.

Really? Not disputing it, just surprises me as I thought I'd seen him hit up a few really decent ones, but I guess I've forgotten all the ineffective ones.

 

[The Bighouse]

I like the way Kennedy plays hard - he's a booming kick and a strong mark.

However, as evidenced by the season...we can't afford to play Cripps, Hewett and Kennedy in the same midfield. Kennedy has said he sees himself as a midfielder. Sounds like both parties are in agreeance that it's in his best interests to find a team who wants him as a midfielder.

Cripps isn't leaving. So it's out of Kennedy vs Hewett as to who takes the other midfielder spot....
It's not an easy decision, both it is a decision which needed to be made.

It’s ironic, pretty sure on Vossy’s arrival MK was told he was an inside midfielder (he questioned what about a forward = no, inside mid), now the roles have reversed and versatility is king.

Have a look around at your options will hopefully only end with a departure if the return is beneficial for us in our overall list moves.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Was Mcgovern worth pick 14?
Saad worth pick 8?
Cerra worth pick 6?

Our drafting being terrible hides the fact the only way to get the guy worth two 1st round picks with 1 is to draft well, we would have been far better served going to the draft and using the cash to get fringe players that cover a weakness like Acres then trying to top up early and being left with no young talent to drive competition and jump from the pack.

I don't think a couple of years of Houstan is worth it personally.

Houston could quite easily play 6 or so years for us. Not sure it will only be a couple

 

[Wickzki]

I really like Zita but he's gone a bit OTT here

If you think that's OTT then you should see social media with club stakeholders.

If anything Zita's hit the nail on the head when it comes to internal sentiment

Have a feeling this one will play out quite publicly.

Might be one of those times we need to judge it by the final cumulative list outcome.

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

We have too many mids that can't hit an i50 target... Kennedy is unfortunately the worst of them in that regard.

Yes, he's a great team player, plays wherever, but really what's his alternative? "Nah, Vossy, I don't wanna play forward this week" come on...

He was visibly pissed off at being subbed out, which I totally get given there were at least 5 other blokes that should've been given the vest ahead of him... the outcome of the game didn't hinge on that decision though...

His versatility is likely to be his most attractive trait for other clubs. If we aren't satisfied with what they're offering for him, he will remain a Carlton player as he is still contracted.

Think about this though, come opening round 2025 our forwards will likely be a mix of:

Harry, Charlie, Williams, JSOS, Kemp, Moir, Fogarty, Motlop (assuming Owies is gone too)

Our backs:

Weiters, Newman, Saad, Gov, Haynes, Cowan, new KPD (of course assuming we have a new KPD lined up in light of encouraging Young to look elsewhere)

So that means he can only play mid... that means:

Cripps, Walsh, Hewett, Cerra, Kennedy as the mainstays

That mix is not working. The club have rightly identified this.

That mix is A ok if Cerra and Walsh aren't carrying injuries....

 

[djw1952]

The club is already ok with moving on Kennedy as we have too many inside mids and you want Kemp to be thrown in there too? It could work out but I’d much rather settle him forward where he looks way more natural than in defence. He can run and jump and utilise his natural assets. In defence he still tries to mark instead of spoil and he has a hard time curbing his natural instincts. He may also make it as an intercepting defender but the alleged acquisition of Haynes to me suggests they prefer Kemp forward and will persist with that. Forward is the go for him. Third tall and pushing up a bit higher. The bigger issue is getting some quicker, more dangerous smalls at the feet of Charlie, Harry and Kemp to balance it out.

Agree that Kemp is dodgy down back for the reasons you put up, but those same instincts could be used in the midfield, and he isn`t slow like most of our mids. Leave him up forward for now perhaps but do not rule him out of a midfield role either.....pace is what we need around the ball right now imo

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

I know I've posted some whacky trade hypotheticals in my time but bloody hell I'm glad the list teams going in the direction I was hoping for.

List has massive limitations despite being stacked for talent. A refresh/rebalance was and is needed. If we can play our cards right with the departures and ins I think we are really set up well for a crack at the flag in the next 24 months.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Apart from Haynes and Houston, I think we have our eyes on a ready made small forward and KPD

A couple small forwards come to mind, no firm idea on the KPD

With no insider knowledge on the matter, I have a feeling Butts or Murray could be gettable from Adelaide. Already stacked for KPD options, we'd be able to guarantee a number of theirs consistent games next year.

Butts specifically is a lockdown key back who would open up Weitering to go berserk up the field a bit more.

Switkowski or Konstanty possible names for small forward but once again, no idea what will happen in that space.

