Autopsy 2025 AFL Round 3: Saints thrash Tigers

[Saint Ray]

Mansell clearly shoves him into the oncoming players with force.
Deserves suspension, you could argue the penalty but this is happening more frequently in play. Suspend players and they’ll stop doing it.

Serves the prick right. The AFL warned all clubs that pushing a player into a contest could result in a suspension of up to three weeks.

 

[The Punter]

There's nothing defensible in Mansell's action. Nothing in the game would change if blokes didn't get pushed into marking contests.

 

[Circus]

It's interesting isn't it. He doesn't try and hide it. He makes it quite obvious. Even when he's wrong about us he finds another angle to twist the knife.

King knows and chuckles when Kane is talking about us. Really wished King brought up Macrae this morning, but he didn't. They were going to bring Macrae up with Cornes on AFL Nation yesterday, but Kane was that late getting on air they ran out of time.

Who cares, its only Kane Cornes. He's an ordinary bloke who has a high profile high paying gig. It doesn't make him special. He's a current media trend type bozo who could fade and disappear into well-deserved obscurity in the near future.
The behaviour and decision-making of media executives is a litany of barely reported scandals, for obvious reasons. Cornes is just another example of moronic floss with a head like a kindergarten plasticine monster.

 

[thekizzler]

Cornes is a professional contrarian.

He often says things that other media are too scared to say as they don't want to harm their access/relationships.

I like a lot of what he says but his opinions on the Saints are a bit shallow. As we haven't been relevant for a long time. I can see where he is coming from. But we all know that there is a good chance he is wrong.
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I finished watching the replay this morning. A couple of things I noticed.

- Caminiti is going to get bags kicked on him while he is learning but boy is he impressive. His closing speed is elite. Pair that with strength and there is heaps of potential to be an elite defender. It was also noticeable that the few times he was beaten by Lynch, or gave away a free kick, he chastised himself. His personality is driven which is another asset in his journey.

- Travaglia was super impressive on debut. The way he hunted the ball, but also his ability to extract it in packs and dish it. Looks like the Saints recruiters knew what they were doing when they selected him as a midfielder. Imagine him with a bit more size. We have another potential weapon. Versatile as well.

 

[St Kilda Death]

Port off a 10 day break.
Rozee under pump for a quiet game.
Butters back.

If we play like we did last 2 weeks, we win.
Port don’t have the fight in em.
Fans want Kenny gone let’s do em a solid.

 

[sammm]

Still, nice to hear about the Saints. Membership day on SEN tomorrow. lots of media

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Cornes is a professional contrarian.

He often says things that other media are too scared to say as they don't want to harm their access/relationships.

I like a lot of what he says but his opinions on the Saints are a bit shallow. As we haven't been relevant for a long time. I can see where he is coming from. But we all know that there is a good chance he is wrong.
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I finished watching the replay this morning. A couple of things I noticed.

- Caminiti is going to get bags kicked on him while he is learning but boy is he impressive. His closing speed is elite. Pair that with strength and there is heaps of potential to be an elite defender. It was also noticeable that the few times he was beaten by Lynch, or gave away a free kick, he chastised himself. His personality is driven which is another asset in his journey.

- Travaglia was super impressive on debut. The way he hunted the ball, but also his ability to extract it in packs and dish it. Looks like the Saints recruiters knew what they were doing when they selected him as a midfielder. Imagine him with a bit more size. We have another potential weapon. Versatile as well.

Agree wholeheartedly on both points. Hammer’s speed was really impressive. He’ll make us nervous with the ball, but just to get it to the kickers.

And TT - we knew he could find the pill, he had 20+ in the VFL last year. And we know he can run (love that he’s so aggressive when he gets it and takes off). But what I loved was exactly as you’ve said. Game sense, ability to take it and get those linguine arms free for the handball and then hit it, and two HTBs IIRC. And this wasn’t just doing it during party time.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Port off a 10 day break.
Rozee under pump for a quiet game.
Butters back.

If we play like we did last 2 weeks, we win.
Port don’t have the fight in em.
Fans want Kenny gone let’s do em a solid.

A few worries though - us in SA and Port. They’ll have some confidence from the PS game (yes, means nothing, but they’ll know they can take us on again), the belting they’ll get in the media.

And we wouldn’t want to repeat that first half v Richmond. I didn’t think we really showed up.

On the break, I often find those longer breaks don’t necessarily translate to an advantage. Let’s hope so.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Geelong had more than enough chances to win that game.

