List Mgmt. 2025 List Management discussion

[LennyHayes77]

I think he'll be the highest paid player in the league for like 2-3 seasons max. The contract will be front loaded due to us having massive amounts of cap space in the now to use but his cap hit will be lower for the final 4-5 years of his contract. At that point, the total salary cap will go up and other players will be re-signed on higher contracts.
So we may as well use the money while we have it, get a good player in and build from there.

 

[jwikked]

Are we seriously sitting here justifying making someone the highest paid player in the AFL on the basis that "he's a top 4 ruckman under 30"?

Does he make the team better?

Objectively - yes.

Does paying him what he's actually worth pry him out of Carlton? Not a chance.
What player would leave their team if we pay them purely what they're worth? None. No good player, anyway.

 

[PJays]

We also have to pay overs cause saints

This is maybe two thirds true.

Yes we usually need to pay overs. Because small club, Marvel, etc.

But how much we have to pay overs depends on exactly where the club, and the list are at.

If we first build through the draft, create a strong culture and a team that people want to join, then look at free agency, we won't have to pay as much over.

If we're sitting here having not tasted a finals win since 2020, and we look at free agency, we'll have to pay a long way over. Which is what happened with Brad Hill too.

 

[The Punter]

For the upteenth time, Brad Hill cost overs because he had two years left on a contract with Fremantle.

 

[PJays]

For the upteenth time, Brad Hill cost overs because he had two years left on a contract with Fremantle.

I'd suggest extra years mightve been necessary.

But I'm referring to dollars per year.

 

[jwikked]

I'd suggest extra years mightve been necessary.

But I'm referring to dollars.

Sign TDK on a 20 year $900k deal? Great idea

 

[The Punter]

I'd suggest extra years mightve been necessary.

But I'm referring to dollars.

Have we had someone forced out due to salary cap concerns since Hill arrived? We didn't think Gresham was value at the asking price. Battle was botched but once he had his head turned by Hawthorn he was gone.

But I don't think we've had anyone forced out the way Zac Dawson was after 2011.

Again, I think the issue with getting Hill was he has not been as promised.

 

[stavro#4]

 

[stavro#4]

Jackson playing as a ruck forward kicked only 11 goals for Melbourne in a season.
Ben Brown when fit was a better forward.
And Melbourne were pretty much a team struggling for tall forwards.

But he made the demons better. Hence the flag and the fortune he cost Freo in assets.

He straightened them up. He took a good key defender. They didn’t lose ascendency when he rucked. He was different to Gawn etc.

There is so much more to weigh up then Goals scored

 

[PJays]

Have we had someone forced out due to salary cap concerns since Hill arrived?

No, but the club's in a very different position now.

Part of the reason it never hurt was because draftees didn't didn't develop as expected. If Clark, Coffield etc had become the stars we hoped for, maybe it would've.

Again, I think the issue with getting Hill was he has not been as promised.

Every part of it was, and has been, problematic.

My biggest concern was giving up Acres, and a draft pick (could've been used on Pickett, Day, Weightman, Bergman etc).

We made him our highest paid player.

And, compounding all of this, he's been a bit disappointing compared to what he did at Freo.

But back to my original point: Even if he had been as good as his Freo era, we still would've been overpaying him. It's just not smart list management.

Wait till we build through the draft and they're willing to come for market value or a bit over.

 

[phantom13]

This is maybe two thirds true.

Yes we usually need to pay overs. Because small club, Marvel, etc.

But how much we have to pay overs depends on exactly where the club, and the list are at.

If we first build through the draft, create a strong culture and a team that people want to join, then look at free agency, we won't have to pay as much over.

If we're sitting here having not tasted a finals win since 2020, and we look at free agency, we'll have to pay a long way over. Which is what happened with Brad Hill too.

No.

How much we chose to pay over is dependent on what youre discussing in the third paragraph. If we WANT TDK which we apparently do then we need to pay more than nearly any other club in the open market.

As for the rest theres alot of "if my mum had a ****" about it.

 

[The_Steadier]

Are we seriously sitting here justifying making someone the highest paid player in the AFL on the basis that "he's a top 4 ruckman under 30"?

The salary cap just went up 25%.

There will be a dozen players across the league on the kind on money in the next couple of years.

1.7 is the new 1.3M that the likes of dusty, fyfe, oliver, petracca etc have been on prior to the cap going up.

 

[saintbill]

Its been a while since its been tried , but Marshall wasn't a great Key Forward, and the point of what they were saying , is if you have a good or better key forward then you are better off using them, rather than a ruck who is OK ish as a forward.
Because its not worth it for just a single hand full of centre bounce attendances.

