Autopsy Cats lose to Lions by 41 points.

[Catman]

Perhaps, Lions PF defeat could be written off
Holmes got injured and Cats tried to defend
Then Cats gave away a big lead in Round 3
That was twice to Lions in the identical way
If Scott was devising a counter plan, Test it!
Instead Lions dominance has now increased
Nature of this loss will create mental scars.
Scott's presser was all excuses and denials
Was no acknowledgement of needed change.
Players have bye will go away forget about it.
Acknowledging change gives team incentive
This is not throwing the team under the bus
Past history shows no evidence of change.

How much of though was a tactical problem and how much was down to execution? The stats didn't show any glaring discrepancies, other than maybe the uncontested disposals, which Brisbane are usually high in, but to the eye it was clear one side was more polished than the other at key moments. Not too dissimilar to the PF second half.

Is that something down to the quality of players of the two teams, or did we just have a very bad night?

 

[calder_daddy]

I made sure to take a deep breath and chill before responding. Having now afforded myself that time I feel better about what I’m going so say.

— I think most sides will have a banana peel game here or there. That was ours. Now we gather ourselves, learn from it and move on.

— Your weaknesses tend to get exposed against the best. Last night certainly did that for Geelong. Provided the coaches and players assess and learn from it then just get on with it, and get better.

— I’ve watched Jack Martin closely the last few weeks. He was filthy bad last night but as a 3 week snapshot I have zero idea what strengths he brings to the team. He looks cooked at AFL level and I can’t see what he adds come finals.
— Mitch Duncan is in the same boat as Martin. He’s been a star for Geelong but his time is up. We got him to 300 and he’s been respected as he should be. But there is no way either he or Martin can be played in finals. Against a hard running / physical team last night, he was made to look second rate.

Overall I think that game is a perfectly timed wake up call. We’re better than that and everyone knows that. But provided the coaches and players learn from it then I think we just take our whack and move on.

No one will remember that result come week one of finals. Just as no one remembers the loss to St Kilda at Marvel before winning 16 games and a flag in 2022.

And the umpiring !! Crikey !! It didn’t affect the result but they’ve got real problems at AFL House if the umpiring dept doesn’t sort itself out before finals. It’s as bad as I’ve seen for a long time.

End of rant

You’re not alone with the Martin and Duncan thoughts.
Though who comes in for full games?
Clohesy and Bowes?

The only 2 guaranteed best 22 come finals time who currently aren’t in our AFL side are Dekoning and Kolo

 

[CoolCat75]

Look, Brisbane deserved to win and obviously they outplayed us. But let’s be glass half full. We haven’t made that many bad turn overs in years. Miers made more clangers in one game that he has in 4 years. And yet, we still had enough chances that expected scores has us in front. Move on and we will be ok.

 

[AWOL]

Who exactly does he replace in a like for like role?

Always find it entertaining when people say player x or y should play. Someone has to drop out.

As much as I think Duncan and Martin are not the answer, in the case of Clohesy, his ball use is nowhere near AFL standard. If you think back to his last game at AFL level, that’s why he was dropped. Butchered it in consecutive efforts within 2-3 passages of play.

Not sure he plays many more games in the hoops.

Personally, I’d have him in ahead of Duncan, Martin and O Henry, and possibly Mullin. None are really like for like but none of them are playing an essential role for us either.

I accept that mullin is in to shut down opposing mid / fwd.

 

[Baudolino]

Ted. He should be playing in the ones.

Clohesy is another Fogarty or Narkle, he's just about good enough to get picked up by another club, but not much more than that, he's a battler and won't make it to 100 games. The idea that he would have helped at all last night is fanciful.

 

[Del216647]

It's interesting looking at the various opinions on this forum and how people saw the game. I have actually enjoyed reading the diverse views.

