Bock Compensation Pick - Use or keep?

[Mr Magic]

I agree that with some tweaking of their team, that the Cats might still see themselves in the premiership window. So trading there compo pick for a very good player (or 2 good ones) this year is something they might consider. The trouble is, they've got enough other internal issues to keep themselves pretty busy, let alone go after a big fish or two. And then there is the issue that a game plan change does affect the recruitment process (to some degree), and with a new coach, things will change. Realistically, they would have liked another month or so to sort out other issues before going into trade week.

Geelong have good reason to consider themselves in the premiership window. They do not lose their talent overnight. Scarlett virtually, said they want to run around to win again and one of the reasons they lost is they went handball mad. The reality is with that other compo pick they will be compelled to trade their players in 2012 end or 2013 so they bottom out and get full effect of this pick and the best chance for a premiership in the longer term. However , they cannot throw away this opportunity for another premiership with the current list they have. Geelong have played complacent football for many years with St Kilda and now Collingwood having far more effective styles not to mention Hawthorn. It is time Geelong got smart, got a few more players, capitlise on their talent while they still have it. Ling for eg. would have to go forward, Bartell in the middle so they will want backman and /or midfielders one would suspect

 

[El Tigre]

Geelong have good reason to consider themselves in the premiership window. They do not lose their talent overnight. Scarlett virtually, said they want to run around to win again and one of the reasons they lost is they went handball mad. The reality is with that other compo pick they will be compelled to trade their players in 2012 end or 2013 so they bottom out and get full effect of this pick and the best chance for a premiership in the longer term. However , they cannot throw away this opportunity for another premiership with the current list they have. Geelong have played complacent football for many years with St Kilda and now Collingwood having far more effective styles not to mention Hawthorn. It is time Geelong got smart, got a few more players, capitlise on their talent while they still have it. Ling for eg. would have to go forward, Bartell in the middle so they will want backman and /or midfielders one would suspect

No, but you lose speed and strength, are more prone to injuries, and your game plan can be overtaken.
Of course Scarlett would say they would want to win again, its not likely he's going to say "nah, i've had my turn. I'm going to sit on my ass and coast for a couple of years".
I wouldn't say that Geelong have played complacent footaball for MANY years.
And i wouldn't necessarily put the word "Talent" and "Ling" so close together. People might construe that you mean Ling has talent.

 

[Mr Magic]

No, but you lose speed and strength, are more prone to injuries, and your game plan can be overtaken.
Of course Scarlett would say they would want to win again, its not likely he's going to say "nah, i've had my turn. I'm going to sit on my ass and coast for a couple of years".
I wouldn't say that Geelong have played complacent footaball for MANY years.
And i wouldn't necessarily put the word "Talent" and "Ling" so close together. People might construe that you mean Ling has talent.

Yes but the Geelong team was a freak list. Most of it is still there. If any list can do a last hurrah it is them. If they don't have a crackand trade the midrange compo 1st round pick all will be lost. Don't worry they won't be looking a a premiership for years and years, much like the Lions. This is their last chance. Ling, BTW is a good kick for goal and has brains and other attributes. They have enough there IMO with a few additions to be a threat with the rule changes. Collingwood , based on the second half of the first GF are not world beaters. The other contenders know this as well.

Geelong have played a handball style which beats weak teams well but is questionable under pressure as in finals. St Kilda and the Hawks, later Collingwood exploited this,. If Geelong wasn't so wasteful they would be far more effective IMO!!

They are really at the crossroads. If thy do not trade the pick I am suggesting for current players now they may as well pack up their boots now IMO!!

 

[shububu]

Dont know if this has already been answered...but what happens with GWS and all the concession picks teams will get when they start their raping and plundering? Does that make the Bock pick worse if we hang onto it?

 

[Mr Magic]

Yes this has to be considered. The thing is clearly it is beneficial to wait till at least 2012 from then on it gets a little more hazy in terms of the right approach. I think it will come down to circumstances, ladder position, who is up for trade etc...

 

[Wally Matera]

Anyway, the Ablett connection is irrelevant as the compensation was not determined in a free market. Besides the other compo pick for Geelong, based on ladder position, is the real kicker which will help them when they bottom out.

Your argument about what Geelong wants from us is irrelevant again, if we involve a third and fourth party etc.. Remember St Kilda, Hawthorn Freo Bulldogs Adelaide all think they are in the window as Collingwood is very beatable. They will want our talent to help their own surges. We can always accomodate them with our players / picks for certain players to Geelong in 4 way deals etc... where we end up with the compo pick and even financial assist Geelong with the players they potentially get.

Even I know we have no chance of getting Geelongs other compo pick as it is too valuable to Geelong. The midrange compo 1st round draft pick though is actually more valuable in Richmonds hands than Geelong IMO.

I am going to continually edit this post (due to internet issues)to provide full reasoning to get the Geelong compo draft pick so bare with me please !!

Firstly, Geelong if they don't trade it for players are telling supporters its over, they are simply going around to make up the numbers and protecting the nest. If Geelong do not trade for players, another 13-20 years is a real possibility unless they bottom out big time in 2013-2015.

Second reason, the Tigers need to set realistic goals. Most realise we could easily have only won 3 times this year. The compo pick maximum use is the J Selwood scenario when you get the excess bonus . Going on Geelong model we need to get to a prelim before we use this pick to get maximum advantage but realistically we use it in 2-3 years along the same principles, it could be later though. Mainstreet does not believe we will make the finals in 2 years necessarily. Mainstreet does believe we will be a real force in 5 years if we play our cards right. Eg. this is why Houli and Grigg want to come over. In other words the plan is realistic

Thirdly, this is an asset(premiership player influence) which has zero cost on the books. This pick enables the team to develop more effectively through the draft table and in addition it lets Lids and Co get longer contracts, front load them to reward them for loyalty and the team to go in one direction in terms of the premiership aim. The players have a realistic target, the player group can get single minded. Blind Freddy knows Grigg and Houli should be falling over themselves to play with the new southern force

Blah, blah, blah....

