Expansion 20th AFL team location

[Purple7x08_24]

20th team in Armadale

 

[neogh]

AFL boss rejects talk of third WA team

AFL CEO Andrew Dillon has shut down talks over a proposed third team in WA with the footy boss saying ‘a lot of work would have to be done.’

thewest.com.au

AFL CEO Andrew Dillon has poured cold water on the prospect of a third team in Western Australia.

Speaking at Friday’s Seven West Media Derby Lunch at Crown, Dillon said “a lot of work would have to be done” to introduce another team in the State.

With Tasmania set to enter the competition in 2028 there is speculation there will be a 20th licence granted. “I’m not that against an odd number of teams,” Dillon said. “Freo and West Coast work pretty well in Perth.”

West Australian Football Commission chair Wayne Martin earlier this year described a push for a third WA AFL team as “madness”, suggesting merging two Melbourne-based clubs as a means of re-equalising the fixture.

A consortium is believed to be interested in pulling together a Geraldton bid, while civic leaders in Joondalup, Mandurah, Bunbury and the South-West have also expressed interest.

“I think it’s madness,” Martin told The West Australian.

“There are a limited number of talented players and if you keep on adding clubs there would be an issue whether there is enough talent to sustain the standards at 20.

“I am not ruling 20 out, but I think in Western Australia there just aren’t enough businesses and people to support a third licence.”

Dillon also hinted at the prospect of a special event for WA, even floating an expansion of Gather Round.

Surprise surprise. What else do you expect from the most static sporting organisation in Australia?

 

[neogh]

“There are a limited number of talented players and if you keep on adding clubs there would be an issue whether there is enough talent to sustain the standards at 20.

Ahh another talent pool myth. Just because the coaches want players a backman that can kick a torp on their opposite foot and a forward that can spoil a ball last line of defence.

If you want a solution then there is way of reducing players on the field.

 

[Coolangatta]

Victoria has 3x the population of WA but 5x the number of teams, but it’s WA that can’t support a third club.

Riiight.

 

[Canberra Pear]

Surprise surprise. What else do you expect from the most static sporting organisation in Australia?

You say that, but the AFL has the most clubs of any professional league in Australia, and it got that way by going slowly.

It's the only Australian pro league I can think of that hasn't rectracted or had to fully reform. Slowly and steady is boring, but it's got the AFL to its pre-eminent position.

 

[neogh]

Victoria has 3x the population of WA but 5x the number of teams, but it’s WA that can’t support a third club.

Riiight.

Depends how on you intepretate it, but that's more to do with AFL being born directly from VFL, because of WCE licence fees that saved them from bankruptcy.

If it was found from a seperate league, would've had 6 7 clubs max, and 1 or 2 more from WA, SA.

 

[peetoo]

Depends how on you intepretate it, but that's more to do with AFL being born directly from VFL, because of WCE licence fees that saved them from bankruptcy.

If it was found from a seperate league, would've had 6 7 clubs max, and 1 or 2 more from WA, SA.

The way australia has grown, if there had just been one code. It would have been absolutely dominated by Sydney and Melbourne.

Granted there wouldn’t be ten teams in both Melbourne and Sydney, but other places would have had one at the most

 

[Coolangatta]

The way australia has grown, if there had just been one code. It would have been absolutely dominated by Sydney and Melbourne.

Granted there wouldn’t be ten teams in both Melbourne and Sydney, but other places would have had one at the most

If there was just one code, there’d probably be 6 Sydney, 5 Melbourne, 1 each Newcastle, Canberra, Geelong, Perth, Adelaide, Brisbane, Gold Coast, North Queensland, New Zealand, and Tasmania.

But there’d be enough talent for more than 20 teams if the NRL didn’t exist so there’d probably be more teams, like a 7th in Sydney using Wollongong as a secondary market, and probably 2 teams each in Brisbane, Perth, and Adelaide.

24 teams.

Though depends on how many people support both codes. But I still think it would’ve been somewhere around 20-24 clubs.

 

[Bjo187]

The way australia has grown, if there had just been one code. It would have been absolutely dominated by Sydney and Melbourne.