Just a bad night / a bit off? Maybe. Poor skill execution? Clearly. But I've seen quite a few on here underrating the Lions dating way back to before our prelim encounter. They have beaten us four out of the last five, inclusive of three wins on three different grounds across two states. One of which was a cut-throat final. What that tells me is right now they have our measure, and the belief they can essentially beat us anywhere, anytime. IMO, it's not a coincidence we just happend to have a 'bad night' against them after a run of great form. They made us have it.

I am a big believer in you can only play as good as the opposition allows you. A soft kill against the Bombers last week where we could essentially do what we wanted against witches hats. Having gone to the game last night, one thing was really clear. The Lions had set themselves up in a way that they invited us to take risks and pull off risky kicks through the corridor. They sat off us just enough to tempt us, and when we went to pull the trigger, they swarmed. They knew exactly where to set up and what we wanted to do, and what we would do. They were waiting and it was strategic. There were clearly lots of mistakes, unforced errors if you will, but many of our turnovers / bad ball use was due to how they set up and not allowing us to move the ball as we had planned.

A lot will have to change tactically to beat these guys in September. We can absolutely achieve this and I back Scott to pull this off. Unfortunately this win does give the Lions massive confidence (not a disaster), but it also means that 'home' MCG QF might be out of reach (2nd spot). Unless we finish fourth and play the Pies anyway. So that is frustrating, but at least we now have the opportunity to dissect and learn. Last thing we want is to draw these guys week one at the Gabba - whilst we would get an MCG Semi if we lose against them up there (likely) and likely play the Pies in an MCG prelim, the last thing we would want is to play a Dogs outfit in a Semi. Like the Lions, these guys trouble us in a big way.

I am mindful of having lots of soft games on the run home. They're great for banking four points, but they don't help you prepare for big finals games against elite opposition. We're still in a good spot but I am not just putting this down to a "bad night". We don't need to panic, but we need to have a good look at this one. Onwards and upwards.

 

[Mr Meow]

It's interesting looking at the various opinions on this forum and how people saw the game. I have actually enjoyed reading the diverse views.

Just a bad night / a bit off? Maybe. Poor skill execution? Clearly. But I've seen quite a few on here underrating the Lions dating way back to before our prelim encounter. They have beaten us four out of the last five, inclusive of three wins on three different grounds across two states. One of which was a cut-throat final. What that tells me is right now they have our measure, and the belief they can essentially beat us anywhere, anytime. IMO, it's not a coincidence we just happend to have a 'bad night' against them after a run of great form. They made us have it.

I am a big believer in you can only play as good as the opposition allows you. A soft kill against the Bombers last week where we could essentially do what we wanted against witches hats. Having gone to the game last night, one thing was really clear. The Lions had set themselves up in a way that they invited us to take risks and pull off risky kicks through the corridor. They sat off us just enough to tempt us, and when we went to pull the trigger, they swarmed. They knew exactly where to set up and what we wanted to do, and what we would do. They were waiting and it was strategic. There were clearly lots of mistakes, unforced errors if you will, but many of our turnovers / bad ball use was due to how they set up and not allowing us to move the ball as we had planned.

A lot will have to change tactically to beat these guys in September. We can absolutely achieve this and I back Scott to pull this off. Unfortunately this win does give the Lions massive confidence (not a disaster), but it also means that 'home' MCG QF might be out of reach (2nd spot). Unless we finish fourth and play the Pies anyway. So that is frustrating, but at least we now have the opportunity to dissect and learn. Last thing we want is to draw these guys week one at the Gabba - whilst we would get an MCG Semi if we lose against them up there (likely) and likely play the Pies in an MCG prelim, the last thing we would want is to play a Dogs outfit in a Semi. Like the Lions, these guys trouble us in a big way.

I am mindful of having lots of soft games on the run home. They're great for banking four points, but they don't help you prepare for big finals games against elite opposition. We're still in a good spot but I am not just putting this down to a "bad night". We don't need to panic, but we need to have a good look at this one. Onwards and upwards.

Lots of great points and I pretty much agree on all of them except one. 2nd isn't out of reach. We're one win off it and Brisbane have to play a few contenders between now and end of season. If we are good enough we can still get 2nd.

