Expansion 20th AFL team location

[Cubs2Lions]

You cannot play AFL level footy at North Sydney Oval. AFLW, probably, but it is far too small for professional mens footy (or professional mens cricket for that matter).

Depends if the NSW Government wants to expand the oval to allow a capacity of 20,000-25,000.

In saying that though, a 3rd NSW team (especially in North Sydney) is still 40-50 years from happening at the very earliest, so I’m definitely not saying build the team up now.

If anything, Canberra has to be next city in the NSW/ACT region that’s need an AFL team

 

[Canberra Pear]

Depends if the NSW Government wants to expand the oval to allow a capacity of 20,000-25,000.

In saying that though, a 3rd NSW team (especially in North Sydney) is still 40-50 years from happening at the very earliest, so I’m definitely not saying build the team up now.

If anything, Canberra has to be next city in the NSW/ACT region that’s need an AFL team

The big issue with North Sydney Oval isn't the capacity, but the oval size itself. It would need to expanded to the southeast.

From memory, they played a men's preseason with only 15-a-side to fit it in.

But yes, Canberra all the way!

 

[1990crow]

2028 - Tasmania
2032 - Canberra
2034 - North relocate to Sunshine Coast
2040 - Saints relocate to Newcastle
2055 - NT
2060 - North Queensland

 

[catters05]

2028 - Tasmania
2032 - Canberra
2034 - North relocate to Sunshine Coast
2040 - Saints relocate to Newcastle
2055 - NT
2060 - North Queensland

AI will wipe us out before NT team…. Damn it.

 

[Daka]

The amount of spike in talent with indigenous players/local talent that a team in Darwin would create would be insane

 

[catters05]

2028 - Tasmania
2032 - Canberra
2034 - North relocate to Sunshine Coast
2040 - Saints relocate to Newcastle
2055 - NT
2060 - North Queensland

just my opinion, but I am not convinced about AFL in Newcastle and especially not convinced they would be accepting a relocation from Victoria. The Giants would have to be doing well imo before another NSW team. Canberra 100% for 20th team.

I thought North were debt free now? IMO, all Melbourne needs is a modern smaller boutique stadium or completely upgraded older vfl one and then they have bases covered with 25k small Stadium/Marvel 50k (if they going to redo it then possibly up to 60-70k/MCG 100K. Balance the 9 teams across the 3 stadiums, with AFL making money out of other events with marvel as well. The smaller stadium could do wonders for AFL and the smaller crowd games if the AFL could set it up for clubs like Geelong with KP. Unsure if AFL could do this.

Youth talent will grow with rejuvenation in Tassie and Canberra teams imo. Giants focusing just on West Sydney and committing 100% to West Sydney will help as well.

Just my thoughts.

 

[peetoo]

just my opinion, but I am not convinced about AFL in Newcastle and especially not convinced they would be accepting a relocation from Victoria. The Giants would have to be doing well imo before another NSW team. Canberra 100% for 20th team.

I thought North were debt free now? IMO, all Melbourne needs is a modern smaller boutique stadium or completely upgraded older vfl one and then they have bases covered with 25k small Stadium/Marvel 50k (if they going to redo it then possibly up to 60-70k/MCG 100K. Balance the 9 teams across the 3 stadiums, with AFL making money out of other events with marvel as well. The smaller stadium could do wonders for AFL and the smaller crowd games if the AFL could set it up for clubs like Geelong with KP. Unsure if AFL could do this.

Youth talent will grow with rejuvenation in Tassie and Canberra teams imo. Giants focusing just on West Sydney and committing 100% to West Sydney will help as well.

Just my thoughts.

It’s too late for that. Marvel is ‘small’ enough now

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

Depends if the NSW Government wants to expand the oval to allow a capacity of 20,000-25,000.

In saying that though, a 3rd NSW team (especially in North Sydney) is still 40-50 years from happening at the very earliest, so I’m definitely not saying build the team up now.

If anything, Canberra has to be next city in the NSW/ACT region that’s need an AFL team

I was talking about the size of the playing surface rather than capacity.
10k would be enough for a third Sydney side in the early days, but the corners of the rugby league field almost reach the boundary fence.

NSO is also far too close to the SCG. A third team would probably go in the south-west. Liverpool-Campbelltown. And allow the Giants to focus on the Parramatta-Penrith corridor (and I doubt there will be one soon, like the Giants it would take decades to build and I'm not sure the AFL wants three "investment" clubs at once). As it is, the Giants are spread very thinly over a vast area - for many of whom getting to a game is quite a trek.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Would be a good showcase to watch a NT team, but the infrastructure and money it would cost to host an AFL license full-time over there would be too much money for them to cope, let alone the hit and humid weather for other AFL teams.

