News 2024 St.Kilda Media Thread

[g_TRAIN]

I didn't mind our style last year. When we were up and about we were good to watch despite not being a high scoring team.

If we had better players, playing that same style we would score enough to satisfy me.

But right now I agree with everyone its yuk,.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

As much as we want to believe RTB can change history shows he cant or wont. There is a definite message in the following article, he needs to change or move aside for someone who will coach attacking footy.

https://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/veteran-journalist-exposes-ross-lyons-damning-coaching-flaw/news-story/0e9378eb066d3a572b18ed1e35eccbf1

RoCo should stick to fighting culture wars on Twitter.

As has been mentioned plenty of times recently, no game plan has a chance of working when senior players can’t execute basic skills on a regular basis

All the track watchers have told us all season that Ross’ message is to be aggressive & move the ball quickly… the sad fact is that we just don’t have the quality ball winners & users to do this consistently.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Remboy]

RoCo should stick to fighting culture wars on Twitter.

As has been mentioned plenty of times recently, no game plan has a chance of working when senior players can’t execute basic skills on a regular basis

All the track watchers have told us all season that Ross’ message is to be aggressive & move the ball quickly… the sad fact is that we just don’t have the quality ball winners & users to do this consistently.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Which is why we have to wait until they recruit players who can, which is going to take a few more trade and draft periods.

 

[CursingFijian]

RoCo should stick to fighting culture wars on Twitter.

As has been mentioned plenty of times recently, no game plan has a chance of working when senior players can’t execute basic skills on a regular basis

All the track watchers have told us all season that Ross’ message is to be aggressive & move the ball quickly… the sad fact is that we just don’t have the quality ball winners & users to do this consistently.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I actually think a big part of it is moving Sinclair out of the backline.

I think for the quick rebound to work well opposition defenders can’t be allowed to structure up. So whether we win the ball from turnover, or from a kick out, the first 2 kicks out of defence have to be instantaneous.

Don’t try to assess just hit the first target then wheel and go to the second, which should mean opposition midfielders are out of play. Prefer we chip around looking for entries into our forward 50 rather than ways out of our defensive 50.

Bonner especially holds play up way too much, and we have a lot of either first possession or second possession coming through him out of defence.

It’s an aspect I think the Bombers have done really, really well this year with McGrath especially disposing ultra quick, complimented by Martin running and kicking out of defense as well.

Bonner is capable in my opinion. He just needs to get on his bike more often. Otherwise, let’s go back to a proven Sinclair and Naz combo.

 

[Saints TV]

 

[DougalHoward]

Maybe RoCo could be our next coach

 

[gringo2011]

I actually think a big part of it is moving Sinclair out of the backline.

I think for the quick rebound to work well opposition defenders can’t be allowed to structure up. So whether we win the ball from turnover, or from a kick out, the first 2 kicks out of defence have to be instantaneous.

Don’t try to assess just hit the first target then wheel and go to the second, which should mean opposition midfielders are out of play. Prefer we chip around looking for entries into our forward 50 rather than ways out of our defensive 50.

Bonner especially holds play up way too much, and we have a lot of either first possession or second possession coming through him out of defence.

It’s an aspect I think the Bombers have done really, really well this year with McGrath especially disposing ultra quick, complimented by Martin running and kicking out of defense as well.

Bonner is capable in my opinion. He just needs to get on his bike more often. Otherwise, let’s go back to a proven Sinclair and Naz combo.

I think it's been injuries to too many this year. Midfield was the worst in footy at full strength and then lost Crouch, Henry and Dow. Marshall and Steele smashed themselves but couldn't hold the dam wall back. Forward line was dysfunctional and having no depth in the small forwards and several players having down years has really bitten.

I think we'll look better with a midfield but wish we'd stay down for draft picks. The season is already shot. Might as well play kids and tank from here.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

I actually think a big part of it is moving Sinclair out of the backline.

I think for the quick rebound to work well opposition defenders can’t be allowed to structure up. So whether we win the ball from turnover, or from a kick out, the first 2 kicks out of defence have to be instantaneous.

