List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion - Part V

[Hubnester]

2025 List Management Discussion - Part 5

Now that our season is over, and news is starting to break - it's time for a fresh thread.

This thread is to discuss all things list management - trades, draft, free agency, delistings and more.
As we are now officially in our off-season, we'll be wanting to keep this thread more strictly on-topic than the previous iterations.
Be respectful. You are allowed to disagree with someone - but play the ball, not the man. Repeat offenders will have their posting rights revoked.

Thanks to Lore once again for this incredibly useful spreadsheet.

2025 KEY DATES
Free Agency Period: Friday, October 3rd - Friday, October 10th
Trade Period: Monday, October 6th - Wednesday, October 15th
AFL Draft: Wednesday, November 19th - Thursday, November 20th

See Also:
2025 Year in Review Rumours & Confirmed Movements 2025 Draft Discussion
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[stavro#4]

Steele St

Reckon that’s why I’m not that fussed about Jack being moved on…. Blind Freddy could see this was on cards for at least this season. If anything I’m surprised it didn’t happen earlier, Ross was obviously waiting for the kids to be ready to take over.

TBH I would have liked him to be kept on as depth but that would have been doing the wrong thing by a great clubman.

Personally I think this benefits Windy more than anyone. He wanted the big deal & now he’s got it, he’s got some big boots to fill.

I went into thinking Marshall and Steele were going, you and a few others knew why and how spot on that info was.

To walk away and atleast hold Roma for a season and give it a crack is an outcome I’m pretty happy with.

Outside of King, I think Ross has numbers across the board for every other spot in the side.

He also has his list that’s good enough for September.

Ross is going to be my one to watch next year. So keen to see how he coaches the likes of Windy Pou Nas Tauru Flanders Higgins King TDK etc.

 

[The Boar]

Elijah Hollands free to a good home.
An upgrade on Byrnes and ticks SOS' key criteria of being a Carlton player.
How ruthless are the list bosses going to be?

 

[True Believer]

You think a player Collingwood used every week wouldn’t fit into our forwardline? I know we were a world beating super threat this year but let’s be real for a moment. We were short up forward all year and using Owens as a key forward in spite of the fact that he was struggling and outsized. We were lucky we had Wood to spend considerable time forward to compensate but he is better on the wing. Membery absolutely plays afl every week for us this year. Next? Well with De Konning likely pushing Marshall forward more you’re probably right, but that depends on if Max gets up and running or not but that still is far from certain.

Macrae is better than Steele that I agree with. But again, we brought in exactly one extra midfielder over this trade period into a undermanned midfield and shipped off our second best proven midfielder to make space! We are hardly overflowing with midfield talent. Hopefully the young guys keep there momentum from this year and Steele would find himself on the outer by 2027 (he’s still not a shabby half forward mind you if a Pou and/or Wilson moves more into the mids) but I’d rather not count our chickens for once and as it stands most of the top sides have between 2-4 midfielders all as good or better than our best.

The problem here is that you're only seeing it from a supporter point of view! Yes, Skunk would have likely played for us this year, but what about next year? Bu staying with us he would have had only one year left in his career. By moving to Collingwood, he now also has next year, that's significant money compared to what he would potentially otherwise be earning in 2026!

 

[sauce_head]

View attachment 2459397

Really REALLY doesn’t like us, so much so that…

View attachment 2459398

He’ll even pump the dogs up with a story that’s absolutely false to whack us

He’s an idiot but if we all don’t click he will go away!

 

[stavro#4]

Elijah Hollands free to a good home.
An upgrade on Byrnes and ticks SOS' key criteria of being a Carlton player.
How ruthless are the list bosses going to be?

Man… I really like his game and think he is a good footballer.

However, something is seriously wrong there

 

[Count_Zero]

Will add: Boxshall is as good of a like for like apprentice to slot right in as you could ask for. Big bodied, decently skilled, excellent marking, seems a big tick so far. He’s why I’d hope Owens could be in the middle, but now I think it makes a lot of sense having Box in the mids and Owens as that power forward.

I am always hopeful that Owens could develop into a Rayner type player, power forward with bursts in the midfield.

 

[sauce_head]

Imagine giving a pay rise to one of the best defenders in the game.. who is also about to be captain. Because we’ve been underpaying him substantially to date because we plucked him from the rookie draft

And who hasn’t missed a game yet.

 

[True Believer]

I am always hopeful that Owens could develop into a Rayner type player, power forward with bursts in the midfield.

I'm the same on this. If Boxshall develops as we hope, Mitch then takes his midfield rotation while Boxshall takes a breather up forward for 5-7 minutes per quarter...

 

[Half Back Pocket]

Do we see a further changing of the guard next year?...

Butler
Howard
Hill
Wood
possibly Dow, Carroll, Byrnes

 

[Windtagger]

I am always hopeful that Owens could develop into a Rayner type player, power forward with bursts in the midfield.

It kind of is his role now no? He’s just inconsistent

 

[Sully111]

It kind of is his role now no? He’s just inconsistent

His time in the midfield is very limited. It's often when we're in trouble too.

 

[The Boar]

Man… I really like his game and think he is a good footballer.

However, something is seriously wrong there

If the due diligence is mirky, a Jamara-style low cost, use it or lose it 1 year "Rehab contract" could work. Depth upgrade at low low risk.

Same applies to Tarryn Thomas if he is on the straight and narrow.

Instabilities aside- either option immediately improves our depth and list quality.