I wouldn’t credit us to highly for how we held up in that last quarter.

I understand the point but that game is likely a loss in the same situation ie same level of youth playing for us. Gassed. Injuries mid game etc.

Big win on the night. But plenty to work on from that. As the boss says, they put as through an audit and you would have to think how we dealt with the pressure in the last and our ability ball in hand has to improve.

Agree. Hopefully the confidence boost means we get better as we progress. But we need to nab one of the next two to reinforce that.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

This has been the argument around every tweak in the rule over the last 10 or 15 years yet the game hasn't been in better shape since the 90's in ly opinion.

Fabulous scoring across the board, or at least it appears that way. I agree.

 

[bird_man]

Port off a 10 day break.
Rozee under pump for a quiet game.
Butters back.

If we play like we did last 2 weeks, we win.
Port don’t have the fight in em.
Fans want Kenny gone let’s do em a solid.

Butters was listed as 2 to 4 weeks last Tuesday?

 

[Sully111]

I want to see players being pushed into contests outlawed.

If you really watch this incident though, Liam is running to try and mark the ball after the push. I honestly think he would have been collected either way.

Regardless, Mansell's actions were no doubt careless. If his ban actually sends a message and helps cut these incidents down, I'm ok with it.

 

[stavro#4]

Butters was listed as 2 to 4 weeks last Tuesday?

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Some thoughts finally catching the replay.

I didn't realise how big Travaglia is. Sure he's a lanky kid at the moment but doesn't seem like it's stopping him! Should grow into his body over the next few years... thought he looked taller than 187 would have said 190ish. Either way.

Garcia is a ball of energy and what's that saying...he zigs when others zag. Thinks a bit differently and is unpredictable. Gret signs that he's getting so many touches. Seems to 'purple patch' and get a bunch of touches in not long and then go missing. He reminds me of Acres in a lot of ways. Probably less good overhead, but a lot quicker and a better kick.

Nas is exciting. Yes he misses a couple kicks a game but he's got 'it'. The Pendles factor. And they've clearly told him to take his chances and don't worry if he misses one every now and then. That might need to change later on but right now he's only 60 games in and gawd its fun to see him becoming elite.

Coops is just so freaking reliable in front of goal. It's nice. Him and Max should make a pretty formidable duo.

Fantastic to see Mitchy get some reward. Absolute animal at the ball and man.

Hill has always been cream...hopefully he can keep it up and snag a goal every now and then.

Max Hall looked like he belonged too, super neat kick.

Sincs, Wilkie, Macrae, Marshall....enough has been said about them but jeez all value pick ups!

Hugo’s pace is such a weapon for someone that loves the hard ball. Extracts it and takes off.

Agree on Hall. He’s been a mid too, so wouldn’t surprise to see him continue to develop - this might not be all he is / or at least not necessarily his longer term ‘level’

 

[stavro#4]

I want to see players being pushed into contests outlawed.

If you really watch this incident though, Liam is running to try and mark the ball after the push. I honestly think he would have been collected either way.

Regardless, Mansell's actions were no doubt careless. If his ban actually sends a message and helps cut these incidents down, I'm ok with it.

I’d rather be collected having jumped for a ball and knowing the traffic is coming my way but my body is vertical and strong.

As opposed to off balanced, pushed forward and my body is moving towards the ground with oncoming traffic roaring towards you.

 

[bergholt]

Hope he plays and then breaks down in the first quarter tbh

 

[stavro#4]

Hugo’s pace is such a weapon for someone that loves the hard ball. Extracts it and takes off.

Agree on Hall. He’s been a mid too, so wouldn’t surprise to see him continue to develop - this might not be all he is / or at least not necessarily his longer term ‘level’

One thing that really stood out as a negative with Hugo was how one sided he is.

1-2 occasions he collects the ball deep forward 50 and he can’t get a shot off because his left foot is taken away.

I think it happened in the centre of the ground aswell.

He probably lacks the real ground breaking assets of like a Butters. But if he can become a more balanced athlete or a more skilled footballer. He probably has a chance of making that elevation.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Another key aspect is that the non listed zebs players are collectively awful. Imagine how our 18yo would be going with a better side when winning simply makes everyone look better and pumps the numbers too.

I’ll be interested by BJs thoughts on the young guys. Just make sure we can’t get that sentence in that order

 

[Tommy Wigs]

One thing that really stood out as a negative with Hugo was how one sided he is.