Don’t try to assess just hit the first target then wheel and go to the second, which should mean opposition midfielders are out of play. Prefer we chip around looking for entries into our forward 50 rather than ways out of our defensive 50.

Bonner especially holds play up way too much, and we have a lot of either first possession or second possession coming through him out of defence.

It’s an aspect I think the Bombers have done really, really well this year with McGrath especially disposing ultra quick, complimented by Martin running and kicking out of defense as well.

Bonner is capable in my opinion. He just needs to get on his bike more often. Otherwise, let’s go back to a proven Sinclair and Naz combo.

Mate the way they were pressing up against us the other day absolutely ****ed our ball movement coming out from the kick in. We looked lost.
Imagine if we had Ari as our first or second receiver. There’s no way they would press up that hard.

 

[Moral Decay]

I think it's been injuries to too many this year. Midfield was the worst in footy at full strength and then lost Crouch, Henry and Dow. Marshall and Steele smashed themselves but couldn't hold the dam wall back. Forward line was dysfunctional and having no depth in the small forwards and several players having down years has really bitten.

I think we'll look better with a midfield but wish we'd stay down for draft picks. The season is already shot. Might as well play kids and tank from here.

The problem of lack of talent becomes compounded when the answers for lack of talent kick in.

This is the midfield pattern for the last decade.

Look at our spacing at stoppages, and we've doing this for a decade, we end up with four around the two players at the contest and they're all within four feet, our mids know they are crap or don't trust the player contesting to win the contest.

The opposition mids are feet behind them and moving they believe their team mate will win the contest and get the ball out to them. When we win the contest it's a rolling maul, and just too hard to get the ball out and moving quickly.

Same in ruck contests, Marshall has no faith and doesn't look to clear the contest, he then works really hard to get the ball and hack it forward. Where our forwards have no hope.

Don't get me wrong if I was coaching this group it would be bloody hard to tell them to spread and have faith because they will get cut up horribly.

Compound it again by saying our mids and HBF are generally lighter built than their opponents, they can't break through the line in front they can't stand up in a tackle let alone break the tackle, so they go sideways. Or they dance, either way our ball movement becomes stagnant.

Compound it again and say that we have been worked out by the opposition, when the ball gets kicked into our defense, the opposition don't go goal side, they deny us our best attack from defense, these smaller quick runners can't break through, they either play safe go sideways and slow the play or take a chance and it's a low percentage chance of working, hack it forward and pray or play on the 45 to the centre and risk the turnover.

Crouch, Dow, Henry and Clark will make a difference, I doubt it will be enough though.

Trading and free agents seem like a waste of time, really good footballers don't leave for money to bottom clubs. Ordinary footballers will leave for opportunity to play but we have enough of them and we really need talent, so the draft it is.

I've been waiting for the Pou to show some signs but apart from some clean hands he just doesn't get enough touches. I hope to God he improves coz right now I can't see it.

Both Windy and Mitch need to start playing a different tune, if they get a chance they need to attack the ball, don't worry about their opponent push hard to break through the front of the pack, take the tackle on and look for a handball 5 metres away.

 

[FQFjt]

To be honest I think the biggest takeaway was effectively saying the path we are on re timelines isn’t set in stone.

That will piss some posters off who are talking top4 expectations

Talk about overreaction

Still an overreaction?

 

[RWBlyf]

Footy’s great science experiment: Why Saints’ woes are not Max King’s fault

Max and Ben King might be identical twins, but the teams they play for look to be heading in opposite directions.

www.theage.com.au

 

[gringo2011]

Footy’s great science experiment: Why Saints’ woes are not Max King’s fault

Max and Ben King might be identical twins, but the teams they play for look to be heading in opposite directions.

www.theage.com.au

100% correct. Crouch will cover some cracks but we need some elite mids.

