Brad Lloyd

[schnoods]

Change is good.

With our historic rise and fall, our recruiting was lacklustre with Lloyds tenure. Whether it was targeting big guns, home sick players, potential players with a freo tie somewhere or luring a player with speculation with one of our own wanting to leave, we were spectators than key players.

We have had bad luck, we have had bad judgment, few silver linings and some absolute guns. We aren't contending and stagnation is looking ominous if we don't change gears or direction.

 

[Sweetback]

Hopefully the next person can identify forwards.

 

[Freo Shark]

The review was done in 2016. Plenty of articles on this which a quick search would reveal. I have no inside info. As to your other questions, I'm a Freo member. I don't know Ross. Never met the bloke.

No arguing musta missed this. all good

 

[Crippa]

Without necessarily inferring anything about Lloyd's abilities, this sounds like a member of staff out of the loop about the club's priorities. That he had to be directly counselled about what to do suggests a breakdown in communication, and that the arrangement couldn't have continued regardless of what Lloyd decided to do with his career.

That's not what it sounded like from the articles I've read. The emphasis was on lack on research. And flawed process of talent identification. The Colin Sylvia debacle was the last straw.

Fremantle are reviewing their recruiting processes after having banished former Melbourne star Colin Sylvia to WAFL club Peel Thunder for failing to meet the club's expectations about his fitness and preparation for the pre-season campaign.

Sylvia, 29, played just six games for the Dockers last year in his first season for the club after being picked up as a free agent on a three-year deal reported to be worth $1.2 million. And a disappointed senior coach Ross Lyon on Friday said the latest chapter in a 163-game career littered with fines and suspensions for indiscretions and poor attitude would force the club into a re-think about its recruiting policies.

"We've got to go back and work through our process of decision-making and research and reference to make sure that we get it right in the future. That's the real opportunity here," Lyon said.

"What didn't we see to tell us that this outcome would occur? So myself, Chris Bond, Brad Lloyd and Steve Rosich are working through our whole process of talent identification and bringing people into our club, because it's really important. When you see what Nick Dal Santo has done for North Melbourne, or Danyle Pearce has done for us or Brian Lake has done for Hawthorn, we're trying to get outcomes like that. And we haven't derived that outcome."

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl...n-sylvia-to-local-league-20150206-137spf.html

 

[DaveLister]

Walls to list manager and steal a decent recruiter from another team to be head recruiter and get us some extra IP

 

[its free real estate]

That's not what it sounded like from the articles I've read. The emphasis was on lack on research. I think the Colin Sylvia debacle was the last straw.

Wasn't Sylvia a Bond decision - back when Lloyd was head of drafting and Bond was head of list management?

 

[mightymouse75]

West ozzie would be good. Having a manager in Melbourne was just dumb.

 

[Crippa]

Wasn't Sylvia a Bond decision - back when Lloyd was head of drafting and Bond was head of list management?

Don't know. The reference here was to a review of recruiting policies. There was a subsequent strategic review of list management in which the talk was of the need to give Lloyd "guidance"

 

[its free real estate]

Don't know. The reference here was to a review of recruiting policies. There was a subsequent strategic review of list management in which the talk was of the need to give Lloyd "guidance"

At some point, I can't remember when, there was a restructure where list management was handed to Lloyd from Bond, and Bond's sole responsibility was football operations manager.

 

[malpaso]

Don't know how to feel about this. We've had a large exodus over the last few years and it's not good for stability.

Oohh, it's so scary. The guy had been here for 10 years. He's sought out a better career position and lives in Melbourne, reading way too much into this.

 

[its free real estate]

That's not what it sounded like from the articles I've read. The emphasis was on lack on research. And flawed process of talent identification. The Colin Sylvia debacle was the last straw.

After some digging, it seems like Sylvia was a Bond decision, which isn't to say Lloyd didn't have input:

Fremantle general manager of football operations Chris Bond said the acquisition of Sylvia was a positive one for the club.

"We see Colin as a mature, bigger-bodied player who can really add to the football club," Bond said.

"All the research we did into Colin, when we spoke to him and we spoke to other people about him, was extremely positive.

"We think his experience and his work-rate is really going to add to our midfield."​

http://www.fremantlefc.com.au/news/2013-10-04/sylvia-signs-with-freo

Further digging, I can't find news articles, but this post from our esteemed moderator last year:

The change that has happened is that Brad Lloyd has moved to be a direct report to Steve Rosich, where he previously reported to Chris Bond, taking Recruitment and List Management out of Bondy's area of responsibility. This is a type of restructure that's common in organisations and footy clubs, and it came about as a result of Lyon's recommendations on reorganising the football department.

