Expansion 20th AFL team location

[Canberra Pear]

Lime green and black could work well, I just think it shouldn't be for Canberra with the Raiders basically owning lime green.

I wouldn't want it as a primary colour, but I'm fine with lime as a secondary or trim. Something like the below (good call with Bing Coolangatta). Canberra United use lime, so to do the Sydney Thunder (which play part-time here and people are pushing for a Canberra relocation). It was originally a Raiders colour, but I think it's evolved to more of a Canberra colour (like Brisbane and maroon).



My preference is probably still the blue, green and yellow like Coolangatta had earlier. It works well for Woodville-West Torrens in the SANFL. Blue and yellow would've been perfect if the Eagles weren't already in. I like green and gold too, but might get pushback from going with the national colours.

 

[Coolangatta]

Canberra Pear I tried to describe to it the Woodville-West Torrens jumper but with a green emphasis instead.

 

[Bjo187]

Good colours, distinctive.

Reminds me of St Kevin's in the vafa.

 

[3207]

How does sky blue represent the ACT?

It's NSW's colour, which is a completely different jurisdiction, and most Canberrans have no affiliation with NSW.

Or common sense.

Look at the rats that work in the public service, for example.

 

[Canberra Pear]

Or common sense.

Look at the rats that work in the public service, for example.

They've got common sense.

They've just used it all up all choosing to live in Canberra over Sydney.

 

[3207]

They've got common sense.

They've just used it all up all choosing to live in Canberra over Sydney.

Real common sense is leaving Sydney to live in Melbourne.

Must say though, Canberra is a great joint at the moment. Super impressed when I visited last.

 

[LordLucifer]

VIC
1. Essendon
2. Footscray (aka Western Suburbs)
3. Melbourne
4. Geelong
5. Carlton
6. Richmond
7. Collingwood
8. Hawthorn East Melbourne

NSW
9. Sydney
10. GWS
11. North Shore Skinks
12. Wollongong Wombats
13. Central Coast Cruisers

QLD
13. Brisbane
14. Sunshine Coast Saints
15. North Brisbane Blue Tongues
16. Gold Coast

SA
17. Adelaide
18. Port Adelaide

WA
19. WCE
20. Fremantle

TAS
21. Hobart Devils

ACT
22. Canberra Kangaroos

 

[3207]

VIC
1. Essendon
2. Footscray (aka Western Suburbs)
3. Melbourne
4. Geelong
5. Carlton
6. Richmond
7. Collingwood
8. Hawthorn East Melbourne

NSW
9. Sydney
10. GWS
11. North Shore Skinks
12. Wollongong Wombats
13. Central Coast Cruisers

QLD
13. Brisbane
14. Sunshine Coast Saints
15. North Brisbane Blue Tongues
16. Gold Coast

SA
17. Adelaide
18. Port Adelaide

WA
19. WCE
20. Fremantle

TAS
21. Hobart Devils

ACT
22. Canberra Kangaroos

Central Coast Passion Pops too wordy?

 

[Cubs2Lions]

 

[Canberra Pear]

This video pretty much sums up why I'm apprehensive about continuing the Giants-Canberra partnership.

And I say this as a Giants member who appreciates what the Giants have done in Canberra in general.

Canberra should absolutely be in the conversation. We're one of only two places viable of hosting Team 20.

But this video doesn't even include us because we're lumped in with the Giants. North's relationship with Hobart didn't stop Tasmania, and our relationship with the Giants shouldn't matter either.

 

[Coolangatta]

FFS.

So three things here bother me.

1. The Giants are NOT the Canberra team, Canberra is a secondary market for GWS in the same way that Darwin is a secondary market for Gold Coast and so on. So, better not have an NT team hey, because the Suns are the NT team.

2. Newcastle has had 0 AFL games played there. I cannot believe even one person in the country, even one, has considered them for the 20th team. You don't put a new team in a location that hasn't been tested as a secondary market yet. And even if they play games there in a NSW Gather Round, it doesn't count, as the games will be packed with outsiders, not locals, giving no real indication of the teams viability.

3. Norwood isn't a good idea for team 20 as the market isn't there in Adelaide for it, the Crows don't have over 100k members like the Eagles do. And don't bother introducing them ever if they can't use their traditional club colours because of Melbourne. How freakin' hard is it for the Dees to just wear an all white kit against Norwood and vice versa?

 

[Rob R]

I personally liked these designs.

View attachment 1904972

That period probably tells us the next club that should go (after the Druggies that can't win finals), get rid of the team that voted to merge.