 

[Blue By Blood]

Agree that Kemp is dodgy down back for the reasons you put up, but those same instincts could be used in the midfield, and he isn`t slow like most of our mids. Leave him up forward for now perhaps but do not rule him out of a midfield role either.....pace is what we need around the ball right now imo

I wouldn’t rule it out but I think he should be settled up forward and given that opportunity now. He definitely looks more natural there. Voss won’t run him through the middle as he loves running the same core guys through there rightly to wrongly.

I don’t think pace around the ball is the biggest issue. I think ball use off half back (hence chasing Houston) and quicker small forwards is more important. An extra pacy midfielder would be very handy don’t get me wrong but the issue is ball retention which hurts us both setting up attacking play off half back and then defending the turnover from poor forward 50 entry which makes out mids look pedestrian. Quicker smalls could apply more pressure and trap it in there. But ball retention is the biggest thing.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

I wouldn’t rule it out but I think he should be settled up forward and given that opportunity now. He definitely looks more natural there. Voss won’t run him through the middle as he loves running the same core guys through there rightly to wrongly.

I don’t think pace around the ball is the biggest issue. I think ball use off half back (hence chasing Houston) and quicker small forwards is more important. An extra pacy midfielder would be very handy don’t get me wrong but the issue is ball retention which hurts us both setting up attacking play off half back and then defending the turnover from poor forward 50 entry which makes out mids look pedestrian. Quicker smalls could apply more pressure and trap it in there. But ball retention is the biggest thing.

I agree. Leave Kemp forward, unless of course we have our eye on a tall forward…

 

[The Bighouse]

If you think that's OTT then you should see social media with club stakeholders.

If anything Zita's hit the nail on the head when it comes to internal sentiment

Have a feeling this one will play out quite publicly.

Might be one of those times we need to judge it by the final cumulative list outcome.

He’s contracted. He wants to play midfield and we don’t see a role there for him moving forward.

If you’re seeking a midfield role, have a look around, if nothing is out there, we’ll see you back here for pre-season.

We need list changes to better our mix of player types, those with some currency but deficiencies for our overall list makeup are on the market.

 

[Pater44]

SOS down back to help weitering. Kemp forward.

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[HereComesJuddy]

SOS down back to help weitering. Kemp forward.

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Don’t think JSOS will be going back

 

[The Flying Doormat]

We seriously could bring in Jesus Christ and journos would still find a way to pick us apart.

In fairness, we'd be listing him as 1-2 weeks around Easter time.

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Switkowski, to me, is a very poor man's Matt Owies....

 

[Arr0w]

With no insider knowledge on the matter, I have a feeling Butts or Murray could be gettable from Adelaide. Already stacked for KPD options, we'd be able to guarantee a number of theirs consistent games next year.

Butts specifically is a lockdown key back who would open up Weitering to go berserk up the field a bit more.

Switkowski or Konstanty possible names for small forward but once again, no idea what will happen in that space.

Butts or Murray would be nice and Young is an Adelaide boy

Wondering if we revisit Wicks

 

[Arr0w]

In fairness, we'd be listing him as 1-2 weeks around Easter time.

Nailed it

 

[Michael Jezz]

Micheal, Touhy was 27 turning 28 in his first season with Geelong a whopping 6 months younger than what Houston would be.

My list is mostly keys or low salaries? Which one is it? I listed 7 players, four of them aren’t key position players, so they’re mostly not keys.

As for low salaries, do you think danger is on a low salary? Cameron on $900,000 is low?

I’m doubtful that Geelong targeted these guys, paid for them using 1st round picks and then paid them peanuts.

You did not understand my point.
Most of Geelongs trades if they paid high salaries and draft picks were for keys and mids. Carlton will be taking on an enormous risk paying 11 + a high salary for Houston. You were right about Thouy's age but it was a 350 to 400k deal for pick 16. Houston is not worth it.

 

[Arr0w]

You did not understand my point.
Most of Geelongs trades if they paid high salaries and draft picks were for keys and mids. Carlton will be taking on an enormous risk paying 11 + a high salary for Houston. You were right about Thouy's age but it was a 350 to 400k deal for pick 16. Houston is not worth it.

No one has decided Houston will cost pick 11

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Nailed it

No chance we go after Stone now. JC not a fan of Stones

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

If Houston costs 11 he isn't worth it imo. I'd imagine thats why we're moving other players on as per reports.

There will be some seriously good players available at our pick this year, Berry/Houston/Travaglia/Lindsay + Houston would be a fantastic couple of additions to our list. For the right prices of course.

 

[carlton_99]

If you think that's OTT then you should see social media with club stakeholders.

If anything Zita's hit the nail on the head when it comes to internal sentiment

Have a feeling this one will play out quite publicly.

Might be one of those times we need to judge it by the final cumulative list outcome.

I don't think his view would be unique - I just think linking that situation to a player that just wants more opportunity in his primary position is a bit extreme. Kennedy-like moves for better opportunity happen every off-season