AGM Date

[mediumsizered]

That is true AD, but he should put the clubs interests before his own. FFS, he moved the AGM so another ticket wouldn't have the required time to challenge the board.

Have a look at Collingwood and Essendon. Two Melbourne clubs who comtinue to make $1M+ profits, have a very settled board and are very very quiet in the off-season, and then have a look at us. We are a complete basket case, and the buck stops with Smorgon.

He is running our great club into the ground, and the quicker he is gone the better.

That is a bit harsh, HBF. How is Smorgon running our club into the ground? Please explain. Is our club financially worse off since Smorgon took over earlier this year? Have we lost required players in the off season? Do we have any players on $1 million contracts anymore? Is it not good to see Ratten & Bradley back at the club?

If you want to compare us to Collingwood & Essendon, the first question that needs to be asked is, why were we still playing at a suburban footy ground up until 2 years ago when both those clubs had long ago accepted that this was not the way forward financially? Instead of building the Legends Stand & trying to coerce the AFL into using Optus Oval as its second major ground, after the MCG, our administration should have had the foresight to get our club the healthy deals that Collingwood & Essendon got at the 'G' & Colonial Stadium/Telstra Dome respectively.

We must also ask how our club missed out on the Anzac Day action. We were playing games on Anzac Day, successfully, long before the current Collingwood v Essendon deal was done to tie this day up. 1975 Carlton v Essendon drew 77k on Anzac Day. Even in 1980 v Melbourne we drew 60k on Anzac Day. Our club fell way behind Essendon & Collingwood because our administration thought our history would be enough to ensure we were always going to be financially strong. We didn't have to get out in the marketplace & compete because we were the most successful club in the history of the VFL/AFL.

FWIW, there is no doubt that Smorgon brought the AGM forward to trump De Lutis & his cohorts, but why did they not put a ticket together as soon as Collins stepped down & handed the reins to Smorgon? They have had several months to challenge Smorgon, but for some reason wanted to leave it to the last minute to put it all together. That is an example of the lack of foresight that has seen our club fall behind Essendon & Collingwood.

 

[HBF]

That is a bit harsh, HBF. How is Smorgon running our club into the ground? Please explain. Is our club financially worse off since Smorgon took over earlier this year? Have we lost required players in the off season? Do we have any players on $1 million contracts anymore? Is it not good to see Ratten & Bradley back at the club?.

He, and he alone, has done some terribe things to the club over the past few months. Lets not go over the Mitchell/Pagan saga again, but he is the boss, and the buck stops with him. To make matters worse, both Mitchell and Pagan are still at PP, and surely there has to be tension there which is not good for the club.

I can't argue about required players, financial plight of the club, contracts and seeing Bradley and Ratts back at the club, but what I will say is that for every good move the club seems to make, it is followed by an equally bad one. Board rooms leaks, division on the board, 2 board members resigning and Smorgon moving the AGM forward a month.

He is NOT a good president - end of story. I want him out of the club, and I want him out now. He better watch out for me at the AGM, 'cuase he aint seen nothing yet!

 

[mediumsizered]

Board rooms leaks, division on the board, 2 board members resigning and Smorgon moving the AGM forward a month.

He is NOT a good president - end of story. I want him out of the club, and I want him out now. He better watch out for me at the AGM, 'cuase he aint seen nothing yet!

Who is responsible for the leaks & why did they happen? Could it have had anything to do with those that may have been contemplating an alternative ticket? This is no different to the leaks that kept filtering through in the weeks/months prior to Kevin Rudd challenging Kim Beasley for the ALP leadership. Those with separate agendas have to indulge in this behaviour to weaken the hold on power of an incumbent.

With respect to the resignation of 2 board members, I am happy to concede that John Valmorbida went due to his dissatisfaction with Smorgon, but The Age reported on 20 April 2006 that Bruce Mathieson would be departing within months. I think it is therefore unfair to suggest that Mathieson's departure is the result of what has taken place at the club in the last 3-4 months.

With respect to your comment that Smorgon is not a good president, who in your opinion, that actually wants to run for the presidency, should be president?