 

[tony74]

As someone who witnesses training twice a week I can assure you it’s not the game plan. The training drills and ball movement are fast, in some cases kamikaze speed. It is basically all out attack. But obviously the defensive part of those drills are less than frantic as injuries would happen all the time. On game days the reverse is the case, the opposition put immense pressure on our ball carrier and we stutter. We just don’t have the players who are good enough to mirror our training drills to the match day. Yet. Simple.
So don’t blame the game plan or coach, blame the recruitment team from 3-10 years ago. All the pillars are now in place, we’ve waited 58 years, you can wait a couple more

 

[saintbill]

I don't get it, Lyon has openly said since he arrived that he wants a different game plan with speed. But the old game plan certainly looks in play this year, but he has also come out said that it's all on the players. But why would they want to play so boringly?

It's been very obvious at the games I have attended this year that there is zero overlap run.

We refuse to use the corridor or even provide an option.

Work rate has dropped off alarmingly since last year.

 

[akaifu]

I actually think a big part of it is moving Sinclair out of the backline.

I think for the quick rebound to work well opposition defenders can’t be allowed to structure up. So whether we win the ball from turnover, or from a kick out, the first 2 kicks out of defence have to be instantaneous.

Don’t try to assess just hit the first target then wheel and go to the second, which should mean opposition midfielders are out of play. Prefer we chip around looking for entries into our forward 50 rather than ways out of our defensive 50.

Bonner especially holds play up way too much, and we have a lot of either first possession or second possession coming through him out of defence.

It’s an aspect I think the Bombers have done really, really well this year with McGrath especially disposing ultra quick, complimented by Martin running and kicking out of defense as well.

Bonner is capable in my opinion. He just needs to get on his bike more often. Otherwise, let’s go back to a proven Sinclair and Naz combo.

Hopefully with Clark returning, we drop Bonner and play Sinc at half back. That way, we'd have the flexibility to send Clark HB and Sinc mids if we need more run. With our current mids, that's not possible except maybe Windy but he's got leg speed so wouldn't want to take him out even if it was for Sinc

 

[True Believer]

It's been very obvious at the games I have attended this year that there is zero overlap run.

We refuse to use the corridor or even provide an option.

Work rate has dropped off alarmingly since last year.

Really? So those buggered-up turnover kicks coming out of the backline, they're not attempting to use the corridor? Dear God, the ability of some people to simply spew tripe that supports their narrative........

We get it - you hate Ross and he is no good at his job, despite taking two separate teams to multiple GF's......

I bet you even believe what you say......

 

[RWBlyf]

The positional switch King thinks Lyon must make to lift Saints out of slump

“That’s just a passion piece of mine.”

www.sen.com.au

 

[littlecreatures]

Footy’s great science experiment: Why Saints’ woes are not Max King’s fault

Max and Ben King might be identical twins, but the teams they play for look to be heading in opposite directions.

www.theage.com.au

Anyone got the unlocked version?

 

[gringo2011]

It's been very obvious at the games I have attended this year that there is zero overlap run.

We refuse to use the corridor or even provide an option.

Work rate has dropped off alarmingly since last year.

Disagree, we are working hard and getting no reward. Midfield is Steele, Marshall, Dow, Jones and Windy ATM, only Marshall getting enough of the ball. Very hard to win footy with such a crap midfield.

 

[gringo2011]

Anyone got the unlocked version?

Try 12ft if you need to get rid of paywalls. https://12ft.io/proxy

 

[gringo2011]

Try 12ft if you need to get rid of paywalls. https://12ft.io/proxy

Looks like you can't link an unlocked article. Go to their website and drop the copied headline in.

 

[RWBlyf]

Saints seeking shared tenancy, Essendon-style, at the MCG

St Kilda want to shift a number of home games to the MCG and, over the longer-term, have a shared tenancy between the AFL’s Marvel Stadium and the MCG – in the same manner as Essendon.

www.theage.com.au

 

[Remboy]

Anyone got the unlocked version?

Max and Ben King look the same, but they are not the same. They play the same position and play it in a very similar way that reflects the fact they are identical twins.
Presently, Ben is flying. Max isn’t. Presently, Ben’s team is in the eight and rising, and Max’s team is St Kilda (Euro-Yroke this round).

The King twins – St Kilda’s Max (left) and Gold Coast’s Ben – face mixed prospects this season.CREDIT: AFL PHOTOS
Ben is playing in front of Matt Rowell, Noah Anderson and Touk Miller at Gold Coast. And who is Max playing in front of? This is St Kilda’s problem in a nutshell. The problem is not Max King.