 

[Del216647]

Lots of great points and I pretty much agree on all of them except one. 2nd isn't out of reach. We're one win off it and Brisbane have to play a few contenders between now and end of season. If we are good enough we can still get 2nd.

Yeah good call - we can still get 2nd. Funnily enough, I think we can beat GWS up there. We can't beat them in Geelong but they have been gettable on their deck. That would be a very valuable four-points.

 

[Footy_Fan2007]

Last thing we want is to draw these guys week one at the Gabba -

I think we have more of a chance of beating them up there in a final to be honest.

 

[Farmer2Goggin]

Yeah good call - we can still get 2nd. Funnily enough, I think we can beat GWS up there. We can't beat them in Geelong but they have been gettable on their deck. That would be a very valuable four-points.

I think your point about a soft draw leading into Finals is a good one.
Sounds silly but I hope some find some form and really test us , would hate to hit September with a number of soft kills and no exposure to real pressure.

 

[The Unforgiven]

Win more of the ball. He is a centre bounce midfielder who only had 21 touches. Probably the least touches of all the regulars.

How'd his direct opponent go? He gave Lachie Neale a bath.

 

[Goggin Our Best]

People still haven't clicked to the fact our game is now designed for the MCG?

Spot on

I tipped the Lions by 23 points , i looked at several factors in deciding that - but to put that into perspective , if the game had been at the MCG my tip would have been this is a 50-50 game which could go either way

And i will add further i hate watching games at KP it is sling shot football , absolutely terrible to watch , and i will go further to say , of all the main grounds in the AFL , the Geelong ground is the worst ground on the TV to watch football at - id even prefer to watch a game at Marvel

I tipped Brisbane to win easily which they did , but i couldnt careless about last nights result , and it is a waste of time analysing the game , and will have no effect on the Cats chances come Sept , because finals are played at the MCG thank goodness not bloody Kardinia Park

 

[fpm84]

Unfortunately this win does give the Lions massive confidence (not a disaster), but it also means that 'home' MCG QF might be out of reach (2nd spot).

Good post. We are still odds on to finish second though given our remaining fixture.

Lions have the Pies, Suns and Freo all away, plus Dogs and Hawks at the Gabba.

We are a reasonable chance to drop the GWS game, and maybe the Swans away too given they're finally getting their star players back on the field. But dropping any other game would count as 'upset of the season' territory.

 

[Del216647]

I think your point about a soft draw leading into Finals is a good one.
Sounds silly but I hope some find some form and really test us , would hate to hit September with a number of soft kills and no exposure to real pressure.

Couldn't agree more. I actually remember Fagan saying after they beat us in the prelim, that they were fortunate enough to have been tested / challenged and were match hardened. He mentioned we had not had that opportunity as we played WC last round in Geelong, followed by a bye, and then a soft kill against Port, followed by another week off prior to the prelim.

 

[Del216647]

Good post. We are still odds on to finish second though given our remaining fixture.

Lions have the Pies, Suns and Freo all away, plus Dogs and Hawks at the Gabba.

We are a reasonable chance to drop the GWS game, and maybe the Swans away too given they're finally getting their star players back on the field. But dropping any other game would count as 'upset of the season' territory.

Good point. Still a good chance to finish second by the sounds of it.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

I didn't watch the game live as I was watching my daughter play basketball, so skipped thru some parts of it, honestly it seemed like one of those "what could go wrong did go wrong" games where you are 5-10% off and get smashed as a result.
We were reactive as a team, and used it poorly while the lions were beyond sharp and cut us up when they wished.
It happens. The league is that close that even being slightly below your opponent risks exactly what happened last night.
The only concern would be if it continued into the next game, or becomes more often than not from here, which we all know it won't.
Take the lessons sure, and the coaches and playing group no doubt will be, but as supporters it's almost a forget and move on situation IMO.