 

[HBF]

Who is responsible for the leaks & why did they happen? Could it have had anything to do with those that may have been contemplating an alternative ticket? This is no different to the leaks that kept filtering through in the weeks/months prior to Kevin Rudd challenging Kim Beasley for the ALP leadership. Those with separate agendas have to indulge in this behaviour to weaken the hold on power of an incumbent.

Perhaps the question should be MS - why would current board members want to join an alternative ticket. Perhaps the answer is that they are unhappy with the direction the club is heading and they need a change at the top.

With respect to the resignation of 2 board members, I am happy to concede that John Valmorbida went due to his dissatisfaction with Smorgon, but The Age reported on 20 April 2006 that Bruce Mathieson would be departing within months. I think it is therefore unfair to suggest that Mathieson's departure is the result of what has taken place at the club in the last 3-4 months.

Hard to say with Mathieson to be fair. Wasn't he looking at moving interstate to concentrate on his business.

With respect to your comment that Smorgon is not a good president, who in your opinion, that actually wants to run for the presidency, should be president?

Anyone who can put the clubs interests before theirs. Smorgon is there for one thing, and one thing only - his ego. If he had the clubs best interests at heart, he would have welcomed the competition from the rival ticket, and then let the members decide who they want to be on the board. The fact that he moved the AGM forward clearly shows that he is on borrowed time as a President and the quicker he goes, the better.

 

[BlueWorld]

That is a bit harsh, HBF. How is Smorgon running our club into the ground? Please explain. Is our club financially worse off since Smorgon took over earlier this year?

No idea.

Have we lost required players in the off season?

French, De luca, Thornton, Russell wanted to leave.

Do we have any players on $1 million contracts anymore?

We can't afford to. We were trying to save money on contracts for players like Thornton & almost lost him- in the end having to pay a lot more than he was worth to prevent Hawthorn taking him.

 

[mediumsizered]

Anyone who can put the clubs interests before theirs. Smorgon is there for one thing, and one thing only - his ego. If he had the clubs best interests at heart, he would have welcomed the competition from the rival ticket, and then let the members decide who they want to be on the board. The fact that he moved the AGM forward clearly shows that he is on borrowed time as a President and the quicker he goes, the better.

This is something I am really bewildered about. ODN recently debated this with Jeff Dunne & I am confused as to where the ego side of it comes in for Smorgon. Unlike Eddie McGuire who's media career received a boost with his involvement with the Collingwood Football Club & Jeff Kennett who just loves the exposure that comes with the presidency of an AFL club, I can't for the life of me see what Smorgon gains from being the president of the Carlton Football Club. He has nothing to prove in the business world. Certainly the Smorgon group of companies would probably derive more negatives than positives through any association with our struggling club. I doubt Smorgon is seeking a media career & I can't see him embarking on a political career. If anything, his time as president has probably given him more headaches than he has encountered during his entire working life.

I doubt the presidency of the Carlton Football Club gives any ego boost to Smorgon, but I could see it being a handy boost for those who are contemplating seeking the position.

 

[Blue Thunder]

That is a bit harsh, HBF. How is Smorgon running our club into the ground? Please explain. Is our club financially worse off since Smorgon took over earlier this year? Have we lost required players in the off season? Do we have any players on $1 million contracts anymore? Is it not good to see Ratten & Bradley back at the club?

If you want to compare us to Collingwood & Essendon, the first question that needs to be asked is, why were we still playing at a suburban footy ground up until 2 years ago when both those clubs had long ago accepted that this was not the way forward financially? Instead of building the Legends Stand & trying to coerce the AFL into using Optus Oval as its second major ground, after the MCG, our administration should have had the foresight to get our club the healthy deals that Collingwood & Essendon got at the 'G' & Colonial Stadium/Telstra Dome respectively.

We must also ask how our club missed out on the Anzac Day action. We were playing games on Anzac Day, successfully, long before the current Collingwood v Essendon deal was done to tie this day up. 1975 Carlton v Essendon drew 77k on Anzac Day. Even in 1980 v Melbourne we drew 60k on Anzac Day. Our club fell way behind Essendon & Collingwood because our administration thought our history would be enough to ensure we were always going to be financially strong. We didn't have to get out in the marketplace & compete because we were the most successful club in the history of the VFL/AFL.