Wouldn’t be the worst option if a joint-venture option from a Victorian club (i.e North Melbourne) occurred to spilt their home games between Victoria and NT though, keeping the amount of teams to 20

would be a total and utter basket case. Infrastructure aside If we can't get good young players wanting to live in the Gold Coast, then getting them to live in Darwin will be an utter shit fight.

 

[werdna78]

Right now, the bye is winning. It also helps the afl have rounds spread over more days

I'm all in for more Thursday night games.

 

[Remboy]

Put a team on the moon by the end of the decade.

 

[Purple Suit]

would be a total and utter basket case. Infrastructure aside If we can't get good young players wanting to live in the Gold Coast, then getting them to live in Darwin will be an utter s**t fight.

Darwin is an awesome place to live, the issue would be getting them to concentrate on footy and not going drinking and fishing all the time.

 

[Coolangatta]

Darwin is an awesome place to live, the issue would be getting them to concentrate on footy and not going drinking and fishing all the time.

Nah. Canberra before NT.

If we go beyond 20 teams, I think two each in Perth, Adelaide, Brisbane, and Sydney would be a good balance. Better to have two strong clubs in each of those cities than three imo. SC, Newy etc as a secondary market.

Throw in NQ based primarily in Cairns and there’s 23 teams. For the last, one of New Zealand or the South West of WA if you just can’t get a Kiwi team up and going.

Something tells me the AFL are going to try and crack the NZ market at some point.

 

[Purple Suit]

Nah. Canberra before NT.

If we go beyond 20 teams, I think two each in Perth, Adelaide, Brisbane, and Sydney would be a good balance. Better to have two strong clubs in each of those cities than three imo. SC, Newy etc as a secondary market.

Throw in NQ based primarily in Cairns and there’s 23 teams. For the last, one of New Zealand or the South West of WA if you just can’t get a Kiwi team up and going.

Something tells me the AFL are going to try and crack the NZ market at some point.

WA & SA will need more teams. Already WC is the most financially powerful club in the country and Freo has 7 mil in the bank on the back of very strong financial performances. Service this market with seats or you'll allow other codes to come in and take that revenue. 2 teams is fine right now, in 5 years it won't be enough, in 10 years it'll cost the league. SA is probably 10 years behind WA but the same thing will happen there too.

WA3 needs to be based in Perth, not the south west. Not enough population and it's spread too thin.

 

[Coolangatta]

WA & SA will need more teams. Already WC is the most financially powerful club in the country and Freo has 7 mil in the bank on the back of very strong financial performances. Service this market with seats or you'll allow other codes to come in and take that revenue. 2 teams is fine right now, in 5 years it won't be enough, in 10 years it'll cost the league. SA is probably 10 years behind WA but the same thing will happen there too.

WA3 needs to be based in Perth, not the south west. Not enough population and it's spread too thin.

Yeah but how many teams do you want the AFL to have? Who misses out from the list that I suggested? ACT is a must, it’s a good growing pro footy market.

Even if you toss out NZ and replace with Perth 3, do you swap out Brisbane 2 for Adelaide 3? Okay, but what happens when Brisbane gets too big for one team or when Sydney gets too big for two? The latter might never have enough interest in footy for three teams but Brisbane will be an under serviced market one day for sure.

 

[LordLucifer]

Newcastle / Northern Sydney would be the 3rd Sydney team option in the future, as you could play 8 home games at North Sydney Oval and 4 games at Newcastle to help build support from all across that region.

Will they be the 20th team option though, ABSOLUTELY NOT

Maybe it will be the 23rd or 24th team (if the AFL keeps continues to keep creating new expansion clubs).

You do realise that Newcastle is 2-hours north of Sydney ??

Are you aware that North Sydney Oval is the size of a postage stamp ??

 

[LordLucifer]

You need two full-time Sydney teams before you get a third one.

Correct.

Giants to withdraw their participation in Canberra so that the ACT can have its own dedicated team.

 

[eth-dog]

ACT would probably need to incorporate Albury and Wagga as part of it's reach.

21 and 22 are likely to be West Perth/Joondalup and Norwood/Sturt before maybe Cairns and NT as 23/24.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

If we go beyond 20 teams, I think two each in Perth, Adelaide, Brisbane, and Sydney would be a good balance. Better to have two strong clubs in each of those cities than three imo.

Why? Those cities aren't equal. It's the dominant sport in two of them and Sydney is much bigger than the rest.

I think Perth can sustain three clubs both now and into the future, and Sydney will be able to also once GWS has become more self-sustaining.