 

[cats_09]

As much as this looked likely to be a comfortable win for North - they haven't hit the scoreboard in the last and Carlton have got this back to 18 points

 

[you pick one]

I didn't watch the game live as I was watching my daughter play basketball, so skipped thru some parts of it, honestly it seemed like one of those "what could go wrong did go wrong" games where you are 5-10% off and get smashed as a result.
We were reactive as a team, and used it poorly while the lions were beyond sharp and cut us up when they wished.
It happens. The league is that close that even being slightly below your opponent risks exactly what happened last night.
The only concern would be if it continued into the next game, or becomes more often than not from here, which we all know it won't.
Take the lessons sure, and the coaches and playing group no doubt will be, but as supporters it's almost a forget and move on situation IMO.

I've had finals losses I've got over quicker than I look like getting over this one it was an insipid performance by a finals contender no heart shown last night by to many pity we have the bye this week no chance to whip a response out of the group.

 

[Romeoh1]

We look to have a decent draw from now on but I’m not calling it a ‘soft’ draw. Anything can happen and that might be getting ahead of ourselves to think like that. Have no doubt the club won’t be complacent about the games to come.

 

[Warhorse]

Not sure why the panic. We play them in finals Danger goes into the middle. We sort out our kicking for goal. Morris won't get a kick with Kolo back in the team.

 

[Mr Meow]

Not sure why the panic. We play them in finals Danger goes into the middle. We sort out our kicking for goal. Morris won't get a kick with Kolo back in the team.

There is a worrying trend though that the last 3 times we've played them our ball use has gone to shit, while their transitions from defence to attack have been far superior.

That looks like a tactical edge to me and it seems the players from both sides are aware of it.

 

[catscratchfever]

I'm surprised by some of the comments here. One loss after 5 wins and it's all doom and gloom. Get real - Brisbane played well, we were crap. It happens.

We're still good for 3rd to 4th after this round so stop your whining, naysayers. You're a tedious lot.

 

[Cataholic]

I've had finals losses I've got over quicker than I look like getting over this one it was an insipid performance by a finals contender no heart shown last night by to many pity we have the bye this week no chance to whip a response out of the group.

The ease with which they smothered our game and outplayed us was concerning to watch, as was the horrendous inability to execute even the simplest of skills.

They exploded out of the blocks and we utterly imploded.

They were levels above with their skill and intent. They went in hard while we stood around flat footed, waiting for someone else to go fetch.

It was insipid, but the most bizarre, unexplainable aspect for me was how the group lost all ability to kick, handball, hit up targets, kick goals.....ya know, do footy stuff.

It was contagious from the moment Miers, Close and Duncan started butchering the ball mercilessly.

Praise be for Tom Atkins.

 

[Kobe Gryant]

Cats midfield is clearly the team weak link
Midfield was dominant in premiership years
Reason why Cats are chasing quality mid's
Also need to address how ball is transitioned
Can't rely on Holmes / Smith to break the lines
Need entire team to run and chain handball
Especially more directness not via boundary
There are many things Cats can improve on

Watching Scott's Presser was most annoying
Can't tell if the Don't Panic was pure spin
Surely can't sweep this loss under the carpet
Interested if tweaks to Game Plan after Bye

We absolutely need to acquire one more quality mid rotation, but the midfield wasn't dominant in 2022. Not even close. 07-11, without doubt.

2022 vs 2025

Contested possession: 10th - 8th
Clearances: 10th - 9th
Scores from stoppage: 4th - 2nd
Scores from cent/bounce: 10th - 3rd

It's very similar, bearing in mind if we had an elite midfield in 2022, the numbers should be swayed by 18-4 and 16 in a row, and they're not.

It's pressure and scores from turnover for us. It was the equation in 2022, and it's the equation now.

Like 2022, the midfield is never going to be dominant. The best we can hope is they hold their own, and we take our opportunities going forward.

 

[bombersboy]

Lots of great points and I pretty much agree on all of them except one. 2nd isn't out of reach. We're one win off it and Brisbane have to play a few contenders between now and end of season. If we are good enough we can still get 2nd.

The draw will get us second spot