Expansion 20th AFL team location

[catters05]

Seeing over 50k tonight at Optus when a Perth team finally gets a decent timeslot kinda tells me in 7 or 8 years time the afl will see the potential in a third team there. It will be an under resourced market. If they could just somehow convince the kangaroos to Canberra and the growth potential it brings got the club, we would be set till about 2050 and the balance of 9 Vic, 11 interstate with 3 in Perth would be perfect.

AFL should have been throwing that same money at North for Canberra over Gold Coast. I think that Canberra market they were building was wasted, but believe the AFL screwed North over on that?

IMO Canberra probably would have been a more attractive option for fans and growth of the club whilst still a closer proximity to Melbourne and access to potential federal funding etc.

Would also allow the Giants to 100% focus on West Sydney.


Wouldn’t happen now though, North not going anywhere.

 

[Bjo187]

AFL should have been throwing that same money at North for Canberra over Gold Coast. I think that Canberra market they were building was wasted, but believe the AFL screwed North over on that?

IMO Canberra probably would have been a more attractive option for fans and growth of the club whilst still a closer proximity to Melbourne and access to potential federal funding etc.

Would also allow the Giants to 100% focus on West Sydney.


Wouldn’t happen now though, North not going anywhere.

I mean could they offer North something like $20 million to move, with the following arrangements:

• still get 3 home games in Melbourne per year, including good Friday.
• 5 away games in Melbourne per year.
• it's only 4 less games in Melbourne per year than their current arrangement.
• 9 home games in Canberra, however the ACT continues to pay gws to play 1 game there per year for 500k, therefore bringing Canberra up to 10 home games. GWS get 11 Sydney games, 10 home, one away v swans.
• Overnight, North become one of the richest teams in the comp, retain a Melbourne presence and tap into a whole new supporter base in Canberra, as they will be the local team and not a fly in/ fly out one.

- Perth falcons come into the competition as team 20, there blue is changed to green, they play 3 games Joondalup, 2 games waca, 6 games at Optus. + 2 away derbies = 13 games in Perth per year.

- I think that's a pretty good balance all round.

 

[peetoo]

With all these ‘second home ground’ arrangements why not let the 20th team play all these grounds, but have all their games as nominal home games including some at the mcg against big drawing clubs. Guaranteed for 10 years. Give them extras like guaranteed charter flights etc.

Eventually a couple of home team bases will appear organically. Change the arrangement then

 

[Archer_11]

[Team in NT]

But how? I'd love it to happen but it'd cost a billion plus to have a stadium there, plus hundreds of millions to go into a high performance centre, an academy, grassroots development, and other stuff I'm not thinking of.

Who's fitting the bill for that? I just can't see the corporate sector funding it. The AFL won't, the NT government can't, the feds are the only ones who could do it and there's no chance it happens just after Tasmania. I suppose never say never if there's a 21-22 round of expansion, though.

Thinking out loud the catalyst would have to be something bigger than footy, I don't know what that is. A huge project where building an air conditioned stadium as part of the project makes sense, funded by truck loads of taxpayer money. It would need to be a tourist destination, a cultural hub, a school & training centre, giant cinema perhaps, it would need to be all the things. It will a long wait but I think that's the only way to could happen. Lonely stadiums plonked 30 minutes drive from town I hope are a thing of the past, too much evidence ideas like that are DOA.

AFL should have been throwing that same money at North for Canberra over Gold Coast. I think that Canberra market they were building was wasted, but believe the AFL screwed North over on that?

IMO Canberra probably would have been a more attractive option for fans and growth of the club whilst still a closer proximity to Melbourne and access to potential federal funding etc.

Would also allow the Giants to 100% focus on West Sydney.

Wouldn’t happen now though, North not going anywhere.

Thanks for acknowledging that.

Despite onfield success North was amateur hour in the late 90's and early 2000's. They chased money playing games in Sydney, then Canberra and the AFL saw their chance. Gold Coast was three times the money or something crazy like that.

Some on the North board believed the hybrid model was inevitable but both these members and the AFL greatly underestimated the passionate rejection the idea would receive. Caroline Wilson constantly published articles saying North are certain to go which ironically galvanized the Melbourne group (thanks Caro! Always looking out for us). Some of the articles she wrote were borderline shrill and and it was obvious to all she was an AFL mouth piece.