One of the unique things about these identical twins in this sporting sense, playing identical positions on the field, is that it creates almost a control group. They are as close as you get to a football science experiment.
How would Max King fare if the twins switched teams for a week? Ben King and the Suns illustrate St Kilda’s problems better than St Kilda does. The Suns have a good midfield, St Kilda doesn’t.

St Kilda is struggling to win games in 2024, with Ross Lyon's defence-first game plan under attack.
St Kilda are trying to be a top-eight side while playing with a bottom-four midfield. They have recruited to introduce good runners and, by extension, add more run to their game. But after what has turned out to be a misleading opening couple of games, the run has not been seen.
They were certainly extremely fit at the start of the year, and perhaps the early victories were a product of getting a jump on teams.

To the eye, it looked like they began the season with more run, but the numbers don’t support that contention.
In the first three rounds of the year they ranked 16th for generating inside-50s from rebound-50 chains, and since round four they are last. So, ball movement has, by the numbers at least, been slow and stagnant all year.

The idea that they wanted to add runners spoke to an intention to move the ball more quickly, but, still, they play with little dare.
Playing Fremantle (Walyalup) – a team younger than the Saints in average age and average games played – they were exposed on Saturday. The Dockers dominated the midfield but couldn’t convert their chances. St Kilda is, in some ways, a peer of Freo for development, but they don’t have any midfielders in the same class as Caleb Serong or Andrew Brayshaw.

The Saints have been open about needing to introduce A-grade talent (as well as speed) to a B-grade midfield (that’s our grading not theirs).
Of their younger mids, Marcus Windhager looks a capable player and Mattaes Phillipou has strong potential. Darcy Wilson looks promising, but more as a small forward/mid than a full-time onballer.
To find the class they need, they will need to look to the draft because, typically, they have not been able to attract quality players through trades. Liam Henry was a tasty pick-up last off-season, but as an outside runner he is a complementary player, not a game-changer.
The danger when you struggle to land high-quality players in trades is that you become so determined to land a player you end up spending A-plus money on B-grade talent. That is the pitfall they need to avoid now.

St Kilda’s problem then becomes one of timing. Max King will be a far better player if he ever gets to receive the ball from a midfield of equivalent quality ton that which is presently supplying his brother at the Suns. But how long might it take for that quality to arrive at Moorabbin?

 

[TheNewEnsign]

I think it's been injuries to too many this year. Midfield was the worst in footy at full strength and then lost Crouch, Henry and Dow. Marshall and Steele smashed themselves but couldn't hold the dam wall back. Forward line was dysfunctional and having no depth in the small forwards and several players having down years has really bitten.

I think we'll look better with a midfield but wish we'd stay down for draft picks. The season is already shot. Might as well play kids and tank from here.

I agree. Just haven't been able to have a settled line up and solve some key form questions - Hayes or Caminiti, Membrey or Sharman, and which of Dow, Byrnes, Clark, Jones, Paton, Bonner & Stocker are in our best 23 since there's only room for maybe three of those players max. moving forward.

The irony being with less injuries and our run home, I reckon we do win another decent handful of games and finish a nowhere position like 12th.

 

[gringo2011]

I agree. Just haven't been able to have a settled line up and solve some key form questions - Hayes or Caminiti, Membrey or Sharman, and which of Dow, Byrnes, Clark, Jones, Paton, Bonner & Stocker are in our best 23 since there's only room for maybe three of those players max. moving forward.

The irony being with less injuries and our run home, I reckon we do win another decent handful of games and finish a nowhere position like 12th.

I think with a full list we potentially sit mid table between 7th and 13th sort of range. You can see with Essendon what an ordinary list with a clear run can do. A shit list could win a flag just by staying fit this year. There is no stand out and everyone apart from Sydney looks vulnerable.

Really frustrating that we managed to fall over before we stood upright this year.

There is that tiny part of me that wants us to do what some of those clubs like GWS and Carlton did last year and go on a run but the practical side says stay down and get Jagga Smith or one of the talented mids and improve our future chances.