Granted there wouldn’t be ten teams in both Melbourne and Sydney, but other places would have had one at the most

This is the way it should have been the whole country playing the Australian game.

Australian football and rugby league did try to combine into one sport and it was going to go ahead, the nswrl, I think maybe the wafl and sanfl had already signed off on it, but ww1 started right at the time which ruined the plans. Universal football it was called.

 

[Cubs2Lions]

This is the way it should have been the whole country playing the Australian game.

Australian football and rugby league did try to combine into one sport and it was going to go ahead, the nswrl, I think maybe the wafl and sanfl had already signed off on it, but ww1 started right at the time which ruined the plans. Universal football it was called.

Found this nice little video essay on the history and downfall of Universal Football (part of essay series of history of Australian Rules Football I’ve been binging with future episodes still to come out for this amazing series).

 

[peetoo]

If there was just one code, there’d probably be 6 Sydney, 5 Melbourne, 1 each Newcastle, Canberra, Geelong, Perth, Adelaide, Brisbane, Gold Coast, North Queensland, New Zealand, and Tasmania.

But there’d be enough talent for more than 20 teams if the NRL didn’t exist so there’d probably be more teams, like a 7th in Sydney using Wollongong as a secondary market, and probably 2 teams each in Brisbane, Perth, and Adelaide.

24 teams.

Though depends on how many people support both codes. But I still think it would’ve been somewhere around 20-24 clubs.

Half those places had bugger all population historically. Itd be Perth adelaid brisbane 1 each and the rest split between Melbourne and Sydney

 

[Coolangatta]

Half those places had bugger all population historically. Itd be Perth adelaid brisbane 1 each and the rest split between Melbourne and Sydney

Depends on how many teams they wanted/could support.

Newcastle would be viable, same as Canberra, Gold Coast, and New Zealand who would easily have the population.

NQ works too with Townsville on board with the code plus input from Cairns/Mackay.

Tassie in time like we’re getting soon.

And Geelong have a looooong history in the game hence success.

It depends on when the comp would’ve began but you’re probably right that it’d be dominated by Sydney and Melbourne with a bit of the other major cities.

I just don’t think they’d ignore places that would have eventually had enough of a population to support a club in time either.

There’d twice the talent pool we have now for this league.

 

[peetoo]

Depends on how many teams they wanted/could support.

Newcastle would be viable, same as Canberra, Gold Coast, and New Zealand who would easily have the population.

NQ works too with Townsville on board with the code plus input from Cairns/Mackay.

Tassie in time like we’re getting soon.

And Geelong have a looooong history in the game hence success.

It depends on when the comp would’ve began but you’re probably right that it’d be dominated by Sydney and Melbourne with a bit of the other major cities.

I just don’t think they’d ignore places that would have eventually had enough of a population to support a club in time either.

There’d twice the talent pool we have now for this league.

I said historically, which was what the poster I responded to was also discussing

 

[Coolangatta]

I said historically, which was what the poster I responded to was also discussing

Yeah and I wasn’t in my post you replied to. Of course I don’t think it would’ve begun with 20 teams or so. It was what I think it might look like today. But yeah, of course it’d be the five major cities to start.

 

[neogh]

You say that, but the AFL has the most clubs of any professional league in Australia, and it got that way by going slowly.

It's the only Australian pro league I can think of that hasn't rectracted or had to fully reform. Slowly and steady is boring, but it's got the AFL to its pre-eminent position.

Doesn't help that other sporting organisations are incompetent, let's say Aleague.

Aleague is the example to not adding multiple random expansions in a short amount of time.

Compared to the AFL, NRL is already working on a 18th team, except its mainly the PM and Vlandys fault on where it should be decided now.

 

[Teen Wolf]

Victoria has 3x the population of WA but 5x the number of teams, but it’s WA that can’t support a third club.

Riiight.

It's more like 2.5x the population. Same ratio of games played in Victoria and WA at stadiums not owned by the AFL.

If there was a bid made for a 3rd (and even 4th) WA team involving a new stadium, which the AFL would get to own after 25 years, of course they would jump at that deal.

But until such a deal is on the table, comparing the number of teams in each state is flawed because of the uniquely great situation that the league have with their ownership of Marvel Stadium (which, btw, wouldn't be so great if they didn't have ~45 AFL games to play there each year).