North reset the board and after a fateful day at Dallas Brooks Hall on 6/12/2007 the rest was history.

I mean could they offer North something like $20 million to move, with the following arrangements:

• still get 3 home games in Melbourne per year, including good Friday.
• 5 away games in Melbourne per year.
• it's only 4 less games in Melbourne per year than their current arrangement.
• 9 home games in Canberra, however the ACT continues to pay gws to play 1 game there per year for 500k, therefore bringing Canberra up to 10 home games. GWS get 11 Sydney games, 10 home, one away v swans.
• Overnight, North become one of the richest teams in the comp, retain a Melbourne presence and tap into a whole new supporter base in Canberra, as they will be the local team and not a fly in/ fly out one.

- Perth falcons come into the competition as team 20, there blue is changed to green, they play 3 games Joondalup, 2 games waca, 6 games at Optus. + 2 away derbies = 13 games in Perth per year.

- I think that's a pretty good balance all round.

GWS have the Canberra market, this will not change. Also when North left, they were told don't let the door hit you and rightly so.

The secondary market that made sense for North was Ballarat. The AFL closed that door and gifted it to the Bulldogs.

 

[catters05]

I mean could they offer North something like $20 million to move, with the following arrangements:

• still get 3 home games in Melbourne per year, including good Friday.
• 5 away games in Melbourne per year.
• it's only 4 less games in Melbourne per year than their current arrangement.
• 9 home games in Canberra, however the ACT continues to pay gws to play 1 game there per year for 500k, therefore bringing Canberra up to 10 home games. GWS get 11 Sydney games, 10 home, one away v swans.
• Overnight, North become one of the richest teams in the comp, retain a Melbourne presence and tap into a whole new supporter base in Canberra, as they will be the local team and not a fly in/ fly out one.

- Perth falcons come into the competition as team 20, there blue is changed to green, they play 3 games Joondalup, 2 games waca, 6 games at Optus. + 2 away derbies = 13 games in Perth per year.

- I think that's a pretty good balance all round.

Wasn’t the AFL offering $100m for Gold Coast relocation, would have to be at least that again I would have thought?

 

[catters05]

GWS have the Canberra market, this will not change. Also when North left, they were told don't let the door hit you and rightly so.

The secondary market that made sense for North was Ballarat. The AFL closed that door and gifted it to the Bulldogs.

Wow, didn’t realise that. I guess that was AFL being grumpy due to not accepting Gold Coast?

 

[Archer_11]

Wow, didn’t realise that. I guess that was AFL being grumpy due to not accepting Gold Coast?

I think hedging their bets on trying it again wtih Tassie. We were doing both and once again left ourselves wide open.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

Wow, didn’t realise that. I guess that was AFL being grumpy due to not accepting Gold Coast?

I think the Ballarat thing had more to do with the state election.

The Libs got elected, weren't going to upgrade the ground North were keen on playing at to keep all games in Vic. We looked to Hobart after being keen to have all games in Vic but not having a secondary venue suitable.
When ALP got back in and upgraded, we were stuck in Tas and Bulldogs got the jump on the better location (for a Vic based team).

 

[Bjo187]

Wasn’t the AFL offering $100m for Gold Coast relocation, would have to be at least that again I would have thought?

I watched the doco that was bullshit north said. Demetriou just threw the random number out there, they were unsure if that included a stadium, training facility etc.

The other thing north would get in Canberra is that whole academy zone of the ACT and riverina. Giants take n.t as a replacement, suns have enough talent in QLD.

 

[Archer_11]

I watched the doco that was bullshit north said. Demetriou just threw the random number out there, they were unsure if that included a stadium, training facility etc.

The other thing north would get in Canberra is that whole academy zone of the ACT and riverina. Giants take n.t as a replacement, suns have enough talent in QLD.

By memory it was $100m but it was for five years and it was to cover everything. So say for example the club got $15m pa as a Melbourne club, North were only getting $25m to relocate(!). The way the media manipulated this to make it sound like a giant handout is laughable.

