Coach Carlton under Voss

[PP34]

There's quite a few that have talent but are just content to coast every week and collect an inflated pay check.

I don’t think it’s coasting to be honest.

I think it’s collective exhaustion and lost of confidence after nearly four years of an incredibly taxing gameplan that isn’t producing results.

Nothing about the way we play under Voss makes things easy on the footy field. It’s a grind. There’s a reason in the 2022,2023 and 2024 seasons we’d have patches looking unbeatable and then others where we looked terrible.

We’d beat the shit out of teams for periods but then once they realised they can just even up contests a bit and get us on the outside we’ve been stuffed.

Our gameplan has meant so many goals have had to come from a stoppage, contested mark etc. Not a heap of the easy rebound, overlap etc the truly elite produce.

During that run in 2023 I’d argue we were a bit more well rounded however Curnow was playing close to the best footy in the league those last 10-12 weeks of that home and away season. Very reliant on him.

 

[Scotland]

The problem is they do everything half assed.

I just compare them to teams who successfully got off the bottom like the Tigers under Hardwick or Lions under Fagan and cringe.

Drafting wise we hit big in 2015, but then whiffed on a number of key picks. Not a great deal of late round success either. That has meant we’re short of players in key areas and had to waste valuable draft capital to secure missing talent.

Those trades for Cerra etc haven’t been nearly as successful as one would hope.

Instead of seemingly having a well run ship with everyone on the same page the club just appears to have continual problems that they try to fix with band aid solutions.

Nothing about the coaches they select seems like it’s ever off the back of well run and comprehensive process.

There has never seemed to be a recruiting strategy that aligns with coaching and forward thinking.

Everyone mentions how the stand rule made the contested footy brand outdated and hard to win with. I do agree somewhat however Richmond was showing back to 2017 that winning games mucking up things with pressure and speed was a viable premiership strategy. Craig McRae was at Richmond and I don’t think his gameplan is drastically different from what a lot of what Richmond was doing then.

I was vehemently against Voss when he was hired. He was no good at the Lions and at Port okay there were decent reviews about people skills etc and maybe his work with Ollie Wines but that club wasn’t winning anything. Yes he wasn’t the head coach but I don’t think he’s much different from Hinkley.

Plus to me it was like they got told no by Clarkson, messed around with Lyon and then just thought oh well Vossy’s a a good guy. There was no proper process.

Both the Tigers and Lions had a strategy and a coach there for a long time to implement what they wanted. Carlton meanwhile chopped and changed coaches and now seemingly decided on a coach with an outdated idea about footy.

I’m sure part of it is how much money we’ve wasted on McGovern etc but compared to say the Lions we simply have ignored key problems with the list. Look at the Lions recruitment since 2016 and you’ll see they consistently filled holes. We did a couple of times but most of our pick ups have been overpaid players who cost too much draft capital like Cerra, McGovern, Saad etc

Now we’ve got Graham Wright who is meant to come in and blow the joint apart and maybe fix things. Consider me quite pessimistic about that considering Carlton’s idea about how to win flags or at least be consistently up the ladder again involves getting in the big name fitness coaches, coaches, CEOs, footy managers, big name player etc.

Voss seems like a good dude that the players get behind but watching the game on Thursday I was scratching my head at how poor the forward entries were and how easy they seemed to make the game for Hawthorn. They have a couple of skilful players in defence and on the wing but turnovers in the corridor and from shallow entries just make their lives easy.

Every team has strengths and weaknesses in personnel but Carlton don't really seem to make great use of what they have. My team has no experienced key position players left. Yesterday's defence was Ginbey (20, not really a tall, 58 games woo), Brock (22, 10 games, probably not AFL standard), Bazzo (21, 23 games, barely played in two years) and at the other end was Archer Reid (19, 11 games) and Jobe Shanahan (18, 4 games). On paper that team should be terrified of Carlton's spine but I don't fear playing Carlton that the talls will do what Curnow did to us a couple of years ago. And that is with a clearly much stronger midfield. Which is weird but the connection between the lines just isn't there. Also don't get why they gave away Owies (or why we wanted him). For a guy that isn't a high priced recruit it seemed weird to not want a guy that kicked 30 goals and can play inside 50 without needing to be a regular target.