FWIW, there is no doubt that Smorgon brought the AGM forward to trump De Lutis & his cohorts, but why did they not put a ticket together as soon as Collins stepped down & handed the reins to Smorgon? They have had several months to challenge Smorgon, but for some reason wanted to leave it to the last minute to put it all together. That is an example of the lack of foresight that has seen our club fall behind Essendon & Collingwood.

Mediumsizered have you stopped to think that the reason a challenge to the current board did not come sooner is because people WERE prepared to give Smorgon his opportunity at getting the club back on track?

The momentum for challenging the current board grew through the deplorable management of the club post season 2006, in addition to the lack of ability for the current board to eradicate the debt, fix the cash flow problems and more importantly the perception of the club.

People's comments about the rival ticket having plenty of time to get things in order is simply naive. To formalize such things with people like Pratt, Grollo, La mana (yes La Mana Bannana), Colin De-Lutis, Mark Maclure, Nicole Stevenson and others takes time and cannot be done within a matter of weeks. Anyone who thinks otherwise must assume that these people live off the fruits of their success consistently sunning themselves on a beach somwhere ready to catch the next plane for a meeting. That is not the reality. All these people are very committed to assisting the club to get back on it's feet but will not do it half whimmed simply to meet the date of the AGM due to it being brought forward.

The approach to this will be proper, and if necessary an EGM will be called once all the formalities for the ticket have been taken care of, and the ticket has had the opportunity to present the business plan to interested members.

There is still more rounds to go before this fight is over.

 

[mediumsizered]

[/B]

Mediumsizered have you stopped to think that the reason a challenge to the current board did not come sooner is because people WERE prepared to give Smorgon his opportunity at getting the club back on track?

The momentum for challenging the current board grew through the deplorable management of the club post season 2006, in addition to the lack of ability for the current board to eradicate the debt, fix the cash flow problems and more importantly the perception of the club.

People's comments about the rival ticket having plenty of time to get things in order is simply naive. To formalize such things with people like Pratt, Grollo, La mana (yes La Mana Bannana), Colin De-Lutis, Mark Maclure, Nicole Stevenson and others takes time and cannot be done within a matter of weeks. Anyone who thinks otherwise must assume that these people live off the fruits of their success consistently sunning themselves on a beach somwhere ready to catch the next plane for a meeting. That is not the reality. All these people are very committed to assisting the club to get back on it's feet but will not do it half whimmed simply to meet the date of the AGM due to it being brought forward.

The approach to this will be proper, and if necessary an EGM will be called once all the formalities for the ticket have been taken care of, and the ticket has had the opportunity to present the business plan to interested members.

There is still more rounds to go before this fight is over.

I would suggest in the best interests of the club, that if/when there is a challenge it take place immediately after the end of the 2007 season. Any changing of the guard post February would only mean more bad media for our club at a time when the focus should be on what our exciting youngsters are going to do in 2007.

Personally I want to be reading about Bryce Gibbs, Marc Murphy, Josh Kennedy, our new captain Lance, Kade Simpson & the rest of the boys, once the NAB Cup has started. I do not want to be reading about Graham Smorgon, Greg Lee, Sticks (except in his role as chairman of selectors), De Lutis, Grollo, Pratt, Maclure etc until the footy is out of the way next season. Surely this is in the best interests of our club.

 

[HBF]

^^^^ That is a good point MS, but can the club afford to stagnate another 12 months whilst Smorgon is in charge. If you have a look at 2 of the names that BT mentioned, Grollo and Pratt, and think how much $$$$ they would be able to sink into the club straight away, and then have a look at their own businesses and you soom realise that they would be great as an alternative ticket for the Carlton Footy Club.

I agree with you on most things associated with the Carlton Footy Club, but on this one, I just cannot.

 

[Man City Blues!]

I would suggest in the best interests of the club, that if/when there is a challenge it take place immediately after the end of the 2007 season. Any changing of the guard post February would only mean more bad media for our club at a time when the focus should be on what our exciting youngsters are going to do in 2007.

Personally I want to be reading about Bryce Gibbs, Marc Murphy, Josh Kennedy, our new captain Lance, Kade Simpson & the rest of the boys, once the NAB Cup has started. I do not want to be reading about Graham Smorgon, Greg Lee, Sticks (except in his role as chairman of selectors), De Lutis, Grollo, Pratt, Maclure etc until the footy is out of the way next season. Surely this is in the best interests of our club.