 

[peetoo]

Doesn't help that other sporting organisations are incompetent, let's say Aleague.

Aleague is the example to not adding multiple random expansions in a short amount of time.

Compared to the AFL, NRL is already working on a 18th team, except its mainly the PM and Vlandys fault on where it should be decided now.

On SEN the knights came out and said no thanks to a league div 2 because they thought it well they couldn’t say because confidentiality, but it’s huge vote of no confidence. Said principal is OK, but not execution.

 

[Cunnington Cartel]

On SEN the knights came out and said no thanks to a league div 2 because they thought it well they couldn’t say because confidentiality, but it’s huge vote of no confidence. Said principal is OK, but not execution.

To me, on face value the principle seems incredibly poor as well. If hardly anyone cares about the A-League first division, then why do they think second division will stimulate interest? Too many people involved with soccer in Australia look towards European football as a source of inspiration and they’re too narrow-minded to realise that those models are never going to be successful in our country. We have one of the most diverse and competitive sports markets out there (which includes 4 professional football codes). The soccer structures in European countries don’t have that level of competition from other codes and they never will, so a cookie cutter approach is doomed for failure IMO.

 

[Coolangatta]

To me, on face value the principle seems incredibly poor as well. If hardly anyone cares about the A-League first division, then why do they think second division will stimulate interest? Too many people involved with soccer in Australia look towards European football as a source of inspiration and they’re too narrow-minded to realise that those models are never going to be successful in our country. We have one of the most diverse and competitive sports markets out there (which includes 4 professional football codes). The soccer structures in European countries don’t have that level of competition from other codes and they never will, so a cookie cutter approach is doomed for failure IMO.

Not to mention proximity and talent pool is completely different in the European comps.

 

[Cunnington Cartel]

Not to mention proximity and talent pool is completely different in the European comps.

Absolutely. Our best players will always move on for better opportunities abroad, which further diminishes the appeal of our domestic comp.

 

[catters05]

Canberra makes the most sense imo. Mainly to continue growing in that market and get GWS focused on West Sydney and having 3 clubs in the NSW/ACT. I think GWS in Canberra hurts growth in West Sydney.

 

[Coolangatta]

Canberra makes the most sense imo. Mainly to continue growing in that market and get GWS focused on West Sydney and having 3 clubs in the NSW/ACT. I think GWS in Canberra hurts growth in West Sydney.

Agreed. I’d love ACT and WA3 but North won’t budge so there’s only one spot up for grabs.

Surely the Giants can move their three Canberra games to Accor. One against Sydney, one against Collingwood, and one against whatever other big Vic club is flying that year. They should get good crowds for those games, right?

 

[Canberra Pear]

Agreed. I’d love ACT and WA3 but North won’t budge so there’s only one spot up for grabs.

Surely the Giants can move their three Canberra games to Accor. One against Sydney, one against Collingwood, and one against whatever other big Vic club is flying that year. They should get good crowds for those games, right?

Canberra only gets two games during the Easter Show, so no issue with scheduling with the later one.

In a normal season, there's a five or six-game stretch over the Easter Show. I reckon the Giants only need to fill that with one Accor game in the middle to break up the stretch, then get more Giants Stadium games later in the season.

 

[Coolangatta]

Canberra only gets two games during the Easter Show, so no issue with scheduling with the later one.

In a normal season, there's a five or six-game stretch over the Easter Show. I reckon the Giants only need to fill that with one Accor game in the middle to break up the stretch, then get more Giants Stadium games later in the season.

Yeah, that's a good short term fix, but long-term, if Canberra were to get their own team, then those two Canberra games the Giants currently get during the Easter Show could surely be moved to Accor.

 

[Cubs2Lions]

Yeah, that's a good short term fix, but long-term, if Canberra were to get their own team, then those two Canberra games the Giants currently get during the Easter Show could surely be moved to Accor.

Another option could be to play that “California” home game against Essendon that was floated pre-COVID so you would have 9x (Showgrounds), 1x (Accor) and 1x (California).

*- Another home match in Adelaide for Gather Round, if home matches equate to 12 in the future.