The Marshall/Ryder combo actually worked pretty well. Marshall may not be an elite forward but he will absolutely make life easier for King.

King is getting swamped by the opposition defence and he simply doesn't have enough tricks to deal with it. By having another big aerial threat in Marshall, it will be harder to double team King.

I remember a stat years ago about King taking more contested marks when Ryder and Marshall were both playing.

This assumes of course King actually gets on the park next year, but I am feeling optimistic today.

 

[stavro#4]

No, but the club's in a very different position now.

Part of the reason it never hurt was because draftees didn't didn't develop as expected. If Clark, Coffield etc had become the stars we hoped for, maybe it would've.

Every part of it was, and has been, problematic.

My biggest concern was giving up Acres, and a draft pick (could've been used on Pickett, Day, Weightman, Bergman etc).

We made him our highest paid player.

And, compounding all of this, he's been a bit disappointing compared to what he did at Freo.

But back to my original point: Even if he had been as good as his Freo era, we still would've been overpaying him. It's just not smart list management.

Wait till we build through the draft and they're willing to come for market value or a bit over.

Clark and Coffield headlined the list of players that were overpaid based on potential trajectory of their careers.

That is a far worse outcome then TDK getting paid the most in the league but only getting best ruckmen in the league value.

 

[phantom13]

Personally i dont think the TDK $1.7m choice is the right one with where the list is at in the premiership window/cycle (god theres alot of cliches in there) but its also not an appalling bad choice like McCartin over Trac or Hanners.

 

[Sainttony]

That Irish kid can’t be too far away from coming over. School term ends around now.

 

[Broski]

Ummmmm, have we tried spending the $1.7m on A-Grade midfielders? I did some analysis and saw that we lack a real gun player around the contest. Although I am a rocket scientist, this decision isn't!

Seriously though, this is how some people sound haha. Do I like the thought of paying that for TDk? Absolutely not, but if it is thought through and allows us to still lock in our own talent and future players down the road, then I can stomach it.

 

[SainterinSydney]

I will be shocked if Nas says he wants to leave.

 

[MordySaint]

Just in, Ben King

34

Ben King

Age

25

Ht

202cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.2

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

2.2

2star

M

3.5

4star

T

0.5

3star

G

1.3

5star

D

7.5

2star

K

5.6

2star

HB

1.9

1star

M

3.6

4star

T

0.3

1star

G

1.5

5star

D

6.8

2star

K

4.4

2star

HB

2.4

3star

M

3.2

4star

T

0.2

3star

G

1.0

4star

back round 18.

Huge News!!!!

 

[True Believer]

Just in, Ben King back round 18.

Huge News!!!!

What about Max?

 

[MordySaint]

What about Max?

LOL, must have Ben on my mind... have watched him play more than Max this year.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

This is maybe two thirds true.

Yes we usually need to pay overs. Because small club, Marvel, etc.

But how much we have to pay overs depends on exactly where the club, and the list are at.

If we first build through the draft, create a strong culture and a team that people want to join, then look at free agency, we won't have to pay as much over.

If we're sitting here having not tasted a finals win since 2020, and we look at free agency, we'll have to pay a long way over. Which is what happened with Brad Hill too.

Locked in: The stars set to cash in on AFL's $35m marketing fund

Top players could earn up to $2m a season when adding their marketing money to their on-field earnings

www.afl.com.au

As someone alluded to the other day, the marketing component that TDK will be paid makes his reported deal much more palatable.

 

[Mystifly]

Zane Duursma looks frustrated at North, I reckon he has serious talent. Needs a new start. Hope we enquire.

If we were able to bring in Zane, then Yasmin may only need to go to 3 games per weekend next year. Xavier's Bombers, Willem's team and Zane and Harley's Saints

 

[phantom13]

The Marshall/Ryder combo actually worked pretty well. Marshall may not be an elite forward but he will absolutely make life easier for King.

King is getting swamped by the opposition defence and he simply doesn't have enough tricks to deal with it. By having another big aerial threat in Marshall, it will be harder to double team King.

I remember a stat years ago about King taking more contested marks when Ryder and Marshall were both playing.

This assumes of course King actually gets on the park next year, but I am feeling optimistic today.

The other thing here would be imagine Sharman with another year under his belt playing the third tall role and getting the oppos third tall defender.

Hed give teams fits.

 

[Twins to the Max]

Enough Said!