Understand this point. We all hate off field dramas which prevent us from enjoying the on field performance of the team. However in this particular case I do not think an EGM which results in the pratt/grollo ticket taking control would be a bad thing. Firstly, I do not think it would bring bad media. Caro and any journalists who have written articles deploring the current state of the Carlton football club are not anti carlton. They call things as they are. They realise that Smorgon is a shocking president and , in the words of Caro 'how his board is functioning remains a mystery'. However if Pratt/Grollo etc were to take over, it is likely we would receive good press. Money would come in, and you would see articles appear about how our financial state is better, our debt is being cleared and we are no longer financially stricken. This has not happened under Smorgon. This would be good press.

Secondly, you write that you want to read articles about Simpson, Kennedy, etc. May I point out that the current board were extremely foolish in not signign up our young guns earlier this year. They should have signed up Thornton and Russell from the start. We were EXTREMELY fortunate we had pick 1 in the PSD, or Thornton would most likely have been gone. Leaving young, talented players uncontracted is waving red to the bulls. Every club will try and poach them. Now as it stands, the board has not made any attempt to re-sign Kennedy, who is out of contract this year and is from WA. This should be a priority in my opinion. Kade Simpson is also out of contract and should be highly sought after. These contracts should be taken care of now, not left until the last minute. Sadly, our board does not understand this. And if we do not have pick 1 in the PSD this year, and leave players like Kennedy unsigned, there is every chance we could lose them. And then next march in the NAB cup you will not be reading about Kennedy, etc. At least not for Carlton...

 

[Johnny_3]

Understand this point. We all hate off field dramas which prevent us from enjoying the on field performance of the team. However in this particular case I do not think an EGM which results in the pratt/grollo ticket taking control would be a bad thing. Firstly, I do not think it would bring bad media. Caro and any journalists who have written articles deploring the current state of the Carlton football club are not anti carlton. They call things as they are. They realise that Smorgon is a shocking president and , in the words of Caro 'how his board is functioning remains a mystery'. However if Pratt/Grollo etc were to take over, it is likely we would receive good press. Money would come in, and you would see articles appear about how our financial state is better, our debt is being cleared and we are no longer financially stricken. This has not happened under Smorgon. This would be good press.

Secondly, you write that you want to read articles about Simpson, Kennedy, etc. May I point out that the current board were extremely foolish in not signign up our young guns earlier this year. They should have signed up Thornton and Russell from the start. We were EXTREMELY fortunate we had pick 1 in the PSD, or Thornton would most likely have been gone. Leaving young, talented players uncontracted is waving red to the bulls. Every club will try and poach them. Now as it stands, the board has not made any attempt to re-sign Kennedy, who is out of contract this year and is from WA. This should be a priority in my opinion. Kade Simpson is also out of contract and should be highly sought after. These contracts should be taken care of now, not left until the last minute. Sadly, our board does not understand this. And if we do not have pick 1 in the PSD this year, and leave players like Kennedy unsigned, there is every chance we could lose them. And then next march in the NAB cup you will not be reading about Kennedy, etc. At least not for Carlton...

alright... first highlighted point, it would be a bad thing as it takes attention away from the players, brings attention to a place i am not proud to show off as well as a new start.
2nd, umm yes they are anti social, and they call things as they dream up in there small little anti social brains.
it is not likely to receive good press as there is no reason for it, surely we know smorgan is a terrible president but a new unproven one would bring unstabability, therefore more bad press.
and just how would all this money fly in it will be at least 3 or 4 years before we break even if not 6 or 7. we need big change and i think that shouldnt start 2 months before the season.
FINALLY I AGREE WITH YOU SIGN THEM UP NOW YOU BLOODY D1CKHEADS

 

[mediumsizered]

^^^^ That is a good point MS, but can the club afford to stagnate another 12 months whilst Smorgon is in charge. If you have a look at 2 of the names that BT mentioned, Grollo and Pratt, and think how much $$$$ they would be able to sink into the club straight away, and then have a look at their own businesses and you soom realise that they would be great as an alternative ticket for the Carlton Footy Club.