To suggest Lloyd didn't have responsibility for the list prior to that is a falsehood, and infers that there was some kind of deliberate interference going on. I don't believe that's the case, rather Bond was involved as it was in his area of responsibility. It also didn't happen during the season. If you are going to try to stir up s**t then suggest you get your facts right.

 

[malpaso]

Massive loss. Has connnections and history of all Victorian networks. Very worried about our footy club at the moment. We have plenty of information and intel locally in WA

Then your a worry wart. Lloyd has been here 10 years, paid his dues and has sought out another role. He was the list manager not the messiah and I will never forgive him for drafting Sheridan.

 

[its free real estate]

Then your a worry wart. Lloyd has been here 10 years, paid his dues and has sought out another role. He was the list manager not the messiah and I will never forgive him for drafting Sheridan.

I laughed.

 

[TheInjuryFactory]

Meh.

 

[Crippa]

After some digging, it seems like Sylvia was a Bond decision, which isn't to say Lloyd didn't have input:

Fremantle general manager of football operations Chris Bond said the acquisition of Sylvia was a positive one for the club.

"We see Colin as a mature, bigger-bodied player who can really add to the football club," Bond said.

"All the research we did into Colin, when we spoke to him and we spoke to other people about him, was extremely positive.

"We think his experience and his work-rate is really going to add to our midfield."​

http://www.fremantlefc.com.au/news/2013-10-04/sylvia-signs-with-freo

Further digging, I can't find news articles, but this post from our esteemed moderator last year:

Thanks for that. On the matter of reviews, I've just checked the 2016 Yearbook and it seems that the review of recruiting policies we were planning to undertake in 2015 morphed into the 2016 strategic review of list management which was completed in May, ahead of the 2016 Trade Period. So there weren't 2 reviews as I had initially thought, but one.

 

[Freomaniac]

So Brad Lloyd has been at Freo since February 2008 as a General Manager of List management. So this bloke is our head recruiter and oversees our trading and Drafting.

I have mixed views on this..... If we are talking about our drafting and Trading from 2008-2017. There were some good years and bad years.

2008, 2009, 2011, 2013, 2014, 2016 and 2017 were all ok to good drafts. Not surprisingly 5 of those 7 years that we had good drafts we didn't make finals, hence what we had access to early picks (Provided we didn't trade for them).

2008 was the year we got Stephen Hill, Suban, Ballantyne, Clarke and walters in the ND. De Boer, Clancee Pearce, Greg Broughton were all in the rookie draft.

2009 got us Morabito, Fyfe, Roberton in the National draft. We got Barlow and Alex Silvagni in the rookie draft.

2011 got us Sheridan, Crozier, Neale, Sutcliffe. Spurr was a rookie pick, Dawson was PSD.

2013 got us Apeness, Alex Pearce, Brady grey, Tabs was a rookie elevation at pick 70. Colin "Whore monger" Sylvia was taken as a free agent

2014 we didn't have access to a top 10 pick be we got Weller, Blakely and Langdon in the draft and Ethan Hughes as a rookie.

2016 was good. Yes we traded pick 3 but we got Cam McCarthy, pick 7 Griffen Logue, Pick 34 in Sean Darcy and pick 72 in Luke Ryan. We also got brennan cox at pick 41. Duman and Strnadica at rookie picks. Kersten was traded for pick 63, Brad Hill was traded for pick 23, hamling was traded at pick 35. A good all round draft.

2017 was good. Brayshaw at 2, Crowden at 5, Dixon at 44, Crowden at 59 Tom North at 65 (Harley balic trade pick), Meek at 73. Bailey Banfield and Stef Giro at the rookie draft. traded a 2018 2nd rounder to get Nathan Wilson, a 2019 3rd rounder to get Matera, a 2019 4th rounder and Crozier was traded for picks 40 and 82. I know its early but this wasn't a bad year.

Now for the bad years, 2010, 2012 and 2015 in my opinions were bad years.

2010 was the year we chose Jayden Pitt over Jack Darling, Viv Michie and Josh Mellington in the draft and Jeremy McGovern was a rookie pick. We did get Jono Griffin and Tendai Mzungu by trades.

2012 was a disaster. Josh Simpson was pick 17, tanner smith was 36, max duffy was 39. Matt Taberner and Craig Moller were on the rookie list.

2015 was a bad one too with the now infamous Harley Bennell trade(s). Traded picks 16 and 34 for Bennell and pick 22 (Darcy Tucker). We wanted pick 34 back. we then traded our 2016 2nd rounder which was pick 21 and pick 61, we got pick 34 (Harley Balic) and pick 55 (Sam Collins) We got Shane Yarran at pick 61. Ryan Nyhuis was a rookie pick.

Long post I know....

Been an interesting 10 years. some good high times some bad times too.

