Past Brad Lloyd

[JustaBattler]

He can't fire them without board approval. He can't tell them to do their job. It's just a reporting requirement really. What qualification did McKay have?

He certainly has an impressive Executive education behind him.

You are assuming something about what his role is - I am not. I am referring to the organisational chart/structure as presented by the Club and taking it at face value.

I'll spell it out....

What chances that the now famous TV 'exchange' between SOS and Loyd - was precisely about the appointment of Loyds brother?
Why was Caro pushing the barrow hard about SOS actually running Carlton exactly during the time after McKay resignation was made public?
Why was SOS described as a henchman involved in the Trigg resignation? Why was Caro and the media in general so focussed on MLG's making a Captain's call on the Lethlian bloke?

Did these accusations - pressure MLG into reaching outside for someone instead of lets say for example - instead of SOS?

LOOK at the new blokes actual experience - nada nothing. I would suggest that this is a very very 'brave' appointment as well as another example of a President who leaves a bit to be desired as far as strategic decision making goes - good Presidents/Chairmen never put themselves in a position where their decisions or preferences can be overruled - by a Board - because they never have a preference that will be over ruled.

One final point on the matter

Liek him or not McKay occupied the role sicne Bolton and SOS appointments. A lot of teh hard yards are now done as far as rebuild goes. Coaching has setteld with more resources and 3 years of continuity and experience in Bolton.

Thsi new appointment has no history or knowledge or experience of teh hard yards already put in - he is a young fresh faced nobody who will have SOS and Bolton reporting to him?

Its a rubbish appointment and wont work - unless he really doesn't run the coaching and List Management areas at all.

 

[Mr_Plow]

He's a significant upgrade on Andrew McKay in terms of qualifications/experience and is highly regarded within the industry as an astute and hard-working individual.

What made McKay good enough to be in a more senior position than SOS and Bolton?

Bolton is a coach, not an executive. SOS is extremely hard working and determined but doesn't come across as having the intellectual capacity and insight to head an entire football department yet (although these are my rough impressions, impossible to assess externally).

 

[passmark]

I'm still coming to terms with the fact we hired a Lloyd ……...

Lllllllloooooyyyyydd!!!

 

[Soapy V]

Its a rubbish appointment and wont work - unless he really doesn't run the coaching and List Management areas at all.

WOW. Do you know him or have met him? What type of person is he? What's his strengths and weaknesses?

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I think that whole premise goes away if you consider that SOS doesn't want to do anything but List Management. That's what he enjoys.

Also, nobody else but an established Balme type would have appealed in terms of experience. It's not exactly a career that unemployed football managers people are waiting at home for a call about.

 

[TD2010]

Generals are made in war. Until he's sitting in the seat we won't know.

Nothing to disagree with your thinking there Ferris and you make some good points..

here is my point of issue

I don't think the bloke has the runs on the Board to have SOS or Bolton reporting TO HIM ....
put another way - I would prefer that the Board had a direct say on SOS and Bolton's future rather than some bloke from Fremantle who used to hawk players around..
or put another way
I don't think he has the gravitas to dictate to Coaching and List management what their business and how they should go about it or judge them.

The position implies that this is the organisational structure and if so it is a very bad structure.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[JustaBattler]

I think that whole premise goes away if you consider that SOS doesn't want to do anything but List Management. That's what he enjoys.

Also, nobody else but an established Balme type would have appealed in terms of experience. It's not exactly a career that unemployed football managers people are waiting at home for a call about.

Well if everyone is happy - then that will be good situation.

 

[gbatman]

It's an administration role and he has administration qualifications and also football experience and people are getting upset that he's not qualified, like he's going to be coaching or recruiting or something like that.

There is a lot of work to do and a lot to organise in making a football game or season happen and he's part of the team doing that and managing the people under him.

 

[Soapy V]

Just read what I wrote before you get your panties in a knot.

Poor response. I read your post several times. You have made several accusations that would virtually be impossible to know unless you have seen him work or know him personally.

I asked if you knew him etc. You made the comments and accusations

Personally I struggle to see how we would have picked him if we didn’t think he could step up. So far Liddle has been a good decision and he hadn’t filled that role either

 

[Blue and Blue]

Well if everyone is happy - then that will be good situation.

And maybe it will at that.