1-2 occasions he collects the ball deep forward 50 and he can’t get a shot off because his left foot is taken away.

I think it happened in the centre of the ground aswell.

He probably lacks the real ground breaking assets of like a Butters. But if he can become a more balanced athlete or a more skilled footballer. He probably has a chance of making that elevation.

Yeah good point. He has to do some 360s. Not sure he always gives the first option either, but at least he seems to want to be the man. On the positive side, He also has the dual part to his game though. Extremely strong in attacking the ball and the man and many of the best don’t really have that focus.

 

[Minga]

And Carlton.

Don’t ever let that scum club get on top of us again.

Of course of course, but we’ve beaten them, and Geelong, and Collingwood somewhat regularly in recent times…

Last time we beat Port was in 2020 and we have lost to them six times since, despite a number of competitive games.

Last time we beat Melbourne was in 2019 and we have lost to them five times since.

Both look gettable, I want.

 

[SaintsofSteel]

There's nothing defensible in Mansell's action. Nothing in the game would change if blokes didn't get pushed into marking contests.

I can understand Richmond challenging the decision after what happened with Lalor. Its not a perfect system but at least the AFL have said we dont want that in the game.

I think the entire 'push in the back' interpretation has gone the wrong way. Too many players force their opponents under the ball using what used to be hands in the back free kick. The competition no longer rewards the players who take the front position in marking duels. Its got to the point where defenders are as good as tunelling their opponents to force them under the ball and out of contests.

How often do we see defenders just push the forward under the ball basically to take an uncontested mark. Its allowed under sized defenders to use the tactic to out mark their opponents - I feel for the current day forwards.

 

[The Punter]

I can understand Richmond challenging the decision after what happened with Lalor. Its not a perfect system but at least the AFL have said we dont want that in the game.

I think the entire 'push in the back' interpretation has gone the wrong way. Too many players force their opponents under the ball using what used to be hands in the back free kick. The competition no longer rewards the players who take the front position in marking duels. Its got to the point where defenders are as good as tunelling their opponents to force them under the ball and out of contests.

How often do we see defenders just push the forward under the ball basically to take an uncontested mark. Its allowed under sized defenders to use the tactic to out mark their opponents - I feel for the current day forwards.

I can understand the Richmond challenge too. AFL's is pretty good at shutting the gate after the horse has bolted. Deal with Gibney in the pre-season and this (or Owens) probably doesn't happen. Mansell not a star so the AFL is happy to make an example of him.

I don't think many liked the hands in the back rule, but it did make the game easier to umpire. There's a lot of obvious pushing going unpunished at the moment, and those are pretty easy to see (bent arm becomes straight arm). The grey area for me has always been tackling from behind.

 

[stavro#4]

I can understand Richmond challenging the decision after what happened with Lalor. Its not a perfect system but at least the AFL have said we dont want that in the game.

I think the entire 'push in the back' interpretation has gone the wrong way. Too many players force their opponents under the ball using what used to be hands in the back free kick. The competition no longer rewards the players who take the front position in marking duels. Its got to the point where defenders are as good as tunelling their opponents to force them under the ball and out of contests.

How often do we see defenders just push the forward under the ball basically to take an uncontested mark. Its allowed under sized defenders to use the tactic to out mark their opponents - I feel for the current day forwards.

But Mansell wasn’t tunnelling in a marking contest.

His eyes are off the ball when he decides to push O’Connell into the marking contest.

That doesn’t mean he had intent to hurt. But his intent to move his opponent into that contest is evident.

For O’Connell- he needs protection. He isn’t moved to the side of the contest. He is moved into the path of the oncoming traffic. He keeps his eyes on the ball and gets steamrolled.

 

[gringo2011]

Yeah good point. He has to do some 360s. Not sure he always gives the first option either, but at least he seems to want to be the man. On the positive side, He also has the dual part to his game though. Extremely strong in attacking the ball and the man and many of the best don’t really have that focus.

Jesus. He’s played a handful of games and keeps upping his output. If we’d had a single player during the Trout years with this kind of promise we would have had a festival to celebrate

 

[stavro#4]

Jesus. He’s played a handful of games and keeps upping his output. If we’d had a single player during the Trout years with this kind of promise we would have had a festival to celebrate

No one is smashing him.

There is room for improvement. He did lots of really good things.

To take the next step though the things mentioned need to be worked on.