News flash Einstein... Geelong are no longer in the premiership window and they know it. The supporters know it. They have an old and the best player in comp just walked out on them. And yet, they were flogged in a prelim. Their window is closed and any new coach that has half a brain would use the picks got by Ablett to rebuild quicker than it usually takes others to bottom out. End of discussion.

As for bringing other clubs in a 4 way trade... you still havent told me what you're willing to give up for ANY club to be interested in HELPING us get that compensation pick. You're simply talking through your arse at the moment.

I dont care what clubs are involved in the trade, we simply dont have what other clubs are interested in. And those they are interested in, we want to keep.

So go back and come up with a real idea.

 

[tugga]

Yes this has to be considered. The thing is clearly it is beneficial to wait till at least 2012 from then on it gets a little more hazy in terms of the right approach. I think it will come down to circumstances, ladder position, who is up for trade etc...

I thought you said you had gone from BF?

 

[LiverpoolRed]

More like shoving a $100 down the back of the couch and in 3 years time finding $150 and the cost of living/inflation has decreased from 2010...

This.

 

[Mario Speedwagon]

I thought you said you had gone from BF?

It was only an illusion...he's magic....

 

[richoatthedisco]

I'd be inclined to hang onto it, unless we can use it to upgrade to a pick in the first 15.

 

[Mr Magic]

I'd be inclined to hang onto it, unless we can use it to upgrade to a pick in the first 15.

I think we should hang on to it to help the club, it is in their best interests.

I think, with the recent developments it is a little academic. AFL HQ wants the premiership to go north and will let nothing stop themselves achieving this.

I came back to to RF big footy because this topic is of high interest to RFC so I put in my 2 cents as stated in earlier posts.

I think though we a pushing s.. up hill though as in the next three years 3 powers will make the Geelong powerhouse look like a feeble girl. One is GC , the other is GWS and the final power, I won't mention to avoid the stars, but I think some might know what body I am referring to!!

 

[Ben_Tiger]

Geez. You lot have got such a hard-on for the 2012 Crop. We've picked up duds using good picks before. I've seen enough kids who look good and don't reach their potential, who simply cant cut it at AFL level despite looking good elsewhere. If we develop our players properly, then we don't need to be praying to the football gods that we come across another Martin. Can we stop hoping to come across a ready made superstar, and actually put the hard yards into a good bloke? It reminds me of Carlton Tanking for a better pick. If we are serious about developing youth, start developing it now. From what I read on here, there's only 25 players in a draft, and everything else is just a waste of space.

 

[Wally Matera]

I think we should hang on to it to help the club, it is in their best interests.

I think, with the recent developments it is a little academic. AFL HQ wants the premiership to go north and will let nothing stop themselves achieving this.

I came back to to RF big footy because this topic is of high interest to RFC so I put in my 2 cents as stated in earlier posts.

I think though we a pushing s.. up hill though as in the next three years 3 powers will make the Geelong powerhouse look like a feeble girl. One is GC , the other is GWS and the final power, I won't mention to avoid the stars, but I think some might know what body I am referring to!!

I reckon we trade your two cents onto Geelong for their compensation pick they got for Ablett.

Do you take medication by any chance?

 

[David3030]

The 2012 crop is supposed to be very enticing.

I have heard the same Wall-e, recruiters are extremely excited about the under 16's of this year who become the draft pool of 2012, the first uncompromised draft with the new teams.

 

[Mr Magic]

I reckon we trade your two cents onto Geelong for their compensation pick they got for Ablett.

Do you take medication by any chance?

Nah, the money I make on my investments each day does me just fine. Thanks for the thought anyway.

 

[The Goon]

Looking at it from a *ahem* mathematical perspective, there have been what 4-5 or so compensation pick go out this year ahead of the one we traded for? If we assume the same number go out next year (with GWS coming in) what we're likely to see is the 2012 draft almost as compromised as this one is. So the real choice is:

1. Pick now.
2. Hold pick and wait for most of the compensation picks to be used before using ours (2013 on).
3. Hold and use as a trading chip.

The most important factor for all these choices is knowing who will use their compo picks when. So can anyone answer for me how the teams who have compensation picks will be required to nominate when they use them? For instance, does everyone nominate 'blind' and then it's announced by the AFL who will be using their picks all at once. Or do teams announce as they make the decision - which will probably lead to a bit of game-theory brinkmanship?

 

[TigerTime88]

Should be used on Luke Mitchell Calder Cannons if he is still available or Dion Prestia. Both very good players.

 

[tugga]

Posts deleted.
No need to get personal.

 

[MightyTiger]

Posts deleted.
No need to get personal.

LOL Magic brings up his financial situation every time someone disagrees with him on something and yet his posts aren't about his personal situation?

 

[SolidTiger]

Looking at it from a *ahem* mathematical perspective, there have been what 4-5 or so compensation pick go out this year ahead of the one we traded for.

As far as I know there are only two compo picks for the first round and that is to Geelong for Ablett. But we have got to keep in mid of the compo picks that may come from GWS next year which is an unknown.

With the compo pick we recieved we will have to be smart about how we use it. The three factors that need to be kept an eye on is what compo picks the other clubs will recieve, when they are likely to use them and which draft coming up is likely to have a lot of depth (i.e which draft will produce the best quality kids for picks between 19 and 25).