I think the premise of some overarching demigod brute that has Bolton and Silvagni cowering with sheafs of paper shaking in its presence is not quite the right perspective to use. How about its a new recruit to the off field team. And like all new recruits they get a chance to prove themselves before the epitaphs are read.

Normally I agree with most of what you say on this forum but I think in this case your normal sound reasoning and balanced logic has fled.
Not to say you wrong in the long run..just that you dont know..no more than any of us know.
Lloyd just might be a management mongrel in the making.

This thread begins and rightly so as a welcome to someone that the good faith of the Carlton Football Club has invested in. It ends up largely as another excuse to take potshots at all things Navy. As usual.
Now wise heads have made the choice wether some care to admit or not. Pretty sure there is no corruption behind every door. Nothing sinister to be found. After all what is the board? A bunch of volunteers trying to right the ship and steer it towards the sea of flags is how I see it. A thankless task that if bigfooty is any guide.

 

[JustaBattler]

Poor response. I read your post several times. You have made several accusations that would virtually be impossible to know unless you have seen him work or know him personally.

I asked if you knew him etc. You made the comments and accusations

Personally I struggle to see how we would have picked him if we didn’t think he could step up. So far Liddle has been a good decision and he hadn’t filled that role either

You've made no substantive response to the issues I've raised - get a grip.
Also I haven't accused anyone of anything - leave off with accusatory stance you take on any view that differs from yours

My issue and I say it again - is I cant see this bloke having Bolton or SOS taking him seriously as their boss.

If you cant see what the implications of that situation are (if I am right) to an organisation - then I cant help you.

 

[JustaBattler]

And maybe it will at that.

I think the premise of some overarching demigod brute that has Bolton and Silvagni cowering with sheafs of paper shaking in its presence is not quite the right perspective to use. How about its a new recruit to the off field team. And like all new recruits they get a chance to prove themselves before the epitaphs are read.

Normally I agree with most of what you say on this forum but I think in this case your normal sound reasoning and balanced logic has fled.
Not to say you wrong in the long run..just that you dont know..no more than any of us know.
Lloyd just might be a management mongrel in the making.

This thread begins and rightly so as a welcome to someone that the good faith of the Carlton Football Club has invested in. It ends up largely as another excuse to take potshots at all things Navy. As usual.
Now wise heads have made the choice wether some care to admit or not. Pretty sure there is no corruption behind every door. Nothing sinister to be found. After all what is the board? A bunch of volunteers trying to right the ship and steer it towards the sea of flags is how I see it. A thankless task that if bigfooty is any guide.

No way do I see Bolton or SOS accepting this bloke as their 'boss' - no way. If he isn't their boss - why call him that? What is the purpose of a fake position? If he is their boss it is a joke on Carlton supporters.*when I say 'him' I mean anyone in the position of Head of Football Operations - whatever that means - nonsense is nonsense.

Anyway i've made my point - seems people don't think there is much in it - and that is fine.

 

[LemmingMaster]

Lloyd has been highly regarded from many people inside the football world from what I've heard.

 

[ESKIE]

You've made no substantive response to the issues I've raised - get a grip.
Also I haven't accused anyone of anything - leave off with accusatory stance you take on any view that differs from yours

My issue and I say it again - is I cant see this bloke having Bolton or SOS taking him seriouosly as their boss.

If you cant see what the implications of that situation are (if I am right) to an organisation - then I cant help you.

Maybe they want to work with him not for him

Any way you are entitled to your opinion

 

[Soapy V]

You've made no substantive response to the issues I've raised - get a grip.
Also I haven't accused anyone of anything - leave off with accusatory stance you take on any view that differs from yours

My issue and I say it again - is I cant see this bloke having Bolton or SOS taking him seriously as their boss.

If you cant see what the implications of that situation are (if I am right) to an organisation - then I cant help you.

Why do I need to have a substantive response? I’ve asked about your accusations. Why can’t he be the boss if Bolton & SOS? That’s his role. SOS said on FC he answers to the head of football. Do you think the club has employed someone in that role NOT to be in charge?

As I said prior I have no idea how good he is but your comments about him are pointed and direct. I struggle to see how you can make them without having intimate knowledge. If you do then great then I will take you at your word. If not I reckon you’re wildly guessing.

