Carlton player Liam Jones refusing vax - Update: Jones retires from AFL

[The 747]

No we just value people's rights to decide what gets injected into them, especially when there are valid safety concerns and everyone is in a different situation health wise. Not a difficult concept and think history will side with us.

Nope.

 

[Ice-Wolf]

Anyone got a link to his gofundme?

 

[Glenn_]

Well how did he expect to train with his team mates, not to mention actually play, travel interstate etc.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Serious question for you. If 95% of people are vaccinated, do we still need to mandate vaccination?

Is there any risk from unvaccinated players getting covid, spreading it through a team and shutting down a multi-million dollar competition, as opposed to vaccinated players? Therein lies your answer.

Frankly, the idea that we would encourage sceptics to clamour to be part of the final 5% who don't have to give a shit, doesn't seem like a good idea. Give them a choice and you'll have a war of attrition instead of a blanket decision that all must follow.

 

[Glenn_]

No we just value people's rights to decide what gets injected into them, especially when there are valid safety concerns and everyone is in a different situation health wise. Not a difficult concept and think history will side with us.

If he had a medical exemption , it wouldn't be an issue.

 

[Roby]

Since the TGA has limited numbers, and still have found higher than expected numbers of myocarditis than unvaccinated, while presentation to the FDA in June this year, showed many times more myocarditis in 18 to 24 male age group males after second dose, you're splitting hairs trying to say ITS NOT A FACT.

Grow up!

Another fact is that Moderna is still banned or age restricted in many countries and Pfizer's second dose for under 18s in at least two as well.

Most important fact is that long-term randomized double blinded placebo-controlled clinical trials haven't been competed or nine FDA ordered clinical trials into myopericarditis, becasue of safety concerns for under 30s and younger.

Splitting hairs on whether it's a fact is not? It's either a fact or it's not. You posted something like it was a consensual conclusion when your only source does not STATE THAT AT ALL.

You've then ignored the rest of my post but we have come to expect this.


By the way why do we need double-randomised blind studies? Not enough at the moment?

 

[DERO]

Is there any risk from unvaccinated players getting covid, spreading it through a team and shutting down a multi-million dollar competition, as opposed to vaccinated players? Therein lies your answer.

Frankly, the idea that we would encourage sceptics to clamour to be part of the final 5% who don't have to give a sh*t, doesn't seem like a good idea. Give them a choice and you'll have a war of attrition instead of a blanket decision that all must follow.

Vaccinated people can still get and pass on the virus though amigo. It all sounds a little bit too conservative. At some point we need to start living with it and I guess that was my point.

Without getting into the politics of it all, NSW seem to have opted for a more balanced approach and I'd hope that the other states might follow once they get their numbers up. Who knows, you might even be able to pick Jones back up in the mid season draft.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

No we just value people's rights to decide what gets injected into them, especially when there are valid safety concerns and everyone is in a different situation health wise. Not a difficult concept and think history will side with us.

History will not side with you. You are wrong.

There are times when the needs of many override the perceived freedoms of the individual.

This is such a time.

 

[Stocks_go_Up]

Is there any risk from unvaccinated players getting covid, spreading it through a team and shutting down a multi-million dollar competition, as opposed to vaccinated players? Therein lies your answer.

Frankly, the idea that we would encourage sceptics to clamour to be part of the final 5% who don't have to give a sh*t, doesn't seem like a good idea. Give them a choice and you'll have a war of attrition instead of a blanket decision that all must follow.

There is also the risk of vaccinated players getting Covid and spreading it. It's already happened in the NFL where multiple players have tested positive entering training. Every day we read about vaccinated people getting Covid - look at our friend Peter Hellier screaming how thankful he is for the vaccine after testing positive lol

 

[Drought Break]

Isn't it up to the governments to build infrastructure that can support its citizens, part of which are people who don't want the jab?

Victoria for example, a better leader than Andrews could have found out if Victorian people actually would willingly take the jab and prepare a plan on medical infrastructure based on that 18 months ago

Yes that “ 2 weeks to flatten the curve” over 18 months ago to build up staffing, resources and equipment in our hospitals didn’t seem to eventuate. With the amount of money governments have blown with covid there could of been billions pumped into our hospital system

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Vaccinated people can still get and pass on the virus though amigo. It all sounds a little bit too conservative. At some point we need to start living with it and I guess that was my point.