We also got a stadium. but there were no details nor timeline. What we were really being asked to sign up to was a guaranteed future.

Emotion aside the million dollar question is, will expansion clubs be given $25m pa in perpetuity? Perhaps yes but I don't think that's a question anyone can answer.

 

[Coolangatta]

I mean could they offer North something like $20 million to move, with the following arrangements:

• still get 3 home games in Melbourne per year, including good Friday.
• 5 away games in Melbourne per year.
• it's only 4 less games in Melbourne per year than their current arrangement.
• 9 home games in Canberra, however the ACT continues to pay gws to play 1 game there per year for 500k, therefore bringing Canberra up to 10 home games. GWS get 11 Sydney games, 10 home, one away v swans.
• Overnight, North become one of the richest teams in the comp, retain a Melbourne presence and tap into a whole new supporter base in Canberra, as they will be the local team and not a fly in/ fly out one.

- Perth falcons come into the competition as team 20, there blue is changed to green, they play 3 games Joondalup, 2 games waca, 6 games at Optus. + 2 away derbies = 13 games in Perth per year.

- I think that's a pretty good balance all round.

They'd reject the offer, but if the AFL decided overnight to only offer them the baseline level of funding each year, and they started going backwards financially, things could turn sour.

It'd have to be 6 away games in Melbourne, 2 home in Melbourne, 9 in Canberra, to bring Canberra up to 10 with a home GWS game.

It won't happen but going along with your hypothetical, if it did, I'd go a bit different from you if it was gonna be Perth Falcons. Light blue sash instead of green as it's closer to West Perth's traditional blue but different from the Eagles; 2 games in Joondalup, 9 at Optus + 2 away derbies.

But I think it'd be better to just go a fresh team (still base them in Joondalup). Do a public survey for the team name, choices out of Perth Falcons/Sharks/Quokkas/Miners/Diggers/Dolphins/Numbats/Panthers/Pirates.

 

[Coolangatta]

Why do Newcastle and Perth both have tassie devils on the jumper?

Cause that's what Bing came up with with my prompt. I just went with whatever it came up with.

With all these ‘second home ground’ arrangements why not let the 20th team play all these grounds, but have all their games as nominal home games including some at the mcg against big drawing clubs. Guaranteed for 10 years. Give them extras like guaranteed charter flights etc.

Eventually a couple of home team bases will appear organically. Change the arrangement then

Travelling Wilburys, 2 games in Darwin, 1 in Alice Springs, 3 in Canberra, 3 at Optus, 2 in Ballarat, 2 in Adelaide, 1 in Sydney, 1 in QLD, 1 in Tassie, 3 at the G, 3 at Marvel, 1 gather round.

Base them on the moon.

Hoo-ah!

 

[Cubs2Lions]

Cause that's what Bing came up with with my prompt. I just went with whatever it came up with.


Travelling Wilburys, 2 games in Darwin, 1 in Alice Springs, 3 in Canberra, 3 at Optus, 2 in Ballarat, 2 in Adelaide, 1 in Sydney, 1 in QLD, 1 in Tassie, 3 at the G, 3 at Marvel, 1 gather round.

Base them on the moon.

Hoo-ah!

Gotta have this as their theme song then

 

[Coolangatta]

North Sydney Kangaroos playing at an upgraded North Sydney Oval, Canberra Saints playing at an upgraded Manuka, Hunter Valley Bulldogs playing at an upgraded Newcastle Showground would do good for the long-term growth of the game. Tasmania and Perth 3 for teams 19 and 20, and you're set until at least 2050. Too bad it can't happen.

 

[Bjo187]

North Sydney Kangaroos playing at an upgraded North Sydney Oval, Canberra Saints playing at an upgraded Manuka, Hunter Valley Bulldogs playing at an upgraded Newcastle Showground would do good for the long-term growth of the game. Tasmania and Perth 3 for teams 19 and 20, and you're set until at least 2050. Too bad it can't happen.

The saints have a decent size supporter base and cover the massive footy area of the South East of Melbourne, where the Sandringham dragons footy factory comes from. On the bulldogs, why would you have a side in western sydney because it's the fastest growing area in the city, but not have a team in the western suburbs of Melbourne, also the fastest growing area in Melbourne?