I agree with you on most things associated with the Carlton Footy Club, but on this one, I just cannot.

I seem to remember reading only a few days ago that the 4 latest board nominees will be bringing approximately $2 million to the club. These people have already put their hand up, whereas the Grollo/Pratt money is only part of speculation/rumour. No one even knows for sure that they or their proxies are even going to be running a ticket. At this stage it is about as solid a rumour as the Goddard to Carlton one that rears its ugly head every now & then.

Since the bloodletting began in September, we have been assured by posters on here that we would be hearing about an alternative ticket in early November, then late November, then December & then by Jan 15. November & December have gone & the Jan 15 people have pulled the pin already. Now of course the big white hope is an EGM which supposedly would be held not longer after the AGM. Let's throw some more money away organising an EGM to satisfy the time line & agenda of a group of people who haven't been able to get their act together to have their nominations ready by January. You have to wonder just how committed these people, should they exist, really are.

 

[drusswaylander]

I seem to remember reading only a few days ago that the 4 latest board nominees will be bringing approximately $2 million to the club. These people have already put their hand up, whereas the Grollo/Pratt money is only part of speculation/rumour. No one even knows for sure that they or their proxies are even going to be running a ticket. At this stage it is about as solid a rumour as the Goddard to Carlton one that rears its ugly head every now & then.

Since the bloodletting began in September, we have been assured by posters on here that we would be hearing about an alternative ticket in early November, then late November, then December & then by Jan 15. November & December have gone & the Jan 15 people have pulled the pin already. Now of course the big white hope is an EGM which supposedly would be held not longer after the AGM. Let's throw some more money away organising an EGM to satisfy the time line & agenda of a group of people who haven't been able to get their act together to have their nominations ready by January. You have to wonder just how committed these people, should they exist, really are.

As much as I want Smorgon out I have to agree mate. The ticket was not well organised and they should not have been so easily out manoevred if they were fair dinkum about running now.

Waiting until the end of next season will give them time to workout a way forward for the club and even if they want to be involved. It is a big job with little reward. I really don't want an EGM.

 

[drusswaylander]

Mediumsizered if you ever get the chance watch the documentary "Rats in the Ranks" about the Leichardt council elections in the mid 90's.

It should give you an insight into how ego plays a part on boards councils etc.

It is a fascinating little film about human nature and how illogical it can be at times Ego can manifest itself in a number of ways mate

Unfortunately for us

 

[mediumsizered]

Mediumsizered if you ever get the chance watch the documentary "Rats in the Ranks" about the Leichardt council elections in the mid 90's.

It should give you an insight into how ego plays a part on boards councils etc.

It is a fascinating little film about human nature and how illogical it can be at times Ego can manifest itself in a number of ways mate

Unfortunately for us

I think I caught up with the tail end of that doco at one time. It was an eye opener. I must look into where I might be able to lay my hands on it so I can watch it in its entirety.

 

[HBF]

As much as I want Smorgon out I have to agree mate. The ticket was not well organised and they should not have been so easily out manoevred if they were fair dinkum about running now.

Waiting until the end of next season will give them time to workout a way forward for the club and even if they want to be involved. It is a big job with little reward. I really don't want an EGM.

I fear that if Smorgon is left in charge of the footy club, then who knows where we might be in 12 months time.

The 2 issues that really stand out for me are:

* The Pagan/Mitchell saga
* The huge divisions that exist at board level.

Who knows what could happen over the next 12 months at Carlton, but I just don't rest that easy knowing that Smorgon is in charge.

 

[Bluebear]

He, and he alone, has done some terribe things to the club over the past few months. Lets not go over the Mitchell/Pagan saga again, but he is the boss, and the buck stops with him. To make matters worse, both Mitchell and Pagan are still at PP, and surely there has to be tension there which is not good for the club.

He alone?
Actually HBF, it appeared at the time that Sticks and Gleeson were in it up to their eyeballs.........please don't rewrite history.

I can't argue about required players, financial plight of the club, contracts and seeing Bradley and Ratts back at the club, but what I will say is that for every good move the club seems to make, it is followed by an equally bad one. Board rooms leaks, division on the board, 2 board members resigning and Smorgon moving the AGM forward a month.