I will say this. That 2008-2017 period was way better than the 2001-2007 "Schawabolly" era when Chris Connolly was our coach and Cameron Schwab was the CEO.

So who ever is next in line has to continue getting some more good youth in the ranks and the occasional experienced player.

 

[Arcassius]

Around 50% of the players come for Victoria. Over 50% of the clubs are from there.

Around 20% of the players come from WA. 11% of the clubs are from there.

It's not about where the players are, it's about where your strategic advantages over the rest of competition lies.

I get that. But your maths has a flaw. That 20% of players that come from WA are draftable by 100% of clubs. Why wouldn't you base your people where the majority of players to draft are located.

We don't have exclusivity over WA players so there's zero advantage in being based here.

 

[tonygeeks]

I get that. But your maths has a flaw. That 20% of players that come from WA are draftable by 100% of clubs. Why wouldn't you base your people where the majority of players to draft are located.

We don't have exclusivity over WA players so there's zero advantage in being based here.

If you are looking harder where the other clubs aren't you surely get an edge in that place and the value of a great WA player to Freo is higher than a great Victorian player


On iPad using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Arcassius]

If you are looking harder where the other clubs aren't you surely get an edge in that place and the value of a great WA player to Freo is higher than a great Victorian player


On iPad using BigFooty.com mobile app

I get that too, but we have people here who profile and scout players here, and it's easy for us to cover.

If we follow the line of argument of prioritising drafting WA talent ahead of best available - that'd be taking Ian Hill over Lukosius, Walsh, Rankine, Kings etc. Where do you want your scouts to be? Where a smaller percentage of the players are? Or the bulk of the players.

Personally I'd rather have recruiters where the talent is. Irrespective of where I'm based myself.

 

[yakka man]

Oohh, it's so scary. The guy had been here for 10 years. He's sought out a better career position and lives in Melbourne, reading way too much into this.

There's no need for immature sarcasm. As I said, I don't know how I feel about it. However, we're not really attracting loads of great people to the club, so it is hard to replace key people when we lose them.

 

[freo84]

So Brad Lloyd has been at Freo since February 2008 as a General Manager of List management. So this bloke is our head recruiter and oversees our trading and Drafting.

I have mixed views on this..... If we are talking about our drafting and Trading from 2008-2017. There were some good years and bad years.

2008, 2009, 2011, 2013, 2014, 2016 and 2017 were all ok to good drafts. Not surprisingly 5 of those 7 years that we had good drafts we didn't make finals, hence what we had access to early picks (Provided we didn't trade for them).

2008 was the year we got Stephen Hill, Suban, Ballantyne, Clarke and walters in the ND. De Boer, Clancee Pearce, Greg Broughton were all in the rookie draft.

2009 got us Morabito, Fyfe, Roberton in the National draft. We got Barlow and Alex Silvagni in the rookie draft.

2011 got us Sheridan, Crozier, Neale, Sutcliffe. Spurr was a rookie pick, Dawson was PSD.

2013 got us Apeness, Alex Pearce, Brady grey, Tabs was a rookie elevation at pick 70. Colin "Whore monger" Sylvia was taken as a free agent

2014 we didn't have access to a top 10 pick be we got Weller, Blakely and Langdon in the draft and Ethan Hughes as a rookie.

2016 was good. Yes we traded pick 3 but we got Cam McCarthy, pick 7 Griffen Logue, Pick 34 in Sean Darcy and pick 72 in Luke Ryan. We also got brennan cox at pick 41. Duman and Strnadica at rookie picks. Kersten was traded for pick 63, Brad Hill was traded for pick 23, hamling was traded at pick 35. A good all round draft.

2017 was good. Brayshaw at 2, Cerra at 5, Dixon at 44, Crowden at 59 Tom North at 65 (Harley balic trade pick), Meek at 73. Bailey Banfield and Stef Giro at the rookie draft. traded a 2018 2nd rounder to get Nathan Wilson, a 2019 3rd rounder to get Matera, a 2019 4th rounder and Crozier was traded for picks 40 and 82. I know its early but this wasn't a bad year.

Now for the bad years, 2010, 2012 and 2015 in my opinions were bad years.

2010 was the year we chose Jayden Pitt over Jack Darling, Viv Michie and Josh Mellington in the draft and Jeremy McGovern was a rookie pick. We did get Jono Griffin and Tendai Mzungu by trades.

2012 was a disaster. Josh Simpson was pick 17, tanner smith was 36, max duffy was 39. Matt Taberner and Craig Moller were on the rookie list.

2015 was a bad one too with the now infamous Harley Bennell trade(s). Traded picks 16 and 34 for Bennell and pick 22 (Darcy Tucker). We wanted pick 34 back. we then traded our 2016 2nd rounder which was pick 21 and pick 61, we got pick 34 (Harley Balic) and pick 55 (Sam Collins) We got Shane Yarran at pick 61. Ryan Nyhuis was a rookie pick.