I think both those clubs have growth potential, they've just been starved of success over history.

North unfortunately are land locked.

 

[Coolangatta]

The saints have a decent size supporter base and cover the massive footy area of the South East of Melbourne, where the Sandringham dragons footy factory comes from. On the bulldogs, why would you have a side in western sydney because it's the fastest growing area in the city, but not have a team in the western suburbs of Melbourne, also the fastest growing area in Melbourne?

I think both those clubs have growth potential, they've just been starved of success over history.

North unfortunately are land locked.

Fair call.

Edit: Too bad the Dogs are playing in Ballarat, if they upgrade the stadium there, it wouldn't be too late to have the Dogs concentrate on the western suburbs of Melbourne and have the Roos play 3 home games in Ballarat after Hobart.

If ever they were gonna move, that'd be the place, but then they are probably adamant in being a Melbourne club and nowhere else. Like you said, though, they've got Carlton, Collingwood, and Essendon surrounding them, talk about land lock, ouch.

 

[Bjo187]

Fair call.

Edit: Too bad the Dogs are playing in Ballarat, if they upgrade the stadium there, it wouldn't be too late to have the Dogs concentrate on the western suburbs of Melbourne and have the Roos play 3 home games in Ballarat after Hobart.

If ever they were gonna move, that'd be the place, but then they are probably adamant in being a Melbourne club and nowhere else. Like you said, though, they've got Carlton, Collingwood, and Essendon surrounding them, talk about land lock, ouch.

North could actually play in Bendigo. It's the same size as Ballarat and more north than west. Or Albury. There are a few options, a long term commitment they could build a supporter base in a big country town.

 

[Coolangatta]

North could actually play in Bendigo. It's the same size as Ballarat and more north than west. Or Albury. There are a few options, a long term commitment they could build a supporter base in a big country town.

Yeah Cunnington Cartel told me that North are taking an interest in Bendigo. That’d be cool to see. Will certainly help grow the fan base some more like you said.

 

[catters05]

Would be interesting, 2 Bulldog games in Ballarat and 2 North games in Bendigo. Then have a shared blockbuster between the two at Marvel Stadium…

 

[Coolangatta]

Would be interesting, 2 Bulldog games in Ballarat and 2 North games in Bendigo. Then have a shared blockbuster between the two at Marvel Stadium…

Yeah they’d be good secondary markets. Would love to see the Saints tap into the Riverina market.

 

[Badger17]

Canberra Pear I tried to describe to it the Woodville-West Torrens jumper but with a green emphasis instead.

Owls are cool, but griffins would be the way to go if you wanted something a bit unique and with more of a traditional Canberra/ACT vibe about it.

 

[Cmarsh]

Seeing over 50k tonight at Optus when a Perth team finally gets a decent timeslot, kinda tells me in 7 or 8 years time the afl will see the potential in a third team there. It will be an under resourced market. If they could just somehow convince the kangaroos to Canberra and the growth potential it brings for the club, we would be set till about 2050 and the balance of 9 Vic, 11 interstate with 3 in Perth would be perfect.

But will the people of Canberra accept a relocated Vic team as their own?

 

[Cmarsh]

Yeah Cunnington Cartel told me that North are taking an interest in Bendigo. That’d be cool to see. Will certainly help grow the fan base some more like you said.

Yeah I have always wondered why the AFL haven't taken more advantage of what is a pretty big regional city.

 

[kreuze_missile]

The smart move would be to grant Carlton a second license in Perth.

We've got a huge fanbase over there.

And we're good enough to field two teams both of which would play finals.

You could even bring back the light blue jumper and the 2000s Carlton logo to save money on design. Refer avatar.

You're welcome Dillon.

 

[Cubs2Lions]

Yeah they’d be good secondary markets. Would love to see the Saints tap into the Riverina market.

Would be interesting if there was infrastructure at Dandenong that St. Kilda or Hawthorn play cpl of matches over there as well and then you would have the Melbourne centric clubs, Western Bulldogs at Ballarat PT, North Melbourne in Bendigo PT, St. Kilda / Hawthorn Dandenong PT, GWS in Canberra / Riverina PT and then the rest of the interstate clubs.

*- Part Time.