Boardroom leaks are his fault? Interesting. Throws up a conundrum for you in that you throw out feelers for BT and THS to provide you with an opinion, yet, if they are to be trusted and have "inside information", are the very leaks that you now blame Smorgon for. I'm not sure how you can reconcile these two.

The board membership thing was laughable.......as I have pointed out, Smorgon was damned if he did (reduce the board) and quite clearly damned if he didn't. Is it just possible that the new appointments (one of which was to replace a director that was going to quite months ago) may actually add some expertise that we require.............or is it purely just shoreing up the numbers?

The momentum for challenging the current board grew through the deplorable management of the club post season 2006, in addition to the lack of ability for the current board to eradicate the debt, fix the cash flow problems and more importantly the perception of the club.

Now BT before you read below, don't get all teary on me. I do appreciate your posts as being informative, but like any good forum I choose to express an alternative point of view.

No doubt the club review was handled poorly, and has left the club with a poor situation, that of Mitchell remaining on as assistant.
Just how, given our on-field perfromances, was the current board, led by Smorgon, since he started in April, supposed to have erradicated the club debt, fix cash flow problems, and, given the likes of the current media (not helped by Sticks), and posters like you leaking nothing but negativity, fix the perceptions of the club?

It seems to me that Smorgon suffers from not having charisma. He is being put to the sword because of his inability to fix the club in 8 months...........sorry, but thats just the biggest load os BS that I've ever heard.
Blaming him for our current financial predicament is far worse than Blaming Pagan for our playing list, and most of us understand what a silly arguement that is.
The potential train wreck that is our club was taken over by Smorgon while running flat out towards a very large wall.
Unless BT or THS choose to enlighten me as to missed opportunities, IMHO the current board could not have possibly produced the results being called for in the quote above.
They are slowing the train down, and it won't hit the wall, but it will take time to turn around and head the right direction.
They have previously mention lack of sponsorship fulfillments as evidence of this financial mismangagement.
I can only imagine, given our current on-field performances, how hard it could be to sell these sponsorships. The fact they filled their quotas for next year astounds me.

As for the rival ticket thing, there were serious rumblings in October led by Fraser Brown about a rival ticket. That was 10 weeks ago, and with another couple of weeks until the deadline, it will be about 3 months all told. Now I concede BT the the following 2 weeks is not long enough to get a ticket together, but 3 months is in anyones book.
What has occurred since the Pagan/Mitchell debarcle that has suddenly caused a stir to form a new ticket. IMO if these people were serious then they would have "sounded out" (as per your Rats in the Ranks) support and candidates. The prosepct that this is unlikely to happen, of course is now used by anti-Smorgonites to bag him, rather than it be used to rubbish the potential suitors to the job. Yet another no-win situation (as per the board numbers joke).
Maybe they couldn't get the numbers because those who would want the positions can see that the club is in good hands......maybe they don't think they could do any better, and want Smorgon to continue to take the hard decisions so they can come in when things look a bit better and take the glory.......maybe they quite simply don't exist in the form that you would like to believe.

I continue to sit and watch, digesting only what is observable, and letting the rest of the drivel pass "through to the keeper".

 

[mediumsizered]

I fear that if Smorgon is left in charge of the footy club, then who knows where we might be in 12 months time.

The 2 issues that really stand out for me are:

* The Pagan/Mitchell saga
* The huge divisions that exist at board level.

Who knows what could happen over the next 12 months at Carlton, but I just don't rest that easy knowing that Smorgon is in charge.

The Pagan/Mitchell saga is a non-event. I would be surprised if either of them are at the club beyond 2008. There are so many assistant coaches ahead of Mitchell in the pecking order, both at our club & in the system in general, that Mitchell should fully embrace the new role he has been handed because that is probably where his future will lay if he wants to remain in the AFL system. Barry Mitchell will never coach Carlton.

The huge divisions seem to get smaller every week. With Valmorbida gone & Diggins highly unlikely to retain her position after the AGM, I would suggest things might at least seem more harmonious than what they are now. That is what any potential challengers fear the most, an appearance of unity among the members of the board. That is why they fear waiting another 12 months, because an improved on-field performance & a more unified board, minus the white-anters, does not make for a good recipe for an alternative ticket to have much of a case to argue.