 

[stavro#4]

Do we see a further changing of the guard next year?...

Butler
Howard
Hill
Wood
possibly Dow, Carroll, Byrnes

Hill and wood contracted until 2027 aren’t they?

Dow Carroll Howard Butler Keeler Said O’Connell Stocker (only takes 1 year deals so has to be included) all under pressure for me.

Dodson, Wilson & Caminiti out of contract and ones to watch now that there is genuine depth and competition for spots.

Marshall revisit a trade again?

 

[MrFoster]

I’m as upset at Steele leaving as the next guy. But you can’t seriously be advocating to keep him if he would be playing VFL 50% of the time. You can’t be paying someone 800k a year to play seconds.

Hope he goes well at the Dees.

Also **** Purple and his shrivelled nutsack.

Think Steele's on about $1M for the next 2 seasons, so considering

1. We shelved more money to Naz, Wilkie and Windhager than what was previously planned
2. We cannot have both Macrae and Steele playing on the same side, yes Steele can play as a half forward, but is he really better than a Higgins and Ryan at that role? Think not.

Would have been better if we also brought in another up & coming mid e.g. Mackenzie, but Hawthorn botched the Merrett deal, so Mackenzie isn't happening. Let's hope he have an underwhelming season next year and come to us at the end of next year, again his talent is clear. Just need to be utilitized and exposed to proper midfield minutes.

 

[Banger9798]

The more I think about it, the more I reckon we absolutely smashed the trade period, and on the back of a few years of excellent drafting, we have to take our hats off to the list management team for putting us in the window after a decade of mediocrity.
If we snare Fincher and Voss, it will cap off a brilliant re build.

 

[Minga]

Who is Voss and why does his name keep popping up?

 

[bird_man]

Do we see a further changing of the guard next year?...

Butler
Howard
Hill
Wood
possibly Dow, Carroll, Byrnes

Hill and Wood likely keep going unless they fall apart or retire. The rest are probably going into their last year ka lucky to have a contract this year.

 

[MrFoster]

The more I think about it, the more I reckon we absolutely smashed the trade period, and on the back of a few years of excellent drafting, we have to take our hats off to the list management team for putting us in the window after a decade of mediocrity.
If we snare Fincher and Voss, it will cap off a brilliant re build.

Think all of our 4 recruits will surprise a few people next year. Flanders and JSOS in particular. Ryan will be exciting to watch regardless and TDK just need an injury free run at it.

 

[Count_Zero]

It kind of is his role now no? He’s just inconsistent

From memory, Rayner took a while to become that midfield bull that he did. Owens is young and I'm happy to give him time.

 

[Miha]

Who is Voss and why does his name keep popping up?

Do believe Lachlan Voss has been recruited to the VFL sode

We’re allegedly looking at Jackson Voss as a rookie pick up

 

[MrFoster]

From memory, Rayner took a while to become that midfield bull that he did. Owens is young and I'm happy to give him time.

If Owens can improve his kicking and touch, there's every chance he goes up to Rayner's level. Is already better than Rayner at marking and contest, need to be cleaner and get some composure into his game.

 

[SainterinSydney]

I went into thinking Marshall and Steele were going, you and a few others knew why and how spot on that info was.

To walk away and atleast hold Roma for a season and give it a crack is an outcome I’m pretty happy with.

Outside of King, I think Ross has numbers across the board for every other spot in the side.

He also has his list that’s good enough for September.

Ross is going to be my one to watch next year. So keen to see how he coaches the likes of Windy Pou Nas Tauru Flanders Higgins King TDK etc.

The pressure is now on Ross. Barring injuries and overall good health, we have a very competitive list and should minimum make finals. I have high hopes.

 

[SainterinSydney]

A Carlton supporting coworker bet me $50 that Carlton would finish higher next year. I couldn’t shake his hand quick enough. Bring on 2026!

Would he be willing to bet his entire savings, superannuation and any property he has on that? I'm game!

 

[St Neil]

Man.. I don’t have the heart to see Steele going as a positive. It’s funny, I don’t think I’d be this upset if NAS had left but that is exactly the mindset shift that has to happen right now. No space for sentimentality, only for improvement and success. Can’t hold onto loveable characters if they aren’t apart of that success and it sucks.

We all love Jack Steele. Has been a wonderful person for our club. Skipper during tough times, our best player for a few years and very courageous.

Decent, good image, very respected.

But Jack is struggling. Lost his ability to spread and was a defensive liability against teams who could run.

He’s getting left behind in a game where outside run is now the most important weapon when moving the ball.

It was time. We have a lot of kids pushing through who are usurping him in the team. We were blunt and transparent about his future.

Nobody wanted to see Jack playing VFL. Not when he could still be an important cog at another club. He considered it and made the right call, taking his salary with him.

Jack Steele left on the best of terms and his dignity has only endeared him more to everyone. No bitterness or rancour. All class.

St Kilda hasn’t won a Flag in 60 years. There is no room for sentimentality. Individuals come and go but the club endures. The decision to trade Jack Steele was correct.

Do whatever we have to do to win a Flag. No individual is sacrosanct. That includes key people off-field. Be ruthless and make the decisions that need to be made.

 

[TheJackal]

Who is Voss and why does his name keep popping up?

Jackson, who is Brett's son. Late bloomer, a bit like Brett in that regard. Lovely kick of the footy, played at Frankston for some time now. Getting great numbers and could be a ready made 'small' defender to replace Webster.