On SM-A125F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Cmarsh]

FFS.

So three things here bother me.

1. The Giants are NOT the Canberra team, Canberra is a secondary market for GWS in the same way that Darwin is a secondary market for Gold Coast and so on. So, better not have an NT team hey, because the Suns are the NT team.

2. Newcastle has had 0 AFL games played there. I cannot believe even one person in the country, even one, has considered them for the 20th team. You don't put a new team in a location that hasn't been tested as a secondary market yet. And even if they play games there in a NSW Gather Round, it doesn't count, as the games will be packed with outsiders, not locals, giving no real indication of the teams viability.

3. Norwood isn't a good idea for team 20 as the market isn't there in Adelaide for it, the Crows don't have over 100k members like the Eagles do. And don't bother introducing them ever if they can't use their traditional club colours because of Melbourne. How freakin' hard is it for the Dees to just wear an all white kit against Norwood and vice versa?

I agree that Newcastle shouldn't be the location of the 20th team, but I also think the AFL haven't put much effort into promotion of the game there. There has always been the assumption that "they just like the Knights" but the Hunter is a pretty big place and I think there is an opportunity for more sporting diversity there. A pre season practice game in Newcastle would be a good start.

 

[Coolangatta]

I agree that Newcastle shouldn't be the location of the 20th team, but I also think the AFL haven't put much effort into promotion of the game there. There has always been the assumption that "they just like the Knights" but the Hunter is a pretty big place and I think there is an opportunity for more sporting diversity there. A pre season practice game in Newcastle would be a good start.

Yeah, and a couple of games during the H&A season would help, but they've gotta mix up the times and clubs that play there to see how many actual locals are taking interest in it.

But getting a club to play there is an issue, and they need to upgrade the Newcastle showgrounds to AFL standard.

Canberra being team 20 is the key to unlocking a red hot go at the Newcastle market. If the Giants take 2 of their Canberra games to Newcastle and 1 to Accor against the Swans/Pies then they'd be the perfect team to test the markets viability as a possible expansion entry if they expand to 22 teams in the future which I think they should.

 

[Cubs2Lions]

3. Norwood isn't a good idea for team 20 as the market isn't there in Adelaide for it, the Crows don't have over 100k members like the Eagles do. And don't bother introducing them ever if they can't use their traditional club colours because of Melbourne. How freakin' hard is it for the Dees to just wear an all white kit against Norwood and vice versa?

Just wanted to talk about SA3 for a minute even though they will definitely not be the 20th team.

Norwood will definitely not work given your reasons above and how the clubs would overlap from each other in areas covered so they should not be considered no matter how popular Norwood is at SANFL level.

Instead, the only club that could be a smoky of being that SA3 at SANFL level would be the South Adelaide Panthers.

Now obviously there is going to be bias here coming from me and Tigerlaird about it and the club would need to change their identity up greatly to avoid clashes, but South Adelaide is the oldest club in the SANFL, has had so many players come there to the AFL (even Craig McRae supported them as a child) and while the success of the club has been starving in the local league, they have so much potential to continue growing the sport in the Southern suburbs (train station to city right next to club), hills and coast down to Mount Gambier.

Initially, the club would play all their matches at Adelaide Oval to gain support but there are options to have the club play in a secondary market (under AFL support) in the future like Mount Barker, Victor Harbour or Mount Gambier, as well as their current home ground in Noarlunga (does need redevelopment mind you) so there is massive potential for the club to be represented in the big time.

Again though, this particular club and catchment area won’t be ready for the 20th team slot and it would all depend on how Gold Coast and GWS fare to dictate where beyond 20 teams are located in the future, but ideally the 22nd team slot would be my calling for South Adelaide to deliver.

 

[Coolangatta]

Just wanted to talk about SA3 for a minute even though they will definitely not be the 20th team.

Norwood will definitely not work given your reasons above and how the clubs would overlap from each other in areas covered so they should not be considered no matter how popular Norwood is at SANFL level.

Instead, the only club that could be a smoky of being that SA3 at SANFL level would be the South Adelaide Panthers.

Now obviously there is going to be bias here coming from me and Tigerlaird about it and the club would need to change their identity up greatly to avoid clashes, but South Adelaide is the oldest club in the SANFL, has had so many players come there to the AFL (even Craig McRae supported them as a child) and while the success of the club has been starving in the local league, they have so much potential to continue growing the sport in the Southern suburbs (train station to city right next to club), hills and coast down to Mount Gambier.