Rest assured HBF, Graham Smorgon will not sit back & allow the club to go backward in the next 12 months, he cares a bit more about the club than you like to believe. Let's not forget that those people up for election at the AGM are those who have got their act together & put their hands up to say they want to be involved. They are not just rumoured names, they are actual nominees. Those names that have been promised by THS & BT, on the other hand, have not put their hands up. Why? Well maybe THS & BT can answer that.

 

[HBF]

He alone?
Actually HBF, it appeared at the time that Sticks and Gleeson were in it up to their eyeballs.........please don't rewrite history.

My concern BB is that IF Smorgon was even a half decent leader/manager of people, then I dount there would have been such a division at Board Level. I realise that Sticks and Gleeson were culprits in it as well, but as far as i'm concerned, the buck stops will Smorgon, and he should be ashamed of how the has handled itself post season 2006.

One thing i'm sure we can all agree on, and that it is going to be an interesting next 12 months at PP, both on and off the field.

 

[AlecDuncan]

My concern BB is that IF Smorgon was even a half decent leader/manager of people, then I dount there would have been such a division at Board Level. I realise that Sticks and Gleeson were culprits in it as well, but as far as i'm concerned, the buck stops will Smorgon, and he should be ashamed of how the has handled itself post season 2006.

He's the chairman of the board, not the fuhrer. If the board's divided (most boards are - but the divisions aren't publicised), then it's not up to him to impose his edict on it. He might have deciding vote if the board is 50-50, but otherwise he's just another director.

If there is strong division, then it's his job to try and guide the group to a concensus decision which everyone can live with. That's what he did. The fact that someone decided to leak the half-baked procedings isn't his responsibility.

It's not the division that makes us look bad - it's the leaks from the boardroom. Division doesn't help, but without leaks do you think we'd be reading crap about it?

 

[BlueBelle]

He's the chairman of the board, not the fuhrer. If the board's divided (most boards are - but the divisions aren't publicised), then it's not up to him to impose his edict on it. He might have deciding vote if the board is 50-50, but otherwise he's just another director.

If there is strong division, then it's his job to try and guide the group to a concensus decision which everyone can live with. That's what he did. The fact that someone decided to leak the half-baked procedings isn't his responsibility.

It's not the division that makes us look bad - it's the leaks from the boardroom. Division doesn't help, but without leaks do you think we'd be reading crap about it?

Wouldn't you rather know than not know?

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Wouldn't you rather know than not know?

Know what though? The truth or a second hand version of the truth? For every reliable piece of info, we have many unreliable pieces.

 

[BlueBelle]

Know what though? The truth or a second hand version of the truth? For every reliable piece of info, we have many unreliable pieces.

BT and THS have been pretty much on the money. Circumstances have intervened but that is it.

 

[Bluebear]

BT and THS have been pretty much on the money. Circumstances have intervened but that is it.

Really?
I seem to recall multiple "watch this spcae" comments regarding. November, then December, then January..............mid year EGM I think is the latest........
(Again....don't get precious BT and THS.......just another opinion )

Let me try another way..........if BT and THS do have direct access to someone at the club....say on the board or in close contact with people on the board.
Now lets assume that there is some division among the board regadinbg leadership.
This places the person they receive their info from in a faction. Pro or anti-Smorgon.
Lets assume after reading much of what they post, that the info they are receiving is from a board member that is anti-Smorgon.
Does everything they post represent the truth?

I'm sure they post in good faith and trust the person thats passing them information, but the very fact that they receive the information in the first place means that the person responsible is already undermining the board.
So our source appears to be somone who is anti-Smorgon and happy to break to confidence of the board room.........objective opinion or propaganda?

It will surprise many of you to know that I have no great love for Smorgon (yes Druss, you saw it here first), I just haven't developed an irrational hatred of the man for what amounts to a poorly handled end of year review.
Is he the best president in our history......not yet and maybe never.......is he the worst..............not by a long shot.

HBF, by saying the buck stops with Smorgon, despite the involvement of others.......is that not like saying sack the coach despite the loss clearly involving a poor performance from senior players?

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

BT and THS have been pretty much on the money. Circumstances have intervened but that is it.

Not naming names BG but there has been more than just the two and some of it has been quite damaging and unnecessary IMO.