 

[Blue and Blue]

So long as they accept him as colleague and partner and there to help with the workload then all is well.
The term boss is very misused.
I employ people. I am their boss technically but it doesnt work unless there is two way communication and respect.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Well if everyone is happy - then that will be good situation.

Happy, until I have solid reason not to be. I give everyone a chance, even Mick after being most upset about Ratts being sacked. He gave me reason not to be happy fairly quickly though.

 

[JustaBattler]

Happy, until I have solid reason not to be. I give everyone a chance, even Mick after being most upset about Ratts being sacked. He gave me reason not to be happy fairly quickly though.

I meant as long as everyone in the Club working under this archaic org model is happy....

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I meant as long as everyone in the Club working under this archaic org model is happy....

Well, it's not as though they didn't know going into this process.

SOS said on FC that he reports to McKay so he knows he reports to the position. I'm almost certain that SOS did not apply for this position and therefore knew he would report to whoever got the job. I'm also almost certain that nobody interferes with SOS's job or Bolton's job, aside from being that conduit between them and Liddle.

I think Judd as the Football Director would be floating around the whole football area.

If the club has the unity they say they do, I think it will be a fairly friendly, adult environment and anybody who is micro-managing or being over bearing with other professional staff will soon be pulled into line.

 

[JustaBattler]

So long as they accept him as colleague and partner and there to help with the workload then all is well.
The term boss is very misused.
I employ people. I am their boss technically but it doesnt work unless there is two way communication and respect.

Yeah I employ people too - and I don't burden them with organisational structures and reporting lines that are meaningless - which is why I don't get the Football Operations role...which is what started me on the whole issue...

and you know what - no one has been able to explain what the purpose of such a role is to me anyway..apart from vague mumbles about 'reporting lines'...

just like CEO means - head of marketing ..another rubbish title in AFL land - CEO in my world means CEO - all department heads report directly to CEO apart from Finance ...

Well, it's not as though they didn't know going into this process.

SOS said on FC that he reports to McKay so he knows he reports to the position. I'm almost certain that SOS did not apply for this position and therefore knew he would report to whoever got the job. I'm also almost certain that nobody interferes with SOS's job or Bolton's job, aside from being that conduit between them and Liddle.

I think Judd as the Football Director would be floating around the whole football area.

If the club has the unity they say they do, I think it will be a fairly friendly, adult environment and anybody who is micro-managing or being over bearing with other professional staff will soon be pulled into line.

I 'get' where you are coming from - and I get that it is a traditional AFL common to all clubs 'function' - but I don't get the purpose of the function is what I am saying in a nutshell.

 

[passmark]

I meant as long as everyone in the Club working under this archaic org model is happy....

Jab makes some strong points and I have to say I tend to agree that the current mix of people in the most senior positions doesn't fill me with confidence.

i'm concerned with the lack of experience and that all appear vulnerable from day one.

 

[Blue and Blue]

Yeah I employ people too - and I don't burden them with organisational structures and reporting lines that are meaningless - which is why I don't get the Football Operations role...which is what started me on the whole issue...

and you know what - no one has been able to explain what the purpose of such a role is to me anyway..apart from vague mumbles about 'reporting lines'...

I see what youre saying man.
Its a new paradigm. Lots of fancy titles for jobs that clubs didnt have in the past. Footbal operations manager used to be called guernsey washer and boot studder and linament rubber inner .

Can a club exist without a GM of football operations ? Possibly, but they bought into this massive administration/ coaching / mentoring regime that has crept over the game. Soon there will be more coaches and recruiters than the playing list. Same round the world. Nice to think all you need still is a coach and 18/ 22 battlers for the cause but hey its a different world. Better or worse? Well it keeps a few souls off the dole..or from doing seriously meaningful work ....LOL

 

[ESKIE]

Have to admit it AFL clubs appear to be top heavy

 

[thylacine60]

Matty Watson endorses this post.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I 'get' where you are coming from - and I get that it is a traditional AFL common to all clubs 'function' - but I don't get the purpose of the function is what I am saying in a nutshell.

I guess being a public servant, all of these reporting functions make sense to me. Being an OHS person, all of those lines of communication make sense to me too. There's a lot of staff there who have GMs to report to, and then the GMs report to the CEO who reports to the board. It would be too unwieldy to have all staff reporting to the CEO for example. Too much would slip through the cracks.