Something tells me the AFL are going to try and crack the NZ market at some point.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but it takes all the negatives of Western Sydney and multiplies them. An even bigger amount of money would have to be thrown into it, and there's even less awareness, tradition and affinity for the game than there is in Western Sydney. At least GWS already had a local rival. Plus going to New Zealand adds a lot to travel costs for all teams.

Can't see the AFL bothering until GWS and Gold Coast are successes.

Yeah but how many teams do you want the AFL to have?

I think 22 is a fine number. Play every team once, and a second game against a rival.

 

[LordLucifer]

2028 - Tasmania
2032 - Canberra
2034 - North relocate to Sunshine Coast
2040 - Saints relocate to Newcastle
2055 - NT
2060 - North Queensland

I do like your thoughts on relocations, I am of the opinion that there has to be some rationalisation of Melbourne clubs too.

However, NT will never ever have a team for a variety of reasons, North QLD the same. Whilst Newcastle is a very big city, it will be a very difficult market to break into, doesn't mean the AFL shouldn't try but it will need some serious planning & forethought.

2028 - Hobart
2030 - Canberra
2032 - St. Kilda relocate to Sunshine Coast ("Sunshine Coast Saints")
2034 - North Melbourne relocate to Northern Brisbane ("Kedron Kangaroos")
2036 - new club in North Sydney/Northern Beaches Brisbane (possible relocation ??)
2038 - new club in either Illawarra or Newcastle/Central Coast

That's it, 22 clubs playing a 21-round season, 11-games per round.

 

[Coolangatta]

I mean, if we’re going to go to 24 without NT, NQ or NZ then I’d go:

Canberra, Perth, 3rd Adelaide, 2nd Brisbane with SC links, 3rd Sydney with Illawarra links. Use Newcastle as a secondary market for the Swans, they already have support up north.

Names I like: Canberra Cobras, Perth Sharks, Southern Panthers, North Brisbane Bears, South Sydney Pirates.

 

[Purple Suit]

Yeah but how many teams do you want the AFL to have? Who misses out from the list that I suggested? ACT is a must, it’s a good growing pro footy market.

Even if you toss out NZ and replace with Perth 3, do you swap out Brisbane 2 for Adelaide 3? Okay, but what happens when Brisbane gets too big for one team or when Sydney gets too big for two? The latter might never have enough interest in footy for three teams but Brisbane will be an under serviced market one day for sure.

I want enough so all teams are making money. Currently we are under that so expansion needs to add profit margins in the future, not take it away. It's an elite competition, the location has to have population and support or it devalues the whole comp.

ACT is still too early. It's basically like Tasmania without the state government backing it. You can't start another two drains on the comp while the last two drains are still there. It's next after WA3 and probably the same time as SA3 so there are 22 teams. Either that or time to merge two vic teams when ACT comes in 2040.

I wouldn't be expanding into QLD or NSW with a third side till they have two financially strong sides. Currently they have Sydney at that level, even Brisbane struggles even though they merged with Fitzroy and won three flags in a row which everyone says is very important for a new side in a rugby market.

NZ is the worst idea of the lot. I can't see the business case.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Darwin is an awesome place to live, the issue would be getting them to concentrate on footy and not going drinking and fishing all the time.

id argue most people would not agree with you.

If Gold Coast is not an attractive place for AFL footballers, then i ver much doubt Darwin would be.

 

[Purple Suit]

id argue most people would not agree with you.

If Gold Coast is not an attractive place for AFL footballers, then i ver much doubt Darwin would be.

Is the place or lack of success and proximity to family the real reason they have higher turnover?

 

[Coolangatta]

I want enough so all teams are making money. Currently we are under that so expansion needs to add profit margins in the future, not take it away. It's an elite competition, the location has to have population and support or it devalues the whole comp.

ACT is still too early. It's basically like Tasmania without the state government backing it. You can't start another two drains on the comp while the last two drains are still there. It's next after WA3 and probably the same time as SA3 so there are 22 teams. Either that or time to merge two vic teams when ACT comes in 2040.

I wouldn't be expanding into QLD or NSW with a third side till they have two financially strong sides. Currently they have Sydney at that level, even Brisbane struggles even though they merged with Fitzroy and won three flags in a row which everyone says is very important for a new side in a rugby market.

NZ is the worst idea of the lot. I can't see the business case.

You make good points, but you’re also suggesting the possibility of ACT, WA3, SA3, and maybe NT, NSW and QLD 3.

As you said, you’d have to merge two VIC clubs to cover all of that. That would make it 24. Supposing NZ is a bad idea, if you think NT is one day viable, why not NQ? There’s good growth potential in Cairns and Mackay. Or is NQ where you’d put a third QLD side if the Lions and Suns become strong off field?