Without getting into the politics of it all, NSW seem to have opted for a more balanced approach and I'd hope that the other states might follow once they get their numbers up. Who knows, you might even be able to pick Jones back up in the mid season draft.

Yes, vaccinated people can still get it and pass it on but the risk of transmission is lower. At some point, the virus could run out of hosts (although international travel makes this more unlikely), and just disappear.

The whole notion that eventually we just have to live with it, doesn't sit well with me, since some people just have to die with it, and that seems to be okay for those who aren't in the high risk groups. A small percentage of people not working in their preferred fields, seems to be a reasonable trade off for actual human lives.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

There is also the risk of vaccinated players getting Covid and spreading it. It's already happened in the NFL where multiple players have tested positive entering training. Every day we read about vaccinated people getting Covid - look at our friend Peter Hellier screaming how thankful he is for the vaccine after testing positive lol

Sigh. We all know this but vaccinated>unvaccinated in terms of transmission rates and severity.

 

[kingswood71]

How many not included becasue not enough information? Reported previously as I listed.

All it need is further investigation.

They'd already made decisions on reports were "deemed unlikely to be myocarditis" which I haven't questioned, and are separate from cases excluded becasue there is not enough information.

You claimed you have a letter they have investigated these cases and I'd like to see that.

Huh? "How many not included becasue not enough information? Reported previously as I listed. All it need is further investigation" ?
Do you mean the 142 due to insufficient information? Maybe they contacted the patient who reported it and the patient wasnt able to give any more info except "I think I had it"....
"You claimed you have a letter they have investigated these cases and I'd like to see that".
Mine wasnt related to myocarditis, mine was another adverse reaction. But sure I will contact patient and make sure they are happy with me de-identifying the letter....See they even investigate other reports
And just to add: "please" would have been nice. You are kinda rude.

 

[Stocks_go_Up]

Yes, vaccinated people can still get it and pass it on but the risk of transmission is lower. At some point, the virus could run out of hosts (although international travel makes this more unlikely), and just disappear.

The whole notion that eventually we just have to live with it, doesn't sit well with me, since some people just have to die with it, and that seems to be okay for those who aren't in the high risk groups. A small percentage of people not working in their preferred fields, seems to be a reasonable trade off for actual human lives.

You might not like it but it's reality, there is no sign the virus is just going to disappear, even at 95% vaccinated. Israel and Singapore already showed us that.

Regarding lower transmission risk, that doesn't prevent your doomsday industry shut down from occuring. We have already had vaccinated AFL players test positive and the season hasn't even started.

 

[Ice-Wolf]

The whole notion that eventually we just have to live with it, doesn't sit well with me, since some people just have to die with it, and that seems to be okay for those who aren't in the high risk groups. A small percentage of people not working in their preferred fields, seems to be a reasonable trade off for actual human lives.

Yeah I don't have much sympathy for a high paid (compared to the average person) professional athlete losing their job because they refuse to get vaccinated.
Good luck to him trying to find a job with a comparable remuneration without having to get vaxxed when you can't even get a job stacking shelves at the supermarket with out being vaxxed.

Has he taken this approach to every other substance the club has asked him to take over his career? Or did he just trust the club doctors instead of some random on the internet.

I think Carlton would have been on a hiding to nothing trying to convince him it doesn't seem to matter the resources they had behind them in doctors and experts and actual research he wasn't going to listen.

 

[Drought Break]

Wheckjob quits due to being a whackjob.

Later Liam. w***er.

Give it a rest. Seems some of you would be quite happy to nail him to a cross. Imagine the crap and bullying he’s copping atm, can’t be doing his mental health any good

 

[Registered User]

Yeah my bad forgot the gov loves us and everything on msm is legit!!!

Exactly.

"Commercial television and radio broadcasters will receive a 100% rebate on their Commercial Broadcasting Tax for 12 months.
The rebate will provide the commercial broadcasting sector with $41 million in tax relief for the use of broadcasting spectrum, backdated to start from 14 February 2020.