Long post I know....

Been an interesting 10 years. some good high times some bad times too.

I will say this. That 2008-2017 period was way better than the 2001-2007 "Schawabolly" era when Chris Connolly was our coach and Cameron Schwab was the CEO.

So who ever is next in line has to continue getting some more good youth in the ranks and the occasional experienced player.

Edited for accuracy.

Otherwise very solid post.

 

[DannyTheDoorman]

There was a strategic review of list management in which Ross, the CEO and three members of the Board were brought in to give "guidance" to Lloyd who wasn't get it done. Further to that, this wasn't a "Draft Pick matter". Ross didn't go to the Board to tell them who Brad should take with pick 2.

If you had read my post I was answering to what se17enteen had said that Ross had gone to the Board about Draft Pick 2 . I don't know where you got the information that 3 members of the Board Ross and the CEO of the Board were brought in to give guidance to Lloyd and that there was a review of List Management. You have that all arse about and why would you have 3 Board members involved in a sub committee to do with decisions on List Management as Board's dont operate that way in a corporate environment as they aren't there to make operational decisions but to set strategic direction for the organisation.

Their is a committee that Ross the CEO Bondy Lloyd and I believe Belly as the footy Director on the Board who in a strategic approach to List Management have devised a model to follow in making decisions on approach to trading drafting etc and decisions are made by Lloyd as per the model. The model is reviewed I believe annually so that they have a current List Management strategy to follow for the coming year and that strategy is signed off by the Board. That is what I have gleaned from comments by Rosich not only in the press and from what I recall when he has spoken at Harbourmaster functions in the past 2 years that I have attended.

 

[DannyTheDoorman]

Without necessarily inferring anything about Lloyd's abilities, this sounds like a member of staff out of the loop about the club's priorities. That he had to be directly counselled about what to do suggests a breakdown in communication, and that the arrangement couldn't have continued regardless of what Lloyd decided to do with his career.

That isnt correct in my view that he was counselled its that the club decided to adopt a strategic approach to list management in a review of list management operations and developed a model that is used in decision making in regards drafting trading and contract extensions.

 

[DannyTheDoorman]

I explained the disadvantages before. As a head recruiter based in Victoria, he gets no inside information from local footy networks (the incentives don't align), and is detached from the comings and goings at the club about player progression and form.

David Walls is responsible for recruiting and he reports to Lloydy and David establishes the networks and where a local recruiter has found a smoky for the draft David would cross check the player or get another recruiter to observe that player. Recruiters speak to State Coaches and Elite Performance coaches at clubs

 

[DannyTheDoorman]

No. You're not going to get any advantage over the 10 Victorian clubs already based in Melbourne, with their informal networks in all the TAC clubs, country juniors, and private schools. Think about it from the point of view of a coach or club official from a small club in Melbourne's exurbs - what incentive is there in giving the Fremantle head recruiter the inside word of a player who is flying under the radar? Because the kid has focused on a different sport before returning to footy, been injured, focused on studies, etc. Take your pick. Why would he tell the Fremantle recruiter something instead of the Collingwood recruiter? "This kids actually a gun, but the reason why he hasn't played much footy in the past couple of years is because his dad's sick". Who gets that information?

The advantages of a WA based head recruiter is that the incentives of the people coaching juniors in WA and Fremantle align better than those elsewhere. A coach of Claremont colts or Aquinas will more likely want to see his players play in Perth - possibly because he knows the family, or just self interest to be able to see the kid play every week. He's more likely to feed that information about who's good to the Perth based clubs than non-WA clubs.

Secondly, presence around the club and in Perth means there is better, faster feedback about the state of the list and how the players he's picked are going. Maybe five years ago he comes into the club one day and hears from a trainer that our key defenders are struggling to get right each game. Or that Zac Clarke's knee issues are worse than thought, and changes his view about the state of the list. Maybe he shows up to a Peel game and sees the kid he took at 30 a couple of years back hasn't made the transition to professional footy that he expected, and recalibrates how he assesses juniors.

David Walls is responsible Nationally for recruiting and he reports to Lloydy and he has a local network of recruiters and Recruiting Managers with various roles. In I have seen John Nykyforak a local recruiter formerly a West Perth player from way back at a WAFL game and I asked him what his role was as I am a training watcher and have seen him in the player warm up area on occasion. There are people who are listed in the Record as Recruiting Managers as I have referred to above with various roles which you can read when you get the next Record that you buy at a Dockers game. There are more players on the Eastern Seabord playing the game so it makes sense for our head people to be located in Melbourne. Local recruiters and Recruiting Managers would have access to speak to State Coaches and Elite Performance coaches as that is how scouting works.