Initially, the club would play all their matches at Adelaide Oval to gain support but there are options to have the club play in a secondary market (under AFL support) in the future like Mount Barker, Victor Harbour or Mount Gambier, as well as their current home ground in Noarlunga (does need redevelopment mind you) so there is massive potential for the club to be represented in the big time.

Again though, this particular club and catchment area won’t be ready for the 20th team slot and it would all depend on how Gold Coast and GWS fare to dictate where beyond 20 teams are located in the future, but ideally the 22nd team slot would be my calling for South Adelaide to deliver.

Wouldn't hurt to try, but if we are to assume they're going to 22 teams and Canberra and Perth 3 will be two of those next three expansion sides, if Newcastle and Auckland are being tested as secondary markets, they are more likely to come under stronger consideration for the remaining expansion spot than SA3 or even Brisbane 2 IMO. But it's possible that no one will give a s**t in those markets and it'd open the door up for a third SA side to come in, especially if WA3 does. I think without WA3, there'll be no SA3, I just hope WA3 doesn't come in before Canberra does.

 

[Cmarsh]

Yeah, and a couple of games during the H&A season would help, but they've gotta mix up the times and clubs that play there to see how many actual locals are taking interest in it.

But getting a club to play there is an issue, and they need to upgrade the Newcastle showgrounds to AFL standard.

Canberra being team 20 is the key to unlocking a red hot go at the Newcastle market. If the Giants take 2 of their Canberra games to Newcastle and 1 to Accor against the Swans/Pies then they'd be the perfect team to test the markets viability as a possible expansion entry if they expand to 22 teams in the future which I think they should.

Newcastle council on its website even mention by name wanting to attract elite AFL matches stemming from the upgrade of Newcastle no1 sportsground.

No. 1 Sportsground Redevelopment

We have redeveloped No. 1 Sportsground to meet regional AFL and cricket standards.

newcastle.nsw.gov.au

The swans played Collingwood in a preseason match there about 20 years ago and attracted about 5k, so there is a level of interest there. But that was 20 years ago. Time to dip the toe in the water again I think.

 

[i am a logo]

FFS.

So three things here bother me.

1. The Giants are NOT the Canberra team, Canberra is a secondary market for GWS in the same way that Darwin is a secondary market for Gold Coast and so on. So, better not have an NT team hey, because the Suns are the NT team.

2. Newcastle has had 0 AFL games played there. I cannot believe even one person in the country, even one, has considered them for the 20th team. You don't put a new team in a location that hasn't been tested as a secondary market yet. And even if they play games there in a NSW Gather Round, it doesn't count, as the games will be packed with outsiders, not locals, giving no real indication of the teams viability.

3. Norwood isn't a good idea for team 20 as the market isn't there in Adelaide for it, the Crows don't have over 100k members like the Eagles do. And don't bother introducing them ever if they can't use their traditional club colours because of Melbourne. How freakin' hard is it for the Dees to just wear an all white kit against Norwood and vice versa?

In 2004, Sydney and Essendon played a pre-season practice match in Newcastle and it attracted a crowd of 3,500

AFL Pre-Season: Sydney v Essendon • Newcastle No.1 Sportsground • 2004

Event information for Sydney v Essendon at Newcastle No.1 Sportsground in 2004 including seating map, tickets, directions, venue details, nearby accommodation and flights.

www.austadiums.com

 

[NoWuckingFurries]

Can the afl really support this many clubs..

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

Yeah, and a couple of games during the H&A season would help, but they've gotta mix up the times and clubs that play there to see how many actual locals are taking interest in it.

But getting a club to play there is an issue, and they need to upgrade the Newcastle showgrounds to AFL standard.

Canberra being team 20 is the key to unlocking a red hot go at the Newcastle market. If the Giants take 2 of their Canberra games to Newcastle and 1 to Accor against the Swans/Pies then they'd be the perfect team to test the markets viability as a possible expansion entry if they expand to 22 teams in the future which I think they should.

The Giants need to be playing all their home games in Sydney. Even if that means Blacktown during the easter show, but ideally something out near Penrith as a second venue. It only needs to be 10k capable to begin with.

 

[Coolangatta]

The Giants need to be playing all their home games in Sydney. Even if that means Blacktown during the easter show, but ideally something out near Penrith as a second venue. It only needs to be 10k capable to begin with.