 

[carlton_99]

Also don't get why they gave away Owies (or why we wanted him). For a guy that isn't a high priced recruit it seemed weird to not want a guy that kicked 30 goals and can play inside 50 without needing to be a regular target.

I think with how he has played at the Eagles it should be abundantly clear why we were very happy to move him on. 28 years old so very limited scope for improvement. Defensive pressure is poor, positional awareness is poor, slow and no positional versatility either. His one strength was set shot kicking accuracy but outside of that he was not making us better.

He essentially averaged 1 goal a game last season against non bottom 4 opposition and provided nothing else. I also do think he pretty much had to be a target to get his goals because they weren't coming from crumbing off the talls. He played like a medium forward at Carlton rather than as a small.

 

[Scotland]

I think with how he has played at the Eagles it should be abundantly clear why we were very happy to move him on. 28 years old so very limited scope for improvement. Defensive pressure is poor, positional awareness is poor, slow and no positional versatility either. His one strength was set shot kicking accuracy but outside of that he was not making us better.

He essentially averaged 1 goal a game last season against non bottom 4 opposition and provided nothing else.

I agree but I thought he was OK to start the year. Hot garbage since he got injured. None of our forwards get much opportunity or good service so he is on a hiding to nothing. IMO Carlton got rid of him without really replacing the role, hence with McKay mostly injured your second highest goal kicker is Zac Williams. Motlop is OK but goes missing a lot.

 

[carlton_99]

I agree but I thought he was OK to start the year. Hot garbage since he got injured. None of our forwards get much opportunity or good service so he is on a hiding to nothing. IMO Carlton got rid of him without really replacing the role, hence with McKay mostly injured your second highest goal kicker is Zac Williams. Motlop is OK but goes missing a lot.

We have a lot of small forwards on the list so quantity is not really the issue - it is more quality. Williams has been a small forward with some stints in the midfield and Motlop similar. We would have hoped for more from the others but we have been pretty putrid so haven't really seen the best of anyone. Regardless, we had to go past Owies and I'd still rather put the faith in a 21 year old like Motlop or 23 year old in Durdin improving than an Owies who I don't see getting much better.

I actually think the list management decisions around Owies/Kennedy/Houston were all correct. Just had far too many good players drop off in form this season mixed in with some very poor coaching. In fact the only motivation for me to keep going to games at the moment is seeing the kids. A bright spark in an otherwise miserable season

 

[PP34]

Voss seems like a good dude that the players get behind but watching the game on Thursday I was scratching my head at how poor the forward entries were and how easy they seemed to make the game for Hawthorn. They have a couple of skilful players in defence and on the wing but turnovers in the corridor and from shallow entries just make their lives easy.

Every team has strengths and weaknesses in personnel but Carlton don't really seem to make great use of what they have. My team has no experienced key position players left. Yesterday's defence was Ginbey (20, not really a tall, 58 games woo), Brock (22, 10 games, probably not AFL standard), Bazzo (21, 23 games, barely played in two years) and at the other end was Archer Reid (19, 11 games) and Jobe Shanahan (18, 4 games). On paper that team should be terrified of Carlton's spine but I don't fear playing Carlton that the talls will do what Curnow did to us a couple of years ago. And that is with a clearly much stronger midfield. Which is weird but the connection between the lines just isn't there. Also don't get why they gave away Owies (or why we wanted him). For a guy that isn't a high priced recruit it seemed weird to not want a guy that kicked 30 goals and can play inside 50 without needing to be a regular target.

In regards to the Hawks game the club is in self preservation mode.

Was at the game and we basically had nobody forward of the footy for when we won it back.

Means we won’t get belted but also gives us little to no hope of winning.

But yes it’s been a theme all year.

Everyone loves to bang on about all the shit kicks we have and I agree to an extent. However poor coaching/lack of system and proper forward structure makes things even worse. Theres guys on our team who can use the footy much better than they have been. The problem is they’re under immense pressure and when they look up have very little to kick it to.

On the rare occasions McKay and Curnow play, they seem to be coached to lead to the same spot together and make a contest which is just complete garbage tactically because teams just plonk spares in front of them and even if they mark it, the other isn’t in a spot to get the next kick.

 

[PonsfordMagpie]

 

[fnerd]

If they do sack him after that ,it just confirms how even more pathetic the blues management is .

Reactive , redundant and with no clear plan moving fwd.