The rebate will help offset the sharp downturn in advertising revenue, which has significantly impacted the operating revenues of commercial broadcasters. More information on the Commercial Broadcasting (Tax) (Transmitter Licence Tax Rebate) Rules 2020 is available on the Federal Register of Legislation.

https://www.infrastructure.gov.au/media-technology-communications/television/relief-australian-media-during-covid-19

To offset a loss of ad revenue? No worries, Scomo. I'm sure the Nine Entertainment Group is struggling for a buck

 

[Roby]

You highly doubt it was because of the vaccine? So you just happened to get it not long after receiving the injection? The odds of you getting it not long after the jab and it not being because of the jab are a needle in a haystack at best. If you honestly believe that I don't know what to say.


Funny you call me 'anti-vax' even though I have received 2 doses of a covid jab (az i received by choice because of the heart issues). I am just willing to accept it is not perfect and there are issues with the jabs that the governments around the world really need to force the manufacturers to improve the jabs so these bad side effects don't occur for nobody or for very minimal people compared to what's happening currently.

Putting your head in the sand and denying what's happening doesn't help nobody

You don't need to say anything, I've had myocarditis before.

Why did you go with AZ? What kind of heart issue do you have? You do realise that AZ the traditional vaccine with the inactive virus? Not sure this is best one for you but your fine obviously.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Give it a rest. Seems some of you would be quite happy to nail him to a cross. Imagine the crap and bullying he’s copping atm, can’t be doing his mental health any good

Anyone got a hammer?

And spare the mental health bullshit. Jones has no concern for others with his anti-vax stance so why should his mental health be of any consideration at all?

He made his choice.

 

[Beerfish]

Give it a rest. Seems some of you would be quite happy to nail him to a cross. Imagine the crap and bullying he’s copping atm, can’t be doing his mental health any good

Head on a stake is probably a better likeness

 

[Roby]

BlueE, I notice you're back in the thread but you seem to have missed my post above. No problem as there's plenty of posts flying around but I was wondering if you had that information that shows that Merck gifted their formula, and that India halted trials on molnupirvir for safety reasons rather than the reasons I stated above.

Blue completely ignored a large section of post and salient points. He did this this with TGA advisory. Obviously can't be trusted.

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

Massive over generalisation about the right wing of politics pushing the anti vax agenda. If you had said ultra right or lunatic right, then you may be a bit closer to the mark. Given that in excess of 90% of Australians will end up being vaccinated against COVID there must be a helluva lot of right wingers in amongst them. I consider myself right wing, but I strongly believe in vaccination and mandating of vaccination for certain professions. As no doubt would many other people who consider themselves to the right of centre.

The Right wing politicians at totally stoking the fire.

I don't think they're anti-vax - they're just using these low IQ battlers to peddle their Right wing message for them, in amongst the anti-vax stuff.

90% of the stuff these protesters are going on about is just classic right wing stuff.

 

[DERO]

Head on a stake is probably a better likeness

Has McGowan mandated vaccination or is he just sticking to : “no one from Victoria unless they are
coming to work in my mines” rule?

 

[DERO]

The Right wing politicians at totally stoking the fire.

I don't think they're anti-vax - they're just using these low IQ battlers to peddle their Right wing message for them, in amongst the anti-vax stuff.

90% of the stuff these protesters are going on about is just classic right wing stuff.

I remember the good old days when it was the lefties who fought for our freedom.

 

[Roby]

Yeah I don't have much sympathy for a high paid (compared to the average person) professional athlete losing their job because they refuse to get vaccinated.
Good luck to him trying to find a job with a comparable remuneration without having to get vaxxed when you can't even get a job stacking shelves at the supermarket with out being vaxxed.

Has he taken this approached to every other substance the club has asked him to take over his career? Or did he just trust the club doctors instead of some random on the internet.

I think Carlton would have been on a hiding to nothing trying to convince him it doesn't seem to matter the resources they had behind them in doctors and experts and actual research he wasn't going to listen.

All the club AFL doctors would've reiterated the best knowledge of epidemiologists and immunologist, the same doctors the players trust, and that's why it's not surprising the other 719 players are vaccinated.