No issue with them playing all their games in Sydney, but that pretty much sticks a fork in Newcastle as a future expansion option because I can’t see anyone else playing a couple games there.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

No issue with them playing all their games in Sydney, but that pretty much sticks a fork in Newcastle as a future expansion option because I can’t see anyone else playing a couple games there.

I doubt Newy wouild be seriously considered in a 24 team comp. The population isn't far off Canberra or Tassie (the Hunter region double either, but growing far less than ACT) but the more important numbers are economic ones. Getting a small share of a small ad spend, with a relatively small corporate base for the secondary and tertiary sponsors isn't likely to be an AFL priority.

Its probably part of why Tassie was given such utterly ludicrous demands, no corporate base to sustain a club so make the government so heavily invested on a white elephant they can't ever back out. NSW won't be so easy to blackmail for AFL games.

 

[Archer_11]

NT must be in the comp one day on principle, and it's hard to see the AFL as a comp with ~22 teams this side of 2050.

For anyone proposing to kill off small clubs like North, the reality is that only six clubs could survive without assistance and seven clubs are within $3m of each other. Only GWS and GC are clear outliers, and assuming Tassie and New Team X are similar you would have to kill off three or four established teams to come out square. Brisbane and Sydney are safe, so we are talking about getting rid of half of the old VFL. Fewer games, less revenue and the Vic comp binning half of it's history. It's just a bizarre conversation to have.

 

[Bjo187]

Seeing over 50k tonight at Optus when a Perth team finally gets a decent timeslot, kinda tells me in 7 or 8 years time the afl will see the potential in a third team there. It will be an under resourced market. If they could just somehow convince the kangaroos to Canberra and the growth potential it brings for the club, we would be set till about 2050 and the balance of 9 Vic, 11 interstate with 3 in Perth would be perfect.

 

[Coolangatta]

I doubt Newy wouild be seriously considered in a 24 team comp. The population isn't far off Canberra or Tassie (the Hunter region double either, but growing far less than ACT) but the more important numbers are economic ones. Getting a small share of a small ad spend, with a relatively small corporate base for the secondary and tertiary sponsors isn't likely to be an AFL priority.

Its probably part of why Tassie was given such utterly ludicrous demands, no corporate base to sustain a club so make the government so heavily invested on a white elephant they can't ever back out. NSW won't be so easy to blackmail for AFL games.

Fair enough, you'll probably be proven correct. It is interesting that occasionally the NT and NQ gets mentioned in the media when it comes to expansion (or by the club captains) and Demetriou in the past. They're both much smaller than Newcastle but there seems to be interest in those regions, especially if it turns out the Hawks do end up playing a game or two in Cairns after they leave Launceston, which is rumoured. It's interesting that the Hawks would play there and not, instead, push for something like Newcastle if their ground was developed better.

NT must be in the comp one day on principle, and it's hard to see the AFL as a comp with ~22 teams this side of 2050.

For anyone proposing to kill off small clubs like North, the reality is that only six clubs could survive without assistance and seven clubs are within $3m of each other. Only GWS and GC are clear outliers, and assuming Tassie and New Team X are similar you would have to kill off three or four established teams to come out square. Brisbane and Sydney are safe, so we are talking about getting rid of half of the old VFL. Fewer games, less revenue and the Vic comp binning half of it's history. It's just a bizarre conversation to have.

But how? I'd love it to happen but it'd cost a billion plus to have a stadium there, plus hundreds of millions to go into a high performance centre, an academy, grassroots development, and other stuff I'm not thinking of.

Who's fitting the bill for that? I just can't see the corporate sector funding it. The AFL won't, the NT government can't, the feds are the only ones who could do it and there's no chance it happens just after Tasmania. I suppose never say never if there's a 21-22 round of expansion, though.

Seeing over 50k tonight at Optus when a Perth team finally gets a decent timeslot kinda tells me in 7 or 8 years time the afl will see the potential in a third team there. It will be an under resourced market. If they could just somehow convince the kangaroos to Canberra and the growth potential it brings got the club, we would be set till about 2050 and the balance of 9 Vic, 11 interstate with 3 in Perth would be perfect.

100% agree, it would be great for the league, but I don't see it happening. I have a feeling you're right, and that sadly ACT will get shafted in favour of a third Perth team. Although, if the AFL insists on owning the 3rd WA club, they might tell the AFL to jump, or the WAFC might say they aren't interested, but as has been said in this thread before, if SA3 makes some noise about team 20 (stupid idea), they might change their tune. But this "Canberra is Giants territory" narrative is unfortunately annoyingly pervasive.