Imagine having the dysfunctional shit show that is the MFC spook you into action

 

[LordLucifer]

Hot gossip ........

There is an unscheduled board meeting convened tonight.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

If they do sack him after that ,it just confirms how even more pathetic the blues management is .

Reactive , redundant and with no clear plan moving fwd.

Imagine having the dysfunctional shit show that is the MFC spook you into action

You do realise this a 'scheduled' board meeting and for months now there's been talk that Graham Wright will make a decision on Voss when as he takes over the CEO role next week ya?

 

[Fadge]

You do realise this a 'scheduled' board meeting and for months now there's been talk that Graham Wright will make a decision on Voss when as he takes over the CEO role next week ya?

This Graham Wright fella must be a good operator.

How many hats is he going to be wearing?

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

This Graham Wright fella must be a good operator.

How many hats is he going to be wearing?

However many necessary from the sounds of it Fadge.

Glad we poached him from the cooked Pies who's season is on a knifes edge as we speak!

 

[Fadge]

However many necessary from the sounds of it Fadge.

Whoever would have guessed... Carlton relying on a great saviour to come in and save the day.

Meanwhile, strong organisations have the right people in the right roles do get the required work done.

I mean, things are humming from Brian Cook's time at the club, aren't they?

 

[Fadge]

Glad we poached him from the cooked Pies who's season is on a knifes edge as we speak!

And those 'cooked Pies' are currently sitting in a position on the ladder that Carlton haven't found themselves in at the end of a home and away season for more than a quarter of a century...

Carlton would dream about being as 'cooked' as the Pies currently are.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Whoever would have guessed... Carlton relying on a great saviour to come in and save the day.

Meanwhile, strong organisations have the right people in the right roles do get the required work done.

I mean, things are humming from Brian Cook's time at the club, aren't they?

Strong organisations... Is that why you have racist Craig Kelly in charge of things down in Pieland?

 

[Do_Beta_Rapport]

Carlton about to sack ANOTHER Snr Coach.

You could set your watch this this lot, clockwork.

 

[Do_Beta_Rapport]

Strong organisations... Is that why you have racist Craig Kelly in charge of things down in Pieland?

Mods might want to delete this, damn near libel.

These Blues fans have seen the ‘22 under 22’ side, seen there are no Baggers named and have turned feral.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Carlton about to sack ANOTHER Snr Coach.

You could set your watch this this lot, clockwork.

Yeah, we really should be keeping Vossy shouldn't we!

 

[Fadge]

Strong organisations... Is that why you have racist Craig Kelly in charge of things down in Pieland?

Craig Kelly appointed as CEO of Collingwood in January 2023.

Currently a 50% Premiership strike rate.

Will it be 66% after this year, or a lowly 33%?

 

[Do_Beta_Rapport]

Yeah, we really should be keeping Vossy shouldn't we!

View attachment 2387851
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So hang on, I am over 2 years ahead of where the Carlton board are?

You might want to bring me on as a consultant in the next search.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Mods might want to delete this, damn near libel.

These Blues fans have seen the ‘22 under 22’ side, seen there are no Baggers named and have turned feral.

Blues youth is doing just fine. Couple of rising stars this year, HOF robbed of one the other week too.

With Jagga and Dean in next year it's all looking rosy for whoever is taking the reins after Vossy!

 

[Do_Beta_Rapport]

Yeah, we really should be keeping Vossy shouldn't we!

View attachment 2387851
View attachment 2387853

NOT WRONG JUST EARLY

 

[Do_Beta_Rapport]

Blues youth is doing just fine. Couple of rising stars this year, HOF robbed of one the other week too.

With Jagga and Dean in next year it's all looking rosy for whoever is taking the reins after Vossy!

Naming a player who is yet to play a single AFL home & away game, and a player who isn’t even on your list yet.

You will get splinters from scraping the barrel to this degree.

 

[demondavey]

If they do sack him after that ,it just confirms how even more pathetic the blues management is .

Reactive , redundant and with no clear plan moving fwd.

Imagine having the dysfunctional shit show that is the MFC spook you into action

He’ll be gone tomorrow. Then it’s an arms race for Longmire, Buckley, Simpson.

 

[demondavey]

Mods might want to delete this, damn near libel.

These Blues fans have seen the ‘22 under 22’ side, seen there are no Baggers named and have turned feral.

Don’t think he is wrong is he?